1079 replies to this topic

[aribadabar]

I'm on day 2 of my yearly senolytic intervention.  This time I'm including my wife as a second experiment.  I did not include dasatinib, and went with my usual protocol:

F (1G) + Q (1G) + C (2.25G) + Bioperine (15mg)  X  3 days

 

So far nothing to report, and frankly I'm getting rather jaded with all of it.  Maybe some folks are correct.  If you don't see/feel something then chances are what you're doing probably is a dud.   I feel like I have no choice but to include dasatinib next year for that reason.  Or maybe just try it again soon, as in very soon.

 

I'd double the F and Q dosages, if I were you. Both have terrible bioavailability and though Bioperine may help somewhat it is not a panacea to the problem.

And yes, without D the effect is marginal so not too surprising that you report nothing overt - all these flavonoids are not absorbed well and the their Cmax reached is insufficient to exert the same senolytic effect that D triggers.

[OP2040]

I was just reading that quercetin also helps with bioavailability too.  Bioperine is no joke, it improves bioavailability of flavanoids by thousands of percent.  Senolytics, being what they are should show "something" even if you only manage to eliminate 10% of them.  It's possible that in humans it's just the long game that matters since we live so long.   But unlike other interventions, theoretically senolytics should be fairly immediate.  This is why we need a cheap and easy test for senescent cell burden like yesterday.

 

Anyway ya, next up is the D. 

[sedentary]

Well, knowledge is power... and understanding. If you research a bit, this plant is not just any old plant, it has been medicinally evaluated for various purposes. I'm just guessing, but it seems it is far more economical to use this plant for fisetin, rather than picking strawberries and extracting. Read the link and you'll see what potential this plant has.

 

"Phytochemical analysis of the C. coggygria methanol extract of the heartwood, performed by Valianou et al. (2009) indicated the presence of 3′,4′,6-trihydroxyaurone (sulfuretin), 3′,4′,7- trihydroxyflavonol (fisetin), 3′,4′,7-trihydroxyflavanol (fustin), 3′,4′,5,7-tetrahydroxyflavonol (quercetin), 3′,4′,5,7-tetrahydroxyflavanol (taxifolin), 4′,7-dihydroxyflavanol, 3′,4′,7- trihydroxyflavanone (butin), 4′,7-dihydroxyflavanone (liquiritigenin), trans-2′,3,4,4′- tetrahydroxychalcone (butein), 4′,5,7-trihydroxyflavanone, and trans-2′,4,4′-trihydroxychalcone (isoliquiritigenin)."

 

Cotinus coggygria Scop.: An overview of it Chemical Constituents, Pharmacological and Toxicological Potential

 

how is it more economical? strawberries are all over the world in every store, billions of them. why is it so difficult to gather them in one place and extract? im sorry, i just dont get it...

[bhangchai]

I'm on day 2 of my yearly senolytic intervention.  This time I'm including my wife as a second experiment.  I did not include dasatinib, and went with my usual protocol:

F (1G) + Q (1G) + C (2.25G) + Bioperine (15mg)  X  3 days

 

So far nothing to report, and frankly I'm getting rather jaded with all of it.  Maybe some folks are correct.  If you don't see/feel something then chances are what you're doing probably is a dud.   I feel like I have no choice but to include dasatinib next year for that reason.  Or maybe just try it again soon, as in very soon.

Did you mix and take this with oil?  If not, I suspect it will not be absorbed very well.  I'd add the oil and the black pepper.

 

I did this protocol with 1 gram each of F + Q + C mixed in 1 Tablespoon of olive oil and 1/2 teaspoon of freshly ground black pepper, for three days.  Taken on an empty stomach - 3 hours after eating or first thing in the morning, and not eating for an hour.

This did seem to have some fairly subtle acute effects and beneficial result in the long term, but frankly, it is not what you see with senolytics, it's what you will not see...

[bhangchai]

how is it more economical? strawberries are all over the world in every store, billions of them. why is it so difficult to gather them in one place and extract? im sorry, i just dont get it...

