54 replies to this topic

[baudfox]

For the past 6 months or so, my blood pressure has been at a constant 170/90, and I was wondering if anyone has any advice on supplements that might help lower it? It's a slight concern considering that I'm only 21.
I'm not sure if it's related, but recently I've started having anxiety-attacks also; my doctor wants to prescribe me SSRIs for it, which I'm not keen on.
I've tried various things, including fasting, but the effects are minimal.

I'm currently already taking the following supplements:

Resveratrol
Acetyl-L-Carnitine
Ginko-biloba
Ginseng
Multi-vitamins
Hawthorn
Melatonin
St.John's Wort
Creatine
Omega3
Pomegranate
Vinpocetine
Astragalus
Milk-thistle
Kelp

Edited by baudfox, 05 January 2008 - 03:35 PM.

[unbreakable]

http://www.lef.org/p...pressure_01.htm
http://www.lef.org/p...clerosis_01.htm

I think you should get a checkup (ECG/stress ECG, echocardiography and maybe blood and urine testing) to be on the safe side.

PS: You shouldn't take St.John's Wort and SSRIs at the same time.

[maxwatt]

Exercise lowers BP. If you are sedentary, a brisk 30 minute walk daily may be all you need.

[tomnook]

The LEF links are a great place to start - I successfully lowered my systolic to a measurable degree by trying many of the supplement suggestions made by LEF - the ones which I've stayed with and which seemed to make the most noticeable difference are 100mg of COQ10 and LEF's own "Natural BP Management" product with CVH 15 Whey protein, Pomegranate and GrapeSkin. Personally, I found that Hawthorn seemed to make me hyper - similarly St.Johns Wort

I had stopped using the LEF product a while ago, as it is quite expensive, and substituted it for a simple Casein based supplement - big mistake - I didn't realise until I tested my BP again after several months that my systolic was raised again. I'm now back on the LEF BP Management twice a day and it made a noticeable difference in less than a week.
At the time I discovered my BP was again raised I believe that this knowledge gave me anxiety panic attacks as you've mentioned - my way out of this was to stop all my supplements for a few days. The problem seemed to resolve itself and I've gradually reintroduced the supplements which I'd been taking previously - I didn't discover any supplement which could have been producing a negative reaction but perhaps in the meantime the fact that my BP reduced was all that was needed.

From my own experience and personal use of virtually every supplement which LEF recommends I doubt if any of them singly or in combination would lower your present systolic rate sufficiently.

Weight loss should also help if your BMI is too high. Possibly also reduce your salt intake?

Incidentally, I asume that you are testing your BP at home as well as at the Dr's surgery? I suffer from "white coat" syndrome and have yet to have an accurate BP test made at the Doctors surgery - I am unable to relax sufficiently and my test at the Dr's will usually give a systolic level around 10-20 higher than my norm.
If you do take a test at home then I'd suggest taking it either, preferably, immediately upon awakening or take three tests five minutes or so apart during the day when you feel relaxed.

[pycnogenol]

Try taking some magnesium and see if it helps. I take the Source Naturals brand [magnesium citrate, taurinate, glycinate, and succinate].

[baudfox]

Thanks for the advice everyone!

I had a blood test last week, and everything was within normal range; it might be worth me getting an ECG though, just to make sure.
I've been taking my BP at home as well as at the doctor's surgery.
It's all a bit of a mystery where the high BP has come from.
I do regular exercise, I'm at my optimal BMI, and have a relatively low salt intake... =\

Edited by baudfox, 05 January 2008 - 03:50 PM.

[ajnast4r]

i also had higher blood pressure when i was ur age...

exercise, supplementing calcium & magnesium, and dropping my caffeine intake significantly brought it down into normal range.

i would cut out all your supplements other than multi, omega3, and st johns wort for atleast a month or 2.. and see how your blood pressure responds.

[DukeNukem]

I'd definitely add cocoa powder (12-15 grams daily -- or 20 grams daily of a 70% cocoa bar), LEF's vit. C (3 per day, spread out), and the LEF blueberry extract to your list (you can get this as a blueberry, pomegranate, cocoa combo -- one of the best polypills on the planet).

Strength building exercises, too, will have a profound effect (more so than cardio-style exercises).

I assume you're not eating trans-fats and fried foods.

Edited by DukeNukem, 05 January 2008 - 04:59 PM.

