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niacin neurotoxicity


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#1 eric29

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Posted 02 February 2008 - 06:05 AM


For many years I have been taking a fairly high dose B vitamin supplement, which includes niacinamide, so I was quite disturbed when I found this article by medical researchers at the University of Birmingham, UK.

QJM. 2005 Mar;98(3):215-26.
Parkinson's disease: the first common neurological disease due to auto-intoxication?
Williams AC, Cartwright LS, Ramsden DB.
Division of Neurosciences, University of Birmingham, Edgbaston, Birmingham.

Parkinson's disease may be a disease of autointoxication. N-methylated pyridines (e.g. MPP+) are well-established dopaminergic toxins, and the xenobiotic enzyme nicotinamide N-methyltransferase (NNMT) can convert pyridines such as 4-phenylpyridine into MPP+, using S-adenosyl methionine (SAM) as the methyl donor. NNMT has recently been shown to be present in the human brain, a necessity for neurotoxicity, because charged compounds cannot cross the blood-brain barrier. Moreover, it is present in increased concentration in parkinsonian brain. This increase may be part genetic predisposition, and part induction, by excessive exposure to its substrates (particularly nicotinamide) or stress. Elevated enzymic activity would increase MPP+-like compounds such as N-methyl nicotinamide at the same time as decreasing intraneuronal nicotinamide, a neuroprotectant at several levels, creating multiple hits, because Complex 1 would be poisoned and be starved of its major substrate NADH. Developing xenobiotic enzyme inhibitors of NNMT for individuals, or dietary modification for the whole population, could be an important change in thinking on primary and secondary prevention.

PMID: 15728403


Basically they are saying that they have found a biochemical pathway that will convert excess nicotinamide into a toxic compound in the brain. It is mediated by an enzyme called N-methyltransferase (NNMT) which has only recently been found to exist in the brain naturally. There will be some individual variation in how much of this enzyme people have, but it can be increased by high levels of its substrate (nicotinamide), and it may produce a slow long term poisoning of dopaminergic brain cells.

The authors AC Williams and DB Ramsden seem to have done quite a bit of work on this. When I enter Williams Ramsden nicotinamine into Google, it lists 951 citatations.

The full text of the article is available here: http://qjmed.oxfordj...t/full/98/3/215

The disturbing part is that they are only referring to the levels of niacin you can get through enriched food. Supplemental niacin or niacinamide would be many times higher.

In the full text of the article they say, "Western societies who suffer more from PD may now have too much nicotinamide in their diet overall, and this may need to be addressed at the population level."

In a less technical article they talk about niacin enriched foods as a possible cause for increased rates of Parkinson's disease

Parkinsonism Relat Disord. 2005 Nov;11(7):413-20.
Nicotinamide: a double edged sword.
Williams A, Ramsden D.
Division of Neurosciences, University of Birmingham, Edgbaston, Birmingham B15 2TT, UK. adrian.williams@uhb.nhs.uk

Enrichment of diet with Nicotinamide in the West was introduced in the 1940s to prevent the dietary deficiency disorder Pellagra. Pellagra was caused by a particular form of poor vegetarian diet leading to Nicotinamide and Tryptophan deficiency... Diets may sometimes now be too high in selected pyridines and inadvertently we have exchanged one neurodegenerative disease for another. Parkinson's disease triggered in contrast to Pellagra by a particular form of rich omnivorous diet. Moderation of Nicotinamide intake would be easy to begin with compared with other dietary manipulations as there is no behavior change necessary for individuals. A substantial amount of Nicotinamide can be removed when and where there is too much that has been introduced artificially and inserted where there is too little because meat is unaffordable.

PMID: 16183323


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#2 EmbraceUnity

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Posted 02 February 2008 - 06:20 AM

Damn, I just bought more bottles of the LEF Mix... I hope there is some reason why this is no problem. Maybe some co-factor alleviates this problem. You would think we'd have figured out if a B vitamin is very damaging by now... it isn't exactly a new experimental supplement.

Edited by progressive, 02 February 2008 - 06:24 AM.


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#3 krillin

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Posted 02 February 2008 - 07:02 AM

The concern seems theoretical at this point, since epidemiology hasn't found any harm. It might even help.

Mov Disord. 1999 Jan;14(1):28-37.
Nutritional and occupational factors influencing the risk of Parkinson's disease: a case-control study in southeastern Sweden.
Fall PA, Fredrikson M, Axelson O, Granérus AK.
Department of Neuroscience and Locomotion, Linköping University, Sweden.

