69 replies to this topic

[Docon]

Similar idea but not project, is called Quantum Archaeology, Second Coming 2.0, Zoltan Istvan wrote about his vision. It is more about taxes and money but a point is that we will be re-created in the future 

https://www.themaven...Yki1kfDq3BSqUQ/

 

To make it happen we need to calculate models of entire Earth. We have to simulate our history and find the one that fulfills all requirements based on information we have. Then, of course, we have also exact you in this simulation . Possible, but we need maybe millions years to get such technology. That is because data we have about people from the past are not very complete.

 

Welcomeback.website project will make it happen faster. All we need is to collect data concerning exact person and keep it securely for some period of time. Let's help a bit future Quantum Archaeologists.

 

Next months I will focus on working more to earn some money for marketing of the project. So, if you like the idea, wish me luck & good clients (you can also use my services: http://www.infotimes.pl/english/ ) :-)

 

 

[Docon]

Digital immortality featured in Discovery.  https://youtu.be/iZ3Gmtc0ETY?t=743

[Docon]

Hi,

Welcome Back Immortality Project is back. Now whole project is revealed.

And it's not only about immortality for people born in 20th Century.

It's about shaping the community of the future. And of the far future.

Watch the movie https://www.youtube....h?v=XkCaseCwp48, visit the website ( www.welcomeback.website ) and join us.

[platypus]

This is a religion, and not a very convincing one at that. Let's recompute Jesus heh heh 

[Docon]

This is a religion, and not a very convincing one at that. Let's recompute Jesus heh heh 

 

Religion? I can agree that this method is not 100% sure. But now in 2019 we can collect so much data that I can not imagine how it could fail in 3219.

From Jesus we have just second-hand data so you can compute some avatar, as functional as office assistant 

[Cloned]

No company will be able to store and keep such data hundred years. Commercial projects are quickly falling. And besides .... Would you trust profit-oriented organization to such extent to give them your entire future? Exactly. That's why we're setting up a community that aims to:

- Secure delivery of our data to a point in the future where it will be possible to re-create us
- Working together to secure our data and, if necessary, to re-create our copies. Through infinity.

 

 

I agree with this 100%. The only problem is proper execution.

How?
First of all, we need to collect accurate data. To do that we will build data collection/storage Centers where the person will spend about 4 days. There will be collected biological and psychological data, using our own tests. (more about this process here: immortality). Most importantly, everything will be recorded, 4 full days in the life of a human. Environment will also be registered. In addition, we recommend collecting data about yourself on your own, we also store it. We will also have a huge amount of data not related to a specific person, but the data would be helpful in facilitating the re-crationo of us in the future by real artificial intelligence.

 

Let's start with a simple question: what data is important? 
Most people think that everything is important. Unfortunately, this is the wrong approach. We don't need to collect "noise".
Thus, you have to specify what information is important for people to start their collection. 

[Docon]

 

I agree with this 100%. The only problem is proper execution.

Let's start with a simple question: what data is important? 
Most people think that everything is important. Unfortunately, this is the wrong approach. We don't need to collect "noise".
Thus, you have to specify what information is important for people to start their collection. 

 

Right. I think it is quite well described here: https://philpapers.org/rec/TURDIT. They are competitors, they started before me and have a bit different idea but they are more focused on individual data collection so for this moment it's ok. 

[Cloned]

Thanks for sharing, Docon.

Yes, they are more focused on individual data collection, which is good, because alongside with a living cells preservation, sufficient data makes easier to blend previous and newly gained personalities.
Author Alexey Turchin did an amazing job by describing in detail the problems that will arise in connection with the preservation of information over a long period of time.

 

Personally I don't care much about being "the same" in my future self. I'm more interested in the "process" - action, which gives the opportunity to live again and again.

At this moment we do not have anything conclusive, it is therefore necessary to support any initiative on this issue.

Otherwise, we are doomed.

[Docon]

Thanks for sharing, Docon.

Yes, they are more focused on individual data collection, which is good, because alongside with a living cells preservation, sufficient data makes easier to blend previous and newly gained personalities.
Author Alexey Turchin did an amazing job by describing in detail the problems that will arise in connection with the preservation of information over a long period of time.

 

Personally I don't care much about being "the same" in my future self. I'm more interested in the "process" - action, which gives the opportunity to live again and again.

At this moment we do not have anything conclusive, it is therefore necessary to support any initiative on this issue.

Otherwise, we are doomed.

 

The Idea is more and more popular. Last weekend futurist Michio Kaku was invited, by governing party's foundation, to Poland to give a speech ( celebration the 546th anniversary of the birth of Nicolaus Copernicus). He was talking also about digital immortality. Moreover in hist last book "The Future of Humanity" he mentioned that best way to reach distant parts of Universe we is to be digitized first. So I'm more and more optimistic.

 

Photo from event (me on the left)

Edited by Docon, 28 February 2019 - 08:11 PM.