 

There is very little fisetin in strawberries.  "The highest concentration of fisetin was found in strawberries (160 μg/g)"

That is .000160 grams fisetin per 1 gram of strawberries.

To get 3 grams of fisetin, you would need about 18,750 grams of strawberries.  

At 453.6 grams per pound, you would need about 41.3 pounds of strawberries.  

At $2.51 per pound   ("Strawberries—Average retail price per pound and per cup equivalent, 2016")   it would cost about $103.60.

 

3 grams of fisetin from Swanson vitamins is $10 to $11. 

Fisetin from strawberries costs $103.6 for material before extraction, processing, and sales costs.

Which sounds more economical?

 

get it?

[sedentary]

There is very little fisetin in strawberries.  "The highest concentration of fisetin was found in strawberries (160 μg/g)"

That is .000160 grams fisetin per 1 gram of strawberries.

To get 3 grams of fisetin, you would need about 18,750 grams of strawberries.  

At 453.6 grams per pound, you would need about 41.3 pounds of strawberries.  

At $2.51 per pound   ("Strawberries—Average retail price per pound and per cup equivalent, 2016")   it would cost about $103.60.

 

3 grams of fisetin from Swanson vitamins is $10 to $11. 

Fisetin from strawberries costs $103.6 for material before extraction, processing, and sales costs.

Which sounds more economical?

 

get it?

 

ok thanks. very informative indeed. but, it does say highest concentration of fisetin has been found in strawberries. so if THAT little is the HIGHEST source of fisetin, arent all other sources lower in fisetin per gram? how were scientists able to isolate it FIRST from strawberries and not any other source even though its so little, but with a claim its the highest natural source? im very confused but im sorry im a bit slow...

but anyway it seems thats not the main compound in strawberries that makes them healthy. as i posted before, this article; https://www.nutraing...ve-decline-risk

 

do you think perhaps pelargonidin also has some senolytic action, perhaps in combo with fisetin?

Edited by sedentary, 10 October 2019 - 07:57 AM.

[OP2040]

Did you mix and take this with oil?  If not, I suspect it will not be absorbed very well.  I'd add the oil and the black pepper.

 

I did this protocol with 1 gram each of F + Q + C mixed in 1 Tablespoon of olive oil and 1/2 teaspoon of freshly ground black pepper, for three days.  Taken on an empty stomach - 3 hours after eating or first thing in the morning, and not eating for an hour.

This did seem to have some fairly subtle acute effects and beneficial result in the long term, but frankly, it is not what you see with senolytics, it's what you will not see...

 

 

It's good to hear that you had an effect, and interesting that you chose the same combination as me.  I did use oil for two doses and Greek yogurt for fat the third time.  

 

To be fair, I'm not measuring anything, just going on my subjective symptoms. 

[OP2040]

I assume people are on this strawberry thing due to cost.  I would hope it's not due to some obsession with "natural" things being superior, as you would find in the general population.  People here should know better than that.  If it is cost, I can understand why people would try to find alternatives, but the fact is strawberries are not a viable alternative so just stop talking about it.  To me, the crux of the issue these days is more efficacy than cost.  If we could definitively prove that Fisetin ablates senescent cells in large numbers and has similar effects as it does in mice, THEN I would consider it the cheapest drug on the planet (per util of health).  And I'd probably be willing (though not able) to pay in the hundreds of thousands for it.  What would you pay to eliminate one of the 9 causes of aging that easily as if you could just check it off the list?  I don't think people here are very poor.  They are just hedging their bets because many of the things we do are still unproven.  Paying a bit for an unproven experiment that may turn out well is one thing.  Paying a lot for it is entirely different.

