672 replies to this topic

[bluemoon]

This is the first I've heard about this company. So he found another compound to increase NAD+. I suppose this will be prescription only and probably as expensive as hell?

 

Good guess.

[able]

This is the first I've heard about this company. So he found another compound to increase NAD+. I suppose this will be prescription only and probably as expensive as hell?

 

It sounds like the MIB626 they will be using in Phase 2 testing is the combo of NMN and H2s they used in this research published mar 2018.

 

The H2s did increase effectiveness.  But you're right, when it gets approved for a specific condition and becomes a prescription, it will cost at least 10x more, and a lot of people won't know they could get nearly the same benefit from straight NMN for far less.

 

Hopefully, we'll have more options from other companies like what Lawrence and friends are working on.  

[Ducky-001]

Does anyone know if Taurine could be used as a source of H2S with NMN? It's not mentioned in the patent here: RESETTING BIOLOGICAL PATHWAYS FOR DEFENDING AGAINST AND REPAIRING DETERIORATION FROM HUMAN AGING , but it has been found to increase H2S levels when supplemented:

 

From: https://www.ncbi.nlm...pubmed/26781281

 

We randomly assigned 120 eligible prehypertensive individuals to receive either taurine supplementation (1.6 g per day) or a placebo for 12 weeks. Taurine supplementation significantly decreased the clinic and 24-hour ambulatory BPs, especially in those with high-normal BP. Mean clinic systolic BP reduction for taurine/placebo was 7.2/2.6 mm Hg, and diastolic BP was 4.7/1.3 mm Hg. Mean ambulatory systolic BP reduction for taurine/placebo was 3.8/0.3 mm Hg, and diastolic BP was 3.5/0.6 mm Hg. In addition, taurine supplementation significantly improved endothelium-dependent and endothelium-independent vasodilation and increased plasma H2S and taurine concentrations.

 

After treatment for 12 weeks, the plasma taurine and H2S levels were significantly higher in the prehypertensive individuals treated with taurine (plasma H2S level: 43.8±20.82 µmol/L at baseline to 87.0±24.51 µmol/L after treatment; 

 

 

 

[able]

Does anyone know if Taurine could be used as a source of H2S with NMN? It's not mentioned in the patent here: RESETTING BIOLOGICAL PATHWAYS FOR DEFENDING AGAINST AND REPAIRING DETERIORATION FROM HUMAN AGING , but it has been found to increase H2S levels when supplemented:

 

From: https://www.ncbi.nlm...pubmed/26781281

 

 

Good question - it does sound promising from that research you found.

 

I haven't had a chance yet to research Taurine, but I had noticed ABN is using Taurine as a main ingredient in their new H2s stimulator product, so there must be something to it.

[LawrenceW]

An interesting study was just released.

 

Systemic inflammation during midlife and cognitive change over 20 years.

 

 

[LawrenceW]

Off topic?

 

This study:  NAD+ Intermediates: The Biology and Therapeutic Potential of NMN and NR

 

stated "Improved insulin secretion and inhibited inflammation"

 

Yet one more reason to take NAD+ precursors.

Edited by LawrenceW, 15 February 2019 - 11:45 PM.

[GABAergic]

Hello GABAergic.

 

Please reread post #1 of this thread to recap all the benefits that I couldn't feel but that did show up in my blood work. 

 

Do you actually take NMN?  I ask, because if you did, you wouldn't be asking these questions, as you would already have experienced all this for yourself.

 

ok i didnt read details throughout the whole thread, my mistake. ill go through when i have time. i just wanted to directly figure out for myself if to get this NMN or not because i have to figure out what to take for my depression and time is running out for me. costly or not, i can go to many other proclaims online beyond NMN since its expensive but so are other methods out there. none of which is scientifically proven! which is the sad part :(

[smithx]

... i have to figure out what to take for my depression and time is running out for me...