[Cloned]

He was talking also about digital immortality.

 

Digital format is ideal for storing and protecting personal data. but I doubt that we can convert digital data back to a living organism.
This is due to the enormous complexity of life as such. 

he mentioned that best way to reach distant parts of Universe we is to be digitized first. So I'm more and more optimistic.

 

No reason for optimism yet. It's all just a pipe dreams, desperate fantasies. Michio itself does not look fresh so to speak  .
I'm not even sure if there are a dozen people on the forum who would like to be resurrected.

 

You look a bit like Karl Marx 

Edited by Cloned, 01 March 2019 - 12:08 AM.

[platypus]

This sounds as or more impossible than any other totally impossible thing I can think of. I find it curious that people want to believe this is possible, and what physical considerations they base their views on. 

[Docon]

Digital format is ideal for storing and protecting personal data. but I doubt that we can convert digital data back to a living organism.
This is due to the enormous complexity of life as such. 

 

 

That's why I'm starting to teach teams that will be able to work on data collection and our own super AI. Then grow it to help us with the task. 

 

More and more people grasp the idea. Startup from recent days: 

hyperoptimistic guys :-)

[Docon]

This sounds as or more impossible than any other totally impossible thing I can think of. I find it curious that people want to believe this is possible, and what physical considerations they base their views on. 

 We, humans, started our journey about 200.000 years ago. Just think where we are after next 10.000 years or million. We are just beginning our travel. :-)

[platypus]

 We, humans, started our journey about 200.000 years ago. Just think where we are after next 10.000 years or million. We are just beginning our travel. :-)

The physical laws of today are identical to the ones to 200000 years and 20000000 years ago for that matter. I hope you are not in the camp that thinks that *anything* is possible because technology is for all practical purposes magic...

[Docon]

The physical laws of today are identical to the ones to 200000 years and 20000000 years ago for that matter. I hope you are not in the camp that thinks that *anything* is possible because technology is for all practical purposes magic...

Laws are similar but we know how to play with that toy better and better.

[Cloned]

linBackup. Digital Civilisation.

44 views

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Well, the only good thing is that immortality gradually becoming the mainstream idea. Just like electric cars.
But we have to admit that data collection is the easiest part. Actually, not much data is needed.
The most important asset is a non-digital living stem cell (cells) that can reproduce the former host. At this point everything is becoming quite expensive, not to mention IVF (In vitro fertilisation), surrogate mother and child raising costs. By my calculations, the minimum requirement is a quarter of a million dollars.
Few can afford this, even it will be possible.

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Another important issue is trust. To whom you will leave all your savings and your cells? 

Edited by Cloned, 01 March 2019 - 11:53 PM.

[platypus]

Laws are similar but we know how to play with that toy better and better.

Yes, until we hit the physical limits imposed by the laws of nature. Everything will never be possible in this universe. 

[Docon]

 

 

The most important asset is a non-digital living stem cell (cells)  

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Another important issue is trust. To whom you will leave all your savings and your cells? 

 

 

We have to keep it low cost, so as for now we will only collect it from blood and digitize. I do not exclude long term preservation of stem cells (not digitized) as an option.

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Trust is most important here. And most difficult problem. Thinking how to make it work through next 1000 years were really challenging. But I think I know how to do it. So I start to create the community. I begin it in small city in Poland where I live. Soon I'll be teaching kids here basics of coding of artificial intelligence and quantum computing. Then maybe CRISPR , brain-machine interface, etc. Goal is to have here in 20-30 years something like Institute for Advanced Study (IAS in Princeton ) when they started. I mean lot of science in nice envirorment and about 0% bureaucracy :-)

 

You are invited to join and help   https://www.welcomeb...lish/membership

[Docon]

Yes, until we hit the physical limits imposed by the laws of nature. Everything will never be possible in this universe. 

No. But how we, after leaving caves a while ago, can tell what is possible in Universe? We didn't even take a walk on another planet yet. 

And from the other hand maybe soon we will be able to make for you realistic simulation where everything would be possible.

[platypus]

No. But how we, after leaving caves a while ago, can tell what is possible in Universe? We didn't even take a walk on another planet yet. 

And from the other hand maybe soon we will be able to make for you realistic simulation where everything would be possible.

Do you believe we are already in a simulation? In that case anything might indeed be possible. But how is that different from having a magical worldview? 

[Docon]

Do you believe we are already in a simulation? In that case anything might indeed be possible. But how is that different from having a magical worldview? 

No, I believe that we are real and we are first in our part of the Universe. When you can do everything with magic it becomes boring. Did you tried to imagine being almighty god? ( thought experiment)

[Cloned]

Thinking how to make it work through next 1000 years were really challenging. But I think I know how to do it. So I start to create the community.

So far so good. It should be a community of like-minded individuals but why a physical village or city?

A virtual community is much cheaper to create and maintain.

