1084 replies to this topic

[Anthony_Loera]

I suppose one could try snorting it then. [bl:)]

OUuuchh!! ..... [cry]...

Why not put it into eye drops then? might hurt a bit less ...

[hormesis]

Does anyone know what you CAN'T take with resveratrol?

I've got mine mixed in with some acetyl-l-cysteine.

I and am worried that such sulfur compounds might be inactivating my resveratrol when I mix them all up and drink them down.

I've read that resveratrol is inactivated by sulfation in the liver. Could this be occuring in my water-supplement-mix as well right before I swallow it?

[roidjoe]

No.

[geo12the]

I know this might seem out there, but how about an injectable solution?

It seems out there to me but I just came across the following study where they injected pterostilbene into mice. Pterostilbene is a methoxylated form of resveratrol thought to be more stable and possibly more bioavailable and may have beneficial effects not produced by resveratrol.

Association between pterostilbene and quercetin inhibits metastatic activity of B16 melanoma.Ferrer P, Asensi M, Segarra R, Ortega A, Benlloch M, Obrador E, Varea MT, Asensio G, Jordá L, Estrela JM.
Department of Physiology, University of Valencia, Spain.

Inhibition of cancer growth by resveratrol (trans-3,5,4'-trihydroxystilbene; RESV), a phytoalexin present in many plant species, is limited by its low bioavailability. Pterostilbene (3,5-dimethoxy-4'-hydroxystilbene; PTER) and quercetin (3,3',4',5,6-pentahydroxyflavone; QUER), two structurally related and naturally occurring small polyphenols, show longer half-life in vivo. In vitro growth of highly malignant B16 melanoma F10 cells (B16M-F10) is inhibited (56%) by short-time exposure (60 min/day) to PTER (40 microm) and QUER (20 microm) (approximate mean values of plasma concentrations measured within the first hour after intravenous administration of 20 mg/kg each polyphenol). Intravenous administration of PTER and QUER (20 mg/kg per day) to mice inhibits (73%) metastatic growth of B16M-F10 cell in the liver, a common site for metastasis development. The anti-metastatic mechanism involves: 1) a PTER-induced inhibition of vascular adhesion molecule 1 expression in the hepatic sinusoidal endothelium, which consequently decreases B16M-F10 cell adhesion to the endothelium through very late activation antigen 4; and 2) a QUER- and PTER-induced inhibition of Bcl-2 expression in metastatic cells, which sensitizes them to vascular endothelium-induced cytotoxicity. Our findings demonstrate that the association of PTER and QUER inhibits metastatic melanoma growth and extends host survival.

[dannov]

The study is also using Quercetin though, which has already been proven to preferentially get inhibited by sulfation/glucorinidation in the liver over Resveratrol, thus increasing the amount of free trans-res in the blood. The problem is, it also affects SIRT1 in a negative way as well.

That said, anything that is methylated is usually far more effective at getting safely through the liver and into the bloodstream as well, and I can't see why Res would be the exception.

[bentl]

I am currently dissolving resv in ethanol and then mixing it with Miralax in water but, being chem/biochem ignorant, I have no idea about quantities. Any discussion on ratios - (resv:etho):(water:peg) - would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks in advance,

[maxwatt]

The study is also using Quercetin though, which has already been proven to preferentially get inhibited by sulfation/glucorinidation in the liver over Resveratrol, thus increasing the amount of free trans-res in the blood.  The problem is, it also affects SIRT1 in a negative way as well.

That said, anything that is methylated is usually far more effective at getting safely through the liver and into the bloodstream as well, and I can't see why Res would be the exception.

It would get into the the bloodstream, but apparently the methyl groups in the 3.5 positions would prevent it from activating SirT1, which is the objective of taking it.
I believe bio-availability is considerably is considerably enhanced bu using a surfactant, such as Tween-80, PEG3350 (Miralax) or lecithin.

Preventing sulfonaton or glucoronidation by the liver would increase the effective dose, so one could use perhaps 250 mg of resveratrol instead of 500 mg and get the same effect. Or one could just take a higher dose of resveratrol.

[jerry]

I'm taking quercetin bid, and have been for the past several years. I started taking 50% resveratrol a few months ago, then switched to the 98% purity due to emodin side-effects. If quercetin does inhibit SIRT activation, any idea what the half-life of quercetin is? Would it make sense to take the resveratrol at a a different time? BTW, I have not noticed any major differences with the 500mg dose over the past few months, but, hey, it can't hurt (hopefully)!

[tintinet]

I'm taking quercetin bid, and have been for the past several years.  I started taking 50% resveratrol a few months ago, then switched to the 98% purity due to emodin side-effects.  If quercetin does inhibit SIRT activation, any idea what the half-life of quercetin is?  Would it make sense to take the resveratrol at a a different time?  BTW, I have not noticed any major differences with the 500mg dose over the past few months, but, hey, it can't hurt (hopefully)!

