1079 replies to this topic

[Oakman]

Well infected cells have to be destroyed ASAP because there is no way to heal them. Senesent cells if you do senolitics you want to kill them: so same thing. By the way I'm preparing myself to coronavirus infection with a 5 days senolitic protocol as it seems for this virus having a lot of senesent cells around is particularly bad...
I live in Italy so the bad guy is here....

 

Then there is this https://www.longecit...ndpost&p=886333

 

This discussion (related to viruses & CV) should probably go to this thread, not here, as it is off topic, so no more from me here.

[bhangchai]

Bioavailability of fisetin can be increased by combining it with quercetin, mixing them with oil, adding black pepper and/or BioPerine, and taking on an empty stomach.  

 

 

 

Absorption of Fisetin and Quercetin can be increased by taking it with oil.

 

Piperine inhibits the major drug-metabolizing enzyme CYP3A4.

 

Quercetin inhibits CYP3A4 enzyme activity in a concentration-dependent manner.

 

 

 

Important things, in my view:

 

Use both Fisetin and Quercetin (approximately equal amounts)

 

Take with oil, best to "dissolve" or mix F and Q with olive oil (approx 1 Tablespoon).

 

Take with 1/4 to ½ tsp ground black pepper and/or with BioPerine.  (Check drug interactions [piperine])

 

Take on an empty stomach, at least 2 or 3 hours after eating.  I took mine in the evening before bed or first thing in the morning.

 

Take away from other medications.

 

Reduce your caffeine intake, per Mayo Clinic.

 

Don’t do any strenuous exercise for a week or two after taking.

 

Don’t take while sick or healing.

I

Edited by bhangchai, 03 March 2020 - 07:32 PM.

[Nate-2004]

Bioavailability of fisetin can be increased by combining it with quercetin, mixing them with oil, adding black pepper and/or BioPerine, and taking on an empty stomach.  

 

 

 

Absorption of Fisetin and Quercetin can be increased by taking it with oil.

 

Piperine inhibits the major drug-metabolizing enzyme CYP3A4.

 

Quercetin inhibits CYP3A4 enzyme activity in a concentration-dependent manner.

 

 

 

Also a little vitamin C, 100mg, will further boost bioavailability by preventing the oxidation side of flavinol breakdown. At least this seems to work with apigenin and EGCG. I'll search for the link on this upon request.

Edited by Nate-2004, 04 March 2020 - 12:00 AM.

[Woody42]

I know it's probably been discussed but in the Mayo Clinic trials  did they mix the Fisetin with

anything to enhance absorption ?

[PAMPAGUY]

I know it's probably been discussed but in the Mayo Clinic trials  did they mix the Fisetin with

anything to enhance absorption ?

No, I don't believe so.  I personally just take 2 tablespoons of olive oil after mixing fisetin powder with water and drinking

[Woody42]

I wonder because of it's short half life would it be best to take it in

a divided dose perhaps 4 or more times a day instead  of all at once.

[PAMPAGUY]

Woody, Fisetin is to be taken for 3 consecutive days every 3 months for anti-aging purposes.  The Mayo Clinic was only using 2 days period.  It takes bad cells, once wiped out, that long to repopulate the mitochondria.  Suggested dose is 20mg/kg.(75 kg. = 1500 mg.)  Intermediate dosing is all that is required.  But there are other Senolytics also that attack different zombie cells. There are 4 different types of senescent cells.  We have treatments for 3 of them.  They are Fisetin, Dasatinib, and  Zithromycin.  If you are serious about anti aging you should take all 3 because they target different cells.  You did not say how old you are as that has a lot to do with treatment.  Try updating your profile.  If you are treating a specific disease then it is once a month.   https://senolyticstreatment.com/

Edited by PAMPAGUY, 07 June 2020 - 01:15 PM.

[Woody42]

Pampaguy I am a 70 year old type 2 diabetic and hoping this and some fasting 

might help my general health.  Living in the USA it may be hard for me to get any

Dasatinib and Zithromycin without a very friendly DR's help which I don't have. 

Does that link you mentioned  sell them without  having to have a Dr's apointment ? 

[PAMPAGUY]

Yes, they sell the other drugs, but you should be on Rapamycin, also which they sell.  You could probably get a Rx. for Zithromycin it is very common in US.  What state do you live in?  Rapa and Dasatinib can be bought in powder form from China.  You only need 2 grams of Rapa to last you for 3-5 years, and 4-5 grams of Dasatinib to last 3-5 years.  These very small amounts are usually very easy to get thru customs because they come in a business size envelope, Fedex, and are renamed to a supplement to get by Customs.  Zithromycin as a pill is much harder to get thru.  With type 2 diabetes, your at high risk, and you should be on 2,000 mg Metformin daily,  extended release is best and cheap.  Have you every had a CIMT for all the arterial inflammation caused by diabetes.  See this video.   https://www.youtube....h?v=KQdplHWQ9ZU  Dr. Brewer has really helped a lot of diabetes patients, has many very good videos, should watch them all.

