• Log in with Facebook Log in with Twitter Log In with Google      Sign In    
  • Create Account
  LongeCity
              Advocacy & Research for Unlimited Lifespans

Photo
* * * * - 9 votes

Stem cell self-renewal with C60

c60 stem cells mitochondria fusion stearic acid aging hydroxytyrosol olive oil mct oil proliferation

  • Please log in to reply
2523 replies to this topic

#2131 Learner056

  • Guest
  • 96 posts
  • 3
  • Location:Lake Camelot, WI

Posted 10 November 2022 - 06:48 PM

This is insightful.  I have done well with this protocol (as well previously on the basic mito protocol).  I have now been helping my autistic son be on the basic mito protocol, so this knowledge is very important to me.  Can you help me develop some knowledge framework? as I need to help him better.  What I gather is that his cells are resistant to differentiation.  He is on lower dose of vyvanse (it helps him for one, stay awake, otherwise he sleeps most of day and night long).  I take a risk-based approach, I have found taking him off med altogether is untenable, so I take him off it during one Fission day, while he continues it on Fusion days (as I observe a good synergy of vyvanse like meds with mito fusion).  He is now doing a ratio of 4-5 fusion days to 1 fission day, to start with he was intolerant of fission altogether.  My hope long-term is he can do 1:1 ratio, and maybe even get rid of med altogether. 

 

 

 

In general, I believe it is healthier to be in fission than in fusion. Fission is needed for mitophagy and apoptosis, and without those, all bodily systems run down.

Fusion has its place, of course, but should be used judiciously. 

 



#2132 Repack Racing

  • Guest
  • 73 posts
  • 32
  • Location:Fairfax, CA
  • NO

Posted 10 November 2022 - 07:18 PM

This is insightful.  I have done well with this protocol (as well previously on the basic mito protocol).  I have now been helping my autistic son be on the basic mito protocol, so this knowledge is very important to me.  Can you help me develop some knowledge framework? as I need to help him better.  What I gather is that his cells are resistant to differentiation.  He is on lower dose of vyvanse (it helps him for one, stay awake, otherwise he sleeps most of day and night long).  I take a risk-based approach, I have found taking him off med altogether is untenable, so I take him off it during one Fission day, while he continues it on Fusion days (as I observe a good synergy of vyvanse like meds with mito fusion).  He is now doing a ratio of 4-5 fusion days to 1 fission day, to start with he was intolerant of fission altogether.  My hope long-term is he can do 1:1 ratio, and maybe even get rid of med altogether. 

 

I empathize and commend you for the continued efforts with your son.  My daughter was exposed to toxic mold (in drinking water) from age 8-14.  It's tough.  We have been working to get her back to baseline on things like cortisol.  Slow but steady, stick with it!
 



Click HERE to rent this advertising spot for C60 HEALTH to support Longecity (this will replace the google ad above).

#2133 Repack Racing

  • Guest
  • 73 posts
  • 32
  • Location:Fairfax, CA
  • NO

Posted 10 November 2022 - 08:17 PM

I have a few product sources to post.  For those using GMS, the best grade is called "distilled" GMS.  You can get it here, the quality is very good:  https://www.ebay.com/itm/284909381921

 

Alive by Science carries a new Liposomal CaAKG that is working well for me.  You can get it from their website.  Mine came rather quickly.  It's more expensive but, theoretically, you need less.  I just take one capsule a day,

 

Happy fusion!



#2134 Repack Racing

  • Guest
  • 73 posts
  • 32
  • Location:Fairfax, CA
  • NO

Posted 10 November 2022 - 09:06 PM

Here is a recipe alternative for those still using Stearic Acid.  While I truly appreciate the brownie recipe, it doesn't taste very good.  I have had success with the following simple recipe for Stearic Acid chocolate bar.  This does not include any DHM, which is simply inedible unless the situation is dire.