PURPOSE AND METHODS: To investigate the possible impact of nutritional and environmental risk factors for idiopathic Parkinson's disease (IP), a case-control study was performed in the county of Ostergötland in southeastern Sweden. The study involved 113 cases of IP and 263 control subjects. Dietary, drinking, and smoking habits, as well as previous occupation, were requested in a structured questionnaire. RESULTS: No increased risk was found for any of the nutritional items in which information was requested. A reduced risk was found for coffee, wine, and liquor at various consumption levels but also for fried or broiled meat, smoked ham or meat, eggs, French loaf or white bread, and tomatoes. All these food and drink items contain niacin. As in many studies, the frequency of preceding and present smoking was reduced in IP patients. Various occupational groups and exposures were analyzed and increased risks of IP in men were found for agricultural work along with pesticide exposure; this was also the case for male carpenters and female cleaners. CONCLUSIONS: The findings indicate that nutritional factors and occupational exposures, especially to pesticides, could be of etiologic importance in IP.

PMID: 9918341

J Neurol. 2003 Oct;250 Suppl 3:III30-9.
Environmental, life-style, and physical precursors of clinical Parkinson's disease: recent findings from the Honolulu-Asia Aging Study.
Abbott RD, Ross GW, White LR, Sanderson WT, Burchfiel CM, Kashon M, Sharp DS, Masaki KH, Curb JD, Petrovitch H.
University of Virginia Health System, Department of Health Evaluation Sciences, 800717, Charlottesville, Virginia 22908-0717, USA. rda3e@virginia.edu

BACKGROUND: Increased westernization with Japanese migration to the U. S. in the early 20(th) century is thought to have altered the risk of cardiovascular disease. Whether similar effects include changes in the risk of Parkinson's disease (PD) is not clear. This report describes the relations between environmental, life-style, and physical attributes and the incidence of PD that have been observed in the Honolulu-Asia Aging Study. METHODS: Beginning in 1965, environmental, life-style, and physical attributes were recorded at selected examinations in a cohort of 8,006 Japanese-American men. Subjects were followed for clinical PD. FINDINGS: During 30 years of follow- up, PD was observed in 137 men. Overall incidence (7.1/10,000 person-years) was generally higher than in Asia and similar to rates observed in Europe and the U. S. Precursors of PD included constipation, adiposity, years worked on a sugar or pineapple plantation, years of exposure to pesticides, and exposure to sugar cane processing. Factors showing an inverse association with PD included coffee intake and cigarette smoking. Among dietary factors, carbohydrates increased the risk of PD while the intake of polyunsaturated fats appeared protective. Total caloric intake, saturated and monounsaturated fats, protein, niacin, riboflavin, beta-carotene, vitamins A, B, and C, dietary cholesterol, cobalamin, alpha-tocopherol, and pantothenic acid showed no clear relation with clinical PD. INTERPRETATION: Findings suggest that several environmental, life-style, and physical attributes appear to be precursors of PD. Whether patterns of precursors can be used to identify individuals at high risk of future PD or can broaden the scope of early interventions or recruitment into neuroprotective trials warrants further study.

PMID: 14579122

Neurology. 1996 Sep;47(3):644-50.
Comment in: Neurology. 1997 Jul;49(1):310-1.
Diet and Parkinson's disease. II: A possible role for the past intake of specific nutrients. Results from a self-administered food-frequency questionnaire in a case-control study.
Hellenbrand W, Boeing H, Robra BP, Seidler A, Vieregge P, Nischan P, Joerg J, Oertel WH, Schneider E, Ulm G.
Institute of Social Medicine, Faculty of Medicine, Otto-von-Guericke University, Magdeburg, Germany.

