7 replies to this topic

[osris]

Anyone agree or disagree with this:

 

https://www.legereph...-vs-nam-vs-nmn/

 

Quote:

 

"In fact, more recent studies have demonstrated that orally ingested nicotinamide riboside (NR) and nicotinamide mononucleotide (NMN) get almost entirely converted to nicotinamide (NAM) in the liver: “Intravenous administration of nicotinamide riboside or mononucleotide delivered intact molecules to multiple tissues, but the same agents given orally were metabolized to nicotinamide in the liver” (Liu, 2018). “Thus, the majority of the orally administered NR that reaches the muscle appears to enter in the form of liberated NAM. […] NR exerts only a subtle influence on the steady-state concentration of NAD in muscles” (Frederick, 2016)."

[able]

I don't disagree with that quote.  It does seem that the majority is changed to NAM.

 

But I do disagree with the use of the word "sublingual" in your title.  I see no reason that Oral NAM would be any different from sublingual NAM.

 

And, the fact that the majority is converted to NAM before reaching the bloodstream isn't the same as ALL.  We don't know how much NR or NMN makes it to the bloodstream.  Some does, as they both show different effects than straight NAM.  How much, we don't know.

[osris]

I only put "sublingual" because the article I link to mentioned that form of NAM.

 

I agree with you, oral NAM shouldn't make a difference.

 

Does the quote I posted mean that a NAM supplement (either oral or sublingual) is just as good as NR and NMN supplements? If so, that's good, as NAM supplements are dirt cheap. 

 

 

[Oakman]

Does the quote I posted mean that a NAM supplement (either oral or sublingual) is just as good as NR and NMN supplements? If so, that's good, as NAM supplements are dirt cheap. 

 

At least for the oral route, you need to go through this thread... and I doubt you'll know the right answer even then.

 

https://www.longecit...e-ribose/page-1

[osris]

Do you mean NAM is better than NR and NMN if taken orally?

 

Thanks for the link. 

 

If NAM is better, then the NR/NMN hype must be down to marketing.

[able]

Both NMN and NR have shown benefit for treating some conditions where NAM did not.  

 

Although most is digested and acts as NAM, clearly they have different behavior for some reason.  

 

The simple explanation is that some quantity makes it  through without being digested.

 

We don't know if that is by Slc128, some other pathway, or what.  And we don't know how much NMN and NR avoids being metabolized to NAM.

 

Whether the difference is worth the extra cost is certainly debatable.

 

[Oakman]

Do you mean NAM is better than NR and NMN if taken orally?

 

Thanks for the link. 

 

If NAM is better, then the NR/NMN hype must be down to marketing.

 

 

Both NMN and NR have shown benefit for treating some conditions where NAM did not.  

 

Although most is digested and acts as NAM, clearly they have different behavior for some reason.  

 

The simple explanation is that some quantity makes it  through without being digested.

 

We don't know if that is by Slc128, some other pathway, or what.  And we don't know how much NMN and NR avoids being metabolized to NAM.

 

Whether the difference is worth the extra cost is certainly debatable.

 

The recent podcast by Rhonda Patrick seems to be a reality based summary of where we are understanding these paradoxes about NAD+ and how to increase it. The only part left out of the greater discussion seems to be regarding NAD+ consumers in the body, and the potential to suppress them in individuals to increase overall NAD+ supplies.

[SearchHorizon]

As others noted above, when one ingests NR, some of it is converted to NAD+, although most of it is turned into NAM. So, NR behaves differently than NAM (when orally ingested).

 

For me, there is one question that has never been answered satisfactorily. There was a paper that showed NR is cleaved into NAM and ribose in the gut before absorption. Once absorbed, the suggestion was that the absorbed NAM and the ribose are recombined into NR at the liver, before being converted to NAD or NAM.  I suppose one can verify this, by taking ribose with NAM and see if you get some of the effects unique to NR.