29 replies to this topic

[jameskin]

I'm really interested in how much you guys take daily.

I've had some really mixed effects from piracetam until now. The first few days I took it, I noticed a lot of changes; more visual clarity, more creativity (especially when playing an instrument) and more energy. I also felt a bit more confidence and less anxiety, I felt I was seeing the world a bit better (like I was actually 'taller'). Anyway, this lasted for only five days and since yesterday I have not really noticed anything different from it.

I started with approximately 5gr piracetam (2x 2.5gr) daily and 1x 250gr choline. Now I'm taking a bit more and less piracetam just to experiment (max 8 gr a day). I haven't increased the choline dosage yet, though.

Any ideas/suggestions are more than welcome! Thanks.

Greetings from the Netherlands

[kikai93]

I'm really interested in how much you guys take daily.

I've had some really mixed effects from piracetam until now. The first few days I took it, I noticed a lot of changes; more visual clarity, more creativity (especially when playing an instrument) and more energy. I also felt a bit more confidence and less anxiety, I felt I was seeing the world a bit better (like I was actually 'taller'). Anyway, this lasted for only five days and since yesterday I have not really noticed anything different from it.

I started with approximately 5gr piracetam (2x 2.5gr) daily and 1x 250gr choline. Now I'm taking a bit more and less piracetam just to experiment (max 8 gr a day). I haven't increased the choline dosage yet, though.

Any ideas/suggestions are more than welcome! Thanks.

Greetings from the Netherlands

Do you suffer from deep vein thrombosis? Also, am I reading that right, 250 GRAMS of choline? What sort of choline supplement do you use? How do you spread out your piracetam/choline? Do you take it all at once in the morning?

[longevitynow]

I take 500 mgs of choline in the AM with whatever my Piracetam dose is, typically 3-4000mg. may take a little more Piracetam later, but don't usually do more choline. Never get headaches when I do this. Sometimes get HA without choline. EGGs, despite choline content, don't prevent my Piracetam HA.

[caruga]

Lately anything above 400mg of piracetam makes me feel dark and like my brain is shutting down, and I find it very hard to rouse myself from sleep, unless I take large doses of choline and dmae (around 1:1:1 ratio). Adding alcar to the mix seems to increase the "darkening" experience.

[Moddy2012]

Choline makes me drowsy but taking piracetam without choline is a really bad idea. Personally since going on Modafinil I will never bother with Piracetam. And anyone saying that Piracetam works better than the traditional ADD meds is full of it.

[Guacamolium]

For me, it's something like:

Piracetam 4.4grams/Alpha-GPC 600mg/ALCAR 1.5 grams
Oxiracetam 1gram/Alpha-GPC 600mg/ALCAR 1.5 grams
Aniracetam 1gram/...
Pramiracetam 400mg/...
Noopept 20mg/900mg Alpha-GPC/1.5grams ALCAR

(obviously taken on different days from one another)

CDP-choline doesn't really work that well for me, centro is good but too expensive, choline bitartrate is worthless for me, and choline citrate is in the middle. I actually respond very well to huperzine-A, but I try not to take it everyday. Galantamine doesn't really work that well for me.

I really want to try some other racetams other than the main four and phenylpiracetam and Noopept. It'd be nice if vendors had a vast array of different ones, other than nefiracetam.

[^ risetolower v]

I'm taking six teaspoons of piracetam daily and I don't have to take ANY choline to get positive effects from piracetam. Piracetam by itself makes me depressed, dull, and apathetic. But with lots of fish oil, the effect is the complete opposite! My sleep quality is greater than ever before. I can recall multiple dreams per night, with little incidence of nightmares. I feel even more motivated than before and acting in the way people like has never been easier!

[caruga]

How much fish oil?

Anyone know any science to back up the effect experienced here?

[^ risetolower v]

How much fish oil?

Anyone know any science to back up the effect experienced here?

The only thing I remember possibly related to it is that "Piracetam is thought to increase cell membrane permeability." suggesting perhaps fats like those in fish oil are needed for this. At first, I tried piracetam with fish oil and it was working great, but I stopped taking fish oil and within a few days, I felt dull, unstimulated, apathetic, etc. so I tried fish oil again, and the great effects came back. I'm taking 10g fish oil three times daily, which is probably an unnecessarily high dose since it took a few days for my brain to get rid of the fish oil (or something like that). Don't forget that it's a fat we're talking about, and taking a few grams isn't likely to have much benefit.