[shuffleup]

Lower carb diet,
Fish oil,
Magnesium (as others have mentioned, I use 800mg/day),
Deep Breathing Exercises (also helps with panic/anxiety, trust me),
Potassium (V8 low-sodium),
CoQ10,
Vit D3 Oil Cap (BP is harder to control in the winter, maybe you are deficient in D?)
6-9g's of Arginine

[unbreakable]

Before self-medicating with supplements in order to lower your blood pressure you should really get that checkup. In general I think supplements/herbs are not that great to lower blood pressure. Things like EPA/DHA, Q10... are cool for the cardiovascular system, but loosing weight in case of obesity, exercising and if necessary prescription medications are more effectice.

Even if an older man could control his serious hypertension with just supplements, who can say that it is the optimal strategy to do that? There are studies that show that eg. Betablockers, ACE-inhibitors and diuretics can lower blood pressure AND reduce mortality rates. Even if the man could reduce his blood pressure from 180/110 to 120/80 just with supplements (which really isn't very realistic) he could still die earlier than with a combination of several prescription medications. Blood pressure drugs do not only reduce blood pressure, Cholesterol drugs do no only reduce cholesterol, they do a whole bunch of things (some good, some bad, many unknown).

[sUper GeNius]

Before self-medicating with supplements in order to lower your blood pressure you should really get that checkup. In general I think supplements/herbs are not that great to lower blood pressure. Things like EPA/DHA, Q10... are cool for the cardiovascular system, but loosing weight in case of obesity, exercising and if necessary prescription medications are more effectice.

Even if an older man could control his serious hypertension with just supplements, who can say that it is the optimal strategy to do that? There are studies that show that eg. Betablockers, ACE-inhibitors and diuretics can lower blood pressure AND reduce mortality rates. Even if the man could reduce his blood pressure from 180/110 to 120/80 just with supplements (which really isn't very realistic) he could still die earlier than with a combination of several prescription medications. Blood pressure drugs do not only reduce blood pressure, Cholesterol drugs do no only reduce cholesterol, they do a whole bunch of things (some good, some bad, many unknown).

I agree with your post.

[narcissistic]

If I was an old man with 10-20(?) good years to live I wouldn’t use try herbs and supplements. Aside from some supplements mentioned earlier I would use carnosine and melatonin in high doses. As well as the Brazilian herb Pfaffia (its referred to as Brazilian ginseng some times). I would eat a significant quantity of goji berries to.This would probably work as well as prescription drugs and would not case any or minimum side effects. And a man in that age hardly have to worry abbot the long term effects any way.

Standard drugs for lowering blood pressure rises the risk of many other age related diseases.

[sUper GeNius]

If I was an old man with 10-20(?) good years to live I wouldn’t use try herbs and supplements. Aside from some supplements mentioned earlier I would use carnosine and melatonin in high doses. As well as the Brazilian herb Pfaffia (its referred to as Brazilian ginseng some times). I would eat a significant quantity of goji berries to.This would probably work as well as prescription drugs and would not case any or minimum side effects. And a man in that age hardly have to worry abbot the long term effects any way.

Standard drugs for lowering blood pressure rises the risk of many other age related diseases.

I seem to be more aware of the age related diseases the "standard" drugs ameliorate, like hearts disease, stroke, and most recently, dementia. Seems certain ACE inhibitors that cross the blodd-brain barrier hold promise in this area.

[stephen_b]

Vinpocetine promotes blood flow. I don't know what effect that would have in a person with high blood pressure. You might want to monitor your blood pressure with and without it. On the plus side, it's easy to measure blood pressure, so you can see how you're doing.

Stephen

[lucid]

No one has mentioned stress yet as a cause of high blood pressure. Understanding what stress feels like and controlling it through relaxation techniques, or meditation may help reduce blood pressure. This might be a good idea along with diet exercise and supplementation.

I would also like to echo Duke on cocoa powder. There are some good studies which show that it increases vascular felxibility which has the effect of making the pulse pressure lower(pulse pressure is the difference between your systolic and diastolic blood pressures). A high pulse pressure is associated with the stiffening of the arteries and is harmful to many organ systems especially the heart, brain and kidneys. It also carries an increased risk of heart disease. In fact, I believe a high pulse pressure is a strong indicator of heart disease than high overall blood pressure.

Edited by lucid, 06 January 2008 - 01:10 AM.

[unbreakable]

Aside from some supplements mentioned earlier I would use carnosine and melatonin in high doses. As well as the Brazilian herb Pfaffia (its referred to as Brazilian ginseng some times). I would eat a significant quantity of goji berries to. This would probably work as well as prescription drugs and would not case any or minimum side effects.

If untreated, hypertension places a person at high risk for the development of a disabling or fatal disease. Therefore it should be treated by professionals who will prescribe drugs that have proven in big randomized, double-blind, placebo-controlled trials to reduce blood pressure and mortality from cardiovascular disease. Of course someone can add supplements like Coenzyme Q10, Carnitine, Taurine, Magnesium Orotate, Ribose, Hawthorn, EPA/DHA, Cocoa Powder and some antioxidants like Pomegranate. But the scientifically proven main treatment of severe hypertension with antihypertensives and lifestyle-modification is more important.

