214 replies to this topic

[niner]

Edward, go to www.benagene.org. it's all explained there.

[edward]

Thanks niner. I should have read the first couple of pages of this thread rather than start from the end and go back.

The info on benagene.org looks good however I agree with a what a few others have said about waiting for third party information and the replication of the mice experiments. If others get the same kind of results then I will definitely consider taking it. If it does prove effective by other researchers I would love to see a rat/mouse study where one group was supplemented with resveratrol, one group supplement benagene and one group supplemented with benagene AND resveratrol, along with a control group of course. Perhaps different dosage levels also... Maybe I should order some lab rats and do it myself...

[opales]

Alan,

I looked at the Benagene site and it looks as if though the C57BL/6 male mice you were using had roughly 50% survivorship of 21 (control, basically AL) and 26 (Benagene) months, and maximum lifespan of 27 (control, basically AL) and 31 (Benagene) months. However, if you look at CR studies done on the same species, these numbers appear to be generally MUCH higher, for example here

http://www.fasebj.or...nt/02-0533fjev1

the 50% survivorships are 26.3 (AL) and 32.6 (40% CR) months, and maximum lifespans are 34.3 (AL) and 42.7 (40% CR). These too were C57BL/6 male mice.

Based on this, it looks to me as if you did a real crappy job of taking care of your mice and Benagene barely normalized their lifespan, getting about the same lifespan as AL mice (sic!) of the same species usually tend to get. That hardly seems like a proof of CR effect though.

Am I missing something here?

[acash]

Hi Opales,

Thoust pulls no punches.

Yes, in some studies, the C57BL/6 male mice live longer, in some they live shorter. This is why it is critical to have a control group under the same conditions, and not "assume" a lifespan, even though C57BL/6 has been studied extensively. My lab conditions are not the same as other lab conditions, so we try to compare "apples" to "apples".

Currently, the Jackson Laboratory is performing long-term studies on various breeds, including several types of C57BL/6. It appears we are within tolerance levels of their work, but their work is not yet complete. You may want to check it out at

http://phenome.jax.o...s&sym=Jaxshock1

Another "popular" study you may want to look at is at Life Extension's website where they did a lifespan study on melatonin (not that I am advocating melatonin use).

http://www.lef.org/m...g95/95dec2d.htm

You will note that the average lifespan of the control group is 23 months, similar to my results. The literature shows a wide range.

The good news is that the National Institute of Health is now working on repeating the research on benaGene with better facilities and many more mice. The bad news is that it will take several years. The good news is that they will publish their findings.

Regards,

Alan

[acash]

Hi,

Terra Biological, who developed "benaGene" is considering various advertising strategies to "get the word out". One thing our marketing department has requested is testimonials. If you have used the product and would like to make a testimonial, please e-mail it to me directly at acash(at)benaGene.org. Please replace the (at) with a @ (I do this so I don't increase my spam load).

I thank you for the help.

Sincerely,

Alan Cash

[Gerald W. Gaston]

Well I am just now going to order some from cureself, so can't make any testimonials. My main test will be to see how it affects my fasting blood glucose levels. I've dropped it an avg of 15 points via exercise, diet, more sleep, and suppliments (ALA, GSE, Fenugreek, Cinnamon, etc). I dropped Chromium Picolinate some time ago. Not taking Metformin or larger amounts of Benfotiamine (there is 54mg in my activated B-Complex) yet.

Anyone else tried it specifically for lower blood glucose? Or just noted that effect via testing?

[acash]

Hi frankbuzin,

I'm glad you are going to monitor your fasting blood glucose levels. You may want to start doing that now, so that you can see your baseline, and the "swings" in your baseline. It will take benaGene about 3 weeks to work. At that time, you will see a decrease in fasting glucose and also the size of the fluctuations (or swings) in your fasting glucose level.

We recommend taking benaGene with an evening meal. If you take it on an empty stomach, about 50% of the people feel light headed due to the glucose lowering effect. We don't see this strong an effect when taken with food.

[Gerald W. Gaston]

Thanks for the reply Alan. I have my baseline as I've been monitoring it steady for over a year now. I always, without fail, take my morning fasting reading. For the first couple of months I would take it before meals, and at various intervals after meals just to see how certains foods would affect me. I still that do every so often (esp when eating new stuff), but as you know strips can get expensive testing all the time.

Edited by frankbuzin, 29 May 2007 - 05:59 AM.

[tintinet]

Evening meal, eh? How'd I miss that advice till now?

[acash]

Hi Tintinet,

The evening meal advice actually came from talking with our customers.

Regards,

Alan

[tintinet]

Thanks, Alan.

What differences have people taking Benagene noted WRT timing the dose?

[acash]

Hi Tintinet,

Some of our customers brought this to our attention. They noted after taking benaGene, it had a calming effect. It may be due to the lowering of glucose levels. benaGene has an immediate effect on blood sugar levels, and then the secondary effect, after 2.5 to 3 weeks to lower overall (fasting glucose) levels. We believe the second effect is due to changes in the genomic response, and it is probably the more important effect. We can measure both the immediate effects and the change at 2.5 to 3 weeks with a simple glucose meter.

Since in some customers it has a calming effect, it make sense to take it at night. We now recommend with an evening meal because the initial effect can make some people light-headed if they take it on an empty stomach. We do not have a double blind study on the calming effect-- just customer reports.