 

Recipe:

 

1 4oz bar of semi-sweet bakers chocolate (chocolate chips would work)

2 TBSP Sunflower lecithin

60g Stearic Acid

1 TBSP butter

1 TBSP truvia baking blend if you like it sweet

 

Add everything to a sauce pan at your stove's lowest heat (or double boiler, but I am not sure that gets it hot enough to really do the job).  Raise heat slowly until it's just hot enough to melt all the ingredients thoroughly but not burn.  I personally let it cook for 20 mins or so just below a heat that scorches the bottom.  Stir regularly.

 

Place parchment paper in the bottom of a square glass or plastic container.  Pour chocolate into container.  Cool in fridge or freezer.  Cut into the number of portions (I make 6).

 

Consume as needed.

 

If you are still putting DHM into brownies or another food, please be aware it is available as tablets.  One brand is "Double Wood" Supplements DHM1000.  There are others.  So much easier and no taste!

Attached Files


Edited by ildr, 10 November 2022 - 09:10 PM.

  • Informative x 2

#2135 Kelvin

  • Member
  • 198 posts
  • 32
  • Location:USA
  • NO

Posted 10 November 2022 - 09:48 PM

In general, I believe it is healthier to be in fission than in fusion. Fission is needed for mitophagy and apoptosis, and without those, all bodily systems run down.

Fusion has its place, of course, but should be used judiciously. It is necessary for SC proliferation, obviously, and it is protective when toxins are dealt with, and when ill with a virus*, as some viruses employ apoptosis to release their progeny. So fusion is good for SC expansion, hangovers, AD treatments, colds, flu, and the like. Fission is good for everything else.

You said earlier in the thread that fusion was damaging to cancer cells.

Sulforaphane, for example, is a hyperfusion promoter and it is being studied for anti-cancer properties.

Is fusion harmful to cancer because it forces the body and cancer cells to use oxygen instead of glycolysis? This would theoretically be bad for cancer cells because they are over dependent on glycolysis for energy because cancer usually has limited access to oxygen, unless the tumor is advanced and has managed to develop blood vessels for oxygen supply.

Also, on the subject of viruses, could a chronic viral infection be treated by first taking an antiviral cocktail such as olive leaf, PABA or oregano oil (or some other antiviral) and then taking fission supplements to trick dormant viruses to release their viral reservoirs straight into a brick wall (so to speak) of antiviral compounds that would neutralize the viruses before they can infect more cells?

This would both deplete the viral reservoirs by having fission release their viruses while the antivirals would prevent the released viruses from infecting more cells to replace the newly depleted reservoirs.

The overall result would be a reduced viral load in the body, perhaps even eradication with enough treatments.

What do you think?

Edited by Kelvin, 10 November 2022 - 09:53 PM.

  • Off-Topic x 1
  • Good Point x 1

#2136 Turnbuckle

  • Topic Starter
  • Guest
  • 4,499 posts
  • 1,830
  • Location:USA
  • NO

Posted 11 November 2022 - 02:06 AM

You said earlier in the thread that fusion was damaging to cancer cells.
 

 

Can you remind me where I said that?


  • Pointless, Timewasting x 1

#2137 Kelvin

  • Member
  • 198 posts
  • 32
  • Location:USA
  • NO

Posted 11 November 2022 - 05:06 AM

January 15th and 16th, 2019. #768
  • Pointless, Timewasting x 1
  • WellResearched x 1

#2138 Turnbuckle

  • Topic Starter
  • Guest
  • 4,499 posts
  • 1,830
  • Location:USA
  • NO

Posted 11 November 2022 - 10:38 AM

January 15th and 16th, 2019. #768

 

Thank you. I see where I made that comment on post 775 --  "Fusion is known to be bad for cancer cells."  That wasn't to say that fusion would actually kill cancer cells, but only slow their growth. From the link on that post --

 

Of note, the opposing force of mitochondrial fusion seems to slow growth of several cancer lines. As described above, MFN2 overexpression can reduce lung cancer growth

 

 

MFN2 is mitofusion 2, which promotes fusion. Fusion is associated with slower tumor growth, but isn't going to kill cancer cells, as far as I'm aware. This discussion was started in post 768, wherein I posted a senolytic protocol, and there was then speculation that it might be used with fusion instead of fission.