In a case-control study, we compared the past dietary habits of 342 Parkinson's disease (PD) patients recruited from nine German clinics with those of 342 controls from the same neighborhood or region. Data were gathered with a structured interview and a self-administered food-frequency questionnaire. Nutrient intakes were calculated from the reported food intakes through linkage with the German Federal Food Code and analyzed using multivariate conditional logistic regression to control for total energy intake, educational status, and cigarette smoking. At the macronutrient level, patients reported higher carbohydrate intake than controls after adjustment for total energy intake, smoking, and educational status (OR = 2.74, 95% confidence interval [CI]: 1.30-6.07, for the highest versus lowest quartile, p trend = 0.02). This was reflected in higher monosaccharide and disaccharide intakes at the nutrient level. There was no difference between patients and controls in protein and fat intake after adjustment for energy intake. We found an inverse association between the intakes of beta-carotene (OR = 0.67, 95% CI: 0.37-1.19, p trend = 0.06) and ascorbic acid (OR = 0.60, 95% CI: 0.33-1.09, p trend = 0.04) by patients, although only the trend for ascorbic acid intake reached statistical significance. There was no difference between groups for alpha-tocopherol intake after adjustment for energy intake. We also found that patients reported a significantly lower intake of niacin than controls (OR = 0.15, 95% CI: 0.07-0.33, p trend < 0.00005). Our results suggest that if antioxidants play a protective role in this disease, the amounts provided by diet alone are insufficient. Although the interpretation of the inverse association between niacin intake and PD is complicated by the high niacin content in coffee and alcoholic beverages, which were also inversely associated with PD in this study, the strength of this association and its biologic plausibility warrant further investigation.

PMID: 8797457
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#4 eric29

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Posted 02 February 2008 - 09:49 PM

Krillin- thanks for posting those articles. I haven't sorted this out yet but it seems clear that niacin itself isn't neurotoxic, it is only if the enzyme NNMT acts on it in the brain and produces the toxic compund N-methylnicotinamide. The authors did point out the many ways that nicotinamide itself is neuroprotective. So if NNMT has low activity in most people, you could actually expect that an epidemiological study would find that people with somewhat higher niacin intake would be protected from neurodegenerative disease.

So I tried to find out what the variability of this enzyme is. When I did a Google Book Search I found "Pharmacology of Endogensous Neurotoxins: A Handbook by Andreas Moser. Published in 1998. Its quite helpful that Google lets you read books online now. The book had a section on Nicotinamide N-methyltransferase (page 192) where it says "Human liver NNMT activity varies five-fold among individuals... Approximately 26% of the population is in a sub-group with high NNMT activity."

If brain activity is similar to liver activity then about 3 out of 4 people have low NNMT activity so a population study could be expected to show a protective effect from niacin. But the 1 out of 4 people who have higher NNMT activity may help to confound the results in other studies.

In the original article I cited, Williams states that "Studies on dietary nicotinamide intake in Parkinson's are confusing...It has been proposed that high nicotinamide in diet is protective, but this has been disputed and is confounded by the fact that coffee has a high nicotinamide component."

Coffee also contains caffeine, and in much larger quantities than niacin, about 200 times as much. Williams also writes "The strongest environmental factors [for Parkinsons] are nicotine and caffeine, which are both protective...No convincing mechanism for this has been described, but both are N-methylated compounds, which seems an extraordinary coincidence." He hypothesizes that as N-methylated compounds they may downregulate the NNMT enzyme through feedback inhibition.

Unfortunately I think it will be quite a while before we can walk into a doctor's office and have our NNMT enzymes levels checked. I guess odds of 26% aren't too bad. But the idea that NNMT activity can be elevated by excess Niacin is what I still find disturbing. The USDA states that a cup of coffee contains 0.453 mg of Niacin. In other words about one half of one milligram. Yikes. This is what the population studies, such as third study listed in Krillin's post, refer to as the "high niacin content in coffee." Just one capsule of Ortho-Core contains 13 mg of Niacin. The recommended 9 caps contain 115 mg of Niacin. Other B vitamin supplements contain even larger amounts. These amounts are off the scale compared to the amounts found in coffee and the usual diet, whether that diet includes niacin enriched bread or not.

For now I have decided to stop taking any supplements with niacin in them, until I find some really good evidence that this is all a bad dream.

#5 health_nutty

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Posted 02 February 2008 - 10:59 PM

Would this potential problem exist with all forms of B3?

#6 krillin

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Posted 03 February 2008 - 12:12 AM

Would this potential problem exist with all forms of B3?


I would think so. Niacin is heavily metabolized to niacinamide and niacinamide metabolites. But interestingly, methylated niacin (trigonelline, present in coffee) is beneficial.

