1708 replies to this topic

[malbecman]

Ahem, umm, back to the original topic. [wis]

I've been on 5 mg/kg/d since the New Year and definitely had a strong improvement in my tolerance to cold.

This past weekend, I was with my entire multi-generational family at a picnic near the CA coast. The fog started blowing in and the air temp dropped rapidly. All 3 generations of my family changed into:
Long pants
Ong sleeve shirts plus
Sweatshirts and jackets for the ladies.
Boots/heavy shoes

I stayed in my:
Shorts
Tropical cotton shirt, shortsleeve plus a regular cotton undershirt
tennis shoes

Everyone thought I was nuts (more than usual, that is) but I was fine for the entire ~2 hours we were there, even just sitting around.
It was very interesting to notice that I did not feel cold, not even in my fingers which usually ice up first in that kind of weather.....

Just my observational 2 cents.

I still, also, have not suffered a cold this entire year so far (fingers crossed), even with 2 little ones at home.

[health_nutty]

I've noticed a bit of increased resistance to cold myself (relatively speaking).

Also, my colds have been very strange since taking t-res. I still get sick about half the time my family gets sick, however the colds are so mild they feel like mild allergies. They hardly effect me at all. I would swear they are allergies but they always happen for 5 days or so after my family gets sick. Other than that I don't get allergies anymore.

[bixbyte]

I noticed I was sweating extreme in a winter coat so I dressed in lighter clothes.
Definately, I am able to tolerate cold weather.
During the winter when the wind chill was 15 degrees outside I wore a summer shirt and a sweat shirt. Made sure my hands and feet were dry and warm with winter gloves and rubber boots.
Walked a long distance like a mile in deep snow.
I mentioned to my wife that we could do Mt Everest on RSV but the elements would probably kill us.
We are not supermen, just able to endure the cold.

Also, I have not had a cold for years.

I felt the start of cold symtoms, but for some reason, I think my body shrugged off the colds in a few hours.
My wife caught one cold this year for the first time but the symptoms did not linger.
Everyone in our surrounding family caught that cold, but me.


When I look at my blood work I now have a higher number of White blood cells.
Maybe they fight infections.

I know it is the RSV but who can prove it?

Alex

[unglued]

It was very interesting to notice that I did not feel cold, not even in my fingers which usually ice up first in that kind of weather.

Ah, but were they actually more resistant to cold or did you just not get the warning signs (a similar effect to what I've heard alcohol has)? If you could be comfortable even while getting frostbite, that would neatly provide a mechanism for my fingers-falling-off theory of why we never heard back from some people after they started taking 500mg. [sfty]

As for me, I was taking only about 2mg/kg/day until I upped it today, and did not notice any such effect, but I definitely noticed that effect dramatically when I was in my late teens and 20's and started walking a lot in college. In high school and as a child I had been one of the first to feel cold, but within a couple of years I found I was still comfortable in a T-shirt when everyone else was putting on three layers of clothing. That effect has lasted for a quarter century now. Either it was all the walking, or my mother not being around to tell me to put on a sweater.

[tintinet]

WRT white blood cells: one of the hallmarks of CRON is lower WBC #.

Speculation regarding this has been the relative low WBC may reflect more efficient, more specific, and less autoreactive immune function, as CRONed folks frequently also report overall decrease in illness and more robust health.

[bixbyte]

WRT white blood cells: one of the hallmarks of CRON is lower WBC #.

Speculation regarding this has been the relative low WBC may reflect more efficient, more specific, and less autoreactive immune function, as CRONed folks frequently also report overall decrease in illness and more robust health.

What you are quoting?
"CRONed folks" ?
"WRT" ?