 

As for your previous question: Is fusion harmful to cancer because it forces the body and cancer cells to use oxygen instead of glycolysis?

 

No, I don't think that's it, because regardless of mitochondrial morphology, cancer cell mitochondria would still be loaded up with UCP2. But C60 would definitely force mitochondria into a more active state by blocking UCP2 pores, and that would surely not be good for cancer. I've long thought that C60+fusion might reduce the incidence of cancer for that reason. Referring back to the link --

 

The central player in mitochondrial fission is DRP1 (Dynamin-related protein 1).... A pool of DRP1 resides in the cytosol and must be recruited to the mitochondrial surface to mediate fission. .... Biochemical pathways present in normal cells are often co-opted in tumor cells to promote their growth. Cell cycle pathways are prime targets, and given the prominent effect of DRP1 on cell cycle, it is perhaps unsurprising that DRP1 seems to be activated in several cancer types....When MFN2 is overexpressed or DRP1 is inhibited, tumor growth is reduced in vitro and in vivo.

 

 

Since MFN2 appears to override DRP1, it also slows the progression of cancer. Of course, being in a constant state of fusion is not good either, as that would prevent apoptosis of senescent cells and eliminate mito QC.


Edited by Turnbuckle, 11 November 2022 - 10:59 AM.

  • Ill informed x 2
  • Needs references x 1
  • Informative x 1

#2139 ambivalent

  • Guest
  • 758 posts
  • 177
  • Location:uk
  • NO

Posted 11 November 2022 - 02:23 PM

I hadn't ingested nicotinamide for 5 years, except through the occasional B complex. I took one gram and that was fine so decided to take 5 grams with 15g fisetin and 3 grams of quercitin (allegedly given the source).

 

I felt groggy for a couple of hours over two days, knees were noticeably weaker, which I would attribute to either a deeper senolytic clean or raised uric acid levels.

 

I suspect raised uric acid was true of nicotinamide and believe have linked to it in the past, as well possibly as d-ribose. I was also a little coughy too, so likely raised histamine. The tiredness should have signalled fission so hopefully it was a good experiment. 

 

I note, TB, you mentioned taking nicotinic acid for decades, affirming the induced fission killed of dead cells. Are you suggesting this is as effective at inducing fission as nicotinamide, they have been opposites to me - and when any amount of nictonimade made me sick, niacin was the opposite. I would likely prefer to use nicotinic acid/niacin over nicotinamde. 



#2140 Turnbuckle

  • Topic Starter
  • Guest
  • 4,499 posts
  • 1,830
  • Location:USA
  • NO

Posted 11 November 2022 - 03:32 PM

Ambivalent: I don't recommend more than a gram of nicotinamide in a single dose. I've tried more and didn't find it useful. As for the niacin I was taking long ago, that was 1 gram three times a day. The half life of niacin is around an hour, while nicotinamide is about five times that. Both will raise NAD+ levels, but by slightly different pathways, so you should use the one you prefer. Many don't like the flush that accompanies niacin, and some -- those who aren't expecting it -- are thrown into a panic.


  • Needs references x 1

#2141 ambivalent

  • Guest
  • 758 posts
  • 177
  • Location:uk
  • NO

Posted 11 November 2022 - 03:47 PM

 Thanks, I'm fine with the flush, though - I've always quite liked it. If the fission is induced through raised NAD levels, then presumably sublingual NR, NMN will be fine as an albeit expensive substitute. 



