178 replies to this topic

[nittybitty]

Several continued taking it after adding Vitamin D3 in adequate amounts to their regimen. Most of the cases of muscle pain resolved from this supplementation. DHEA as a treatment is a relatively recent find for me.

In your opinion, do you think Biosil or Jarrowsil would help?

The notion that anyone would feel the pain or the cracking of their joints I have felt (or the original poster) and would continue to take anything they thought was causing that seems pretty impossible to me. I feel it in my toes, fingers and forearms. The pain moves around and feels very abnormal and unhealthy. Something about random, sharp aches and pains in my little toes really freaked me out; maybe it is normal for some.

I appreciate all the links and info in this thread and I wish the OP would come back, unless he offed himself as he threatened to do a few times.

Edited by nittybitty, 27 July 2012 - 07:51 AM.

[maxwatt]

I do not know if these would help, and I am skeptical that many people suffer from inadequate consumption of silicon. Still, perhaps if too few vegetables in one's diet ... . There is no harm in trying.

The neuralgia you describe could be symptomatic of rheumatoid arthritis, lupus or other conditions. It may have nothing to do with resveratrol, or resveratrol may be aggravating it.

Have you had your hydroxy-D25 tested? My joint pain resolved when I supplemented sufficient D3 to raise my level above 35. Yet I know one many who stil complained of joint pain with a level of 45. Most who have reported joint pain with resveratrol have reported use of D3 fixed it. DHEA is new to me for this, may be worth trying.

If the pain continues, see what a doctor says. You might want to consult with a rheumatologist or a pain management specialist. If you cannot afford doctors, I suggest moving to Mexico or Canada, both of which have better health care systems than the United States for the average person.

[kenj]

Old topic revived and still 'unsolved'..
While Maxwatt has been helpful pushing vitamin D supplementation for resolving the joint pain in some, I don't think everyone will benefit from this.
I was one individual that felt the "joint pain" and weaker recovery from exercise when I took resv. 50% or 99%, it didn't matter. Took vitamin D consistently for MONTHS, in dosages 5,000IU-20000IU, IIRC, it didn't make a difference.

No supplement AFAIK can "fix" this strange "joint pain". I tested every contender over the last couple years, DHEA (as being mentioned), and I'm on a chronic heavy regiment anyway to keep inflammation low, including MSM, hyaluronic acid, silicon, minerals and vits for "bone/joint health", etc. I've taken it all almost.

Interestingly, high dose pterostilbene made the "joint pain" much worse.

or resveratrol may be aggravating it.

I think resveratrol (and pterostilbene) is aggravating *something*....

Edited by kenj, 04 September 2012 - 02:59 PM.

[Turnbuckle]

Old topic revived and still 'unsolved'..

Considering that CR failed to show a longevity advantage in a primate trial and the CR mimetic resveratrol didn't show enhanced longevity at the rodent level, and in addition caused me severe joint pain, I wouldn't touch this stuff again at any dose. It's a failed supplement, in my opinion.

[kenj]

Considering that CR failed to show a longevity advantage in a primate trial and the CR mimetic resveratrol didn't show enhanced longevity at the rodent level, and in addition caused me severe joint pain, I wouldn't touch this stuff again at any dose. It's a failed supplement, in my opinion.

What I find remarkable, is how the effects in individuals can vary so much. Topic starter got some severe joint pain from it (and other people as well) but then most people taking it don't get any joint pain whatsoever.

[Turnbuckle]

Considering that CR failed to show a longevity advantage in a primate trial and the CR mimetic resveratrol didn't show enhanced longevity at the rodent level, and in addition caused me severe joint pain, I wouldn't touch this stuff again at any dose. It's a failed supplement, in my opinion.

What I find remarkable, is how the effects in individuals can vary so much. Topic starter got some severe joint pain from it (and other people as well) but then most people taking it don't get any joint pain whatsoever.

I agree, most haven't had this reaction...yet. I didn't have one for about 2 years and now I'm sensitized to the stuff. Even a small amount after a few days is enough to cause joint pains. But that's just a side effect, so if there were truly a longevity effect, there might be an argument for its use.

Edited by Turnbuckle, 04 September 2012 - 04:37 PM.

[nowayout]

My data point, in case it might help someone.