 

If you have serious depression the things to try are:

• Standard medical treatments plus therapy. Please do this ASAP, at least the therapy part (CBT is well studied and has evidence for its effectiveness)
• Making sure you don't have high inflammation, via c-reactive protein test, sedimentation test, etc. and treating that if you do
• Exercising daily for at least 30-45 minutes (proven to improve mood)
• Supervised (preferably) therapy with psilocybin, ketamine or esketamine, LSD, etc.

You could take NMN in parallel and it might even do something on its own (perhaps help reduce inflammation?), but you are much more likely to get meaningful results with some combination of the above.

[GABAergic]

i see. thanks! i did exercise so many times to help with depression because thats number one solution from all the forums and google results i get and it never helped with my depression really. it only made me a bit overexcited and agitated. i tried shrooms for depression too, low dose kind of helped, but its hard to measure so i went a bit over one time and i almost lost my mind!

anyway, ill still consider NMN as regime to help with depression, hopefully.

[NaHanyate]

Try meditation. It will work. Definitely.

[GABAergic]

i did try meditation. it didnt help with depression but it kind of calmed me down a bit only during , but not after. i guess im one of THOSE that just needs a pill :s

[Chrys]

DIY NMN Liquid Solution...

 

per ABN instructions I mixed 1 jar (12 grams) of NMN powder with 60 ml of distilled water (I'm using five15 ml bottles). Their instructions say '1 squirt' = 125 mg of liquid NMN. These are eye dropper bottles so it seems that one squirt wouldn't be enough. Is anyone else using this sublingual delivery method? Please confirm. I emailed ABN but haven't got a response.

 

 

....from ABN site

125 Mg per squirt
A full squirt from the squeeze bulb will empty a 15 ml bottle in about 20 squirts. So if you mixed 3 grams of powder in the 15 ml bottle, each squirt will deliver around 125-150 Mg of NMN

 

Thanks

[Chrys]

I heard back from ABN. 20 drops = 125 mg.

[GABAergic]

for the people who voted me off topic, try to pay attention, i was trying to and still am to figure out if NMN can work for depression. perhaps it has some anti depression mechanism? thanks if anyone figures it out and helps me here

[LawrenceW]

for the people who voted me off topic, try to pay attention, i was trying to and still am to figure out if NMN can work for depression. perhaps it has some anti depression mechanism? thanks if anyone figures it out and helps me here

 

 

The members that post on this forum could be described as pioneers and self-experimenters.  Some members have given you great advice, i.e. seek professional help.  As none have replied about their experience with depression and NMN, please feel free to assume that you are the pioneer in that arena and to please report back to us with your findings.

[stefan_001]

for the people who voted me off topic, try to pay attention, i was trying to and still am to figure out if NMN can work for depression. perhaps it has some anti depression mechanism? thanks if anyone figures it out and helps me here

 

Hi Gabaergic, there is a link between depressions and sirtuins. Sirtuins are linked to NAD+. So there is a link to NR or NMN:

http://www.timelessl...-to-depression/

[GABAergic]

yeah ill look into it, thanks. i just wish people are more open minded when it comes to discussion, meaning straying off topic for a bit just so you can get to the point, it takes patience, but please pay attention thanks

[Chrys]

@LawrenceW

 

  Can you give a hint on how often one needs to use it for activating antioxidant system? Paper says its 2 PM when NAD is low but is it every day or once or twice a week?

 

 

With every dose of NMN.

 

I want to use hydrogen peroxide as an activator but not sure of the dosage. In one of your post you said "3 drops per day diluted in 6 to 8 ounces of  water" but above you say with each intake of NMN (30 mg).

 

Can H2O2 be added to the NMN (in one batch) or should it be ingested separately? I use 15 ml eye dropper bottles; approximately 1 bottle per day (8 times x 30mg) - 5 drops at a time.

 

Also, I assume you are using 35% Food Grade H202. Is this right?

 

Thanks

 

Chrys

 

[Chrys]

So the batch I refer to is 'NMN + Water + H2O2'. Currently I'm using NMN + Water per the ABN instructions.

