219 replies to this topic

[Lazarus Long]

Be History

Live to see it

Be and Live

or just the second line:

Live to see history

or

History lives though you living it

or

Life is for living

edit: I was trying for the phoneme play on *be* and *live* sounding like *believe* when expressed together as subliminally stimulating.

[Live Forever]

I should also explain that I think the *www* needs to be back in the title because we here *in the web* assume too much about computer literacy and this is supposed to appeal beyond young folks and geek geezers like me.

The *www* prefix is more universally understood to make the name an address than just the period before *org.*

The address is easy enough to memorize or quickly jot down and making it obvious to those a little less familiar with the web is important; to reiterate Graeme's point about target subjects.

www isn't required in our address, just fyi for everyone. imminst.org and www.imminst.org go to the same place. (actually there are a couple differences, but nothing anyone browsing to it would notice)

[zoolander]

If we could make our own death clock, and make that the landing page

Street art installation.......stick a death clock onto an alley way wall. The death clock could be a normal clock with a note/sign or it could be a countdown timer. It would cgreat to have a countdown timer on the wall that counts down from 10 minutes. At the end of the 10 minutes the number LCD count down just says "Imminst.org" People would most likely stop and watch it count down from 3 minutes or so just to see what it said. NOTE: This might cause quite a stir a la Mooninite.

You Americans are so jumpy

Mitkat, up for some street art?

[Lazarus Long]

www isn't required in our address, just fyi for everyone. imminst.org and www.imminst.org go to the same place.

You actually just demonstrated my point. YOU *know* that in most cases you can reach this place by just entering imminst.org but a lot of the people we are trying to reach out to still don't recognize immediately that .org even indicates a web address, let alone a *domain*.

My point is that someone only generally familiar with the web might not recognize quickly *.org* as a web address but they are far more likely to understand it instantly if it is prefixed with *www*.

[eternaltraveler]

You actually just demonstrated my point.  YOU know that in most cases you can reach this place by just entering imminst.org but a lot of the people we are trying to reach out to still don't recognize immediately that .org even indicates a web address, let alone a *domain*.

My point is that someone only generally familiiar with the web might not recognize immediately *.org* as an addresss but they are likely to understand it is if it is prefixed with *www*.

i wonder how useful our website is to someone who doesn't know that .org indicates a web address [wis]

[zoolander]

Here are something we might want to keep in mind from an visual perspective. Watches/clocks and skulls generally represent time. In Asia it's not good form to give someone a watch because it symbolises that time is running out. So we could use a clock in a flyer to attract the Asain demographic.

Having a collection of things that symbolise life with just one little thing that doesn't works fairly well for me because I tend to notice the odd thing out. For example, a bowl of fruit with one piece of fruit in the bowl slightly damaged. This would be a great symbolic statement about aging.

[Lazarus Long]

i wonder how useful our website is to someone who doesn't know that .org indicates a web address

Very, you are not appreciating the demographic. One of the fastest growing class of web surfers are the elderly but they are not as familiar with the nuance and vernacular of the web even though they are fast becoming widespread users.

We need to appeal to not only the young and university minds but the boomers and AARP set (elderly). They still control the purse strings in most cases.

[Live Forever]

You actually just demonstrated my point.  YOU *know* that in most cases you can reach this place by just entering imminst.org but a lot of the people we are trying to reach out to still don't recognize immediately that .org even indicates a web address, let alone a *domain*.

My point is that someone only generally familiar with the web might not recognize quickly *.org* as a  web address but they are far more likely to understand it is instantly if it is prefixed with *www*.

Aah, good point. Sorry, I misunderstood initially and thought you meant that imminst.org was a different website than www.imminst.org. My apologies.

[zoolander]

i wonder how useful our website is to someone who doesn't know that .org indicates a web address

LOL

I just had a visual of my 75 year old father trying to log on. LOL

It's a shame really. The people that need the information most likely don't know how or are not capable of accessing the information

[Aegist]

We're getting some great ideas flowing, but I think we need to re-perspectivize this a little.

I think it is very important to keep 'immortality' and living 'forever' completely out of it for this exercise. People are very very resistant to that concept, and even violently opposed in many cases. We need to focus on real life stuff which everyone agrees is true and worth fighting against. I think we need to find a way of saying "You can retire from work at the age of 60, and still feel like a 20 year old for the extent of your retirment if you join our crusade" without saying it.

Thinking of that 'life in reverse' skit :

The unfair thing about life is the way it ends. I mean, life is tough.
It takes up a lot of your time and what do you get at the end of it? You
die.