 

All of that is a really long way of repeating what I've been saying for some time now.  Without metrics, we are wasting huge amounts of time, energy and money.  At this point the biggest limiting factor is having basic metrics.   And having that would change the entire game.  I've been ignored or told that it's impossible for an individual outside of a lab.  And it's my own fault that I'm not independent enough to just do it myself.  But there should be no controversy over the fact that this is the next step and possibly the last step for finalizing senolytics as a real clinical treatment.  A cheap, reliable senescent cell test would be worth it's weight in gold at this point.  But the fact is, unwieldy, somewhat reliable lab tests already exist and for a variety of fairly trivial reasons, we refuse to pursue it.

Edited by OP2040, 10 October 2019 - 11:33 AM.

[Dstein]

 

 

"Phytochemical analysis of the C. coggygria methanol extract of the heartwood, performed by Valianou et al. (2009) indicated the presence of ..., 3′,4′,7- trihydroxyflavonol (fisetin),  ...."

 

Cotinus coggygria Scop.: An overview of it Chemical Constituents, Pharmacological and Toxicological Potential

 

It appears that fisten from strawberries is 3,3′,4′,7-tetrahydroxyflavone not 3′,4′,7- trihydroxyflavonol???

https://www.ncbi.nlm...les/PMC3689181/

 

I don't know enough about chemistry to know what if any the extra 3 means.

[Oakman]

It appears that fisten from strawberries is 3,3′,4′,7-tetrahydroxyflavone not 3′,4′,7- trihydroxyflavonol???

https://www.ncbi.nlm...les/PMC3689181/

 

I don't know enough about chemistry to know what if any the extra 3 means.

We need the help of a chemist !!!  I tried to understand after doing some research, but the more I looked, the more confusing it got. It's a lexicon I'm not familiar with. It seems there are many names for the same or similar molecules I guess? Or maybe the article I linked got is wrong?  Or Purebulk mislabeled?  

 

Questions...questions, life is full of questions!

[Rays]

Well, tri hydroxy means it has three OH groups (Oxygen and Hydrogen) and tetra hydroxy means four of those. So, it's a different molecule. 

That could change its activity.

 

Which one was used in the mouse studies?

The study mentioned by OP2040 at the beginning of this thread used "fisetin (Indofine Chemical Co., Hillsborough, NJ)". Searching with Google results in the four hydroxy version (3,7,3',4'-Tetrahydroxyflavone):

 

https://www.indofine....aspx?Sku=F-002

 

https://www.ebiomedi...0373-6/fulltext

 

[Nate-2004]

I was just reading that quercetin also helps with bioavailability too.  Bioperine is no joke, it improves bioavailability of flavanoids by thousands of percent.  Senolytics, being what they are should show "something" even if you only manage to eliminate 10% of them.  It's possible that in humans it's just the long game that matters since we live so long.   But unlike other interventions, theoretically senolytics should be fairly immediate.  This is why we need a cheap and easy test for senescent cell burden like yesterday.

 

Anyway ya, next up is the D. 

 

I think the answer, ultimately, lies in regrowing/rejuvenating the thymus and restoring the immune system allowing it to do its job of eliminating these death resistant cells. Not taking cocktails of drugs that bypass and ignore the problem. Your best bet here is doing things that boost growth hormone. Regular consistent exercise, sauna, etc.  I hear using the sauna for 2 separate hours a day for a week can boost growth hormone by up to 16 times. Taking a week or two to go through that might be more useful than trying to inject HGH.

 

I think the senescent cell elimination will at best extend youthspan by a couple of decades at least, but not max lifespan.

Edited by Nate-2004, 10 October 2019 - 08:04 PM.

[Oakman]

I think the answer, ultimately, lies in regrowing/rejuvenating the thymus and restoring the immune system allowing it to do its job of eliminating these death resistant cells. Not taking cocktails of drugs that bypass and ignore the problem. Your best bet here is doing things that boost growth hormone. Regular consistent exercise, sauna, etc.  I hear using the sauna for 2 separate hours a day for a week can boost growth hormone by up to 16 times. Taking a week or two to go through that might be more useful than trying to inject HGH.