My WBC is in the normal range but two of the components are higher

http://pages.prodigy...bite/butest.jpg

This could be due to a light infection or nothing specific

Alex

[krillin]

CRON = calorie restriction with optimum nutrition
WRT = with respect to

[bixbyte]

CRON = calorie restriction with optimum nutrition
WRT = with respect to

IMHO, diet restriction is not enough, you must exercise to live longer.
skinny rat without a treadmill vs a fat rat on a treadmill

Add sinclair study to dose the fat rat w. RSV

Alex

[malbecman]

Ah, but were they actually more resistant to cold or did you just not get the warning signs (a similar effect to what I've heard alcohol has)?  If you could be comfortable even while getting frostbite, that would neatly provide a mechanism for my fingers-falling-off theory of why we never heard back from some people after they started taking 500mg.  [sfty]

Normally, my family, including myself, are the kind that get cold hands/feet very easily. I doubt it is Reynaud's syndrome, just part of our family "heritage". We are Anglo-saxons with BMIs <25, exercise regularly and good health so I don't think its any kind of circulatory issue either. Anyways, I just observed that my hands and feet were not cold while at the beach while the rest of my family was feeling chilled and having the usual icy hands, etc.....

[unglued]

Here are my blood test results, after 6 months of moderate-dose resveratrol (ramping up from about 15-90mg to about 100-200mg -- I weigh 80kg). Last pre-resveratrol test was August 2006. (See my introductory post for more.)

[mellow] Glucose: 88 mg/dL, essentially unchanged.
(was 86 in 2006, 87 in 2005, 89 in 2004, 78 in 2002).

[mellow] Cholesterol: 123 mg/dL, down 2% (insignificant?)
(was 126 in 2006, 135 in 2005, 115 in 2004, 158 in 2002)

[thumb] Triglyceride: 72 mg/dL, down 45% from 2006, 36% from lowest recent
(was 130 in 2006, 102 in 2005, 98 in 2004, 248 in 2002)
[Note: After the 2002 test I tried to avoid non-whole grains.
I forget when I switched to artificial sweetener, but it was before 2004.]

[mellow] HDL: 44 mg/dL, unchanged
(was 44 in 2006, 42 in 2005, 45 in 2004, 34 in 2002)

[huh] LDL calculated: 65 mg/dL, up 16%
(was 56 in 2006, 73 in 2005, 50 in 2004, 74 in 2002)
[I wonder what other change made that calculation go up -- triglyceride?]

Discussion:
I was sort of hoping to see my HDL increase (as a marker -- it's already well within the range currently considered good). That hope was based on anecdotal evidence from other humans here, but I wasn't on the 5mg/kg dose until after the blood draw, so we'll see what happens if I stay in the higher dose for a few months. But the study on rabbits (see above) suggests that I shouldn't expect to see lipid improvements, even though it may protect my heart.

But my dietary cholesterol intake is actually closer to that of the control bunnies, and I'm still manging to stay in the healthy weight range, so maybe the rumored study on healthy mice would be a better model for me. I'm going to be very disappointed if it shows that all resveratrol does is to make fat lazy couch potatoes exactly as healthy as people who eat right and get plenty of exercise.

Edited by unglued, 16 May 2007 - 08:05 AM.

[sUper GeNius]

Question for the experts here. Is it possible that t-res can cause higher blood levels of Paxil? See this pdf for the metabolism of Paxil:

http://us.gsk.com/pr.../us_paxilcr.pdf


I am taking the AOR blend with piperine, as well as curcumin with piperine. This morning I had a few hours where I felt very very strange, like maybe too much paxil. It wore off a few hours later.

The pdf talks about P450 being involved in paxil's metabolism.

Thanks

[bixbyte]

Question for the experts here. Is it possible that t-res can cause higher blood levels of Paxil? See this pdf for the metabolism of Paxil:

http://us.gsk.com/pr.../us_paxilcr.pdf


I am taking the AOR blend with piperine, as well as curcumin with piperine.  This morning I had a few hours where I felt very very strange, like maybe too much paxil. It wore off a few hours later.

The pdf talks about P450 being involved in paxil's metabolism.

Thanks

I am no expert on contraindications of Paxil.

In my nonmedical opinion, RSV may be making your liver metabolize the Paxil faster.


Plus, I would stop taking the curcumin.
Cucumin appears to turn on the P 35 Gene.

video google search: Paul McGlothin

Select the video on Paul McGlothin Resveratrol.

