50 replies to this topic

[mentatpsi]

So I have been using iMusic BrainAmp for a bit less than a week, and thought I should write a bit about it.

It revolves around the idea of brainwave entrainment, except instead of the common usage of EEG Neurofeedback, it bases its effects on Auditory stimulation:

The Technology
...
iMusic works because of a scientifically documented, physiological process called brainwave entrainment. Your ear drums are the super highways to your brain, and it's this channel that the sub-audible digital beats and pulses in iMusic travel through-sending slight vibrations echoing through to your sensory cortex. This creates a precise cortical evoked response that activates and optimizes the frequency and amplitude of your brainwaves, eliciting an immediate and very powerful change in your mental state. Within minutes your mind is guided, or "entrained" into the perfect state. What comes next is peak performance.

There is documented evidence for this particular type of augmentation.

Focus & iMusic research
IQ & iMusic research

For those inclined to read more:
IMAGINCE | The Technology Behind iMusic

For those who wish to give it a try:
Test Run

What do you guys think?

Edited by mentatpsi, 16 August 2009 - 11:49 PM.

[nito]

cool im gonna try it out. Is there a full version you can download, or you only have access to test run?

[nito]

Do you feel you have mady any gains mentalpsi?

[mentatpsi]

They seemed to have stopped their marketing strategy; essentially try it now only paying the shipping & handling. Later on you'd pay for it though, a couple months down the road. The CD costs $39.99 and comes with an MP3.

BrainAmp information

A bit more samples


As far as the experience, I'm still holding off for the week or more mark before going into detail with changes (essentially the instructions says "cognitive growth within 7-12 days". The 7 day mark is 8/18. I have noticed an increased in attention though, there's no question. I also enjoy the effect i get right after the session, it's odd to describe, but the brain just feels more active.

Edited by mentatpsi, 17 August 2009 - 06:35 PM.

[nito]

read on youtube you can download the program instead of paying on bit torrent.

[Yearningforyears]

Well this was a nice surprise!

I listened to the demo posted here and found myself to get quite a bit stimulated.
Then before deciding to buy it I did some random google searches and found some discouraging posts about it.
For example the Thrive and flow was totally ripped apart by one poster - touting it´s content like an awful off key garage rock band. Paying 40 bucks for that didn´t seem very appealing all of a sudden.
The test runs on getimusic.com kind of confirmed this. You don´t really get to hear very much and it doesnt sound very promising either. So with this newly found dissapointment in mind I opened a new browser and did some other random searches.
After approx 50 minutes, suddenly, out of nowhere, some music starts playing in my head phones. Sounds really good!
What the heck I think... Virus?
Nope! For some reason the whole cd started playing. It really got me into a very cheerful and uplifted mood =D (free things always seem to do that).

Funny because I felt really irritated, fatigued and depressed during the day and evening. Almost to the point of starting to cry at silly commercials.
Got to try this again tomorrow :D

1. Well duh! Bipolar can do that to you!
2. Well duh! Bipolar with a lot of supplements like dmae (the same day) can do that to you
3. Well yeah! I love alternative rock! (which gives me a better mood just by hearing it)
4. Oh my... This might actually have an effect.

Time will tell. Funny experiment nonetheless.

[nito]

Nicholas how did you get the whole CD playing? I've only listened to the demo which is roughly 20 mins long. I listened to it three times so 1 hour of Imusic is now in my head. I must say i feel relaxed and seem to be in a better mood.

The only down side is that i might be fed up listening to the same 20 mins over and over again, but then again if it has an effect - then why not!

[Yearningforyears]

nito: just cruise to the thrive and flow. There is a small "pre-listen"-button in the left corner. Press it, listen to the fragments if you want and then wait for 30-40 minutes.

Edited by Nicholas, 20 August 2009 - 07:46 PM.

[Esoparagon]

I own the intelligence suite and brainamp but I haven't listened to it enough to claim whether it certainly works or doesn't. All my comments on it are so subjective I don't know if they are even worth putting here.

I'm the kind of guy who really loves to find new ways to push his intelligence higher. Other than this and binaurial beats by themselves I've tried imagestreaming which I found effective... but I haven't done it enough. I did resolve to make sure at some stage I do a good 6 months of it since after doing 3 sessions I felt I could visualize, learn, and think better. Imagine what 24 hours could do.

[nito]

Nicholas - Yea it worked after roughly 30 mins of wait. Pretty cool, i wonder how many people know about it. I would have prefered it to be more instrumental and classical like the test-run version but if it works then - hey who cares.

Esparagon: It would be interesting to know what you feel about it so far even if it's subjective. I rather take people opinions than the claimed ones by the websites. So if you don't mind, then please share.

What is your method of imagestreaming btw? Do you record your own words or how do you carry it out? Please share.