Int J Clin Pharmacol Ther. 2007 Aug;45(8):448-54.
Plasma and urine pharmacokinetics of niacin and its metabolites from an extended-release niacin formulation.
Menon RM, Adams MH, González MA, Tolbert DS, Leu JH, Cefali EA.
Kos Pharmaceuticals, Weston, FL 33326, USA. menonrm2000@gmail.com

OBJECTIVE: To characterize plasma and urine pharmacokinetics of niacin and its metabolites after oral administration of 2,000 mg of extended-release (ER) niacin in healthy male volunteers. METHODS: Niacin ER was administered to 12 healthy male subjects following a low-fat snack. Plasma was collected for 12 h post dose and was analyzed for niacin, nicotinuric acid (NUA), nicotinamide (NAM) and nicotinamide-N-oxide (NNO). Urine was collected for 96 h post dose and analyzed for niacin and its metabolites, NUA, NAM, NNO, N-methylnicotinamide (MNA) and N-methyl-2-pyridone-5-carboxamide (2PY). RESULTS: Mean niacin Cmax and AUC(0-t) values were 9.3 microg/ml and 26.2 microg x h/ml and were the highest of all analytes measured. Peak niacin and NUA levels occurred at 4.6 h (median) while tmax for NAM and NNO were 8.6 and 11.1 h, respectively. The mean plasma terminal half-life for niacin (0.9 h) and NUA (1.3 h) was shorter as compared to NAM (4.3 h). Urine recovery of niacin and metabolites accounted for 69.5% of the administered dose; only 3.2% was excreted as niacin. The highest recovery was for 2PY (37.9%), followed by MNA (16.0%) and NUA (11.6%). Mean half-lives for 2PY and MNA calculated in urine were 12.6 and 12.8 h, respectively. CONCLUSIONS: Niacin was extensively metabolized following oral administration, and about 70% of the administered dose is recovered in urine in 96 h as niacin, NUA, MNA, NNO, NAM and 2PY. The plasma levels of the parent niacin were higher than its metabolites though only about 3% of the unchanged drug is recovered in urine.

PMID: 17725178

Neurosignals. 2005;14(1-2):34-45.
Search for natural products related to regeneration of the neuronal network.
Tohda C, Kuboyama T, Komatsu K.
Research Center for Ethnomedicines, Institute of Natural Medicine, Toyama Medical and Pharmaceutical University, Sugitani, Japan.

The reconstruction of neuronal networks in the damaged brain is necessary for the therapeutic treatment of neurodegenerative diseases. We have screened the neurite outgrowth activity of herbal drugs, and identified several active constituents. In each compound, neurite outgrowth activity was investigated under amyloid-beta-induced neuritic atrophy. Most of the compounds with neurite regenerative activity also demonstrated memory improvement activity in Alzheimer's disease-model mice. Protopanaxadiol-type saponins in Ginseng drugs and their metabolite, M1 (20-O-beta-D-glucopyranosyl-(20S)-protopanaxadiol), showed potent regeneration activity for axons and synapses, and amelioration of memory impairment. Withanolide derivatives (withanolide A, withanoside IV, and withanoside VI) isolated from the Indian herbal drug Ashwagandha, also showed neurite extension in normal and damaged cortical neurons. Trigonelline, a constituent of coffee beans, demonstrated the regeneration of dendrites and axons, in addition to memory improvement. 2005 S. Karger AG, Basel

PMID: 15956813
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#7 ilanso

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Posted 03 February 2008 - 09:15 AM

So I tried to find out what the variability of this enzyme is. When I did a Google Book Search I found "Pharmacology of Endogensous Neurotoxins: A Handbook by Andreas Moser. Published in 1998. Its quite helpful that Google lets you read books online now. The book had a section on Nicotinamide N-methyltransferase (page 192) where it says "Human liver NNMT activity varies five-fold among individuals... Approximately 26% of the population is in a sub-group with high NNMT activity."

If brain activity is similar to liver activity then about 3 out of 4 people have low NNMT activity so a population study could be expected to show a protective effect from niacin. But the 1 out of 4 people who have higher NNMT activity may help to confound the results in other studies.
In the original article I cited, Williams states that "Studies on dietary nicotinamide intake in Parkinson's are confusing...It has been proposed that high nicotinamide in diet is protective, but this has been disputed and is confounded by the fact that coffee has a high nicotinamide component."

Coffee also contains caffeine, and in much larger quantities than niacin, about 200 times as much. Williams also writes "The strongest environmental factors [for Parkinsons] are nicotine and caffeine, which are both protective...No convincing mechanism for this has been described, but both are N-methylated compounds, which seems an extraordinary coincidence." He hypothesizes that as N-methylated compounds they may downregulate the NNMT enzyme through feedback inhibition.