#2142 Turnbuckle

  • Topic Starter
  • Guest
  • 4,499 posts
  • 1,830
  • Location:USA
  • NO

Posted 11 November 2022 - 03:58 PM

 Thanks, I'm fine with the flush, though - I've always quite liked it. If the fission is induced through raised NAD levels, then presumably sublingual NR, NMN will be fine as an albeit expensive substitute. 

 

 You aren't going to get much absorption sublingually, and as previously discussed, NMN promotes telomerase, and thus does exactly the opposite of what you want.


  • Needs references x 1

#2143 Kelvin

  • Member
  • 198 posts
  • 32
  • Location:USA
  • NO

Posted 11 November 2022 - 04:10 PM

No, I don't think that's it, because regardless of mitochondrial morphology, cancer cell mitochondria would still be loaded up with UCP2. But C60 would definitely force mitochondria into a more active state by blocking UCP2 pores, and that would surely not be good for cancer. I've long thought that C60+fusion might reduce the incidence of cancer for that reason. Referring back to the link --

So, correct me if I am wrong, but are you saying that if C60 blocks the UCP2 pores of cancer cells and sends the cancer into an active state WHILE fusion limits the access of cancer cells to glycolysis (which they usually prefer for energy over oxygen) that the cancer would be damaged by the combination because it would be in a state where it would need more energy than normal but not have access it?

Sort of like hitting the gas on an empty tank.

Did I interpret your statement right?

Edited by Kelvin, 11 November 2022 - 04:11 PM.

  • Pointless, Timewasting x 1
  • Good Point x 1

#2144 ambivalent

  • Guest
  • 758 posts
  • 177
  • Location:uk
  • NO

Posted 11 November 2022 - 04:23 PM

 You aren't going to get much absorption sublingually, and as previously discussed, NMN promotes telomerase, and thus does exactly the opposite of what you want.

 

Telemorase issues aside, while I don't have papers to hand, sublingual NMN/NR has been demonstrated as a more effective way of raising NAD+, though hasn't it?


  • Agree x 1

#2145 Turnbuckle

  • Topic Starter
  • Guest
  • 4,499 posts
  • 1,830
  • Location:USA
  • NO

Posted 11 November 2022 - 04:41 PM

So, correct me if I am wrong, but are you saying that if C60 blocks the UCP2 pores of cancer cells and sends the cancer into an active state WHILE fusion limits the access of cancer cells to glycolysis (which they usually prefer for energy over oxygen) that the cancer would be damaged by the combination because it would be in a state where it would need more energy than normal but not have access it?

Sort of like hitting the gas on an empty tank.

Did I interpret your statement right?

 

C60 will activate mitochondrial oxidative processes that are turned off in both normal SCs and in cancer cells by the overexpression of UCP2. DRP1 is promoted by cancer cells and MFN2 appears to override DRP1. MFN2 slows the growth of tumors, so the combination of two things cancer cells don't like does what? I don't know, offhand, but it doesn't sound like a healthy situation for cancer.


  • Off-Topic x 1

#2146 ambivalent

  • Guest
  • 758 posts
  • 177
  • Location:uk
  • NO

Posted 11 November 2022 - 04:51 PM

I should add that high dose sublingual NMN, several grams a day over a couple of weeks, was one of the three or so supplemental driven miracles I had experienced  - it was extraordinarily effective in recovering from the experimental damage I had suffered five years ago. 


  • Off-Topic x 1

#2147 kurt9

  • Guest
  • 271 posts
  • 28

Posted 11 November 2022 - 05:13 PM

Does this protocol help with reversing the "miniaturization" of head hair?



#2148 Kelvin

  • Member
  • 198 posts
  • 32
  • Location:USA
  • NO

Posted 11 November 2022 - 06:01 PM

MFN2 slows the growth of tumors, so the combination of two things cancer cells don't like does what? I don't know, offhand, but it doesn't sound like a healthy situation for cancer.