Regards,

Alan

[kenj]

Some of our customers brought this to our attention. They noted after taking benaGene, it had a calming effect. It may be due to the lowering of glucose levels

FWIW, I noted similar effect from R-Lipoic Acid first times I took it (w/o being "light-headed").

[Gerald W. Gaston]

Well it took long enough to arrive from CureSelf but I finally got my bottles. 30 of these small size 3 capsules at the bottom of each bottle seems like a big waste of space. :-)

I'm going to a use my HbA1c test and get it mailed off before starting.

[trevyn]

4/28 draw: Fasting glucose 92
~5/5: Started benaGene 1 pill/day
5/25 draw: Fasting glucose 86
7/17 draw: Fasting glucose 94, HbA1c 4.7% (ref 4.8-5.9)
8/7 draw: Fasting glucose 91

Continuing benaGene at least until my supply runs out. All tests by LabCorp. Far from a controlled experiment, all sorts of things changed in that time.

Edited by trevyn, 13 August 2007 - 12:35 AM.

[acash]

trevyn,

You may want to measure daily glucose levels with a glucose meter. If you compare "before" and "after" benaGene, you should also see a marked drop in your glucose "swing"-- the levels will stabilize and remain more stable.

Your HbAlc (which measures glucose interaction with hemoglobin over a 120 day span) is a little bit lower than would be expected with readings of 86 and 94, but is still in the normal range (at the low end). Keeping the glycosylated hemogloben down is good, indicating great glucose control, and is a good long-term strategy.

Keep us posted on any test updates.

Regards,

Alan

[Gerald W. Gaston]

I finally started taking beneGene last Monday. I was waiting until I got back from vacation, had time to do/mail off my HbA1c test, and for the effects of a few other "blood sugar" related supplements that I had dropped to level off.

I dropped the 300mg (75% gymnemic acid) Gymnema Sylestre extract which was taken 15-20min before meals, and the 920mg Cinnamon (cassia) & 1.2g Fenugreek Seed that were each taken with meals. I still take Na-ALA with meals. I also cut out all of my high caffeine sources (coffee, low carb energy drinks, etc) at the same time. Major headaches the first week.

Within the 4 weeks since I dropped them, my fasting avg has rose slightly from 94 to 98. A bigger difference would likely be seen post-meal testing, but because of limited supply of strips I haven't been doing that. Another 200 strips should be here Monday and I will resume more frequent testing.

The first week of beneGene hasn't affected my fasting numbers in any obvious way, but we will see how they look in 4 weeks. And when the strips get here (hopefully tomorrow as I'm now out as of today), I will be noting the pre and post meal numbers. With the +/- 20% afforded BG meters, the composition of meals, timing of meals, exercise, supplements, etc. I'm not so concerned about small changes in day to day testing, but more of the efects over time.

My HbAlc came back last week: 5.0% (ref range 3.8 - 5.9). Using the commonly used formula:
AvgBGL = (HbA1c * 33.3) - 86

My avg BG would be 81. Even taking into account the Dawn effect, with such a higher fasting number I must be going hypo a good bit for that to avg out. I will test a few times in the 2-4am range to see how it looks then and will test more frequent through the day (would be nice to have a CBGM at this point) to note any hypoglycemia.

[curious_sle]

Small update:
NIA begins Aging "Intervention" testing with benaGene
http://www.nia.nih.g...tingProgram.htm

Is that the one Spindler is doing? If so i would like to think that it helped someone *cough* suggested testing Benagene

Let's see what comes from it.

[neogenic]

Is anyone using OAA for ergogenic benefit, given its a key TCA intermediate?

[drmz]

So what is the end conclusion for benaGene ?

[rabagley]

I still have a question about how the active substance remains stable, given how every mention in literature mentions it's instability. In solid form, 3-carboxy-3-oxopropanoic acid includes the note to use refrigerated storage, preferably below 0 degrees C.

Is it the vitamin C that provides the stability? For how long?

[Gerald W. Gaston]

Personally I didn't reorder after my two months supply ran out. Even on an empty stomach I could not see an a difference in regard to blood glucose testing (which was my main short term objective). By the end of Sept my fasting BG avg was up to 102 where it currently remains.

[neogenic]

Ragbagley, the formulators of Benagene state how crucial the Ascorbic acid is to work. That using OAA by itself is nearly worthless. I assume they cite stability. Although a patent wouldn't be the same with one ingredient that is not novel, unless it is a novel use patent. So another ingredient almost becomes a necessity. It certainly is a cheap one, which is another bonus.

I have no idea if it truly makes all the difference or not. I guess the data and feedback will tell that story in time.

[mikeinnaples]

A little expensive without any concrete evidence from other sources.

[Anthony_Loera]

Don't you use Huperzia Zader? Would you consider that a supplement?

[neuroenhanced]

So this is available in the US yet?

[tintinet]

Ya can order it from Canadian vendors, at any rate.

[neogenic]

Any updates from Benagene users or research that is newly available?

[Forever21]

The latest update I found on this is here

http://www.mfoundati...hread.php?t=715

[tintinet]

The latest update I found on this is here

http://www.mfoundati...hread.php?t=715

I'm still taking it. Still no noticeable effects, etc.