I think the life cycle is all backwards. You should die first, get it
out of the way. Then you live in an old age home. You get kicked out
when you're too young. You get a gold watch when you go to work. You
work forty years until you're young enough to enjoy your retirement. You
do drugs, alcohol, you party, and you get ready for high school. You go
to grade school, you become a kid, you play, you have no
responsibilities, you become a little baby, you go back into the womb,
you spend your last nine months floating...and you finish off as an
orgasm.

Much better....

Try to play on that idea.

Everyone wants to feel young again, but many people are strongly opposed to 'eternal youth' (at least when you suggest that we should do it.) It's weird. But this is what we have to deal with.

[Lazarus Long]

"Youth is wasted on the young"

is an old cliche.

I happen to agree with this Shane

I think it is very important to keep 'immortality' and living 'forever' completely out of it for this exercise. People are very very resistant to that concept, and even violently opposed in many cases. We need to focus on real life stuff which everyone agrees is true and worth fighting against. I think we need to find a way of saying "You can retire from work at the age of 60, and still feel like a 20 year old for the extent of your retirement if you join our crusade" without saying it.

and I was trying to get away from the forever part with the live history approach but you raise an important point and it is a good idea to restrict the parameters of the mindmap and keep it somewhat task specific. It is also why I was saying use the logo without the banner or text.

[Lazarus Long]

I hope Bruce doesn't mind my posting this PM between us here but it is self explanatory:

QUOTE (laz)
Bruce what legal protections do we have for the logo to protect our ownership and exclusive use?

(Bruce)
ImmInst has not made any trademark registrations. To do so would cost around $250-$300 for each... slogan, logo, etc.

One more agenda item

[Live Forever]

How about some sex related ones? Sex always sells.

"Have sex like a 20 year old at 80"

"Viagra for the whole body"

"Wife getting old? Keep her young and sexually invigorated."

"Bigger Penis Now!"
(ok, not really)

[Aegist]

How about some sex related ones? Sex always sells.

"Have sex like a 20 year old at 80"

"Viagra for the whole body"

"Wife getting old? Keep her young and sexually invigorated."

"Bigger Penis Now!"
(ok, not really)

Nah, won't work. While the last one is a joke, even the rest of them make me think 'Spam'. They do actually sound like we're trying to sell some new viagra (or some other illicit drugs). We have to keep the commercial feeling out of it completely.

Laz: The Youth is wasted on the young one was one of the first i thought of. Cliche or not, it is a very poignent phrase.

Youth is wasted on the young.
Help us correct that error.
www.ImmInst.org

[Lazarus Long]

I like that. How about this variation?

Youth wasted on the young?
Help us correct the error
www.ImmInst.org

[John Schloendorn]

Much of the stuff here makes me think of spam. I guess including the word "science", "non-profit" might help. But then again in advertisement, superficial, content-free non-messages often seem to work best.

I think it may be worth aiming at attracting less, but smarter people. But then again, content-free messages also seem to work when advertising to smart people. I really don't know.

Good stuff here anyway, keep it up!

[Lazarus Long]

I am trying for kitsch John and careful attention getting. Advertising that works also offends a great number of people and the trick is a favorable risk-reward balance.

I am also suggesting a careful formula like in the simple and effective ad campaign:

Got Milk?

What is the question?
How to sustain youth and have long life. That is why I turned the cliche on its head as a question. It begs the question. It forces the reader to ask it in their mind.

Then we answer it simply with *us* as an important part of the answer.

[Live Forever]

Much of the stuff here makes me think of spam. I guess including the word "science", "non-profit" might help. But then again in advertisement,  superficial, content-free non-messages often seem to work best.

I think it may be worth aiming at attracting less, but smarter people. But then again, content-free messages also seem to work when advertising to smart people. I really don't know.

Good stuff here anyway, keep it up!

Yes, all of these are very spam like. One of the reasons being that spam is so effective. (it has to have a catchy title if it wants to get any type of response rate)

It is worth discussing the demographic we are trying to attract, though. (more people of general intelligence, or less people of higher intelligence) In the end, I think the Aubrey de Grey model of convincing as many people as possible in as many ways as possible is best, and not worry about targeting a certain class of people with a higher intelligence. To do that, we have to look at what has worked in the past. (e.g. sex, beauty, money, lust, love, envy, short targeted messages, etc.)

[Aegist]

It is worth discussing the demographic we are trying to attract, though. (more people of general intelligence, or less people of higher intelligence)

Ahhh.... that is indeed a problem that I had not considered.

My personal goal, is to have the entire world paying attention. But I doubt it very highly that we want the entire world in *here*. There is only so much activity a forum can handle.

So maybe this is an issue we need to think about more.

I say our demographic is : "everyone"
However I also think that I only want the intelligent non-crazy people actually participating here. I would like to add value to the forums, not flood it with noise.