Description: Sample clip of a talk given at the Calorie Restriction (CR) Society 2004 Conference. Paul McGlothin: Resveratrol - CR Memetic? DVDs containing this and other conference lectures are available from the Calorie Restriction Society, www.calorierestriction.org.

P450 is responsible for almost every drug metabolization.


I am no expert so if you take RSV and Curcumin you could inform your medical care expert.

You may need take a smaller paxil dose and at a different interval.

Alex

[maxwatt]

The piperine is probably contributing to P450 inhibition, resulting in higher Paxil levels. Bixbytes suggestion to lower your Paxil dose would probably help, as would changing formulations to piperine-free versions.

[sUper GeNius]

The piperine is probably contributing to P450 inhibition, resulting in higher Paxil levels.  Bixbytes suggestion to lower your Paxil dose would probably help, as would changing formulations to piperine-free versions.

Bixbyte and Maxwatt:

I do think it is the piperine. I am going to cut back on the Paxil tomorrow and see. I am taking 12.5mg x3, so I can easily cut back one 12.5 mg pill.

I was reading through the Paxil pdf I cited. They say that the therapeutic effect is linear with dose, but only up to the point where the P450 is saturated. Then the effect is non-linear, which makes alot of sense. Also explains how I could get such a jolt from the same dosage of Paxil. If I had been near the P450 saturation level already, the 700mg of AOR t-res, along with the added piperine in the AOR formulation, the curcumin formulation, and (I forgot!!) the piperine in the Vitacost Occupower Basic, all could have inhibited the P450, helping me reach the "tipping point."

Thinking about it more now, cutting back on the Paxil might not be the answer. I may not be able to keep stable blood levels with teh added piperine.

Does cucumin or t-res themselves inhibit P450?


Geez, I got like $500 worth of AOR acta-t-res. What am I going to do.

[bixbyte]

The piperine is probably contributing to P450 inhibition, resulting in higher Paxil levels.  Bixbytes suggestion to lower your Paxil dose would probably help, as would changing formulations to piperine-free versions.

Bixbyte and Maxwatt:

I do think it is the piperine. I am going to cut back on the Paxil tomorrow and see. I am taking 12.5mg x3, so I can easily cut back one 12.5 mg pill.

I was reading through the Paxil pdf I cited. They say that the therapeutic effect is linear with dose, but only up to the point where the P450 is saturated. Then the effect is non-linear, which makes alot of sense. Also explains how I could get such a jolt from the same dosage of Paxil. If I had been near the P450 saturation level already, the 700mg of AOR t-res, along with the added piperine in the AOR formulation, the curcumin formulation, and (I forgot!!) the piperine in the Vitacost Occupower Basic, all could have inhibited the P450, helping me reach the "tipping point."

Thinking about it more now, cutting back on the Paxil might not be the answer. I may not be able to keep stable blood levels with teh added piperine.

Does cucumin or t-res themselves inhibit P450?


Geez, I got like $500 worth of AOR acta-t-res. What am I going to do.

*******************************************************

Detailed Description
90 Vegi-Caps 231 mg AOR04142
______________________________________________
SUPPLEMENT FACTS:
Serving Size: 1 Capsule

___________________________________________________


Trans-Resveratrol (in oxygen, pH, and light-resistant beadlets) .............................. 100 mg
Luteolin ......................................................... 20 mg
Quercetin ...................................................... 51 mg
Vitamin C (Ascorbic Acid) .................................. 40 mg
Piper Nigrum ................................................... 20 mg
____________________________________________________


I looked up AOR acta T-Res
Can you return this RSV and buy some 98% or 50% ?


Alex

*******************************************************************************

[sUper GeNius]

The piperine is probably contributing to P450 inhibition, resulting in higher Paxil levels.  Bixbytes suggestion to lower your Paxil dose would probably help, as would changing formulations to piperine-free versions.

Bixbyte and Maxwatt:

I do think it is the piperine. I am going to cut back on the Paxil tomorrow and see. I am taking 12.5mg x3, so I can easily cut back one 12.5 mg pill.