Unfortunately I think it will be quite a while before we can walk into a doctor's office and have our NNMT enzymes levels checked. I guess odds of 26% aren't too bad. But the idea that NNMT activity can be elevated by excess Niacin is what I still find disturbing. The USDA states that a cup of coffee contains 0.453 mg of Niacin. In other words about one half of one milligram. Yikes. This is what the population studies, such as third study listed in Krillin's post, refer to as the "high niacin content in coffee." Just one capsule of Ortho-Core contains 13 mg of Niacin. The recommended 9 caps contain 115 mg of Niacin. Other B vitamin supplements contain even larger amounts. These amounts are off the scale compared to the amounts found in coffee and the usual diet, whether that diet includes niacin enriched bread or not.

For now I have decided to stop taking any supplements with niacin in them, until I find some really good evidence that this is all a bad dream.


Eric, in the full text pointed to by your post, I find:

Twenty-five per cent of the general population are high expressors of NNMT.

I am thinking this may refer to the brain figure.
As to having your NNMT checked, there may be a faster path. Any of the new personal genome service companies (such as DecodeMe or 23andMe) will decode some 600,000+ SNPs throughout your DNA for about $1000. I did not see Parkinson's among the traits currently studied, but new ones get added as advances are made, allowing you to revisit and discover new things about yourself without the need for retesting.
I personally take about 1g/d (used to take 2g for years) to up my HDL, so I'm probably already dead without knowing. On top of that, I take heavy methylation aids (2g of TMG) - thank God this happens peripherally and would not cross the blood-brain barrier.
What unsettles me more is that the susceptibility to these neurotoxicities (incl. Parkinson's) has such a high "nurture" component (see Krillin's quotations). Which means that what we do do here in Supplements is serious (read with potentially irreversible effects) business indeed.

#8 aikikai

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Posted 14 October 2008 - 06:13 PM

(Sorry for bumping, but I don't find it ok to start a new thread on the same topic)

Any more news or info regarding this? I haven't used B3 supplements (except multivitamin) for some year now. Don't know if it is still a good idea to skip it.

#9 katzenjammer

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Posted 14 October 2008 - 06:25 PM

(Sorry for bumping, but I don't find it ok to start a new thread on the same topic)

Any more news or info regarding this? I haven't used B3 supplements (except multivitamin) for some year now. Don't know if it is still a good idea to skip it.


I'd like to know what people on this board think as well. I've been using slo-niacin for a few months now. It is hard to believe that such a standard supp hasn't been flagged all this time.

#10 katzenjammer

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Posted 14 October 2008 - 06:37 PM

Also, Slo-niacin is "nicotinic acid" - does anyone know if this inhibits SIRT1?
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#11 aikikai

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Posted 14 October 2008 - 07:09 PM

It seems that a lot of forum members here still use B3, so I am interested to know the opinions and reasons for using this supplement, regarding the above studies and possible side-effects.

#12 mikeinnaples

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Posted 17 October 2008 - 05:20 PM

It seems that a lot of forum members here still use B3, so I am interested to know the opinions and reasons for using this supplement, regarding the above studies and possible side-effects.



We use Nictonic Acid rather than Niacinamide for the most part as well as certain time releases version if you have problems with the flush. There are numerous discussions and threads on it if you search for them.

#13 Steve_86

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Posted 30 January 2009 - 05:46 AM

Bump, I would love some more info on this.

Also, Slo-niacin is "nicotinic acid" - does anyone know if this inhibits SIRT1?


Not sure if you have seen this thread? http://www.imminst.o...o...ic=27350=

#14 OneScrewLoose

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Posted 30 January 2009 - 08:56 AM

Oops wrong thread.

Edited by OneScrewLoose, 30 January 2009 - 08:58 AM.


#15 RoadToAwe

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Posted 30 January 2009 - 06:20 PM

Here is another research article that explores the link between Niacin and Parkinson's.

Retrospective study of preventive effect of maize on mortality from Parkinson’s disease in Japan


"From these results niacin is expected to be one of the promoting factors for Parkinson's disease, and maize could be an important food for its prevention. Vitamins
are excessively ingested now in Japan.22 But the previous reports provided weak evidence for the safety of their long-term excessive intake. It may be necessary to revisit the recommended amount of niacin for daily consumption."