In order for the project to start working, we need to build at least one Center for the beginning. The estimated cost is about EUR 20 million.

Insanely expensive. The service should be free for members, otherwise it sounds like a regular scam.

Do you believe we are already in a simulation?

The theory of simulation is the same nonsense as religion, and is intended for people with low IQ.
"we are real and we are first in our part of the Universe"

Edited by Cloned, 07 March 2019 - 09:13 PM.

[Docon]

1. So far so good. It should be a community of like-minded individuals but why a physical village or city?

2.A virtual community is much cheaper to create and maintain.

3.Insanely expensive. The service should be free for members, otherwise it sounds like a regular scam.

 

 

1&2 Local people can believe me. Online people will not (not at this phase of the project)

 

3 Scam issue - that's why I do not ask for money now. Just for symbolic support - one penny,one cent or one kopieyka or one fen or one grosz or one centime, etc. Money will come from investors not members.

[Docon]

Differences between www.welcomeback.website project and other #Immortality #Digitalimmortality projects. 

 

 Fortunately idea came to me before I even heard about #transhumanism, #Bostrom or #Kurzweil. And maybe thanks to that it differs from other projects. 

 

It is a system of mutual insurance during intergalactic travel and during computer simulations. Of course, immortality is included in the package.

Today, a few words about how this project differs from similar ones. Fortunately idea came to me before I even heard about transhumanism, Bostrom or Kurzweil. And maybe thanks to 

 

The differences between my project and similar are:

 

- We immediately take into account the problem of future generations, i.e. safeguarding immortality indefinitely.

 

- Success will be based on an organized community, not on the fastest possible technological progress. Others often say that the breakthrough is already around the corner.

 

- The project is not commercial but social. Commercial companies will not survive long enough to help us effectively.

 

- Immortality will not be discovered quickly. There is no magic biological death switch. And the brain is quite complicated to copy. Therefore, the plan assumes waiting for up to 10,000 years.

 

- Singularity is not much closer than it was in the 1950s, when the creator of the perceptron talked about it as the beginning of thinking, self-aware machines.

 

- It is not enough to collect data on your own. We have to do it methodologically and we need infrastructure / organization for this. Hence the need to build Centers.

 

And now something optimistic.

 

- We have enough data to restore. It's just that we have to wait a bit for technically capable individuals. We have to create them ourselves.

 

- We will build our own Super Artificial Intelligence to be independent of governments and corporations

 

Details are in the project. There is no magic in him just a question. To what extent we can perfectly reproduce ourselves from the collected data. Because, that somehow we manage to do it, there is probably no doubt.

 

Time frame, The first Center should be created in 2023. Around 2035, we will establish a university for basic research, ideologically modeled on the beginnings of the Institute for Advanced Study at Princeton. Science without bureaucracy.

 

What exactly I do to make it work in the future, you will always find in the news section of my website: https://www.welcomeb...e-english/news 

 

[Cloned]

On the whole, I agree with your thoughts, but I find the project too complicated. The plan assumes waiting for up to 10,000 years?

You make the common mistake - by believing in the existence of the soul you want to digitize. There are no such thing as soul (or immutable personality).

We are genetic code + personal memories + public memory + legal status. 
Therefore, the task is much simpler - and may be implemented in the coming decades.

 

You are right in stating that biological immortality is a very distant prospect and success will be based on an organized community. This is a premium task.

How do we convince ordinary people if no one is interested even here on the forum of immortality?

[Docon]

So we agree. 

It could be 100 or 1000 years. No idea. 10000 here just means "not soon"

I did not mention "soul". If someone believes in soul, it's ok - I believe that soul consists of something wave-particle like.

 

I can convince people I know to support the project. But they have no idea how this will work so they are not engaged too much. 

I started to teach about AI, quantum computing, next year I plan to teach also about brain-computer interface, CRISPR gene editing - so people will understand how it could work. But it is no fast track to acquire members. 

Another method I will be testing next year.

After that we professionalize marketing efforts.

So step-by-step it will work.

 

Do you have any suggestions?

Edited by Docon, 02 September 2019 - 02:55 PM.

[Cloned]

Do you have any suggestions?

 

 

Start small. Make a list of people who want to be resurrected.
The only information required for registration should be a nickname.
How many people will subscribe here on our forum? A few at best, I think.

 

At this point our task is to gather as many like-minded people as possible. Step-by-step.

 

1. The list.

2. Database

3. Application form

4. Donations
5. Safe storage (both stem cells and information)

6. Resurection when the right technology comes along.

----------------------------------

 

 

[Docon]

Ok, we can try.

[Cloned]

Why not try right now, right here?
The first step would be to correctly formulate the goal and a call to join.

 

For example:

We believe in the opportunity to revitalize people in the near future through the use of stored information and stem cells. All you have to do to register is write your nickname here in this thread.

 

Ready to be immortal? Or afraid to look stupid?

 

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[Docon]

Can we talk about security of data delivered by people on priv?