At a minimum it would make cancer more vulnerable to other anti-cancer compounds.

If you were to tweak the C60 protocol to maximize its destructiveness to cancer cells what (if anything) would you add or remove from it?

How about adding IP6 and quercetin to the protocol to push cancer cells into apoptosis?
  • Good Point x 2
  • Off-Topic x 1

#2149 Learner056

  • Guest
  • 96 posts
  • 3
  • Location:Lake Camelot, WI

Posted 11 November 2022 - 06:04 PM

Your comment is insightful. 

1) It made me realize that my energy levels have been absolutely great on this as well previous protocol (including my eyesight has improved), however my skin and hair pigment have not fared well.  A "negative" thought is that maybe this increased energy has translated to increased aging rate (evidenced by wrinkling and further pigmentary loss) maybe because I do not have the complete continuum of molecular machinery for mtDNA turnover:  Turnbuckle has helped us understand: a) Symmetric Proliferation (+Fusion -UCP2), b) Asymmetric Proliferation (+Fusion), and/or c) Differentiation (+Fission), would there be some components that have not been looked?

 

2) I do wonder, there is lot of research that purports mitochondrial dysfunction to longevity.  And the premise behind that research is that induction of mito dysfunction actually delays locomotor impairments to periods later in life.  So maybe the reason: real case study (Abe has DNA damage consequences i.e. Integrated stress responses, delayed development), he is resisting the standard Fission protocol to maintain his mito dysfunction state, as it is for better of the organism survival, reduced ATP, etc.?  And a negative thought I have is, that under the standard protocol i.e. Assymetric Proliferation (pseudo-differentiation) correcting the baseline mito dysfunction state can deplete SCs over time, and maybe that is why Abe is resistant to standard Fission (which further performs terminal differentiation).  

 

 

 

Given the relatively rapid turnover of skin cells, I would tend to think skin would be one of the first things to improve if this protocol works as hypothesized.  

 


Edited by Learner056, 11 November 2022 - 07:02 PM.


#2150 Learner056

  • Guest
  • 96 posts
  • 3
  • Location:Lake Camelot, WI

Posted 11 November 2022 - 07:54 PM

In my experience it helps, Kurt.  Though in my opinion:

a) the first step would be to decrease DHT (dihydrotestosterone). There are herbal methods as well pharmaceutical approaches (e.g. Finasteride) to decrease it.  In addition to that, there are Oral vs Topical approaches. 

b) peripheral blood circulation increase: Again Oral vs Topical (e.g. Rogaine) approaches.  I think this is where Turnbuckle's mitochondrial stack as well C60 stack also fit in, though they do a lot more.  E.g I used to use  'Woman Rogaine' though frankly since this protocol, I feel no need.  

 

Does this protocol help with reversing the "miniaturization" of head hair?

 


  • Dangerous, Irresponsible x 2
  • Off-Topic x 1
  • like x 1

#2151 Kelvin

  • Member
  • 198 posts
  • 32
  • Location:USA
  • NO

Posted 12 November 2022 - 03:59 PM

If you are going to enhance the anti-cancer properties of the protocol how would you tweak it?
  • Good Point x 3
  • Off-Topic x 1

#2152 Turnbuckle

  • Topic Starter
  • Guest
  • 4,499 posts
  • 1,830
  • Location:USA
  • NO

Posted 12 November 2022 - 09:32 PM

If you are going to enhance the anti-cancer properties of the protocol how would you tweak it?