 

[Woody42]

I wish I could take metformin but unfortunately I experience a extremely rare

side effect . It made me gain a lot of weight. After being on the same diet and

exercise plan for 3 years and losing about 40 lbs I tried it 3 months and  regained

30 lbs with no change to my exercise or how much I ate.  A year later I tried it

again and gained 5 lbs in 2 weeks.  

[PAMPAGUY]

Never heard of people gaining weight only losing it with Metformin.  Go to Berberine to control your diabetes, works very well.  500mg x 3 times a day + Vitamin E, 200 mg with each tablet for absorption.  Has short 1/2 life that why 3 times a day.  You have got to do something or your not going to be around very long with that disease.  It's a killer or kidneys, heart and brain stroke.  Causing inflammation in arteries.  Rapamycin will cut your appetite also.             :text=Berberine%20can%20improve%20the%20activity,insulin%20resistance%20in%20the%20body.' class='bbc_url' title='External link' rel='nofollow external'>https://www.ncbi.nlm...ce in the body.

[Woody42]

Here is an intresting webpage   foundmyfitness.com . If by chance you have your DNA data  like

from some place like 23andme   you can for a token $ 10 fee run ti through a program that's very

informative and gives it ditary  advice according to your dna.  When I had mine run it strongly advised

me not to take suplimental vitamin E   as in my case it would depress my built in antioxident system.

 

[PAMPAGUY]

Just received my order for Fisetin 50 grams and Dasatinib 5 grams from China.  No problems with Customs was shipped via Fedex.  Fisetin was $2.50 gram including $25 Fedex.  Dasatinib was $20 gram + $25 shipping.  I received exactly 50 grams of Fisetin, and 5.6 grams of Dasatinib.  Over paid for Fisetin, better to order online.  Dasatinib and Rapamycin also are such small amounts that they can ship in an envelope and less likely to have a problem with customs.  Dr. Green is now recommending to take Fisetin and Dasatinib together and you can skip or not quercetin because Fisetin works better.  Green recommends 1500 mg Fisetin x 3 day x quarterly for anti ageing.  I prefer to use Mayo clinic's formula of 20mg/kg.  On July 01, 2020, I will take Fisetin 1700 mg x 3(with olive oil) + Dasatinib 100 mg x 3.(quarterly)  The next week will  take 250 mg Zithromycin x 6 days (quarterly)  Will try taking Vitamin C, 500 mg with all of the above.  These 3 drugs target 3 of the 4 senescent putrid cells, (aka, zombie)  WIll be waiting for a treatment for the 4th. cell type.

[pro-v]

Pampaguy, can you PM me your source?

[JimWoodall]

Hello, getting ready for my next fisetin cycle. Last time I took it I stopped workout out for about 2 weeks due to the blood clotting fears.  That 2 weeks off really set me back in my physical fitness goals.   What’s the latest on this? Are folks doing resistance training after dosing ?  Is there a bleeding concern, or was that just a couple of anecdotals that were never proven?  Thanks 

[OP2040]

This is a fear of lack of blood clotting no?  Yes, anecdotal.  Considering that 1/3 of the worldwide population dies of the opposite problem or something very closely related to it, I'd say this fear is not worth your time unless you have a blood clotting disorder of some kind.  Pretty much everything that is anti-aging will lower blood pressure and coagulation to some extent, because uh, it's anti-aging.  Now if your talking something direct like nattokinase, then we can have a discussion.  That stuff is very powerful anti-coagulant, but for my opinion still a great thing!

 

 

Edited by OP2040, 14 June 2020 - 04:55 PM.

[JimWoodall]

Thanks, so maybe sticking to more of a maintenance schedule for a week of workouts, with some  intermittent fasting.  

[ambivalent]

Campisi, meanwhile, wonders about the consequences of losing the benefits that senescent cells provide. Of the hundreds of proteins secreted by these cells that her group has identified over the years, some are critical for wound healing, for instance—eliminate them all, and the body’s ability to handle injuries may suffer, she notes. “There will be times where you’ll have to be cautious. You probably don’t want to take a senolytic before you go into major surgery.” 

 

https://www.the-scie...-disease--67136

[aribadabar]

Campisi, meanwhile, wonders about the consequences of losing the benefits that senescent cells provide. Of the hundreds of proteins secreted by these cells that her group has identified over the years, some are critical for wound healing, for instance—eliminate them all, and the body’s ability to handle injuries may suffer, she notes. “There will be times where you’ll have to be cautious. You probably don’t want to take a senolytic before you go into major surgery.” 