[Andey]

for the people who voted me off topic, try to pay attention, i was trying to and still am to figure out if NMN can work for depression. perhaps it has some anti depression mechanism? thanks if anyone figures it out and helps me here

 

  You could safely assume that it doesn't work for depression, at least for now there is no evidence for it.

People are quite categorical coz it looks like you are wasting time instead of looking for somebody who could prescribe you drugs that are proven to help. Depression is no joke and could wreak havoc in health very quickly.

If you adamant in not meeting a doctor, at least consider buying SSRI class drug or mirtazapine generic from India (alldaychemist.com etc), though you need to educate youself first on adverse effects, dosages etc

Edited by Andey, 22 February 2019 - 11:06 AM.

[Ducky-001]

yeah ill look into it, thanks. i just wish people are more open minded when it comes to discussion, meaning straying off topic for a bit just so you can get to the point, it takes patience, but please pay attention thanks

 

Since this is a personal experience thread i'll chime in. I think NAD precursors does help for mood / depression. When i'm trying the Fusion/Fission experiments of Turnbuckle, my mood tends to be considerably better when in fission (NAD+) state than in fusion (stearic acid). I can downright explode in the fusion state. I have a history of using SSRI's for a long time, but i'm off them now, and believe i will never go back. SSRI's just makes you numb and without positive or negative feelings, it's for sure not a happy pill. When on NMN and exercise i can feel happiness for the first time in many many years.

Edited by Ducky-001, 25 February 2019 - 08:02 AM.

[QuestforLife]

That's right, a tablespoon or two of 3% H2O2, swish it around for less than a minute, then rinse with out yo' dirty mouth with water. It says on the very bottle itself that the stuff is a mouthwash. I try not to do too much or for too long; yet it's indicated to destroy harmful dental bacteria and help heal gingivitis, and also whitens coffee-stained teeth. Test these benefits on yourself, prove it to you. Science isn't going to study this -- no money to be made here. Long term application? Who knows. Give it a break, too, use it cyclically. Sorry I'm off topic here :(

 

Just for information I do this too; been using 3% H2O2 instead of toothpaste for 2-3 years. Like sthira says, if you keep it in there too long you'll regret it - you get skin peeling in your mouth, but there is no doubt it is far superior to toothpaste.

 

I hadn't been to the dentist in 8 years - went recently - no problems whatsoever, in fact I've had worse plaque regrowth since he performed his 'cleaning' on the back of some of my teeth. I've learnt my lesson, I don't need a dentist.

[QuestforLife]

 

 

C. We believe that as with oral supplementation, homeostasis kicks in at around 4 weeks.

D. We believe that by keeping multiple anti-aging pathways in balance that the triggering of the homeostatic negative feedback loop can be avoided.

 

 

 

I wonder if the homeostasis mechanism is merely nicotinamide levels building up in the body?

 

We know from in vitro testing (see: https://www.ncbi.nlm...ubmed/22493485)that 5mMoles of nicotinamide induces mitophagy via increased NAD+, but that 20mMoles inhibits mitophagy through sirtuin inhibition. Therefore NMN, NR and Sirtuin activation will all lead to increased Nicotinamide levels, until the point the cycle limits itself by cutting off SIRT activation. Upregulating the NAMPT enzyme via sulphide donors or exercise (AMPK) will cycle it back to NMN and NAD+ at an increased rate, and Nrf2 activators will also use up NADH and produce NAD+, which explains how these pathways compensate for the homeostasis caused by constantly dosing with NMN.

[joesixpack]

i see. thanks! i did exercise so many times to help with depression because thats number one solution from all the forums and google results i get and it never helped with my depression really. it only made me a bit overexcited and agitated. i tried shrooms for depression too, low dose kind of helped, but its hard to measure so i went a bit over one time and i almost lost my mind!

anyway, ill still consider NMN as regime to help with depression, hopefully.