All I can surmise from all the reports I have read is that resveratrol seems to jumpstart autoimmune or runaway inflammatory conditions in some people. I came down with symptoms similar to E.T.'s and others' coincident with a short course of resveratrol a few years ago during the peak hype. Eventually the pain localized in my shoulder and spine but never went away. After almost three years of being in a lot of debilitating pain I was finally diagnosed with ankylosing spondylitis (an autoimmune/inflammatory condition) based on imaging showing active bone marrow inflammation in the SI joint (probably not just there, but that is the standard site for diagnosis of this condition). There is no family history of it, and I am one of the 10% with this condition who do not have the genetic marker most commonly associated with it. I was started on a TNF blocker (Enbrel) that made a big difference within a couple of months, and have been doing much better in the year since.

I wish I had known better. Basically I lost three years of my life that I will never get back, not to mention a 10 year relationship that didn't survive my illness.

I see the same hype happening now with buckyballs. If I have any advice, it is that unless you are in really dire straits and it is your last hope, stay away from unproved supplements.

Edited by viveutvivas, 04 September 2012 - 05:24 PM.

[Turnbuckle]

I see the same hype happening now with buckyballs.

Rats lived nearly 90% longer with C60 but didn't live longer with resveratrol. So that's a big difference up front. And as for personal use, I've seen many positives from it (several which by themselves would be sufficient reason to take it) while I never saw anything at all from resveratrol until the joint pain. I was taking it on faith.

[zorba990]

I never got any joint pain from TRes, even as high as 2-3 grams liposomal. I've settled on just around 500mg for daily use. I take about 2-3 weeks off every now and then and the reduction in endurance starts at about the two week point. I never used anything less than 98% so never had any significant exposure to emodin if the emodin - quinolone connection has any merit : http://www.longecity...ing-quinolones/

[scottknl]

I've had some Achilles pain from resveratrol use over the last 4 years. I wear copper rings and necklace and I find it helps to reduce the pain quite a bit. I also supplement vitamin D, 5000 mg/day. I reduced my intake to 10 - 30 mg per day with wine. Last week I made a personal best 10 Km best time in 44 minutes. I'm trying to run a 42 minute 10k this year as a goal.

edit: added vitamin D.

Edited by scottknl, 04 September 2012 - 07:12 PM.

[kenj]

My data point, in case it might help someone.

All I can surmise from all the reports I have read is that resveratrol seems to jumpstart autoimmune or runaway inflammatory conditions in some people. I came down with symptoms similar to E.T.'s and others' coincident with a short course of resveratrol a few years ago during the peak hype. Eventually the pain localized in my shoulder and spine but never went away. After almost three years of being in a lot of debilitating pain I was finally diagnosed with ankylosing spondylitis (an autoimmune/inflammatory condition) based on imaging showing active bone marrow inflammation in the SI joint (probably not just there, but that is the standard site for diagnosis of this condition). There is no family history of it, and I am one of the 10% with this condition who do not have the genetic marker most commonly associated with it. I was started on a TNF blocker (Enbrel) that made a big difference within a couple of months, and have been doing much better in the year since.

I wish I had known better. Basically I lost three years of my life that I will never get back, not to mention a 10 year relationship that didn't survive my illness.

I see the same hype happening now with buckyballs. If I have any advice, it is that unless you are in really dire straits and it is your last hope, stay away from unproved supplements.

Thank you for this information, and I'm sorry you had to go through that experience.

[Lufega]

Two supplements that could be helpful for the resveratrol induced joint pain are Sesamin and cissus quadrangularis. Both have mild estrogenic activity and protect/rebuild the tendons.

[platypus]

I see the same hype happening now with buckyballs.

Rats lived nearly 90% longer with C60 but didn't live longer with resveratrol. So that's a big difference up front. And as for personal use, I've seen many positives from it (several which by themselves would be sufficient reason to take it) while I never saw anything at all from resveratrol until the joint pain. I was taking it on faith.

Didn't people report a large list of postives from 500mg resv daily as well?

[Turnbuckle]

Two supplements that could be helpful for the resveratrol induced joint pain are Sesamin and cissus quadrangularis. Both have mild estrogenic activity and protect/rebuild the tendons.

I tried cissus for a damaged tendon and got the same joint pains I'd experienced previously from resveratrol. Then I discovered that there was resveratrol in cissus.

BTW, cissus was hawked by Julius Oben for weight and cholesterol reduction, but it doesn't work. Nothing this guy from Cameron claims (mostly for weight and cholesterol) ever seems reproducible, and if you read his papers carefully, they raise many red flags.

