2208 replies to this topic

[hooter]

Hey all, if cerebrolysin is 3-4x more effective via IV, why aren't more people just purchasing self-administration IV sets? They look pretty effective & cheap

Do you have a source for that info?

[themastadon]

No I don't, just anecdotal evidence from earlier in the thread:

However I would guess it to be anywhere from 3 to 5 times stronger, since I've tried intramuscular injection as well. The effects on perceptual 'smoothness' (the difference between a low and high framerate in video games) and direct perception of environmental light refraction are definitely at least 5 times stronger with the IV route. The rest can be attributed to synergy. Either way it's really hard to distinguish, which is why I opted for IV in the first place.

Edit: Oh wait, you were the one who said that earlier. So no, I was just going off of what you said (haha)

On an unrelated note, I can't seem to find any cerebrolysin for sale online. Can anyone suggest reputable vendors who are selling at this time? Everything I've found is back-ordered.

Edited by themastadon, 24 February 2012 - 08:09 PM.

[Gamerzneed]

Hey all, if cerebrolysin is 3-4x more effective via IV, why aren't more people just purchasing self-administration IV sets? They look pretty effective & cheap

Edit: Looks like IV hookups are pretty difficult to self-administer....finding the vein seems especially problematic for the untrained user.

On an unrelated note, I can't seem to find any cerebrolysin for sale online. Can anyone suggest reputable vendors who are selling at this time? Everything I've found is back-ordered.

An even more cost effective method would be to go to your local slaughter house and ask for pig heads, next go set up your own lab in your basement with enzyme potions and crap like that. Botta bink, botta boonk....... poof, you have cheap cerebrolysin. But seriously,how practical would that be? All pharmacies that sell cerebrolysin are freakin expensive, we need far better alternatives.

[MangekyōPeter]

Had my first IV injection of 10ML yesterday in a clinic.

And I kind of somehow managed to drink 5 beers and take 2mg clonazepam... don't remember how I got home nor about 2 hours before that.

This is ironic because I very rarely drink alcohol and even rarer for me to take clonazepam on top of it (or take them by themselves).
A very dumb move of me.

But am feeling decent today, a little hungover, won't do the second injection today, will do it on monday so will report how that goes.

Edited by marekso, 25 February 2012 - 01:58 PM.

[sunshinefrost]

Had my first IV injection of 10ML yesterday in a clinic.

And I kind of somehow managed to drink 5 beers and take 2mg clonazepam... don't remember how I got home nor about 2 hours before that.

This is ironic because I very rarely drink alcohol and even rarer for me to take clonazepam on top of it (or take them by themselves).
A very dumb move of me.

But am feeling decent today, a little hungover, won't do the second injection today, will do it on monday so will report how that goes.

Amnesia with 5 drinks ? I guess its possible if you dont drink often.

I'm curious to know if you felt anything with your 1 injection. It took me a few days before i noticed angthing. I had trouble sleeping with 5 ml im, i find 10 ml iv to be a huge dose.

[MangekyōPeter]

amnesia because both benzodiazepams and alochol were MIXED, otherwise I never get amnesia just from drinking alone (no matter how drunk I am)

But I woke up seeing that I had puked up on the floor in my room sometime in the evening, but felt just a little hungover).

And on your question about feeling it I would definitely say that I experienced a sense of well being (euphoria) for the next 4 hours after the injection but it may have been placebo because I have been waiting to try Cerebrolysin for a few months now and I have been in a very good mood overall ever sine I bought the cerbrolysin and had it in my hand.. :D

But now as it's 7:30 pm I think I'm feeling pretty much average...
Today
I also took 800 mg piracetam
20mg ro-accutane (for acne)
marijuana
eyeballed 40-90 mg noopept

and that's basically it


Not profound effects felt from cerebrolysin yet..

and again, this was terribly stupid of me to do in the first place, couldn't resist a friends invite.... but I was kind of determined to spend my time doing varous health and brain activities while I go through my first ever cerebrolysin cycle.

I hope I haven't somehow embedded alcohol-ish brain and perma sedation from clonazepam by doing this .. .:D:D:D

ohh... and btw the injection that they did in the hospital was via a drip chamber instead of directly injecting it with a noral syrenge.

Edited by marekso, 25 February 2012 - 05:32 PM.