[Live Forever]

It is worth discussing the demographic we are trying to attract, though. (more people of general intelligence, or less people of higher intelligence)

Ahhh.... that is indeed a problem that I had not considered.

My personal goal, is to have the entire world paying attention. But I doubt it very highly that we want the entire world in *here*. There is only so much activity a forum can handle.

So maybe this is an issue we need to think about more.

I say our demographic is : "everyone"
However I also think that I only want the intelligent non-crazy people actually participating here. I would like to add value to the forums, not flood it with noise.

True. If you had a landing page that was just informational, and not directly to ImmInst, then you could accomplish the goal of informing the general public, while only the most interested would take the time to go a step further and do more research/find the ImmInst community.

...of course increasing the amount of full members (no matter how low or high the intelligence) increases the funds we have to work with to accomplish our goals, but whatever...

(I am not of the opinion that this is going to drastically jump the numbers of ImmInst overnight anyway, so I don't think there is anything to worry about)

[zoolander]

have the entire world paying attention

sounds like we need a publicity stunt

laser graffiti on a building?.....



STOP

AGING

IMMINST.org

[lunarsolarpower]

I really like the saying I thought up a couple days ago:

Not questioning the status quo
WILL KILL YOU!

It might go well on a shirt or something I guess.

[Aegist]

True. If you had a landing page that was just informational, and not directly to ImmInst, then you could accomplish the goal of informing the general public, while only the most interested would take the time to go a step further and do more research/find the ImmInst community.

...of course increasing the amount of full members (no matter how low or high the intelligence) increases the funds we have to work with to accomplish our goals, but whatever...

(I am not of the opinion that this is going to drastically jump the numbers of ImmInst overnight anyway, so I don't think there is anything to worry about)

I think we need several hoops.

Immediate landing page will consist of something along the lines of a Death Clock (slap in the face, wake up to reality) and then the possibility (partly made up from current science, and partly made up from the idea of many people working together). That page will provide links to ImmInst and the other various websites which are important, but the focus should be on the "Learn More" link at the bottom of the page (or "Still Unsure?" or something like that).

People land on the first page out of curiosity and have the problem and the objective handed to them. They can then either walk away or go for more information.

The next page should have a short FAQ on it, a list of impressive scientific advances which promote the idea (maybe some details of SENS or something), a link to the fable of the dragon, and then at the bottom, there should be a Poll. Actually, it will be more like a petition. People have to leave their name and email address and vote
1. "I want to see more scientific interest and funding invested into longevity research and rejuvenation"
2. "I have no interest in seeing scientific improvements in the quality of life of humans"
3. "I think the idea is interesting, but there are a lot of problems with it"

And of course we record the results of the poll, and depending on their answer they land on particular pages. The pages are crafted precisely for their mindset, if they are interested, then they can participate at X, Y, Z. If they are opposed, then thanks for your vote, now you can get back to dying. If they have isssues, then we direct them to the our wealth of knowledge (movie, book, FAQ's, and other articles) and of course place a huge emphasis on participating in the ImmInst forum where they can have all of their problems discussed in detail.



The practical upshot of this, is we can use every visitor we get without needing them to participate. If we can show that there are millions of people worldwide who want this, then our job is done. We don't need them all to participate in the forum, but we do need to know they exist (and they need to know we exist, and show their support).

Plus we can use that as a separate email list. Not for any regular newsletter, but for worldwide announcements about huge impact news items which affect the goals of our movement.

[Aegist]

sounds like we need a publicity stunt

laser graffiti on a building?.....



STOP

AGING

IMMINST.org

That is very cool. It is probably no coincidence that before you even posted this my mind went to "Project Mayham" in Fight Club when I was thinking about branding. The giant Smiley Face on the building.

[Live Forever]

then at the bottom, there should be a Poll. Actually, it will be more like a petition. People have to leave their name and email address and vote
1. "I want to see more scientific interest and funding invested into longevity research and rejuvenation"
2. "I have no interest in seeing scientific improvements in the quality of life of humans"
3. "I think the idea is interesting, but there are a lot of problems with it"

And of course we record the results of the poll, and depending on their answer they land on particular pages. The pages are crafted precisely for their mindset, if they are interested, then they can participate at X, Y, Z. If they are opposed, then thanks for your vote, now you can get back to dying. If they have isssues, then we direct them to the our wealth of knowledge (movie, book, FAQ's, and other articles) and of course place a huge emphasis on participating in the ImmInst forum where they can have all of their problems discussed in detail.



The practical upshot of this, is we can use every visitor we get without needing them to participate. If we can show that there are millions of people worldwide who want this, then  our job is done. We don't need them all to participate in the forum, but we do need to know they exist (and they need to know we exist, and show their support).

Plus we can use that as a separate email list. Not for any regular newsletter, but for worldwide announcements about huge impact news items which affect the goals of our movement.