 

Most (though not all) cancers are associated with age. These are the median ages from this site  --

 

Breast 62
Lung 70
Prostate 66
Colorectal 68
Bladder 73
Melanoma 63
Non-Hodgkin Lymphoma 63
Thyroid 51
Kidney 64
Leukemia 66
All Cancers 65
 

To a great degree this age will be the epigenetic age more so than chronological age, as it is known that disturbances in the epigenome can lead to cancer.  For example --

 

Aberrant DNA methylation of genes is closely linked to many aspects of tumor development. This study focuses on the effect of DNA hypermethylation of von Willebrand factor C domain containing 2 (VWC2) on colorectal cancer (CRC) progression and the underpinning mechanism. According to data in the bioinformatic systems, VWC2 had the highest degree of DNA methylation in colonic adenocarcinoma, and it showed DNA hypermethylation in rectal adenocarcinoma as well. 

https://pubmed.ncbi....h.gov/36353938/

 

 

Thus lowering epigenetic age with this protocol should lower your risk level to that of a person of lower chronological age. This wouldn't apply to already existing tumors, but as suggested above, UCP2 blocking and mito fusion might slow the growth of tumors. What can be done in addition to this with supplements, I can't say.


Edited by Turnbuckle, 12 November 2022 - 09:34 PM.

  • Informative x 2
  • Well Written x 1
  • Off-Topic x 1

#2153 Kelvin

  • Member
  • 198 posts
  • 32
  • Location:USA
  • NO

Posted 12 November 2022 - 10:48 PM

What can be done in addition to this with supplements, I can't say.

If C60 triggers oxidative processes to go off in an uncontrolled manner within cancer cells then perhaps Omega 3 supplements taken the night before the protocol would help.

DHA fats in Omega 3 are apparently not good for cancer cells (see link).

Cancer cells cannot store DHA in the type of carefully contained way they store other fatty acids which they must do in order to prevent ferroptosis whereby fatty acid lipids are oxidized and would risk destroying the cancer cell.

So if someone supplemented Omega 3 a day or a few days before taking your protocol any cancer cells would have already ingested DHA.

Then when C60 sets off oxidation in cancer cells the DHA already stored within them would react with C60-induced oxidation creating a ferroptopic chemical reaction that would destroy the cancer cell.

So the DHA would be the “C4 explosive” (so to speak) “implanted” into the cancer cell and the C60 would be the “detonator”.

Fusion would be an additional problem for cancer cells to deal with.

The one flaw with this idea is that C60 also triggers oxidative processes in healthy stem cells, which need to be suppressed for stem cells to preserve their immortality.

In theory, if DHA is stored in stem cells then the ferroptopic oxidative reaction would also destroy them, which is quite at odds with the purpose of the protocol.

How stem cells would react to DHA + C60 + mito fusion would depend on how they store fatty acids in general and how they store DHA in particular.

https://www.eurekale...releases/911071

Edited by Kelvin, 12 November 2022 - 11:12 PM.

  • Informative x 2
  • Off-Topic x 1

#2154 Turnbuckle

  • Topic Starter
  • Guest
  • 4,499 posts
  • 1,830
  • Location:USA
  • NO

Posted 12 November 2022 - 11:19 PM


The one flaw with this idea is that C60 also triggers oxidative processes in healthy stem cells, which need to be suppressed for stem cells to preserve their immortality.

In theory, if DHA is stored in stem cells then the ferroptopic oxidative reaction would also destroy them, which is quite at odds with the purpose of the protocol.

 

 

When SCs are activated, UCP2 pores disappear and the mitochondria become active, similar to what happens when C60 blocks them. So by that argument, DHA should accelerate aging by damaging stem cells. Does it?


  • Informative x 2
  • Off-Topic x 1

#2155 Kelvin

  • Member
  • 198 posts
  • 32
  • Location:USA
  • NO

Posted 12 November 2022 - 11:33 PM

When SCs are activated, UCP2 pores disappear and the mitochondria become active, similar to what happens when C60 blocks them. So by that argument, DHA should accelerate aging by damaging stem cells. Does it?

I’m not sure. I don’t have enough background in how stem cells use fatty acids.

But my best guess is no because nations that eat large amounts of fish like Greece and Japan tend to have good life expectancy.

Edited by Kelvin, 12 November 2022 - 11:35 PM.