[MangekyōPeter]

Okay about to head off to the second injection in 2 hours.
Wanted to ask you guys what therapeutic things I could do now for the duration of my cerebrolysin cycle...

I've already downloaded Brain Workshop which I'm going to use for at least half an hour every day, then there's also meditation (also for half an hour)
have been eating healthy, sleeping well for the past 2 days and will continue to do so but wanted to know what anyone else might be recommending...

I'm not physically active at all, would it help a lot if i exercised DURING the cycle if I haven't done it before in a great while ( I know exercise is good regardless of if i'm taking cerebrolysin) but would there be any addition positive effects from anything that I can do while taking it... as 10ml IV is a pretty huge dose for the first cycle and maybe I can exploit that somehow and really achieve even more profound-er effects than others who started with 5ml IM or 10ml IM or 5ml IV....

Recommendations people, please? :P

[sunshinefrost]

Brain training and meditation should be good. You will probably be building new neural connections so try a lot of things , just stay mentally active without exhausting yourself and you can also try to avoid stress because you definitly do not want to reinforce or activate stress brain connections. Other than that you could Try to speed read when going through a document. You may find that your normal word-capture can be increased. As for sports im pretty shure it's a good idea

[MangekyōPeter]

Roger that sunshinefrost, will speed read (i've used programs before, got to 600 wpm at one point so i can now try to see if i can get back to that level in a few days as before taht it took me a few weeks of daily practice to reach that speed)
also yeah will try to completely avoid stressful things as well have a good long nights sleep so I get most of the regenerative benefits..

My other question

SHOULD I be using noopept, modafinil, piracetam during this course? as to be honest i'm somewhat of a non responder to noopept most of the time and just get cloudy minded as others have noted and forgetful... and maybe if take noopept +cere together it may help me get the effects from noopept as well..

and any thought on using piracetam and modafinil while doing cere?

[sunshinefrost]

I'm sure you can but i would wait till i see the effect of cere alone. You will soon realise that you dont need modafinil at all. Modafinil is a stimulant so you may be overwhelmed if the 2 are synergistic. I've read someone who liked the verbal fluency hightened by piracetam and cere together. As for noopept, never tried it.

[MangekyōPeter]

Ahh, I see, thanks I'll keep that noted...

It's now been 2 hours after the second injection and I don't feel A LOT different just yet, but I do feel this "something is a little better overall" feeling... more clear, difficult to describe but still nothing profound yet. Also took 2400mg piracetam with it... and juist a bit of weed and yeah, i seem to not get the subtle anxiety feeling that i always feel from weed at all, that's what i've noticed as well..

[jillin]

Cannabis use has been shown to shunt neurogenesis; I personally would not touch cannabis [if at all] if I were using Cerebrolysin. The peptide solution as you already know is very expensive -- why would you want to hinder its potential neurotrophic effects with weed?

[MangekyōPeter]

Hi jillin,
Didn't know that Cannabis shunted neurogenesis... I'm mainly smoking to self treat my ADHD but yeah I guess I have to cease it for the time being while I'm on Cerebrolysin...

Will do that...

And By the way on the effects that Cere is having... going to the third injection in an hour... just woke up... and had a very very vivid dream, and just feel even more serene and clearer today (not profoundly though, yet).. will update after the injection (and yesterday did do the speed reading exercises on speed reader x as well as brain workshop in addition to completing some tasks on lumocity.com ... Got a slight headache towards the end of the whole cognitive straining/learning process later in the evening... then proceeded to meditate for about 30 minutes... and slept like a baby afterwards..

Cannabis use has been shown to shunt neurogenesis; I personally would not touch cannabis [if at all] if I were using Cerebrolysin. The peptide solution as you already know is very expensive -- why would you want to hinder its potential neurotrophic effects with weed?

[sunshinefrost]

Hi jillin,
Didn't know that Cannabis shunted neurogenesis... I'm mainly smoking to self treat my ADHD but yeah I guess I have to cease it for the time being while I'm on Cerebrolysin...

Will do that...

And By the way on the effects that Cere is having... going to the third injection in an hour... just woke up... and had a very very vivid dream, and just feel even more serene and clearer today (not profoundly though, yet).. will update after the injection (and yesterday did do the speed reading exercises on speed reader x as well as brain workshop in addition to completing some tasks on lumocity.com ... Got a slight headache towards the end of the whole cognitive straining/learning process later in the evening... then proceeded to meditate for about 30 minutes... and slept like a baby afterwards..