That survey part sounds an awful lot like the LESurvey project we had going on awhile back:
http://www.imminst.o...T&f=142&t=10272
http://www.imminst.o...=ST&f=1&t=10700
http://www.imminst.o...=ST&f=1&t=10875
http://www.imminst.o...T&f=142&t=10699


I don't know if there is any information to be gleaned from the successes/failures of that project, but it definitely got a ton of responses and participation. I was just talking to mrfesta a few days ago about that project in fact...

[Aegist]

That survey part sounds an awful lot like the LESurvey project we had going on awhile back:
http://www.imminst.o...T&f=142&t=10272
http://www.imminst.o...=ST&f=1&t=10700
http://www.imminst.o...=ST&f=1&t=10875
http://www.imminst.o...T&f=142&t=10699


I don't know if there is any information to be gleaned from the successes/failures of that project, but it definitely got a ton of responses and participation. I was just talking to mrfesta a few days ago about that project in fact...

Similarities yes, but huge difference in magnitude. The LESurvey was an attempt to collect data, this survey is more a way of collecting general stances (for, against, neutral) and sorting visitors.

If the LESurvey is still going, that could be part of the following landing page: "Are you interested in conducting a longer survey on this topic?"

[Live Forever]

That survey part sounds an awful lot like the LESurvey project we had going on awhile back:
http://www.imminst.o...T&f=142&t=10272
http://www.imminst.o...=ST&f=1&t=10700
http://www.imminst.o...=ST&f=1&t=10875
http://www.imminst.o...T&f=142&t=10699


I don't know if there is any information to be gleaned from the successes/failures of that project, but it definitely got a ton of responses and participation. I was just talking to mrfesta a few days ago about that project in fact...

Similarities yes, but huge difference in magnitude. The LESurvey was an attempt to collect data, this survey is more a way of collecting general stances (for, against, neutral) and sorting visitors.

If the LESurvey is still going, that could be part of the following landing page: "Are you interested in conducting a longer survey on this topic?"

Unfortunately the domain expired and no one renewed it, so I don't think it is still going.

[lunarsolarpower]

I think we need several hoops.

Immediate landing page will consist of something along the lines of a Death Clock (slap in the face, wake up to reality) and then the possibility (partly made up from current science, and partly made up from the idea of many people working together).

Definitely. After that though I think there should be a separate forum set up at the site itself. The tagline of the site at the bottom of the pages could say "a production of imminst.org" or something but I think there needs to be a softer forum for people to interact in. A forum that is not rife with discussions about the singularity.

The domain for it should be something like coalitionforlife.org or revolutionarylifeextension.org or life2020.org or something. It needs to sound somewhat like a serious operation but it needs to keep the word immortality away with a 10 foot pole. Even hard-core life extensionists signed up for cryonics recoil from the word immortality both because of the potential paradoxes and because of its association with mythological hubris.

It might seem that to create a new forum would weaken ImmInst but I really don't think so. Imminst.org is where the really big ideas bounce back and forth along with a bunch of nootropic discussions. The new forum/site could be a much more polished looking presentation that we could feel comfortable presenting to a wide audience. It would have a focus on advancing medical science and could have regular pieces written by authors as well as relevant news items.

Potential allies that could be enlisted include FasterCures, the Coalition to Extend Life and maybe even the American Academy of Anti-Aging Medicine. Obviously I would like to see Aubrey's message featured front and center but the site should be about more than just the Methuselah Foundation. Researching this post I ran across this promotional for the book 121 ways to live 121 years and more. It would be refreshing to find an anti-aging page that was not selling a product.

edit:It would also be cool to have a portion of the site explaining exactly how to join the fight. Justin, John Schloendorn, Mark Hamalainen, Brian Wowk, etc. could give first hand accounts of how they ended up in the trenches doing real anti-aging research.

[Live Forever]

This thread is a classic example of how a simple idea (creating a flyer to be put up) can balloon into a complex idea. (extra websites with forums and a coordinated amount of effort and bells and whistles on the flyer) Don't get me wrong, I think all the ideas are great ideas!, but I hope we don't lose focus on what Aegist was originally trying to do. I have seen lots of projects in a corporate environment sunk because of bloat, and I am willing to bet that non-profit/goodwill projects have the ability to succumb to a similar fate. (just a hypothesis, however, I would be grateful to be proven wrong)

In fact, just disregard what I just typed. I apologize for being a stick in the mud. I am not trying to discourage the idea-generating process at all; Just making a statement about keeping perspective. I realize this is just a thread to bounce ideas off one another, and the final idea might look nothing like what the original intent was, but I was simply trying to make a statement about feasibility.

Please continue on...

[opales]

just catching up, great stuff guys!