Attached Files


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#16 Chris Edited

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Posted 18 June 2015 - 05:09 AM

It seems that a lot of forum members here still use B3, so I am interested to know the opinions and reasons for using this supplement, regarding the above studies and possible side-effects.

 

Hopping in here and bumping this old thread posting.

any updates on Niacin increasing  risk of PD?

 

 

Wow  so I went and found this which is extremely alarming    ceasing any and all b3 forms of supplimantation even though it may possibly be  limited to people with a particular genetic profile as I have no PD in any familiy history  but had  jumped forst onto the Niagen bandwagon and then  shifted to Niacin  as a cheaper alternative for that pathway..

 

 http://www.trackyour...s.aspx?ID=17845


Edited by Chris Edited, 18 June 2015 - 05:52 AM.

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#17 Dolph

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Posted 18 June 2015 - 08:45 AM

People, there have been several studies with high dose niacin over years, to treat etherosclerosis with THOUSANDS of participants. I feel VERY safe that any amount of a possible neurotoxic effect would have been found in these trials... Really...


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#18 ceridwen

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Posted 18 June 2015 - 10:25 AM

I think there is something in this. At the beginning of this illness I took large doses of Nicotinamide because I read about it reversing Alzheimer's in mice. I developed a severe tremor that was only resolved on taking PRL-8-53. It was resolved very quickly and easily but it had been a very severe tremor.

#19 Darryl

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Posted 18 June 2015 - 01:17 PM

On the other hand, there's this:

 

Hellenbrand W et al. 1996. Diet and Parkinson's disease II A possible role for the past intake of specific nutrients: Results from a self-administered food-frequency questionnaire in a case-control studyNeurology47(3), 644-650.

 

We also found that patients reported a significantly lower intake of niacin than controls (OR = 0.15, 95% CI: 0.07-0.33, p trend < 0.00005). Our results suggest that if antioxidants play a protective role in this disease, the amounts provided by diet alone are insufficient. Although the interpretation of the inverse association between niacin intake and PD is complicated by the high niacin content in coffee and alcoholic beverages, which were also inversely associated with PD in this study, the strength of this association and its biologic plausibility warrant further investigation.

 

 

Wakade C et al 2014. Upregulation of GPR109A in Parkinson’s Disease. PLoS ONE, 9(10).

 

Niacin levels were lower in PD and were associated with increased frequency of experiencing body pain and decreased duration of deep sleep.

 

Alisky et al. reported an account of a man with PD who was initially given 500 mg of niacin daily to treat his high triglyceride level. The treatment appeared to work and a higher dose of 1000 mg was subsequently attempted. Three months later, during a follow-up primary care visit, the patient's family reported an unexpected positive side-effect of the niacin treatment in the form of an increase in his physical functioning. They included the ability to rise from a chair (which he previously was unable to do without assistance) and being able to walk faster (which he previously was very slow to execute due to freezing). These improvements were thought to be attributed to a noticeable decrease in his rigidity and bradykinesia, the classical symptoms of PD. The niacin dosing however, was too high, which may explain the nightmares and skin reactions. A lower dose that can elicit similar symptomatic relief without side effects would be noteworthy. It needs to be further clarified whether the above-mentioned effect of niacin was due to its metabolic effects or its effects on GPR109A or the combination thereof.
 
Similarly, two case-control studies found that those who consumed a niacin-rich diet had a decreased risk of developing the disease, after correcting for occupational and environmental factors.
 
The neuroprotective role of niacinamide is documented in MPTP and other models of PD in mice. The role of NAD, decreased apoptosis (by blocking PARP pathway), decreased oxidative stress and inhibition of NOS have been implicated as possible mechanisms involved in neuroprotection by niacinamide. Niacin has been shown to be neuroprotective in animal stroke models. Niacin was thought to be involved in vascular and axonal remodeling of the animals. However, there is no published data that demonstrates the neuroprotection of niacin in any PD animal model. Both niacin and niacinamide are sources of NAD. Niacin but not niacinamide acts as an agonist of GPR109A. Therefore, although both niacin and niacinamide are neuroprotective, their mechanisms appear to be different. 