[niner]

Wow, I listened to the demo and thought it was really cool. I'd kind of like to try it out on my 7-year-old son. He's into music and is insanely smart and creative; who knows what would happen... I don't doubt that this is able to do something to the brain. Is there a way to process music of your choice to turn it into imusic? I imagine that some genres of music would work better than others.

[nito]

I think yuo might be able to upload music of your choice if you buy the software.

[Declmem]

Is there a way to process music of your choice to turn it into imusic?

Yep, using this software: http://www.transpare...cts/mindstereo/

[mentatpsi]

Is there a way to process music of your choice to turn it into imusic?

Yep, using this software: http://www.transpare...cts/mindstereo/

That or the neuro programmer. I still think the software is riskier than they make it out to be. You're creating changes, be it temporary or permanent, and the user must be responsible when undertaking experimentation and make sure to document results and remain objective. For instance, the ADHD sessions might work for some but might not be good for others. At least with brainamp there is a set procedure, thereby set results. Also, it's difficult to not be intrigued by the amount of sessions and desire to attempt them, such undertakings change the trajectories of development making it difficult to use the software as "treatment".

This is the reason I've decided to write a bit on BrainAmp. It's a straightforward protocol that will either work for people or won't.

[mentatpsi]

I own the intelligence suite and brainamp but I haven't listened to it enough to claim whether it certainly works or doesn't. All my comments on it are so subjective I don't know if they are even worth putting here.

I'm the kind of guy who really loves to find new ways to push his intelligence higher. Other than this and binaurial beats by themselves I've tried imagestreaming which I found effective... but I haven't done it enough. I did resolve to make sure at some stage I do a good 6 months of it since after doing 3 sessions I felt I could visualize, learn, and think better. Imagine what 24 hours could do.

What's imagestreaming?

[mentatpsi]

Is there a way to process music of your choice to turn it into imusic?

Yep, using this software: http://www.transpare...cts/mindstereo/

That or the neuro programmer. I still think the software is riskier than they make it out to be. You're creating changes, be it temporary or permanent, and the user must be responsible when undertaking experimentation and make sure to document results and remain objective. For instance, the ADHD sessions might work for some but might not be good for others. At least with brainamp there is a set procedure, thereby set results. Also, it's difficult to not be intrigued by the amount of sessions and desire to attempt them, such undertakings change the trajectories of development making it difficult to use the software as "treatment".

This is the reason I've decided to write a bit on BrainAmp. It's a straightforward protocol that will either work for people or won't.

What i mean by this is the user has more of a chance to "screw up" with Neuro programmer, due to the variety of sessions, then with something that has one set protocol.

[nito]

I own the intelligence suite and brainamp but I haven't listened to it enough to claim whether it certainly works or doesn't. All my comments on it are so subjective I don't know if they are even worth putting here.

I'm the kind of guy who really loves to find new ways to push his intelligence higher. Other than this and binaurial beats by themselves I've tried imagestreaming which I found effective... but I haven't done it enough. I did resolve to make sure at some stage I do a good 6 months of it since after doing 3 sessions I felt I could visualize, learn, and think better. Imagine what 24 hours could do.

can you make it available for download?

[Declmem]

Is there a way to process music of your choice to turn it into imusic?

Yep, using this software: http://www.transpare...cts/mindstereo/

That or the neuro programmer. I still think the software is riskier than they make it out to be. You're creating changes, be it temporary or permanent, and the user must be responsible when undertaking experimentation and make sure to document results and remain objective. For instance, the ADHD sessions might work for some but might not be good for others. At least with brainamp there is a set procedure, thereby set results. Also, it's difficult to not be intrigued by the amount of sessions and desire to attempt them, such undertakings change the trajectories of development making it difficult to use the software as "treatment".

This is the reason I've decided to write a bit on BrainAmp. It's a straightforward protocol that will either work for people or won't.

What i mean by this is the user has more of a chance to "screw up" with Neuro programmer, due to the variety of sessions, then with something that has one set protocol.

Sure, but I still prefer the flexibility of software. I like to be able to add my own music, or even create my own sessions. I've used this software for 4 years without any problems.

Let us know how BrainAmp works out.

[mentatpsi]

Is there a way to process music of your choice to turn it into imusic?

Yep, using this software: http://www.transpare...cts/mindstereo/

That or the neuro programmer. I still think the software is riskier than they make it out to be. You're creating changes, be it temporary or permanent, and the user must be responsible when undertaking experimentation and make sure to document results and remain objective. For instance, the ADHD sessions might work for some but might not be good for others. At least with brainamp there is a set procedure, thereby set results. Also, it's difficult to not be intrigued by the amount of sessions and desire to attempt them, such undertakings change the trajectories of development making it difficult to use the software as "treatment".

This is the reason I've decided to write a bit on BrainAmp. It's a straightforward protocol that will either work for people or won't.

What i mean by this is the user has more of a chance to "screw up" with Neuro programmer, due to the variety of sessions, then with something that has one set protocol.