Edited by Turnbuckle, 04 September 2012 - 09:29 PM.

[Turnbuckle]

I see the same hype happening now with buckyballs.

Rats lived nearly 90% longer with C60 but didn't live longer with resveratrol. So that's a big difference up front. And as for personal use, I've seen many positives from it (several which by themselves would be sufficient reason to take it) while I never saw anything at all from resveratrol until the joint pain. I was taking it on faith.

Didn't people report a large list of postives from 500mg resv daily as well?

I'm not saying it didn't do some good. I'm saying that the major interest in it was for longevity and that's not panning out. And worse is the serious side effect that those selling it don't warn their customers about.

[gomesbs]

Hi! I also was diagnosed with Ankylosing Spondylitis 3 years ago, at the time I was taking resveratrol but I had previous symptoms of the disease.

When I was diagnosed I had my knees, hips and neck very inflamed, barely couldn't move. Stopped resveratrol then.

Months later resumed res. Until now I am symptoms free and no pain (fingers crossed here) and great fitness level. Maybe my flare was from a reactive arthritis but nevertheless never had tendon pain from res.

I also been keeping my D levels in 50 ng/l due to the autoimmune condition, but maybe helped with resveratrol side effects.



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[maxwatt]

Resveratrol has been reported to aggravate auto-immune conditions such as RA or Ankylosing Spondylitis, but this appears to be inconsistent and dose dependent. Symptoms such as tendon pain have usually manifested after an increase in dose, or taking large (>500 mg) doses from the start. In some cases such as the above, resumption at a lower dose does not produce symptoms.

However, exercise caution. Resveratrol as with most high doses of even naturally occuring substances, can have strong effects. With any supplement of this sort, it would be wise to start with a low dose and gradually increase to assess effects and tolerance.

Edited by maxwatt, 06 September 2012 - 07:01 PM.

[Junk Master]

Isn't the definition of a worthless supplement one that doesn't have a strong effect?

I'd guess with most of the joint pain sides would be resolved with 50 mg oral DHEA, every other day; at least in those over 40 years old.

[zorba990]

Isn't the definition of a worthless supplement one that doesn't have a strong effect?

I'd guess with most of the joint pain sides would be resolved with 50 mg oral DHEA, every other day; at least in those over 40 years old.

Why?

[Anthony_Loera]

Look, maybe i secretly have alien DNA, or maybe have a super fast metabolism that instantly metabolizes res, or... i am simply a normal guy without any extraordinary sickness or autoimmune illness...

The fact is that I have taken res since 2006 at gram levels.. at one point i even went up to 15 grams a day...all without issue.

I really find it difficult to understand what some folks here have reported.

Even thefirstimmortal who posted on this forum didnt have this issue, when he was alive fighting for his life... and he was taking large, large amounts of res for a while...

i still fijd it difficult, but i do understand that some folks simply have issues with res, and side with maxwatt on this, not with turnbuckle.

The fact is that there are too many people that have benefited greatly from resveratrol. If i were you, consider looking up Dr. 'Snuffy' Myers on the internet. See his CV as he is no lightweight in his field... and ask him what he believes res has done for his patients.

Will res work for everyone? no... but does it work for many? oh yes.

Cheers

A

[Turnbuckle]

Look, maybe i secretly have alien DNA, or maybe have a super fast metabolism that instantly metabolizes res, or... i am simply a normal guy without any extraordinary sickness or autoimmune illness...

The fact is that I have taken res since 2006 at gram levels.. at one point i even went up to 15 grams a day...all without issue.

I really find it difficult to understand what some folks here have reported.

Even thefirstimmortal who posted on this forum didnt have this issue, when he was alive fighting for his life... and he was taking large, large amounts of res for a while...

i still fijd it difficult, but i do understand that some folks simply have issues with res, and side with maxwatt on this, not with turnbuckle.

The fact is that there are too many people that have benefited greatly from resveratrol. If i were you, consider looking up Dr. 'Snuffy' Myers on the internet. See his CV as he is no lightweight in his field... and ask him what he believes res has done for his patients.

Will res work for everyone? no... but does it work for many? oh yes.

Cheers

A

It is not encouraging that a person selling something assures us that it is safe based on his own experience while disparaging multiple reports that it has problems. As for Dr. 'Snuffy' Myers, I see that he recommends your brand of resveratrol, so that raises the questions...has he ever received any benefits from Revgenetics? Does he recommend that everyone take it, or only those with specific problems?