 

I think the senescent cell elimination will at best extend youthspan by a couple of decades at least, but not max lifespan.

 

Good thoughts, although I think their are benefits to a synolytic therapy. For fun, I checked how long Finnish live, what with their sauna reputation. Seems men don't do well as Finnish women, who do fall in the Nordic average for life expectancy. They do die, however. As far as sauna itself, seems to help (but we thought that). As you say, won't keep you alive forever, but may keep you healthier while you're here.

 

https://www.health.h...ms-201502257755

Edited by Oakman, 10 October 2019 - 08:41 PM.

[Nate-2004]

Good thoughts, although I think their are benefits to a synolytic therapy. For fun, I checked how long Finnish live, what with their sauna reputation. Seems men don't do well as Finnish women, who do fall in the Nordic average for life expectancy. They do die, however. As far as sauna itself, seems to help (but we thought that). As you say, won't keep you alive forever, but may keep you healthier while you're here.

 

https://www.health.h...ms-201502257755

 

I imagine they've got other issues due to where they live. Not a good place for a solid circadian rhythm. Lots of drinking and depression. 

[Harkijn]

Finland used to be notorious for CVD incidence because of their traditional diet, extremely high in saturated fats. This has been changing for quite some time now but the change will be slow to occur in statistics.

[OP2040]

I think the answer, ultimately, lies in regrowing/rejuvenating the thymus and restoring the immune system allowing it to do its job of eliminating these death resistant cells. Not taking cocktails of drugs that bypass and ignore the problem. Your best bet here is doing things that boost growth hormone. Regular consistent exercise, sauna, etc.  I hear using the sauna for 2 separate hours a day for a week can boost growth hormone by up to 16 times. Taking a week or two to go through that might be more useful than trying to inject HGH.

 

I think the senescent cell elimination will at best extend youthspan by a couple of decades at least, but not max lifespan.

 

 

Agree with the fact that senolytics will increase health span not necessarily lifespan.  But he game is survival in a fairly well-intact state until such time that technology allows us much more control over our biology.

 

Things like exercise and sauna reinforce the point of taking senolytics.  No study has shown any appreciable life extension via either sauna or exercise that I'm aware of.  These things are just cultural bugaboos.  People think if they have the perfect mix of exercise, diet and lifestyle they will somehow live longer.  Well, the science pretty much says that those things are exactly the same as senolytics.  They will improve your health span and decrease your risk of dying over time.  But they don't make much a dent in population level longevity.  Senolytics also have the added benefit of convenience and targeting.  Exercise may decrease senescent cells or other hallmarks of aging.  But it will never precisely maintain these systems like future technology will and like senolytics is very close to doing.  

[Nate-2004]

Agree with the fact that senolytics will increase health span not necessarily lifespan.  But he game is survival in a fairly well-intact state until such time that technology allows us much more control over our biology.

 

Things like exercise and sauna reinforce the point of taking senolytics.  No study has shown any appreciable life extension via either sauna or exercise that I'm aware of.  These things are just cultural bugaboos.  People think if they have the perfect mix of exercise, diet and lifestyle they will somehow live longer.  Well, the science pretty much says that those things are exactly the same as senolytics.  They will improve your health span and decrease your risk of dying over time.  But they don't make much a dent in population level longevity.  Senolytics also have the added benefit of convenience and targeting.  Exercise may decrease senescent cells or other hallmarks of aging.  But it will never precisely maintain these systems like future technology will and like senolytics is very close to doing.  

 

Never said there would be maximal life extension from sauna and exercise, except where age related disease onset is delayed and healthspan extended. Same goes for senolytics. I'm saying that, in the same way researchers are trying to harness the immune system to battle cancer, we should be using the same methods to deal with senescent cells.  I think Greg Fahy is working on just that.

Edited by Nate-2004, 11 October 2019 - 06:19 PM.

[Rocket]

Agree with the fact that senolytics will increase health span not necessarily lifespan.  But he game is survival in a fairly well-intact state until such time that technology allows us much more control over our biology.