Cannabis use has been shown to shunt neurogenesis; I personally would not touch cannabis [if at all] if I were using Cerebrolysin. The peptide solution as you already know is very expensive -- why would you want to hinder its potential neurotrophic effects with weed?

I'm really surprised that IV delivery doesn't seem accelerate the effects. You are unfortunatly in the loading phase, if i can call it that, and i understand it can be frustrating since you are paying money for this. Is your treatment for 4 weeks ? I once had a video showing that neuron growth cones move a lot faster after the 4th day on cerebrolysin... but for some reason the video isn't available anymore.

I don't want to open a marijuana debate here but i believe that if you take only a slight amount of cannabinoids, it can help reduce brain inflammation and help with mental decline in aging brains. i could find sources but i'll just post this vid:

physical exercise (increased bdnf), meditation, cerebrolysin and a challenging environement are pretty much all you need

[sunshinefrost]

double post

Edited by sunshinefrost, 28 February 2012 - 08:23 AM.

[sunshinefrost]

there found it. The video starts at day #4. that maybe means that between 0 and 4 the result wasn't evident enough to prove anything. not sure just speculating though.

[Gamerzneed]

there found it. The video starts at day #4. that maybe means that between 0 and 4 the result wasn't evident enough to prove anything. not sure just speculating though.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ucFBGhZSZPY&feature=related

that looks so disgusting and awesome,
Anyways back to Marekso, do you have to go to the doctors everyday or something? Or do they put on a catheter for you that you inject into everyday yourself or something?

[MangekyōPeter]

Just got home from the injection, am in just a generally good, crisp, aware and clear mood at the moment, no euphoria no nothing...
And about Marijuana, I vaporize (90% of the time) it and use about 0.05g per dose so It's definitely a small dose but I still get high to very high most of the time (I've developed like a reverse tolerance, although if I were to smoke out of a pipe,bong or any other "smoking" medium and do like 0.1g to 0.2g doses I could easily develop tolerance but if I vaporize in such small amounts daily I always seem to get just the right amount of "high"... and it's always somewhat recreational.


And about the video of the neurons growing (wow, would have never thought they can develop at such speeds, this is amazing)... And my prescription is for 10 doses and till now i've done 3 so we'll see how it goes..


And @GamerzNeed - I go to the hospital everyday for the injections, and pay 4$ per session.

[Ben]

And @GamerzNeed - I go to the hospital everyday for the injections, and pay 4$ per session.

Interesting. How'd you get that prescription?

[MangekyōPeter]

Just said to my family doctor if she could pretty PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE write me a prescription for either Selegiline or Cerberolysin as I'm having a hard time concentrating on work and she said a big NO on the Selegiline but said yeah on the cerebrolysin as she knows it increases blood flow and in my latest blood test results I had some signs of anemia and I have generally told her i am having small blood circulation problems from sitting on the computer so she said yeah why not.. and then as she was writing the prescription i said that she might as well make it 10ml instead of 5ml as she planned because there aren't any dangers to it to which she concurred... (but to be honest i doubt she even has the slightest idea of the true potential of Cere)

[hooter]

Cannabis use has been shown to shunt neurogenesis;

As far as I know Cannabis is neuroprotective and increases BDNF, do you have any sources for this?

[Gamerzneed]

And @GamerzNeed - I go to the hospital everyday for the injections, and pay 4$ per session.

Do they use a catheter or shove in a new needle everytime, if the latter if true then wouldn't that leave track marks on your skin and make you look like a heroin junkie or something?

Also, this is the video that shows neuron dendrite growth WITHOUT cerebrolysin compared to the one shown by sunshinefrost which shows neuron dendrite growth WITH cerebrolysin

Edited by Gamerzneed, 29 February 2012 - 07:08 AM.

[MangekyōPeter]

To answer your question Gamerzneed they shove in a new needle every time and the needle injection marks aren't that bad haha, and it's only a couple of injections, if i did it daily for months then i'd be worried about it.

[Gamerzneed]

To answer your question Gamerzneed they shove in a new needle every time and the needle injection marks aren't that bad haha, and it's only a couple of injections, if i did it daily for months then i'd be worried about it.

was today's effect any different than your previous?