Edited by ^ risetolower v, 19 January 2011 - 05:42 AM.

[caruga]

How much fish oil?

Anyone know any science to back up the effect experienced here?

The only thing I remember possibly related to it is that "Piracetam is thought to increase cell membrane permeability." suggesting perhaps fats like those in fish oil are needed for this. At first, I tried piracetam with fish oil and it was working great, but I stopped taking fish oil and within a few days, I felt dull, unstimulated, apathetic, etc. so I tried fish oil again, and the great effects came back. I'm taking 10g fish oil three times daily, which is probably an unnecessarily high dose since it took a few days for my brain to get rid of the fish oil (or something like that). Don't forget that it's a fat we're talking about, and taking a few grams isn't likely to have much benefit.

It's interesting that yo umention the permeability. I don't know if it's the cause of what i've experienced but I've become more responsive to other substances after supplementing with piracetam (rhodiola rosea especially, then theanine and caffeine).

I know a good supplier of high dose figh oil but it tastes horrendous, taking 10 grams would feel quite nasty on my stomach (I learned from experience when I took about 15 grams when I first got the bottle--to no effect I might add).

[^ risetolower v]

It's interesting that yo umention the permeability. I don't know if it's the cause of what i've experienced but I've become more responsive to other substances after supplementing with piracetam (rhodiola rosea especially, then theanine and caffeine).

I know a good supplier of high dose figh oil but it tastes horrendous, taking 10 grams would feel quite nasty on my stomach (I learned from experience when I took about 15 grams when I first got the bottle--to no effect I might add).

http://www.vitacost.com/NSI-Fish-Oil-EPA-360-mg-DHA-240-mg

This is the cheapest molecular distilled fish oil I could find on the internet. I'm using it right now and I'm keeping it in the freezer. It has close to no smell and it doesn't smell bad either. I get no "fishy burps" from it.

[caruga]

I've never experienced the colour intensity with piracetam before, but today, after taking my 500mg piracetam morning dose, and then dosing 500mg of alcar 4 hours later, I experienced the colour intensity about 20 minutes after the ALCAR dosage... I have to say it is really intense (experiencing it right now), it looks like the contrast volume is turned right up. The pink in my hands almost looks red. It's kind of annoying me actually.

Also i've gotten quite intolerent to ALCAR after being on piracetam for a few weeks (at varying dosages as I try to figure it out). I used to be able to take 3 grams or more of it and have this really wired feeling for ages afterward, which helped with my attention wandering (Don't know if I have ADD or not). But eventually when reaching 5 grams I started getting diaharrea and continued getting it even when I scaled back to 2 grams, so I stopped taking it completely. I only really returned to using it after starting piracetam and I respond to the much smaller doses that most people go for, and I've become a responder to other substances as well. So far for me piracetam has been much more an enabler of other substances than a useful substance in itself.

[caruga]

It's interesting that yo umention the permeability. I don't know if it's the cause of what i've experienced but I've become more responsive to other substances after supplementing with piracetam (rhodiola rosea especially, then theanine and caffeine).

I know a good supplier of high dose figh oil but it tastes horrendous, taking 10 grams would feel quite nasty on my stomach (I learned from experience when I took about 15 grams when I first got the bottle--to no effect I might add).

http://www.vitacost.com/NSI-Fish-Oil-EPA-360-mg-DHA-240-mg

This is the cheapest molecular distilled fish oil I could find on the internet. I'm using it right now and I'm keeping it in the freezer. It has close to no smell and it doesn't smell bad either. I get no "fishy burps" from it.

Thanks, although ordering to the UK will probably jack up the price a great deal.

[Ichoose2live]

I only take 250mg of CDP-Choline with 4g of Piracetam and 12g/day of Fish oil. The effects on me are very consistent.

[Justchill]

Are your effects of piracetam increased by the choline?
I'm now taking choline citrate (1:4)

[ayu]

Piracetam at 800mg made me sleepy, even with ALCAR and the 3-4 eggs that I eat. I'll try taking some with 10g fish oil, I have a half liter bottle coming tomorrow.