  • Off-Topic x 1

#2156 Turnbuckle

  • Topic Starter
  • Guest
  • 4,499 posts
  • 1,830
  • Location:USA
  • NO

Posted 13 November 2022 - 01:00 PM

I’m not sure. I don’t have enough background in how stem cells use fatty acids.

But my best guess is no because nations that eat large amounts of fish like Greece and Japan tend to have good life expectancy.

 

 

I don't see anything re DHA reducing longevity, so it should be safe, but I also doubt that it would act the way you think it will -- as a "C4" explosive that oxidizes a cancer cell, because the research you linked to also used a DGAT inhibitor "that prevents the formation of lipid droplets." They investigated several, in fact, which improved the results via peroxidation. 

 

What is a DGAT?

 

Triglyceride accumulation is associated with obesity and type 2 diabetes. Genetic disruption of diacylglycerol acyltransferase 1 (DGAT1), which catalyzes the final reaction of triglyceride synthesis, confers dramatic resistance to high-fat diet induced obesity. Hence, DGAT1 is considered a potential therapeutic target for treating obesity and related metabolic disorders. https://journals.plo...al.pone.0027009

 

 

But that is out of reach for a supplement protocol (with the possible exception of xanthohumol). And there are other explanations for why DHA is bad for cancer cells, such as --

 

Inhibition of lung cancer growth and metastasis by DHA and its metabolite, RvD1, through miR-138-5p/FOXC1 pathway

Non small cell lung cancer (NSCLC) is one of the most common cancers in the world. DHA is known to be capable of suppressing NSCLC cell proliferation and metastasis. However, the mechanisms by which DHA exhibits its antitumor effects are unknown. Here we aimed to identify the effects and mechanisms of DHA and its metabolites on lung cancer cell growth and invasion...These data identified the RvD1/miR-138-5p/FOXC1 pathway as a novel mechanism by DHA and its metabolite, RvD1, and the potential of targeting such pathway as a therapeutic strategy in treating NSCLC.

 

 

In any case, adding DHA to the diet seems like a good prophylaxis, with or without the C60 protocol. The research you linked to also recommended it --

 

Our study positions the rewiring of lipid metabolism associated with tumor acidosis not as a druggable target to inhibit but as a cancer cell vulnerability that can be exploited to locally increase LC-PUFA effects. The well-established link between tumor acidosis and disease progression, including through increased invasiveness, drug resistance, and immune escape, makes dietary n-3 LC-PUFA supplementation a particularly relevant strategy to be implemented.

https://www.cell.com...33?showall=true

 

 


Edited by Turnbuckle, 13 November 2022 - 01:19 PM.

  • Informative x 2
  • Good Point x 2
  • Off-Topic x 1

#2157 Kelvin

  • Member
  • 198 posts
  • 32
  • Location:USA
  • NO

Posted 13 November 2022 - 08:49 PM

I don't see anything re DHA reducing longevity, so it should be safe, but I also doubt that it would act the way you think it will -- as a "C4" explosive that oxidizes a cancer cell, because the research you linked to also used a DGAT inhibitor "that prevents the formation of lipid droplets." They investigated several, in fact, which improved the results via peroxidation.

According to the paper DHA by itself had strong tumor inhibitory effects, both in vitro and in vivo with mice. The DGAT inhibitor simply enhanced the effect of DHA -

https://www.cell.com...t/S1550-4131(21[/url])00233-3?_returnURL=https%3A%2F%2Flinkinghub.elsevier.com%2Fretrieve%2Fpii%2FS1550413121002333%3Fshowall%3Dtrue