[jillin]

Posted 28 February 2012 - 12:24 PM

jillin, on 28 February 2012 - 04:31 AM, said:

Cannabis use has been shown to shunt neurogenesis;
As far as I know Cannabis is neuroprotective and increases BDNF, do you have any sources for this?

Yes, here are a few:

* "

Reduced serum concentrations of nerve growth factor, but not brain-derived neurotrophic factor, in chronic cannabis abusers." - a study from European Neuropsychopharmacology. 2008, Dec, 18

* "Chronic Cannabis Abuse Raises Nerve Growth Factor Serum Concentrations in Drug-Naive Schizophrenic Patients." - a study from Journal of Psychopharmacology. 2003
- This study may seem to contradict the first study I mentioned but actually goes to elucidate a possible mechanism of how chronic administration of cannabinoids may interact with a Schizophrenic model to produce similar symptopathologies seen in non-schizophrenic models -- with a key deviation of increased NGF's in the schizophrenic model, compared to decreased NGF's in wild-type models. It should also be noted that these increased NGF levels correlate to onset of schizophrenic episodes in both schizo-and-non-schizo models.

* "Preliminary evidence of cannabinoid effects on brain-derived neurotrophic factor (BDNF) levels in humans." - a study from Pychopharmachology, 2009
- This study addresses the acute and chronic exposure to cannabis; results show that the active component of cannabis seem to decrease BDNF levels with acute use, but increase BDNF levels with chronic use. There is mentioning of a correlation between cannabinergic systems and elevated BDNF levels interacting via unknown mechanism to increase the risk factor of developing Schizophrenia.

I think it is interesting that neurotrophin levels, particularly of the NGF class fluctuates a lot in schizo-models, yet increased levels of BDNF is noted for most schizo-models. I find it even more interesting that with chronic exposure to cannabis, BDNF levels increase also and seemingly potentiate unknown mechanisms to produce schizophrenia nervosa phenotype in wild-type, and individuals with genetic pre-disposition for schizophrenia. Now, I am not saying cannabis use is bad as I do agree it has been shown to have neuroprotective properties and is completely warranted when used for medical purposes; but when used recreationally with the hopes of achieving nootrophic effects, especially combining with Cerebrolysin [which contain a variety of neurotrophic factors] -- caution should be a requisite.

[hooter]

So in low doses it increases NGF and is neurotrophic, while chronic use decreases it. Makes sense. Explains why low doses are helpful to depression and other mental disorders, while higher doses are not.

Edited by hooter, 01 March 2012 - 09:41 AM.

[MangekyōPeter]

So this was the last of the first 5 injections and I am feeling noticeably better overall... But nowhere near how I thought I would feel, there's no crispness or increased hearing or vision or none of those, at least as far as I can tell.. as well as cognition is only moderately better not by a whole lot...

And yesterday I even somehow forgot my pin code to my credit card and got it blocked... which is funny as I thought cerebrolysin would give me far better working as well as other types of memory but doesn't seem so (at least not yet)

And i've had a lot of sleep and used piracetam (for the first time ever, at 2400mg doses together with cere so I expected far bigger improvements in overall alertness and memory but even these 2 things combined don't seem to do "much")

Edited by marekso, 01 March 2012 - 10:19 AM.

[sunshinefrost]

Most people start to sens it around the 4th time but for me it started to be evident and clear at the 10th day, after 5 days i though i eas a non responder. . You will know when you are on it, "on" days with cerebrolysin are kind of productive and reaction time is a lot faster, even with mrijauna, alcohol (eliminates 70% of hang overs) ,piracetam etc.

[sunshinefrost]

Interesting stuff jilin !

[Gamerzneed]

Most people start to sens it around the 4th time but for me it started to be evident and clear at the 10th day, after 5 days i though i eas a non responder. . You will know when you are on it, "on" days with cerebrolysin are kind of productive and reaction time is a lot faster, even with mrijauna, alcohol (eliminates 70% of hang overs) ,piracetam etc.

What were the longterm cognition effects for you? Did you JUST experience faster reaction time/productivity or did you feel an actuall increase in intelligence, like was understanding conscepts any easier than when you weren't on cerebrolysin? Any difference in logic/spatial reasoning or anything like that?

Edited by Gamerzneed, 01 March 2012 - 04:40 PM.