As suggested by YADAYADA I have started a new thread for the open discussion of everything relating to BPAP, including the current Group Buy, and for participants to post feedback and details regarding their experiences.
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Posted 14 January 2014 - 05:15 PM
Posted 14 January 2014 - 06:10 PM
Posted 14 January 2014 - 06:17 PM
Great thread, i was lurking the other thread but there is a password on it now? any details would be appreciated!
Posted 14 January 2014 - 06:41 PM
Posted 14 January 2014 - 06:47 PM
Posted 14 January 2014 - 06:56 PM
I just want to know the password. I am a member of the group buy.
It's ultimately bad for a public forum such as this one. I understand that yada probably wants to ameliorate some friction within the BPAP thread but it's not a long term solution.
Edited by ScienceGuy, 14 January 2014 - 07:09 PM.
Posted 14 January 2014 - 10:15 PM
Posted 14 January 2014 - 11:47 PM
Posted 15 January 2014 - 12:23 AM
ewwI'll soon be giving selegiline+BPAP a combo. Might be a double whammy. I've been impressed by my results with BPAP so far, selegiline+BPAP will be my new amph substitute if it works out.
Posted 15 January 2014 - 12:40 AM
Thank you for your concern. lolewwI'll soon be giving selegiline+BPAP a combo. Might be a double whammy. I've been impressed by my results with BPAP so far, selegiline+BPAP will be my new amph substitute if it works out.
seems like a bad combo, esp if you've had to call the ambulance to pick you up from a panic attack before, if i remember correct?
Posted 15 January 2014 - 02:18 AM
Posted 15 January 2014 - 03:06 AM
Posted 15 January 2014 - 05:53 AM
Today discovered that the original thread is password protected and restricted to the group buy members. I guess to get the password I have to PM yadayada. I dont like this as it would restrict discussion to a narrow group. Besides yadayada himself has switched to this new thread. So I post here...
...I decided to remove DMSO and replace it with other more tolerable solvent.
I was successful in drying out DMSO under vacuum in several smaller size vials. After drying there was a brown residue left supposedly BPAP. It is readily soluble in ethyl alcohol.
Ran RP HPLC. I cannot confirm the identity of the compound. But can say that I see more foreign contaminants by mass than the active compound itself...
Edited by ScienceGuy, 15 January 2014 - 05:54 AM.
Posted 15 January 2014 - 06:06 AM
Today discovered that the original thread is password protected and restricted to the group buy members. I guess to get the password I have to PM yadayada. I dont like this as it would restrict discussion to a narrow group. Besides yadayada himself has switched to this new thread. So I post here...
...I decided to remove DMSO and replace it with other more tolerable solvent.
I was successful in drying out DMSO under vacuum in several smaller size vials. After drying there was a brown residue left supposedly BPAP. It is readily soluble in ethyl alcohol.
Ran RP HPLC. I cannot confirm the identity of the compound. But can say that I see more foreign contaminants by mass than the active compound itself...
Personally I cannot fathom why on earth the supplier chose to firstly ship the product as a liquid as opposed to a powder; and secondly to use DMSO (of all things!) as a SOLVENT / PRESERVATIVE... utterly insane and nonsensical if you ask me... it's a potential NEUROTOXIN... see this for example:
Neurobiol Dis. 2009 Apr;34(1):1-10. doi: 10.1016/j.nbd.2008.11.006. Epub 2008 Dec 3.
Dimethyl sulfoxide (DMSO) produces widespread apoptosis in the developing central nervous system.
Hanslick JL, Lau K, Noguchi KK, Olney JW, Zorumski CF, Mennerick S, Farber NB.
Author information
Abstract
Dimethyl sulfoxide (DMSO) is a solvent that is routinely used as a cryopreservative in allogous bone marrow and organ transplantation. We exposed C57Bl/6 mice of varying postnatal ages (P0-P30) to DMSO in order to study whether DMSO could produce apoptotic degeneration in the developing CNS. DMSO produced widespread apoptosis in the developing mouse brain at all ages tested. Damage was greatest at P7. Significant elevations above the background rate of apoptosis occurred at the lowest dose tested, 0.3 ml/kg. In an in vitro rat hippocampal culture preparation, DMSO produced neuronal loss at concentrations of 0.5% and 1.0%. The ability of DMSO to damage neurons in dissociated cultures indicates that the toxicity likely results from a direct cellular effect. Because children, who undergo bone marrow transplantation, are routinely exposed to DMSO at doses higher than 0.3 ml/kg, there is concern that DMSO might be producing similar damage in human children.
PMID: 19100327
Posted 15 January 2014 - 08:00 AM
Posted 15 January 2014 - 03:18 PM
Edited by lourdaud, 15 January 2014 - 03:20 PM.
Posted 15 January 2014 - 04:17 PM
Posted 15 January 2014 - 07:48 PM
Posted 15 January 2014 - 09:00 PM
Today discovered that the original thread is password protected and restricted to the group buy members. I guess to get the password I have to PM yadayada. I dont like this as it would restrict discussion to a narrow group. Besides yadayada himself has switched to this new thread. So I post here...
...I decided to remove DMSO and replace it with other more tolerable solvent.
I was successful in drying out DMSO under vacuum in several smaller size vials. After drying there was a brown residue left supposedly BPAP. It is readily soluble in ethyl alcohol.
Ran RP HPLC. I cannot confirm the identity of the compound. But can say that I see more foreign contaminants by mass than the active compound itself...
Personally I cannot fathom why on earth the supplier chose to firstly ship the product as a liquid as opposed to a powder; and secondly to use DMSO (of all things!) as a SOLVENT / PRESERVATIVE... utterly insane and nonsensical if you ask me... it's a potential NEUROTOXIN... see this for example:
Neurobiol Dis. 2009 Apr;34(1):1-10. doi: 10.1016/j.nbd.2008.11.006. Epub 2008 Dec 3.