Quercetin impact is unclear. But I'd not assume supplementation can't hurt- too many examples of negative effects noted in association with many other supplements.

[stephen_b]

I've taken to dosing resveratrol (2g/day 99% with a heaping teaspoon of soy lecithin) in the morning and not taking any other supplements (excepting cod liver oil and pomegranate extract) until after lunch. I have no evidence that this is the best way to go about it though.

Stephen

[dannov]

Due to a recent study I've read about antioxidants possibly negatively impacting the healing process of muscles after a workout (something about inhibiting RONS, study was posted on bodybuilding.com), I'm a bit worried that Res may negatively impact that process. As such, I'm going to be taking it in the morning with breakfast.

[shadowrun]

Dannov -

I also heard about this issue concerning antioxidants negatively affecting muscle growth.

Before my workouts I would dose with Resv, C and Green Tea to reduce free radical damage but now I have no idea if I should continue doing it.

[dannov]

Ya shadow, I heard no earlier than 4 hours before your workout should you dose on antis, because apparently that's about how long your body takes to excrete them or something. So, that's why I'm gonna stick with breakfast. :D

[shadowrun]

Back to drawing board for me also - I gotta look more into this.

[sUper GeNius]

I just started taking my gram of Relentless's T-res 99% with Lecithin. Here's my question. Never bought liquid lecithin before. It's thick like molasseses. Is that normal? I poured, (dolloped) about a tablespoon into a glass, and added abit of water, maybe 5 tablespoons of water. Then I microwaved until quite warm. I stirred the mixture, attempting to get the lecithin to dissolve, but it seemed that much of it would not. I thought that maybe at least some had dissolved, so then I cracked open three caps of 99% t-res and poured into the mixture. I stirred, and the t-res seemed to dissolve quite easily, making the solution a milky white, with a blob of undissolved lecithin. I drank the brew, but left the blob of lecithin in the cup. It tasted somewhat like whey, rather bland.

Any comments on how to get more lecithin to dissolve? Maybe enough dissolved to do the trick, as the t-res seemed to dissolve quite well.

[malbecman]

tobar8,

I used soy lecithin which comes as little yellow granules. I only need 1/2-1 tsp per 12 oz of water and that is plenty of lecithin to get my resveratrol into suspension. I"m guessing you need to add less lecithin and some more water......

I just started taking my gram of Relentless's T-res 99% with Lecithin. Here's my question. Never bought liquid lecithin before. It's thick like molasseses. Is that normal? I poured, (dolloped) about a tablespoon into a glass, and added abit of water, maybe 5 tablespoons of water. Then I microwaved until quite warm. I stirred the mixture, attempting to get the lecithin to dissolve, but it seemed that much of it would not. I thought that maybe at least some had dissolved, so then I cracked open three caps of 99% t-res and poured into the mixture. I stirred, and the t-res seemed to dissolve quite easily, making the solution a milky white, with a blob of undissolved lecithin. I drank the brew, but left the blob of lecithin in the cup. It tasted somewhat like whey, rather bland.

Any comments on how to get more lecithin to dissolve? Maybe enough dissolved to do the trick, as the t-res seemed to dissolve quite well.

[malbecman]

Just a new addition to my regime although I'm not sure if I can do this every day.

I used a bath sonicator on my soy lecithin/resveratrol/H20 combination and the resulting liquid was much more milky in appearance, much like Lucid's ethanol+PEG experiments posted earlier in this thread. Normally, although they are very small, I can see/distinguish the individual resveratrol granules in the water/lecithin solution. Now, with the sonication, the individual particles are impossible to distinguish.


edit: I got this idea when I was reading about the idea of making liposomes for an experiment. Bath sonicators are one of the preferred methods for making them.

[dannov]

No more Miralax for me--as Maxwatt said, it does stack up and catch up to ya...bought some Soy Lecithin, gonna stick with that.

What exactly is a bath sonicator?

[malbecman]

Think of one of those ultrasonic jewelry cleaners. You can check some out here:

http://www.jewelsmal...CFRpzYAodASmZIg

Professional grade ones cost quite a bit, small personal ones arent a whole lot of dough-re-mi....

  What exactly is a bath sonicator?

[stephen_b]

Are those food grade? I'd be a little worried.

I added a couple of tablespoons 40% alcohol vodka to my lecithin mix this morning. Hard to say if the resulting mixture was less clumpy.

Stephen

[malbecman]

You put your lecithin/water/resveratrol in a glass or mug and then put the base of that in the water bath. Then turn on the sonicator.
No worries. [thumb]

I tried it again today, definitely a better emulsification......

Are those food grade? I'd be a little worried.