What medications are you on, it might have an impact on what advice you are being given.

[bladedmind]

I take 3 drops per day diluted in 6 to 8 ounces of water.

 

Lawrence, thanks for starting this thread and for your courtesy.   That/s 3 drops of the 35% H2O2 or the 3%?  

 

If the former, then caution in storage and usage...

[LawrenceW]

I take 3 drops of 35% per day diluted in 6 to 8 ounces of water.

Edited by LawrenceW, 26 February 2019 - 03:39 PM.

[MJC73]

Ok - long time lurker first time poster here

 

I thought I'd throw in my personal experience with NMN. 

 

I'm a 45 year old male in good general health and I'm currently taking one sublingual scoop of AlivebyNature's NMN along with 500mg Resveratrol and 500mg TMG morning and nighttime - this regimen was started 12 days ago.

 

I work out once or twice a week and hope to get a swim in the ocean on the weekends (weather permitting)

 

Unfortunately I couldn't get in to see my doctor to get my blood work done before I started (I was too excited to get going once the package arrived from the States and he was booked up the day that I was free) so all I've got a my observations of the experience so far. 

 

Here goes

 

- my general energy levels appear significantly improved, I feel more inclined to work out at the gym (I even did my first cardio session in a year or so)

- my bodyfat has dropped markedly to the point where it's become visually noticeable, bodyweight has not changed at 96kgs but this is no doubt related to the next point

- I have done personal best lifts at the gym that are 20-30% higher than my previous bests e.g 6 reps at 120kg deep back squats vs previous best of 100kgs (possibly some placebo effect here but I am definitely not feeling the levels of fatigue or DOMS I used to during heavy weight lifting sessions, I even put 140kgs on the bar to see how that felt and did 6 half reps and I think next leg day I'll try to hit that mark with at least some full reps)

- bowel movements are significantly more regular (twice a day at least vs once a day or every other day)

- my resting pulse that I take regularly with an app on my Iphone has gone from low to mid 60's to low to mid 50's

 

I'll counter all this by saying that my wife who is also taking the same regimen has noticed no improvements so perhaps all of these effects are primarily testosterone related.

 

My father who has stage 4 COPD and is in recent remission from lung cancer also started taking NMN at the same time. He was extremely skeptical and had no background on it but I badgered him to try it for me and he called me up a couple of days after starting it to ask if it was meant to lower your heart rate. He (or more specifically my mother who effectively nurses him) keeps very close notice of his heart rate and O2 levels as they point to any potential exacerbations that may end up in hospital visits and she documents this methodically. Due to his lung capacity being at 15% his resting pulse is consistently in the low 100's (107-115 would be normal for him and has been for years - it's truly a miracle that he's still alive at age 75). Anyway he called me on day 2 or 3 to ask what this stuff was as his resting heart rate was 89 and his O2 was 91 - these are spectacular numbers for him and he was in shock. He also had two bowel movements that day which is somewhat of a miracle again for him as he's on slow release morphine in the form of Ordine to counter panic attacks and his bowels are usually blocked to the point of requiring an enema to resolve the situation. He also appeared to me to be more physically active (although still primarily bed ridden). Unfortunately he stopped taking the NMN as he was urinating excessively during the night and was unsure if this was contributing to this, hopefully we can get him back onto it asap once they work out what is causing that problem (I'm sure the two are unrelated as he had the issue before he started taking the NMN but he was just being overly cautious). 

 

Anyway - apologies for the long post, I suppose I'm just excited to pass on my experience. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[able]

Ok - long time lurker first time poster here

 

I thought I'd throw in my personal experience with NMN. 

 

I'm a 45 year old male in good general health and I'm currently taking one sublingual scoop of AlivebyNature's NMN along with 500mg Resveratrol and 500mg TMG morning and nighttime - this regimen was started 12 days ago.