 

Things like exercise and sauna reinforce the point of taking senolytics.  No study has shown any appreciable life extension via either sauna or exercise that I'm aware of.  These things are just cultural bugaboos.  People think if they have the perfect mix of exercise, diet and lifestyle they will somehow live longer.  Well, the science pretty much says that those things are exactly the same as senolytics.  They will improve your health span and decrease your risk of dying over time.  But they don't make much a dent in population level longevity.  Senolytics also have the added benefit of convenience and targeting.  Exercise may decrease senescent cells or other hallmarks of aging.  But it will never precisely maintain these systems like future technology will and like senolytics is very close to doing.  

 

You should consider the concept of an increased health span versus life span. Been to a nursing home lately, it's a sad place! If exercising and taking my "weird" supplements keep me out of a nursing home and with active life, but not a longer life, mission accomplished. If along the way, while living in good health, regenerative medicine has a breakthrough and I can live to 150 in good health, since I've exercised and took my weird supplements to maintain health span, I will be benefit more from regenerative medicine than the average wheelchair bound 85 year old.

 

And I would argue that exercise does increase lifespan. I remember a time not too long ago when people didn't exercise, men all had pot bellys at 35, people retired at 62 and were dead at 70 of a heart attack. Exercising is reducing the incidence of heart disease and people live longer as a result.

Edited by Rocket, 11 October 2019 - 07:12 PM.

[Mind]

Agree with the fact that senolytics will increase health span not necessarily lifespan.  But he game is survival in a fairly well-intact state until such time that technology allows us much more control over our biology.

 

Things like exercise and sauna reinforce the point of taking senolytics.  No study has shown any appreciable life extension via either sauna or exercise that I'm aware of.  These things are just cultural bugaboos.  People think if they have the perfect mix of exercise, diet and lifestyle they will somehow live longer.  Well, the science pretty much says that those things are exactly the same as senolytics.  They will improve your health span and decrease your risk of dying over time.  But they don't make much a dent in population level longevity.  Senolytics also have the added benefit of convenience and targeting.  Exercise may decrease senescent cells or other hallmarks of aging.  But it will never precisely maintain these systems like future technology will and like senolytics is very close to doing.  

 

Based upon the animal data thus far, senolytics should extend lifespan in humans. SASP is well studied and contributes to poor health. Reducing this burden should help keep people healthy longer. Given that other methods of extending lifespan in short-lived species do not work as spectacularly in humans, I would suspect senolytics to have a lesser effect in humans (than animals). Still, there is no reason, as far as I can tell, to say that senolytics WILL NOT extend lifespan in humans. 

 

Of course, we won't know for sure for many years because no one is conducting or will conduct a double blind placebo controlled trial in humans with lifespan as an end point.

[Michael]

I think the answer, ultimately, lies in regrowing/rejuvenating the thymus and restoring the immune system allowing it to do its job of eliminating these death resistant cells.

As I've pointed out before, this won't work: the thymus produces T-cells, whereas the cells responsible for immunosurveillance of SEN are natural killer cells. As you may know, SENS Research Foundation has launched a collaboration with Dr. Judith Campisi to develop rejuvenation biotechnology to augment the ability of NK immunosurveillance of senescent cells. I can now happily report that — after many months of our postbacc and an intern banging their heads against the wall trying to get the most basic aspects of our experimental systems set up — we are no finally properly getting going, and with the very impressive leadership of recently-hired immunosurveillance lead Dr. Amit Sharma.
 

Not taking cocktails of drugs that bypass and ignore the problem.

Senolytics don't ignore the problem: they ablate the problem.
 

Your best bet here is doing things that boost growth hormone.

Growth hormone at best does next to nothing if given to the elderly, and extensive evidence strongly argues that it accelerates aging if given at younger ages.
 

I think the senescent cell elimination will at best extend youthspan by a couple of decades at least, but not max lifespan.