I was reading through the Paxil pdf I cited. They say that the therapeutic effect is linear with dose, but only up to the point where the P450 is saturated. Then the effect is non-linear, which makes alot of sense. Also explains how I could get such a jolt from the same dosage of Paxil. If I had been near the P450 saturation level already, the 700mg of AOR t-res, along with the added piperine in the AOR formulation, the curcumin formulation, and (I forgot!!) the piperine in the Vitacost Occupower Basic, all could have inhibited the P450, helping me reach the "tipping point."

Thinking about it more now, cutting back on the Paxil might not be the answer. I may not be able to keep stable blood levels with teh added piperine.

Does cucumin or t-res themselves inhibit P450?


Geez, I got like $500 worth of AOR acta-t-res. What am I going to do.

*******************************************************

Detailed Description
90 Vegi-Caps 231 mg AOR04142
______________________________________________
SUPPLEMENT FACTS:
Serving Size: 1 Capsule

___________________________________________________


Trans-Resveratrol (in oxygen, pH, and light-resistant beadlets) .............................. 100 mg
Luteolin ......................................................... 20 mg
Quercetin ...................................................... 51 mg
Vitamin C (Ascorbic Acid) .................................. 40 mg
Piper Nigrum ................................................... 20 mg
____________________________________________________


I looked up AOR acta T-Res
Can you return this RSV and buy some 98% or 50% ?


Alex

*******************************************************************************

I don't know, I'll have to call.

Guess what else. Luteolin is also an inhibitor of the P450 enzymes.

[bixbyte]

The piperine is probably contributing to P450 inhibition, resulting in higher Paxil levels.  Bixbytes suggestion to lower your Paxil dose would probably help, as would changing formulations to piperine-free versions.

Max,

His AOR brand of Resveratrol contains a couple items that interact with other medications.

Luteolin, Quercetin, Piper Nigrum

http://www.cureself....ROD&ProdID=4551

Alex

[wayside]

Geez, I got like $500 worth of AOR acta-t-res.  What am I going to do.

How closely together are you taking them? Maybe separating by a few hours will mitigate the piperine effect on the Paxil.

[sUper GeNius]

Geez, I got like $500 worth of AOR acta-t-res.  What am I going to do.

How closely together are you taking them? Maybe separating by a few hours will mitigate the piperine effect on the Paxil.

Yesterday I took AOR first thing in the morning, and then the paxil an hour later. I normally seperate them by maybe two hours. Maybe that's also why I had the issue yesterday. Today I'm going to take take the paxil many hours later in the afternoon.

Edited by tobar8, 16 May 2007 - 03:22 PM.

[health_nutty]

Here are my blood test results, after 6 months of moderate-dose resveratrol (ramping up from about 15-90mg to about 100-200mg -- I weigh 80kg).  Last pre-resveratrol test was August 2006.  (See my introductory post for more.)
I'm going to be very disappointed if it shows that all resveratrol does is to make fat lazy couch potatoes exactly as healthy as people who eat right and get plenty of exercise.

Thanks for sharing your bloodwork!

[inawe]

I joined yesterday and this is my first post.
I took Pomeratrol and low dose BAC resveratrol powder for some time. Then I switched to BAC 50%. Like 4 month ago I upped the dosage to 800 mgr/day. Yesterday I got the results from my latest blood work. Glucose stayed put. But, HDL increased 13% and LDL decreased 30% (WOW!).
I am not bothered too much by the Emodin. Every 2-3 weeks it hits me for a day or so. My wife is much more sensitive and that's why I'll like to get 98-99% powder.
Inawe

[unglued]

Thanks for sharing your results, inawe. If you don't mind, could you also tell us:

(1) what the absolute values of your HDL and LDL are?
(Mine didn't improve after nine months on a low dosage,
but LDL was exceptionally good to start with, so I don't know
if they might improve if I get tested in 3-4 months at my own expense.)

(2) roughly how much you weigh? I'm about 175lb or 80kg, so 400mg for me
is the same as 500mg for someone who weighs 100kg (220lb), for example)
You're taking exactly twice what I'm starting to take, but it could be less than
that if you're bigger (in any direction) or less than that if you're short and/or
skinny. The very name of this topic is based on the average American
man's weight, because "500 club" sounds catchier than "5mg/kg/day club",
according to one of the earliest posts. But the dose per body weight is
the only thing we can compare among ourselves.