I added a couple of tablespoons 40% alcohol vodka to my lecithin mix this morning. Hard to say if the resulting mixture was less clumpy.

Stephen

[health_nutty]

Any comments on how to get more lecithin to dissolve? Maybe enough dissolved to do the trick, as the t-res seemed to dissolve quite well.

Let the granules sit in water overnight. This is by far the easiest way. This works even better than the liquid lecithin.

[Anthony_Loera]

malbecman,

that sonicator is really a great idea. nice!

[sUper GeNius]

malbecman,

that sonicator is really a great idea. nice!

Are we so sure that some denigration might not occur to the t-res? From the Wiki article:

"The bubbles created can be as hot as 10,000 degrees and 50,000 lbs per square inch, but are so small that cleaning and removal of dirt is the main result."


http://en.wikipedia....rasonic_cleaner

[Anthony_Loera]

Wow, ok... maybe not such a good idea.

[malbecman]

Hmm, tobar8, good point. I wonder if running the sonicator on the lecithin/water mixture first to make the liposomes would help. Of course, I guess the resveratrol would then not be incorporated into the liposomes but it still might help emulsify them better.

If you read the wikipedia entry on liposomes here

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liposomes

it really seems like these would help the absorption of resveratrol-they are used a lot for drug delivery, etc ,etc. They mention other ways of making liposomes, perhaps those might not be harmful. Of course, if sonication is the preferred method of liposome production for other compounds, it doesnt seem to be harming them very much.

Anyone else have any thoughts?

malbecman,

that sonicator is really a great idea. nice!

Are we so sure that some denigration might not occur to the t-res? From the Wiki article:

"The bubbles created can be as hot as 10,000 degrees and 50,000 lbs per square inch, but are so small that cleaning and removal of dirt is the main result."


http://en.wikipedia....rasonic_cleaner

[malbecman]

Taken from a talk I saw on Liposomes. Any of these sound like our friend resveratrol????


Liposomes Help Improve:

Therapeutic index

Rapid metabolism

Unfavorable pharmokinetics

Low solubility

Lack of stability

Irritation

[health_nutty]

Hmm, tobar8, good point.  I wonder if running the sonicator on the lecithin/water mixture first to make the liposomes would help.  Of course, I guess the resveratrol would then not be incorporated into the liposomes but it still might help emulsify them better.

If you read the wikipedia entry on liposomes here

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liposomes

it really seems like these would help the absorption of resveratrol-they are used a lot for drug delivery, etc ,etc.  They mention other ways of making liposomes, perhaps those might not be harmful.  Of course, if sonication is the preferred method of liposome production for other compounds, it doesnt seem to be harming them very much.

Anyone else have any thoughts?

malbecman,

that sonicator is really a great idea. nice!

Are we so sure that some denigration might not occur to the t-res? From the Wiki article:

"The bubbles created can be as hot as 10,000 degrees and 50,000 lbs per square inch, but are so small that cleaning and removal of dirt is the main result."


http://en.wikipedia....rasonic_cleaner

The 10K degrees and 50,000lbs sounds like utter nonsense. If the bubbles were that hot, wouldn't the water vaporize (or at least boil)? If the water isn't boiling, I wouldn't worry about it damaging the resveratrol.

[sUper GeNius]

Hmm, tobar8, good point.  I wonder if running the sonicator on the lecithin/water mixture first to make the liposomes would help.  Of course, I guess the resveratrol would then not be incorporated into the liposomes but it still might help emulsify them better.

If you read the wikipedia entry on liposomes here

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liposomes

it really seems like these would help the absorption of resveratrol-they are used a lot for drug delivery, etc ,etc.  They mention other ways of making liposomes, perhaps those might not be harmful.  Of course, if sonication is the preferred method of liposome production for other compounds, it doesnt seem to be harming them very much.

Anyone else have any thoughts?

malbecman,

that sonicator is really a great idea. nice!

Are we so sure that some denigration might not occur to the t-res? From the Wiki article:

"The bubbles created can be as hot as 10,000 degrees and 50,000 lbs per square inch, but are so small that cleaning and removal of dirt is the main result."


http://en.wikipedia....rasonic_cleaner

The 10K degrees and 50,000lbs sounds like utter nonsense. If the bubbles were that hot, wouldn't the water vaporize (or at least boil)? If the water isn't boiling, I wouldn't worry about it damaging the resveratrol.

Actually, I think it IS boiling. Very small areas of the water are vaporizing. Just not enough heat going on on a macro scale to start the whole thing boiling.

[maxwatt]

Actually, I think it IS boiling. Very small areas of the water are vaporizing. Just not enough heat going on on a macro scale to start the whole thing boiling.

That is cavitation caused by the pressure waves from the ultrasonic waves. This is not boiling.