 

 

 

The Fukushima et al paper cited above is particularly weak. The region of Japan that dominates maize production is the northern island of Hokkaido, which has numerous ethnic, climate and dietary differences from the more southern Japan - not least being much lower industrialization. When one looks at Parkinson's incidence in the US, it seems to concentrate in more industrial Northeast - rural Iowa doesn't have a notably high inciedence. 

 

Wright Willis A et al 2010. Geographic and ethnic variation in Parkinson disease: a population-based study of US Medicare beneficiariesNeuroepidemiology34(3), 143-151.

 


Edited by Darryl, 18 June 2015 - 01:34 PM.

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#20 Chris Edited

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Posted 18 June 2015 - 02:56 PM

People, there have been several studies with high dose niacin over years, to treat etherosclerosis with THOUSANDS of participants. I feel VERY safe that any amount of a possible neurotoxic effect would have been found in these trials... Really...

 

How then do you account for the reports of tremors whne taking Niacin which resolve after cessation of its use?

 

As I said it may have a strong genetic component to any damage but no benefit in my view could outweight doing such serious damage to my brain...  sorry you didn't like the  information but its there and I felt it warranted discussion


Edited by Chris Edited, 18 June 2015 - 03:01 PM.

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#21 Dolph

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Posted 18 June 2015 - 03:00 PM

 

People, there have been several studies with high dose niacin over years, to treat etherosclerosis with THOUSANDS of participants. I feel VERY safe that any amount of a possible neurotoxic effect would have been found in these trials... Really...

 

How then do you account for the reports of tremors whne taking Niacin which resolve after cessation of its use?

 

 

When there are no such reports in controlled trials with over 50.000 participants total whatsoever I account for those "reports" as expression of hysteria and nocebo phenomenon as they can be seen regularly on this ****** up forum with every single drug or supplement...


Edited by Dolph, 18 June 2015 - 03:00 PM.

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#22 Chris Edited

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Posted 18 June 2015 - 03:04 PM

 

 

People, there have been several studies with high dose niacin over years, to treat etherosclerosis with THOUSANDS of participants. I feel VERY safe that any amount of a possible neurotoxic effect would have been found in these trials... Really...

 

How then do you account for the reports of tremors whne taking Niacin which resolve after cessation of its use?

 

 

When there are no such reports in controlled trials with over 50.000 participants total whatsoever I account for those "reports" as expression of hysteria and nocebo phenomenon as they can be seen regularly on this ****** up forum with every single drug or supplement...

 

 

Wow.. touchy ... well have fun playing lab rat with your one and olnly body..  I have no qualms raising any information related to the topic of discussion for further consideration..

 

 The post I initially linked was  plainly made with sincerity and  aimed at possibly preventing what amounts to extremely dangerous  brain damage... if that is  time wasting or  hysteria so be it.

 

Also take note that posting was made just  a couple of months ago and references High Doesages of Niacin (1,500mg/day) not simply any dietary intake.
 


Edited by Chris Edited, 18 June 2015 - 03:23 PM.

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#23 ceridwen

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Posted 18 June 2015 - 05:06 PM

I have taken NR since then. No tremor and I find it quite helpful

#24 Dolph

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Posted 22 June 2015 - 10:43 AM

http://journals.plos...al.pone.0109818



#25 zorba990

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Posted 22 June 2015 - 06:21 PM




People, there have been several studies with high dose niacin over years, to treat etherosclerosis with THOUSANDS of participants. I feel VERY safe that any amount of a possible neurotoxic effect would have been found in these trials... Really...


How then do you account for the reports of tremors whne taking Niacin which resolve after cessation of its use?

When there are no such reports in controlled trials with over 50.000 participants total whatsoever I account for those "reports" as expression of hysteria and nocebo phenomenon as they can be seen regularly on this ****** up forum with every single drug or supplement...

Wow.. touchy ... well have fun playing lab rat with your one and olnly body.. I have no qualms raising any information related to the topic of discussion for further consideration..

The post I initially linked was plainly made with sincerity and aimed at possibly preventing what amounts to extremely dangerous brain damage... if that is time wasting or hysteria so be it.

Also take note that posting was made just a couple of months ago and references High Doesages of Niacin (1,500mg/day) not simply any dietary intake.

1500mg holy moly! 250mg and I am a lobster.
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#26 mikeinnaples

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Posted 23 June 2015 - 01:00 PM

Zorba, the flush effect of Nicotinic Acid can be tolerated if you take your time and slowly increase the dosage. I can take 1.5 grams and not even get so much as a tingle now.






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