Edited by unglued, 16 May 2007 - 07:25 PM.

[inawe]

I'm not taking resveratrol to improve on my lipid profile which was in quite good shape before. Besides for preventative measures, I was taking it in the hope it would lower glucose (which it didn't) and help in my exercises (which it did slightly).
I weigh 60 Kg and I'm taking 800 mgr/day. Comes out 13.33 mgr/Kg/day. (Does that make me more of a fanatic than Sinclair?).
I think in general it's easier to improve on bad numbers. But as I said my cholesterol numbers were good and became even better (as compared from a year ago).
My LDL went from 103 mgr/dL to 70. HDL from 102 mgr/dL to 115.

[health_nutty]

I'm not taking resveratrol to improve on my lipid profile which was in quite good shape before. Besides for preventative measures, I was taking it in the hope it would lower glucose (which it didn't) and help in my exercises (which it did slightly).
I weigh 60 Kg and I'm taking 800 mgr/day. Comes out 13.33 mgr/Kg/day. (Does that make me more of a fanatic than Sinclair?).
I think in general it's easier to improve on bad numbers. But as I said my cholesterol numbers were good and became even better (as compared from a year ago).
My LDL went from 103 mgr/dL to 70. HDL from 102 mgr/dL to 115.

[:o] [:o] [:o] [:o] [:o]
Your HDL went from 102 to 115????

I've never heard of HDL being that high.

What kind of exercise performance increase did you see?

[inawe]

My HDL was always around 100 (one of the few good genes I have). But the change in only 4 months is hard to believe (I keep looking at the test reports).
As far as exercise, I think I got a little more stamina/endurance.

[tintinet]

Prior to going high dose trans-resveratrol, my HDL went from 65 mg/dl to 105 mg/dl by switching from high carb/low fat diet to low carb diet/higher fat diet. Dunno what it is now that I'm on > 1 gram trans-resv./day.

[unglued]

Hungry for Blood results?

The 41 pages of discussion of subjective effects, suppliers, best way to take, and so on have been very interesting, but anyone wanting to find the objective results people have reported in the past five months faces a lot of stuff to read or reread.

So as a convenience, I've gone back and spotted all the reports I could find of pre- vs. post-resveratrol (any dose) blood tests or blood pressure measurements, and here are the links of all of them to date:

* fearfrost
* maxwatt
* sablystone
* Addison Strack
* applepoly
* unglued
* inawe
* velopismo (other topic)

(Did I miss any?)

Hope others find this useful. I still say Survey Monkey or a table of some kind would be a more practical way of collecting them than a forum.

Edited by unglued, 17 May 2007 - 07:06 AM.

[Anthony_Loera]

unglued, that is great!

I think this should stand as a post on it's own, as it may become lost later as more folks continue to post here, what do you think?

Anthony Loera

[bixbyte]

Effects noted after nine weeks of resveratrol use, starting at 400 mg, increasing every other week to 1.8 g/day.  Using Orchid synthetic  and a 98% extract in powder form, taken with meals. 

Blood sugar: unchanged.  Still borderline.
Cholesterol:  decreased 6%
HDL:            increased 30%.

Mood, energy: good, not tired by exercise that should have knocked me out (eg, >2 hour fast bike ride)  but when I do get tired, the urge to lie down and sleep is overpowering.  Awaken quickly, no sleep hangover, even if I've slept too little.  My "default" walking pace is faster.

Less sensitive to cold.
Ruddier complexion.
Arthritis is less painful, especially fingers. One finger that would "jam" when flexed no longer does.  Big toe still hurts, where I first noticed arthritis symptoms.
Am able to crack my knuckles for the first time in over 10 years.

This isn't a cure-all.  I still need pain meds for an old back injury.

"Big toe still hurts"

Gout?

[health_nutty]

unglued, that is great!

I think this should stand as a post on it's own, as it may become lost later as more folks continue to post here, what do you think?

Anthony Loera

Definitely!