 

https://www.the-scie...-disease--67136

 

Personally I would rather help the body recover with BPC157, LL-37, HGH and the like than letting senescent cells exist solely for that purpose. 

[PAMPAGUY]

These treatments only target the sick cells, and leave healthy alone.

[Daniel Cooper]

Campisi, meanwhile, wonders about the consequences of losing the benefits that senescent cells provide. Of the hundreds of proteins secreted by these cells that her group has identified over the years, some are critical for wound healing, for instance—eliminate them all, and the body’s ability to handle injuries may suffer, she notes. “There will be times where you’ll have to be cautious. You probably don’t want to take a senolytic before you go into major surgery.” 

 

https://www.the-scie...-disease--67136

 

 

This has always been a conundrum to me.  Children have very few senolytic cells, and yet we don't think of them as being particularly impaired when it comes to wound healing.  Quite the opposite in fact.

 

 

[Florin]

This has always been a conundrum to me.  Children have very few senolytic cells, and yet we don't think of them as being particularly impaired when it comes to wound healing.  Quite the opposite in fact.

 

There's no conundrum here, only misunderstanding. Senolytics kill pre-existing senescent cells but don't prevent normal cells from turning into SEN cells during the wound healing process. After those normal-cells-turned-SEN help heal a wound, they're killed off by the immune system. So, SENCs that accumulate with age aren't part of healed wounds, nor do they participate in any wound healing.

[aribadabar]

There's no conundrum here, only misunderstanding. Senolytics kill pre-existing senescent cells but don't prevent normal cells from turning into SEN cells during the wound healing process. After those normal-cells-turned-SEN help heal a wound, they're killed off by the immune system. So, SENCs that accumulate with age aren't part of healed wounds, nor do they participate in any wound healing.

 

How can you be certain that those senescent cells are killed off after they served their useful purpose? There are numerous senescent skin cells hanging around for years.

What makes those normal-cells-turned-SEN special purpose ones easier to remove than the others?

[Florin]

How can you be certain that those senescent cells are killed off after they served their useful purpose? There are numerous senescent skin cells hanging around for years.
What makes those normal-cells-turned-SEN special purpose ones easier to remove than the others?

 
Senescent cells play an essential role in wound healing
https://www.buckinst...-wound-healing/
 

The researchers also found that senescent cells were present only for a short time during tissue repair, in contrast to the persistent presence of senescent cells in aged or chronically damaged tissues.

[aribadabar]

 
Senescent cells play an essential role in wound healing
https://www.buckinst...-wound-healing/
 

Thanks for the link.

 

OK, these transient senescent cells are helper cells and not causing any lasting damage but they do not fit into the "typical" idea of senescent cells exactly because they don't hang around long enough expressing their SASP.

For all intents and purposes, it's precisely their transient nature that makes them senescent in name only and periodic senolytic regimens wouldn't affect them anyways ( as they are gone). One just don't have to run these sweeps when dealing with an active injury.

Before or after that, they are absent anyways making this a moot point (if keeping it in mind).

Edited by aribadabar, 02 July 2020 - 01:49 AM.

[StanG]

I recently took 1.3 grams of Fisetin powder mixed in orange juice and bioperine and it acted as a strong laxative. I wonder how much was absorbed into my system. What would be a better mix so that I wouldn't have such loose bowels afterwards?

[Engadin]

This has always been a conundrum to me.  Children have very few senolytic cells, and yet we don't think of them as being particularly impaired when it comes to wound healing.  Quite the opposite in fact.

 

In my humble opinion, children are almost senescent cells free also by the contribution of their brand new immunologic system, perfectly active and efficient at getting rid of SC as soon as they start signaling their state by means of SASP compounds all around the body. My guess is that all this, paired to the fact that cellular death process is quickly and unobstructedly executed at that ages, contribute to a very short lived senescent cells and hence to their low population in children.

[JimWoodall]

I’m going to take 1 gram F, 1 gram Q, 1 gram curcumin, pipeline. Dissolved in olive oil for 3 days.  I am going to continue my physical fitness routine, but cut back the intensity, only a little.  

 

starts today, I can’t imagine wrecking my physical fitness routine every 3 months.  

[mikeinnaples]

Just received my order for Fisetin 50 grams and Dasatinib 5 grams from China. 

 

I have such a hard time trusting any and everything from China. As much as I want to source these things from there, I just cant get over the trust issue.
 

[Daniel Cooper]

I have such a hard time trusting any and everything from China. As much as I want to source these things from there, I just cant get over the trust issue.
 

 

 

Having dealt with Chinese suppliers in other areas, I wouldn't trust anything from them that I hadn't independently verified.  

 

They will cut any corner they think they can get away with.