 

I work out once or twice a week and hope to get a swim in the ocean on the weekends (weather permitting)

 

Unfortunately I couldn't get in to see my doctor to get my blood work done before I started (I was too excited to get going once the package arrived from the States and he was booked up the day that I was free) so all I've got a my observations of the experience so far. 

 

Here goes

 

- my general energy levels appear significantly improved, I feel more inclined to work out at the gym (I even did my first cardio session in a year or so)

- my bodyfat has dropped markedly to the point where it's become visually noticeable, bodyweight has not changed at 96kgs but this is no doubt related to the next point

- I have done personal best lifts at the gym that are 20-30% higher than my previous bests e.g 6 reps at 120kg deep back squats vs previous best of 100kgs (possibly some placebo effect here but I am definitely not feeling the levels of fatigue or DOMS I used to during heavy weight lifting sessions, I even put 140kgs on the bar to see how that felt and did 6 half reps and I think next leg day I'll try to hit that mark with at least some full reps)

- bowel movements are significantly more regular (twice a day at least vs once a day or every other day)

- my resting pulse that I take regularly with an app on my Iphone has gone from low to mid 60's to low to mid 50's

 

I'll counter all this by saying that my wife who is also taking the same regimen has noticed no improvements so perhaps all of these effects are primarily testosterone related.

 

My father who has stage 4 COPD and is in recent remission from lung cancer also started taking NMN at the same time. He was extremely skeptical and had no background on it but I badgered him to try it for me and he called me up a couple of days after starting it to ask if it was meant to lower your heart rate. He (or more specifically my mother who effectively nurses him) keeps very close notice of his heart rate and O2 levels as they point to any potential exacerbations that may end up in hospital visits and she documents this methodically. Due to his lung capacity being at 15% his resting pulse is consistently in the low 100's (107-115 would be normal for him and has been for years - it's truly a miracle that he's still alive at age 75). Anyway he called me on day 2 or 3 to ask what this stuff was as his resting heart rate was 89 and his O2 was 91 - these are spectacular numbers for him and he was in shock. He also had two bowel movements that day which is somewhat of a miracle again for him as he's on slow release morphine in the form of Ordine to counter panic attacks and his bowels are usually blocked to the point of requiring an enema to resolve the situation. He also appeared to me to be more physically active (although still primarily bed ridden). Unfortunately he stopped taking the NMN as he was urinating excessively during the night and was unsure if this was contributing to this, hopefully we can get him back onto it asap once they work out what is causing that problem (I'm sure the two are unrelated as he had the issue before he started taking the NMN but he was just being overly cautious). 

 

Anyway - apologies for the long post, I suppose I'm just excited to pass on my experience. 

 

Thanks for posting.  Hope you can get your father back on it and are able to report back with some update.  I'd think someone in his condition would see the most benefit from it - especially if it can help get him back on his feet a little more.

 

I love the powder, but have trouble getting my dad to take it regularly.  Am hoping he will take the NAD+ drops more regular, but don't know if that will be as good as the NMN powder.

 

Edited by able, 06 March 2019 - 02:26 AM.

[bluemoon]

 my bodyfat has dropped markedly to the point where it's become visually noticeable, bodyweight has not changed at 96kgs but this is no doubt related to the next point.

 

This is hard to believe after taking NMN just 12 days, although there are no before and after percentages to indicate what "dropped markedly" means. 

[able]

This is hard to believe after taking NMN just 12 days, although there are no before and after percentages to indicate what "dropped markedly" means. 

 

 

I agree it is difficult to believe there could be a big fat loss from the NMN by itself.  

 

But he does say he has more energy and has been working out more.

 

I am quite regular in my eating and exercise, but even I can see a noticeable difference over 2 weeks of excess eating over the holidays, or 2 weeks of eating less and exercising more after the holidays.  Not like a "before and after" photo, but noticeable.

 

My question is, would you call it  a placebo effect, if you get a little more energy or feel a bit stronger,  and that inspires you to exercise more?    

 

The additional exercise and increased motivation may be responsible for most benefits, but perhaps that was initiated due to a supplement.