Dimethyl sulfoxide (DMSO) produces widespread apoptosis in the developing central nervous system.
Hanslick JL, Lau K, Noguchi KK, Olney JW, Zorumski CF, Mennerick S, Farber NB.
Author information
Abstract
Dimethyl sulfoxide (DMSO) is a solvent that is routinely used as a cryopreservative in allogous bone marrow and organ transplantation. We exposed C57Bl/6 mice of varying postnatal ages (P0-P30) to DMSO in order to study whether DMSO could produce apoptotic degeneration in the developing CNS. DMSO produced widespread apoptosis in the developing mouse brain at all ages tested. Damage was greatest at P7. Significant elevations above the background rate of apoptosis occurred at the lowest dose tested, 0.3 ml/kg. In an in vitro rat hippocampal culture preparation, DMSO produced neuronal loss at concentrations of 0.5% and 1.0%. The ability of DMSO to damage neurons in dissociated cultures indicates that the toxicity likely results from a direct cellular effect. Because children, who undergo bone marrow transplantation, are routinely exposed to DMSO at doses higher than 0.3 ml/kg, there is concern that DMSO might be producing similar damage in human children.
PMID: 19100327
Posted 16 January 2014 - 12:19 AM
Posted 16 January 2014 - 12:26 AM
Posted 16 January 2014 - 11:35 AM
Posted 16 January 2014 - 05:12 PM
Posted 16 January 2014 - 05:55 PM
Posted 16 January 2014 - 07:41 PM
Experience Report
15 drops of bpap solution was drunk on an empty stomach followed by a little coffee.
20 min later: Feeling mentally focused. No physical stimulation. My current "ADD" seems to be accentuated if I don't make a conscious effort to focus. I did not sleep well last night so that might have some influence on the effects I am feeling.
35 min later: The coffee possibly is having a synergistic effect. When listening to music it is easier to hear the details. More effortless concentration. No rewarding feeling from doing activities as would be experienced with an amphetamine.
Uralsky found that at least 50% of the dried powder out of the dmso solution was impurities and if his calculation is correct with 14 drops equating to 100ug then perhaps 28 drops would be an appropriate dose. Maybe the effects will be more pronounced at that amount.
Posted 16 January 2014 - 08:06 PM
Today discovered that the original thread is password protected and restricted to the group buy members. I guess to get the password I have to PM yadayada. I dont like this as it would restrict discussion to a narrow group. Besides yadayada himself has switched to this new thread. So I post here to.
reporting my experiences.
I have received 23 mL of BPAP solution in DMSO at presumed concentration of 300 ug/mL, which makes total 7 mg BPAP.
Expected recommended dose is 100 ug or 333 uL.
Solution is supplied in a dropper bottle. Testing the dropper gives a weight of 10 drops = 258 mg. Considering density of DMSO is 1.1 this makes the volume of one drop = 23.5 uL thus containing ~7 ug BPAP. To dose 100 ug one needs 14 drops.
That was what I started with.
Dissolved it in small amount of water and swallowed.
Did not notice any particular effect other then bad smell persisting for couple days.
Following days tried reduced doses down up to 2 drops (14 ug). Smell was negligible but so other effects. One drop under the tong gave me not pleasant aftertaste for few hours potentially masking expected stimulating effect.
In retrospect I suspect the heated debate on the original thread could have contributed to my failing to experiencing of desired effects.
Unfortunately as I found I do not tolerate well DMSO. Pure DMSO is supposed to be odorless. Certain bacteria transform DMSO under hypoxic conditions into dimethyl sulfide (DMS) that has a strong disagreeable odor, similar to rotten cabbage.
So I decided to remove DMSO and replace it with other more tolerable solvent.
I was successful in drying out DMSO under vacuum in several smaller size vials. After drying there was a brown residue left supposedly BPAP. It is readily soluble in ethyl alcohol.
Ran RP HPLC. I cannot confirm the identity of the compound. But can say that I see more foreign contaminants by mass than the active compound itself. That is probably why it is brown in color. I am hesitant now whether I should continue with testing the BPAP I got.
Other than to test it by LC-MS one could compare it to other sourced BPAP. Vitaspace for example sells BPAP 8 mg for $150, which is cheaper than what I paid. I anyone buys there please let us know what is your experience with it. What form they provide it in, and how they deal with the stability issue?
Edited by meatsauce, 16 January 2014 - 08:08 PM.
Posted 16 January 2014 - 08:22 PM
Posted 16 January 2014 - 08:27 PM
but how do we even know that the DMSO was pure and not industrial grade? the DMSO seems a big problem to me here. Not only might it itself carry its own contaminants but also helps deliver whatever possible active impurities are in the BPAP.
Posted 17 January 2014 - 04:16 AM
Experience Report
15 drops of bpap solution was drunk on an empty stomach followed by a little coffee.
20 min later: Feeling mentally focused. No physical stimulation. My current "ADD" seems to be accentuated if I don't make a conscious effort to focus. I did not sleep well last night so that might have some influence on the effects I am feeling.
35 min later: The coffee possibly is having a synergistic effect. When listening to music it is easier to hear the details. More effortless concentration. No rewarding feeling from doing activities as would be experienced with an amphetamine.
Uralsky found that at least 50% of the dried powder out of the dmso solution was impurities and if his calculation is correct with 14 drops equating to 100ug then perhaps 28 drops would be an appropriate dose. Maybe the effects will be more pronounced at that amount.
Posted 18 January 2014 - 02:58 AM
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