PS: Prescription drugs are not always bad. Take for example the combined alpha/betablocker carvedilol. It can effectively lower blood pressure, has a favourable side-effect profile and some of it's metabolites are extremely potent antioxidants.

Edited by unbreakable, 06 January 2008 - 01:16 AM.

[niner]

i would cut out all your supplements other than multi, omega3, and st johns wort for atleast a month or 2.. and see how your blood pressure responds.

I agree. Some of the supplements you are taking might actually be increasing your bp. For example, I took ginkgo for a few months and it reliably raised my blood pressure, which returned to normal when I stopped taking it. There's lots of good advice in this thread. I think you should try to get to the bottom of this, as your bp is high enough to be concerned about. What are your height, weight, exercise, and diet habits?

[unbreakable]

@baudfox: Do you know how high your blood pressure was before you took any supplements?

[baudfox]

What are your height, weight, exercise, and diet habits?

height: 181cm,
weight: 76 kg
As for exercise, I walk about a mile a day; although not lately due to the holidays, and when possible I try to do about an hour a week of cardiovascular.
diet: well balanced, very little processed food; and I keep away from foods containing the usual "bad-stuff" (i.e. trans-fats, MSG, saccharin, aspartame... etc.)

Do you know how high your blood pressure was before you took any supplements?

Unfortunately not, though I've been on supplements for a few years.

As of today I've stopped taking St.John's Wort, Vinpocetine, GInkgo biloba and Ginseng after reading that in some cases they've been linked to high blood pressure.
I'll try out the other suggestions as well, and let you know how I get on. If it doesn't get my blood pressure down within a week, I'll go back to the doctors and see about getting some medication.
I'll let you know how I get on.
Any advice on the best BP meds?
I've tried beta-blockers (inderal to be precise) in the past for stress, and I didn't get on well with them at all. Bad nightmares, brain-fog, light-headedness etc.

Edited by baudfox, 06 January 2008 - 01:34 PM.

[narcissistic]

If untreated, hypertension places a person at high risk for the development of a disabling or fatal disease. Therefore it should be treated by professionals who will prescribe drugs that have proven in big randomized, double-blind, placebo-controlled trials to reduce blood pressure and mortality from cardiovascular disease.

I don’t like that logic, in the end medical companies are driven by profit this is not necessarily a bad thing however it excludes a lot. It think every individual should use the good things that has come out of the industry, and beaver that must drugs are weary bad; more importantly they are not good blest gifts to humanity, but exists only because people are making money on them.

Of course someone can add supplements like Coenzyme Q10, Carnitine, Taurine, Magnesium Orotate, Ribose, Hawthorn, EPA/DHA, Cocoa Powder and some antioxidants like Pomegranate. But the scientifically proven main treatment of severe hypertension with antihypertensives and lifestyle-modification is more important.

Some the supplements you mention are probably weary good for a young person that like to stay health (And might have some effect on lowering high blood pressure, probably coca powder would be good.) however Carnosine in doses of 5gram, and a weary large dose of the non toxic herb Pfaffia (witch I well tolerated ) would most likely be comparable to standard drug treatment. And would have a vide range of other beneficial effects. Without any immediate side effects.

PS: Prescription drugs are not always bad. Take for example the combined alpha/betablocker carvedilol. It can effectively lower blood pressure, has a favourable side-effect profile and some of it's metabolites are extremely potent antioxidants.

The greatest objection I have against standard drug treatment are side effects. Almost disregarders of the dieses I would try other things than what a doctor would prescribe. Some is proven to be effective in double-blind placebo-controlled studies and have even bin prescribed by doctors. Unfortunately not used because its not profitable. Other things have a long traditional use, and are mostlikly saffe.

I do agree that some drugs, a fraction of al drugs, are good and have interesting properties. Most likely we will se more and more drugs that are good.

Any way a person with high blood pressure has to correct it, and might have to use the standard drugs available. But I would say that its definitely a last resort at the time being.

[missminni]

My dad raves about Thorne's Neo Cardio. He has been taking it for about a year.
He is taking it in addition to a prescribed blood pressure medication, Lisnopril, that he has been on for many years.
This is a bit of anecdotal info in regard to the Neo Cardio:
My dad had glaucoma (this is about 20 years ago)and had cataracts removed
and lens implants. He still had to wear bi-focal glasses after the operation.
Since he started the Neo Cardio, he noticed that
he no longer needs his glasses for reading or driving.
On a recent eye exam,
the opthamologist told him that the pressure was down in both eyes.
I can't believe he is 92 and reads without glasses.
I can't.