Mice were injected with HCT-116 cancer cells 2 weeks after initiation of either diet, i.e., at a time when mice of both groups were consuming the same daily amounts of food. The development of acidosis in these tumors was verified using a pHLIP peptide as an in vivo acid sensor. A highly specific accumulation of Alexa647-conjugated pHLIP peptide could be detected, whereas a control pH-insensitive peptide (K-pHLIP conjugated to Alexa568) failed to label tumors (Figure S13B). A significant tumor growth delay was observed in mice fed the DHA-rich diet (versus OA-rich diet) (Figure 6H), together with a significant prolongation of mouse survival (Figures 6I and S13C). Importantly, while the DHA-rich diet per se very significantly delayed tumor growth, DGAT1i further delayed tumor growth in mice fed the DHA-rich diet, but not the OA-rich diet (Figures 6H and 6I). GC-FID measurements of FA accumulated into tumors confirmed a net increase in n-3 PUFAs as FFAs, PL, and NL for the mice fed the DHA-rich diet (versus OA-rich diet) (Figure 6J). Of note, in the tumors of mice fed the OA-rich diet, most n-6 PUFAs consisted in LA (C18:2) that is much less peroxidable than n-3 EPA (C20:5) and DHA (C22:6), the two most enriched PUFAs in the tumors of mice fed the fish oil-based diet (Figure S13D).


A DGAT inhibitor is probably unnecessary to trigger ferroptosis in DHA fed cancer if Carbon 60 is used to contact the UCP2 pores of cancer in order to set off uncontrolled oxidative processes within those cancer cells.

Interestingly mice fed olive oil did not experience the ferroptopic effects fish oil/DHA fed mice did.

Another potential way to use Carbon C60 as an “oxidative detonator” is combining it with iron. Cancer cells require higher levels of iron to function than normal cells. But if iron is exposed to oxidation the reaction is toxic to cancer.

For example artemesia annua AKA sweet wormwood damages cancer cells by triggering oxidative reactions with the iron stores of cancer cells. This reaction with iron then destroys the cancer cells that were using iron.

This might mean that an iron chelation like IP6 should not be used before using C60 since one would want cancer cells to have plenty of iron stores BEFORE C60 triggers oxidation of the cancer cells.

One would also not want to use an antioxidant like glutathione with the C60 protocol because you would want the oxidative reaction of cancer cells to contact any iron that is nearby. It may not be necessary for people to supplement with iron before using C60 since most people have ferritin levels over 150.

For those with low iron stores with ferritin below 100 it might be advisable to take an iron supplement of 20 mgs 24 hours before using C60. But they shouldn’t supplement with iron more than couple of days a year since the body has no natural way of removing excess iron.

Edited by Kelvin, 13 November 2022 - 08:55 PM.

  • Informative x 2
  • Off-Topic x 1

#2158 Confectman

  • Member
  • 10 posts
  • 4
  • Location:Germany
  • NO

Posted 14 November 2022 - 08:27 AM

does anyone see a problem with taking 5mg ritalin during the protocol


  • Good Point x 1
  • dislike x 1

#2159 Kelvin

  • Member
  • 198 posts
  • 32
  • Location:USA
  • NO

Posted 15 November 2022 - 12:53 AM

does anyone see a problem with taking 5mg ritalin during the protocol


What is your reason for adding Ritalin to it?

In general I wouldn’t add something to the protocol unless there were a very good reason because it is already pretty novel as it is.
  • like x 2
  • Pointless, Timewasting x 1
  • Disagree x 1

#2160 Confectman

  • Member
  • 10 posts
  • 4
  • Location:Germany
  • NO

Posted 15 November 2022 - 11:18 AM

What is your reason for adding Ritalin to it?

In general I wouldn’t add something to the protocol unless there were a very good reason because it is already pretty novel as it is.

 

My friend has ADHS and longtime prescribed on this medication.

So it would be interesting to learn wether the are interactions with this substance.


  • Good Point x 1





Also tagged with one or more of these keywords: c60, stem cells, mitochondria, fusion, stearic acid, aging, hydroxytyrosol, olive oil, mct oil, proliferation

6 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 6 guests, 0 anonymous users