6 replies to this topic

[StephCThomp]

What do you make of this, and what would you advise?

 

I have a female friend in her late 50s.  She has/is...

• Slim
• Quite fit
• Eats Mediterranean-ish
• Very high Cholesterol, comprising mostly LDL
• High Triglycerides
• Blood sugar normal (mid-range)
• CRP normal (low end)

• Angiogram shows zero atherosclerosis/arterial plaque
• Arterial calcium score is zero

Doctors are trying to get her on statins to 'bring her numbers down' despite confirmation of zero visible arterial disease - actually unusually good arteries.  However, her Triglycerides are up too, so...?  What are your thoughts?

Edited by StephCThomp, 07 December 2020 - 01:40 AM.

[hotbit]

 

• Angiogram shows zero atherosclerosis/arterial plaque
• Arterial calcium score is zero

 

Above markers are truly important, unlike cholesterol level.  If she's healthy, why to take statins? To become sick?

My knowledge about cholesterol is very limited, but it seems:
- there is a limited if any evidence that high cholesterol is detrimental; "high cholesterol" history might be one of the biggest myths in modern medicine

- size of cholesterol molecules seems to be more telling that level itself

 

 

 

According to the British-Austrian philosopher Karl Popper, a theory in the empirical sciences can never be proven, but it can be shown to be false. If it cannot be falsified, it is not a scientific hypothesis. In the following, we have followed Popper’s principle to see whether it is possible to falsify the cholesterol hypothesis. We have also assessed whether the conclusions from three recent reviews by its supporters [1–3] are based on an accurate and comprehensive review of the research on lipids and cardiovascular disease (CVD).

 

LDL-C does not cause cardiovascular disease: a comprehensive review of the current literature

• The hypothesis that high TC or LDL-C causes atherosclerosis and CVD has been shown to be false by numerous observations and experiments.

• The fact that high LDL-C is beneficial in terms of overall lifespan has been ignored by researchers who support the lipid hypothesis.

• The assertion that statin treatment is beneficial has been kept alive by individuals who have ignored the results from trials with negative outcomes and by using deceptive statistics.

• That statin treatment has many serious side effects has been minimized by individuals who have used a misleading trial design and have ignored reports from independent researchers.

Edited by hotbit, 08 December 2020 - 03:32 PM.

[thompson92]

Get an NMR lipoprofile and check the LDL particle count.  

 

Also, terms like "very high LDL" are not useful  Give real numbers.

[StephCThomp]

Thanks Hobit.  Everyone except her doctor is of the same view regarding the cholesterol.  However, it is puzzling that her body is producing so much LDL and some extra Triglyceride.

 

 

Thompson92, the test you mention...  What do you propose should be the actions that flow from the results of this? 

 

And for her "Very high LDL", what actions do you propose should follow and how should they be different if whether her LDL is 5, 6, 7 or 8 mmol/L?

[Rocket]

How do you know that this persons condition isn't just beginning? A one off lipid panel says nothing. Also with age the vascular system develops imperfections that collect plaques.... Sounds dangerous to assume that the persons health will always remain good with high lipids. Take a healthy person and feed them big Macs and French fries every day and sure they will be healthy at the beginning with high lipids but health will degrade.

[thompson92]

Thanks Hobit.  Everyone except her doctor is of the same view regarding the cholesterol.  However, it is puzzling that her body is producing so much LDL and some extra Triglyceride.

 

 

Thompson92, the test you mention...  What do you propose should be the actions that flow from the results of this? 

 

And for her "Very high LDL", what actions do you propose should follow and how should they be different if whether her LDL is 5, 6, 7 or 8 mmol/L?

 

 

I don't speculate much until I know the NMR Lipoprofile.  At first glance, her diet should be evaluated, particularly related to cheap/processed carbs or some carb source that is driving her elevated Trigs.  It's likely that the LDL is along for the ride and the issue is excessive trig synthesis due to diet.  But IDK.  It could be genetic factor.  Would need to know the NMR data and know more about her diet and any hereditary issues.

 

Statin may be appropriate, but NMR lipoprofile should be done first to evaluate its necessity.  Any good lipidologist would tell you that.  Average doctor might not know any better.

[Grooovin1]

https://www.ncbi.nlm...les/PMC4357520/

 

The role of macrophages and arterial plaque needs more study. Perhaps she is blessed with unusually strong ones.