[AmericanEmpire]

I used to take 250 - 500 mg of choline as needed... from my small research it seems that possibly choline builds up...? I agree with this as now I do not have to take choline as much. I take a racetam every day, multiple times...and use choline maybe once a day or once every other day...whereas when i first started taking the racetams i required choline AT LEAST everytime i ingested a racetam..that is no longer the case..

[SuperjackDid_]

400mg PIR/ 600 mg Alpha GPC choline ,
right look too much choline ,but less than that ,so much headace .


i think Choline will built it up day to day if it not deplete all them out,in my experience.

[matter_of_time]

I take nootropics for five year and with a lot of positive results but I never found the perfect combo.

The only nootropic which made a big difference was Cerebrolysin.

After reading the topic of fish oil with piracetam, I thought I should give it a try. first I erased most of the fats from my diet and took 20 gram of fish oil for 3 days. Then I started taking 3 grams of piracetam/oxiracetam with 3 grams of fish oil in the morning and it was great. After two weeks I added the new Magnesium L-Threonate and I found the perfect combo.

[kassem23]

No choline, or other acetylcholine precursors, and Piracetam is working just fine!

[unregistered_user]

Likewise. Just fish oil with my piracetam.

[Dirk_Diggler]

I agree...you should have put an option for "No choline supplementation".

[Dantony]

Everyone suggests fish oil suppliments with noots. Is there any difference with flax oil supps.

[ScienceGuy]

Piracetam at 800mg made me sleepy, even with ALCAR and the 3-4 eggs that I eat. I'll try taking some with 10g fish oil, I have a half liter bottle coming tomorrow.

Piracetam at 800mg makes me sleepy as well. In fact Piracetam dosage of anything up to and including 1600mg induces severe drowsiness in me.

However, I find that a dosage of 5 GRAMS followed circa 3 hours later by a SECOND dosage of 5 GRAMS yields simply astonishing cognitive enhancing results without ANY drowsiness; in fact, it gives me a huge amount of both mental and phyisical energy. (N.B. Dosages as high as this have been used in human clinical studies).

And, I only need 200mg supplemental Choline to accompany this, which equates to a ratio of just 1:50. Less than this and I get a headache, above this I get depressed (which is a common side effect of too much choline, and is nothing to do with the Piracetam)

So for me Piracetam's sedating effects are VERY much dosage dependant.

Why not try out 5 GRAMS followed circa 3 hours later by a SECOND dosage of 5 GRAMS and see if that works of you too?

[synaptiq]

Everyone suggests fish oil suppliments with noots. Is there any difference with flax oil supps.

Not all omega-3s are created equal. Fish oil contains DHA and EPA. DPA is the predominant PUFA in the brain, and EPA has shown a number of therapeutic benefits in studies. Flax oil has neither, and only a tiny fraction of its ALA can be converted to DHA/EPA in the body. If you're vegetarian/vegan, there are algal DHA/EPA supplements that cost more than fish oil but are far more effective than flax oil. If your concern is mercury contamination or unsustainable fish harvests, look at krill oil - they're currently taken at less than 10% of the max sustainable harvest and are too far down the food chain to have accumulated anything worth worrying about.

[LBGSHI]

One issue with this poll, aside from the lack of a 'no choline source or precursor supplementation' option, is that the type of choline is not specified. Choline bitartrate, choline citrate, etc are different substances, and have different quality and quantity of effect. That's ignoring the fact that many people are supplementing with other choline sources or precursors, such as alpha-GPC, ALCAR, centrophenoxine, etc.

Edited by LBGSHI, 03 December 2012 - 03:47 PM.

[SuperjackDid_]

I think we should have another thread Piracetam/L-glutamic ratio .

[Godof Smallthings]

Choline makes me drowsy but taking piracetam without choline is a really bad idea.

People's brain chemistries vary a lot. Maybe it is a bad idea for you, but for me, any kind of choline supplementation causes severe neck tension, low mood and brain fog. I take my piracetam without supplemental choline, but get synergy effects when I take it with fish oil and ALCAR.

[BeginnersMind]

I thought Piracetam is water soluble.  Is there a reason why many of you suggest taking with fish oil?

[jroseland]

Similar poll for Piracetam: Alpha GPC here http://www.longecity...iracetam-ratio/