It is biologically implausible that you would extend youthspan by as dramatic an amount as a couple of decades and not have an effect on maximum lifespan.

[Michael]

Finland used to be notorious for CVD incidence because of their traditional diet, extremely high in saturated fats. This has been changing for quite some time now but the change will be slow to occur in statistics.

 

Oh, it's been showing up for decades:
 

-Norwegian Institute of Public Health

 
Of course, it's not just SaFA (as the NIPH page points out,  "The proportion of smokers has decreased markedly...  both cholesterol and blood pressure levels have fallen), but the shift away from SaFA was definitely in the mix.

[sedentary]

can someone create "Finland's health" thread separate of this and move most of those posts, thanks

Edited by sedentary, 12 October 2019 - 12:55 AM.

[Rocket]

Growth hormone at best does next to nothing if given to the elderly, and extensive evidence strongly argues that it accelerates aging if given at younger ages.

 

Growth hormone does nothing for the elderly only if you don't consider stronger bones and improved healing from injuries as being nothing. Or if you don't consider fat loss as nothing. 

 

Growth hormone is ONLY mildly anabolic. That means if given to the elderly it will do almost nothing at all for regaining muscle. You need to administer HGH in youth to maintain health and muscle tissue. 

 

Being mildly anabolic means that HGH will not magically reverse frailty. But if given in youth it delay, postpone, and diminish the frailty that people experience as they age.

 

Giving HGH to the elderly is like firefighters trying to save a burning house after it has burned down.

 

More muscle, Stronger bones. Regenerated thymus and stronger immune system. Better healing. Less fat accumulation. Stronger skin. Healthier vascular system. Yes, I suppose by all accounts HGH speeds aging! Please, give me that kind of aging over what we have today.

 

HGH does not cause osteoperosis, atherosclerosis, diabetes (need to take with DHEA), sarcopenia, arthritis, thinning and wrinkled skin, macular degeneration.

 

There is a lot of money vested in keeping people ill and also ill informed. HGH speeds healing. Has been given to burn patients to speed healing. But if you go to the hospital for a major operation, it Is illegal for a doctor to give you HGH to help with your healing. Even in cases of spinal fusion where it would greatly aid in the successful outcome of the bone fusion process, it is illegal.

 

 

Edited by Michael, 13 October 2019 - 02:31 AM.
trim quotes

[Harkijn]

can someone create "Finland's health" thread separate of this and move most of those posts, thanks

You are right Sedentary we should not talk about Finland. We should talk about Mexico  Because of the spectacular growth of per capita strawberry  consumption, soon the steep trails of mount Popocatepetl will see hordes of sprightly Mexican senior hikers: 

https://www.indexbox...s-in-the-world/

 

But no, seriously: in answer to your earlier question: I have seen pelargonidin mentioned in the literature as a weak senolytic in strawberries, olive oil and red wine. That is not to distract from it's possible importance since as you suggest combining polyphenols may conceivably lead to stronger senolytic approaches.

I believe there is a consensus in medicine that whole plant extracts have much stronger effects than substances isolated from them. This is surmised to be caused by better absorption. So combos  just might lead to somewhat better senolytic effects (for those who can't or won't take Dasanatib etc.) . So a recipe will probably contain fisetin, quercetine, piperlongumine, olive oil (for fat and pelargonidin) and  we will probably never get confirmation of its senolytic effects   Any more suggestions for the recipe?

[bhangchai]

 So a recipe will probably contain fisetin, quercetin, piperlongumine, olive oil.  Any more suggestions for the recipe?

My protocol is as follows: (age 67, weight approx. 77kg)

 

(Approximately 1 gram each per day [for 3 days] of F + Q + C.  I also did one protocol with only F + Q)

 

1,000 mg of Fisetin (Swanson Ultra Fisetin Novusetin 100 mg, 10 capsules)

950 mg Quercetin (Swanson Quercetin 475 mg, 2 capsules)

1,050 mg of Curcumin (Swanson Curcumin Complex 350 mg with 2.5 mg piperine, 3 capsules)

1/2 teaspoon of freshly ground black pepper

1 Tablespoon of Olive Oil

 

Open all capsules and mix with the olive oil.  Add the black pepper.  Take on an empty stomach.  Enjoy...