[niner]

I see the same hype happening now with buckyballs.

I'm sorry to hear about all that you went through, that sounds awful. There is a big difference in hype between resveratrol and C60. With resveratrol, the first thing everyone heard about it was that it was a "CR mimetic" and that it was responsible for the French "Paradox". We had a very long wait before it was shown to be ineffective for life extension in mammals. On the other hand, with C60, there was no lead story. The first thing everyone heard was Baati's startling results. The media hype for resveratrol was huge, while after an initial stir, the C60 story seems dead in the media. Most of the early reports of resveratrol wonderfulness (euphoria, appetite suppression...) were the result of the other compounds found in 50% extracts. Eventually, the useful effects of resveratrol (anti-inflammatory effects, mitochondrial biogenesis...) became apparent, as did the harmful pro-inflammatory side effects that some of us saw. So far, the effects that people are reporting from C60 range from not noticeable in young healthy people to jaw-dropping improvements in the health of three people who were in pretty bad shape- two with respiratory problems and one with a suspected mitochondrial dysfunction. Serious side effects have yet to emerge, which doesn't mean they won't. I think that C60-oo is going to prove useful in a host of disease states characterized by ROS, hypoxia, or mitochondrial insufficiency. Some examples are asthma, COPD, pulmonary fibrosis, congestive heart failure, and possibly fibromyalgia/CFS.

So, compared to resveratrol, I would say that C60 hype has some solid basis, while resveratrol mostly did not. I think it will ultimately prove to be a far more important compound. I just hope that it doesn't turn out to have a hidden dark side. Only time will tell about that.

[Anthony_Loera]

It is not encouraging that a person selling something assures us that it is safe based on his own experience while disparaging multiple reports that it has problems. As for Dr. 'Snuffy' Myers, I see that he recommends your brand of resveratrol, so that raises the questions...has he ever received any benefits from Revgenetics? Does he recommend that everyone take it, or only those with specific problems?

Hi Turnbuckle,

No Dr. 'Snuffy' Myers has never received any benefits from RevGenetics, and yes Turnbuckle, I can assure you that I and my family have had a great experience taking resveratrol that we make sure is pure as heck, and no... no one has complained either.

Now they only reason I personally believe Dr Myers started to recommends us, is because he called me personally a few years back and asked to provided him proof that our product was pure, and we did. We also test all our batches and don't practice skip-lot testing that the FDA allows.

Since we have never provided him any benefits, I can only assume he still recommends us because his patients and some tests have been coming out positive after taking our resveratrol . I will add that he did tell me that he started to look for a pure resveratrol product after his previous recommended resveratrol product manufacturer started adding things to the formulation that he didn't want for his patients and that the manufacturer did not (and would never) provide larger capsules... they could only provide the extremely low dose 100mg capsules at the time.

I have a high respect for the man, regardless if he continues to recommend our product or not.

Look Turnbuckle, it appears you don't like me because I do not agree with your opinion. However, if you really are interested to see if resveratrol has actually helped people, consider emailing or talking to Dr. Myers who has had thousands of patients and the data from which he recommends specific products internally to his patients. He doesn't have a commercial interest and doesn't care to make commercials or add his name to anyone's brand or product.

I appreciate he recommends RevGenetics Resveratrol for the time being, but I also know his patients come first. I suspect that if he ever finds something better than our 99% pure micronized resveratrol, he will recommend it to his patients without hesitation. Make no bones about it, this doctor puts patients first.

Here is Dr. Myers Video Log:
http://askdrmyers.wordpress.com/

But I believe you can reach him on his forum here:
http://www.prostatef...t-dr-myers.html

Cheers
A

[Turnbuckle]

No Dr. 'Snuffy' Myers has never received any benefits from RevGenetics, and yes Turnbuckle, I can assure you that I and my family have had a great experience taking resveratrol that we make sure is pure as heck, and no... no one has complained either....

Look Turnbuckle, it appears you don't like me because I do not agree with your opinion. However, if you really are interested to see if resveratrol has actually helped people, consider emailing or talking to Dr. Myers who has had thousands of patients and the data from which he recommends specific products internally to his patients. He doesn't have a commercial interest and doesn't care to make commercials or add his name to anyone's brand or product.