Edited by missminni, 06 January 2008 - 05:02 PM.

[unbreakable]

@narcisstic

I'm a more scientific person and like evidence-based medicine. Sure, you can say Carnosine + Pfaffia + Goji Berries will lower blood pressure as effective as Betablockers, ACE-inhibitors, Diuretics... - and that without side effects. Problem is, you can't prove it. Another guy could say "Take Resveratrol + Lipoic Acid + Silymarin", this will cure your liver cancer. Problem is, he can't prove it and he is most probably wrong.

[niner]

Any advice on the best BP meds?
I've tried beta-blockers (inderal to be precise) in the past for stress, and I didn't get on well with them at all. Bad nightmares, brain-fog, light-headedness etc.

I was on a low dose (40mg/d) of Diovan, an angiotensin II antagonist, for a couple years. No side effects at all. After I lost weight I didn't need it any more so now I'm not taking anything. My bp was only marginally high, like 140/something.

[malbecman]

I'm in agreement with lucid and Duke: Check out your stress levels and try cocoa powder. Since starting cocoa powder at 15-20 grams per day, my bp is consistently very good. Also, my wife and her father both suffer from "white coat syndrome"-just going to the doctor's office can raise their bp 30-40 points but when they have it measured in a more comfortable/relaxed environment, they both have much more normal #s........

No one has mentioned stress yet as a cause of high blood pressure. Understanding what stress feels like and controlling it through relaxation techniques, or meditation may help reduce blood pressure. This might be a good idea along with diet exercise and supplementation.

I would also like to echo Duke on cocoa powder. There are some good studies which show that it increases vascular felxibility which has the effect of making the pulse pressure lower(pulse pressure is the difference between your systolic and diastolic blood pressures). A high pulse pressure is associated with the stiffening of the arteries and is harmful to many organ systems especially the heart, brain and kidneys. It also carries an increased risk of heart disease. In fact, I believe a high pulse pressure is a strong indicator of heart disease than high overall blood pressure.

[sUper GeNius]

Surprised no one has mentioned this:

http://www.resperate...CFUtyOAodECewXg

[unbreakable]

Looks interesting. One may also consider taking C12 peptide. But as much as I like supplements I think they are not extremely effective in reducing blood pressure. They may lower it moderatly, but not as much as lifestyle modification and prescription drugs. On the other hand supps like cocoa, EPA/DHA, Q10... can be safely combined with antihypertensives and I think this is the way to go in case of hypertension which can not be controlled by lifestyle modifications alone.

[lucid]

Surprised no one has mentioned this:

http://www.resperate...CFUtyOAodECewXg

That looks legit but I have more or less mentioned it when I suggested meditation.
That is basically what this machine does: guide you through breathe control to a reduced stress state. Looks like a good buy though where as it can be difficult to concentrate and meditate.

[tham]

I remember reading about a post in LEF's forum some
years ago, about someone who couldn't lower his BP
on their standard hypertension protocol, but did so
after trying celery seed oil.

I'd suggest cutting out all your supplements except
for the multivit for a couple of weeks, and taking celery
seed. After that you could reintroduce the others one
at a time per week, which would help you determine which
are the ones raising your pressure, by exclusion.

This looks good.

http://www.betterlif...p?prod_id=14230

[gavrilov]

...

Standard drugs for lowering blood pressure rises the risk of many other age related diseases.

***

Yes, some blood pressure medications can deplete your CoQ10 levels:

Tenormin, Catapres, Dyazide, Toprol, Inderal.

If you must take one of these medications, some doctors recommend to supplement your diet with extra CoQ10 each day.

See page 60 at: http://tinyurl.com/2t6jcv

Hope it helps,

-- Leonid Gavrilov, Ph.D.
Website: http://longevity-science.org/
Blog: http://longevity-science.blogspot.com/
My books: http://longevity-sci....org/Books.html

[bixbyte]

For the past 6 months or so, my blood pressure has been at a constant 170/90, and I was wondering if anyone has any advice on supplements that might help lower it? It's a slight concern considering that I'm only 21.
I'm not sure if it's related, but recently I've started having anxiety-attacks also; my doctor wants to prescribe me SSRIs for it, which I'm not keen on.
I've tried various things, including fasting, but the effects are minimal.

Avoid all Caffeine products such as Coffee, tea, green tea, coca cola, pepsi ....
Maybe you are ingesting too much caffeine.
Your Anxiety attacks could be from too much caffeine and perhaps elevated anxiety by white coat syndrome.
Do you feel more anxious when you see your doctor?