This was done for 3 consecutive days.

 

Important things, in my view:

Take with oil, best to "dissolve" or mix F and Q and C with olive oil.

Take with ½ tsp ground black pepper.  (Check drug interactions [piperine])

Take on an empty stomach, at least 2 or 3 hours after eating.  I took mine in the evening before bed or first thing in the morning.

Take away from other medications.

Reduce your caffeine intake, per Mayo Clinic.

Don’t do any strenuous exercise for a week or two after taking.

Don’t take while sick or healing.

 

My feeling is that it could be taken every 4 to 6 months.  I did a second protocol after 1 month and felt it was too early.  I certainly felt like it did something for me.

Younger people especially probably won't notice much, it would be more like taking a prophylactic or preventative measure.  Perhaps even the older people won't

notice much after taking it for a time or two.  I plan to take it 2 to 3 times a year.

(This cost under $15 per 3 day protocol, but I had to buy extra Q and C that was not used right away so the initial cost is somewhat more.)

[Michael]

can someone create "Finland's health" thread separate of this and move most of those posts, thanks

 

I agree, and apologize for dragging it out. I have been trying to split them off, but every time I do so I get an error with the www.longecity.org  database. This kind of thing has happened before; hopefully it will get fixed in the next day or so.
 

[Nate-2004]

Michael aren't NK cells produced all over? Bone marrow, spleen, thymus, lymph nodes, like other aspects of the immune system? Either way if producing NK cells is key and Judi's on to something there, that's awesome. 

 

What readily available ways are there to produce more NK cells other than quality deep sleep and mobilizing them through exercise?

Edited by Nate-2004, 13 October 2019 - 07:12 PM.

[Kentavr]

Please pay attention to this. I think you have chosen the wrong polyphenol:

1. Replace fisetin with taxifolin. Taxifolin is practically non-toxic.

2. Use taxifolin with a purity of at least 92%.

3. Do not use polyphenols in compressed form. After pressing, they polymerize. It is necessary to use polyphenols in the form of a powder, or dissolved in oil.

4. I recommend taxifolin from the company Ametis (Russia).

[Psy]

Any studies for senolytic   properties of taxifolin?

Edited by Psy, 14 October 2019 - 12:55 AM.

[OP2040]

Based upon the animal data thus far, senolytics should extend lifespan in humans. SASP is well studied and contributes to poor health. Reducing this burden should help keep people healthy longer. Given that other methods of extending lifespan in short-lived species do not work as spectacularly in humans, I would suspect senolytics to have a lesser effect in humans (than animals). Still, there is no reason, as far as I can tell, to say that senolytics WILL NOT extend lifespan in humans. 

 

Of course, we won't know for sure for many years because no one is conducting or will conduct a double blind placebo controlled trial in humans with lifespan as an end point.

 

 

Fair enough, I'm certainly hoping that it does exactly that.  But at the least we can all agree that it is still a stopgap, and LEV will not happen with either senolytics or the nutrient sensing pathways.  It will be one of the other hallmarks or some third party intervention organ replacement.  My money is on epigentics and partial reprogramming.   In any case, the argument can be made that we should stop spending so much time on senolytics and sirtuins, and move on a bit to the vanguard. After all, these are becoming mature technologies and I'm convinced they will be mastered in most of our lifetimes.  So all we have to do is cautiously but optimistically follow what the many startup companies and research groups are doing and upgrade year-on-year.  But as vanguards, the bulk of our energy should be on the cutting edge stuff, not endlessly fine-tuning of established technologies.  All that I want left of the senolytics space is a test and that's the only reason I pay attention to this thread.  Outside of that, I'm sure the studies will keep rolling in, and within a few years we will have the senescent cell hallmark checked off.