This has nothing to do with likes or dislikes, Anthony. This has to do with selling a product without informing the public that there might be a severe side effect. You are not the only one doing this, by any means, but you are the only vendor here defending resveratrol with personal anecdotes rather than scientific studies.

As for Dr. Myers, I have no interest in being sold on resveratrol as I don't plan on ever using it again, but you of all people should be comparing notes with him. You should be saying, look, I'm selling the stuff and you're prescribing the stuff, but some are reporting a serious side effect with other brands, so what do you think? You see any of this with Revgenetics resveratrol? And if he says he hasn't, you can use this in your marketing. Perhaps the problem isn't resveratrol at all but the impurities, and yours is so pure that there isn't a problem.

Edited by Turnbuckle, 09 September 2012 - 11:07 AM.

[Supierce]

Niner, I don't agree that res promotion is simply hype. Don't we have piles of very positive studies on PubMed?

[Anthony_Loera]

Turnbuckle,

The fact is that you posted an opinion that res caused a 'side effect' to you personally. Now we all can't know much about you except your opinion.

however, the supplement industry has a method to report these types of adverse events. In fact each bottle is required by a labeling law to furnish info on where to call to report incidences.

Now i expect you did your duty and report the adverse event? Didnt you?

What brand were you taking?

Now, since you can post your opinion, why do you feel i could not also posted my experience with res? Because we manufacture and sell it, doesn't mean i am not allowed to be proud of our great product and my experience with it?

Heck, i dont hide who i am behind an anonymous nickname... you simply know who i am. Lastly i have also posted my Biophysical 250 results so people know i am no super alien from mars, but more of a normal guy in my early forties.

Regarding safety... we state on the label to consult your doctor before use if you have had or have a current health condition. If you were are a normal guy without health conditions like me, you may also be praising res.

Instead, you may not be so healthy or normal... and may simply need to consult your doc, thats all. Don't take it in a bad way, it maybe a just a reason to be somewhat cautious and go see a doc.

Cheers
A

[gizmobrain]

Just to add my n=1: Taking 100mg or more of Trans Resveratrol prevents my body from healing properly after my labor-intensive job shift, and I've never been able to find anything to stack with it that will prevent this from happening. At some point, I might go back and try to figure this out after I get a new job, but I couldn't afford to be in pain every day at work. The cumulative damage by the end of each week caused my hands, wrists, and forearms to be in constant pain.

Edited by zrbarnes, 09 September 2012 - 09:35 PM.

[Turnbuckle]

however, the supplement industry has a method to report these types of adverse events. In fact each bottle is required by a labeling law to furnish info on where to call to report incidences.

Thank you for pointing that out. The bottle did not have any such reporting information, so I tried to submit an adverse report with the FDA. Their form was not working properly, so I will try again later. The sooner they come down on the lack of warning labels or pull it from the market, the better.

[maxwatt]

i would not want to see it pulled from the market; it has many reported benefits in humans by now (vis a vis glucose control for example), and not just those reported in this group. I believe it will prove useful in treating sarcopenia in the aged and in others. That some people have joint issues or autoimmune issues is unfortunate, but not possible to quantify absent proper testing. If it were as much as 10 or even 5 percent of those taking it, I think the FDA would have noticed by now and taken action like they did with ephedra. Sirtris' testing of doses up to 5 grams in a fairly large sample for several months did not turn up joint pain as an effect, so I doubt it is common.

Prescription drugs come with a list of side effects, some of which look pretty gruesome. Side effects are noted even if there are only a few cases. If you are taking something like a purified natural substance at high doses without carefully titrating the dose you might be unlucky.

[kenj]

Just to add my n=1: Taking 100mg or more of Trans Resveratrol prevents my body from healing properly after my labor-intensive job shift, and I've never been able to find anything to stack with it that will prevent this from happening. At some point, I might go back and try to figure this out after I get a new job, but I couldn't afford to be in pain every day at work. The cumulative damage by the end of each week caused my hands, wrists, and forearms to be in constant pain.

Yeah, this was my experience as well. It would take more than 100mg, more like 300+mg.
My job is not 'labor-intensive', but I could definitely feel the lack of proper recovery if I took resv around vigorous exercises.
Plus, there is the tendonitis link, that is worrisome. Not for all, obviously, but for me, at least.

i would not want to see it pulled from the market; it has many reported benefits in humans by now

That would be unfortunate, I agree.