Sure, but I still prefer the flexibility of software. I like to be able to add my own music, or even create my own sessions. I've used this software for 4 years without any problems.

Let us know how BrainAmp works out.

Sorry for the delay. I decided to give Neuro Programmer a try again after the discussion. As such i'm halting the BrainAmp experiment for the time being.

[mentatpsi]

Just another quick point. I have been using a bit of IvyFocus atm and have found it to be a little bit more effective than brainamp. Not really sure the cause but i suspect the exposed time plays an impact on attention to track and thereby decreases overall effect. I'm not sure if there's a difference in the two in terms of frequencies, I would suspect IvyFocus implements more SMR while BrainAmp is more 18hz. This would only be a guess though.

IvyFocus can be found here

[nito]

Just another quick point. I have been using a bit of IvyFocus atm and have found it to be a little bit more effective than brainamp. Not really sure the cause but i suspect the exposed time plays an impact on attention to track and thereby decreases overall effect. I'm not sure if there's a difference in the two in terms of frequencies, I would suspect IvyFocus implements more SMR while BrainAmp is more 18hz. This would only be a guess though.

IvyFocus can be found here

Since you have the softweare can u make it avalaible for download for us poor people lol?

[mentatpsi]

Just another quick point. I have been using a bit of IvyFocus atm and have found it to be a little bit more effective than brainamp. Not really sure the cause but i suspect the exposed time plays an impact on attention to track and thereby decreases overall effect. I'm not sure if there's a difference in the two in terms of frequencies, I would suspect IvyFocus implements more SMR while BrainAmp is more 18hz. This would only be a guess though.

IvyFocus can be found here

Since you have the softweare can u make it avalaible for download for us poor people lol?

I can not due to legality. Sorry comrade.

If money is a constraint you could always look into such supplements as fish oil and bacopa. Though I'd recommend finishing the semester .

[castrensis]

I've owned a Photosonix Nova Pro 100 for three or four years now that utilizes both audio & visual stimulation for brain wave entrainment. I'd used binaural beats solely prior to the Light & Sound Machine with some success, but adding the optical input dramatically increased the efficacy.

[mentatpsi]

I've owned a Photosonix Nova Pro 100 for three or four years now that utilizes both audio & visual stimulation for brain wave entrainment. I'd used binaural beats solely prior to the Light & Sound Machine with some success, but adding the optical input dramatically increased the efficacy.

Ya i think my goggles (Light & Sound Synergizer) are faulty. When i created a session and used a balance for the AudioStrobe on Neuroprogrammer, it reversed the Left & Right. This is rather troublesome as i wonder if the sessions account for this. Regardless, the only use i have for the goggles now are Left & Right simulatenous pulses. Anything requiring different pulses I use solely with headphones.

I was looking at the Photosonix, what sessions have you used on there?

[castrensis]

I was looking at the Photosonix, what sessions have you used on there?

I've had the opportunity to experience all the sessions at least once, but I only use a handful on a regular basis. R02 (Relax & Back) is effective for me after hard day at work or when I'm stressed over something or the other. I formerly used R07 (Daily Escape) when I would get too stressed at work but the unit's a little cumbersome to carry to work & it's a solution after the fact when I need to be calm & focused in the midst of intense situations; to this end I practiced hand-warming exercises & then conditioned a stimulus of three square breaths ( 4 count inspiration, 4 count pause with full lungs, 4 count exhalation, 4 count pause with empty lungs) to quickly induce the state. D11 (Deep Low Meditation) took some practice to maintain consciousness when ramping down to deep delta, but now induces a state where I lose consciousness of bodily sensations & experience something I can only describe as "pure consciousness", an interesting state. I haven't had much success with the sleep sessions. I use L01 (Quick Pre-Study) & L02 (Quick Post-Study) for rote memorization. I use E02 (AM Pumper) almost every morning right after my alarm goes off, helps to shake off morning grogginess. I rarely use Visualize/Create, Entertain/Fun or Special sessions because they're not of any great utility for me.

[mentatpsi]

I found the user manual for the device. I think using it, it would be possible to reconstruct some of the sessions using Neuroprogrammer. Though many of them don't mention the exact protocols used. It's actually relatively expensive given the market, pretty close to the price of pendant eeg, a neurofeedback hardware. Though that doesn't cover the software. It does have a lot of sessions though. How long have you been using it btw?

Edited by mentatpsi, 22 September 2009 - 07:58 PM.

[castrensis]

I found the user manual for the device. I think using it, it would be possible to reconstruct some of the sessions using Neuroprogrammer. Though many of them don't mention the exact protocols used. It's actually relatively expensive given the market, pretty close to the price of pendant eeg, a neurofeedback hardware. Though that doesn't cover the software. It does have a lot of sessions though. How long have you been using it btw?

Three to four years. Nova Pro 100 has been their flagship products for quite a few years now & its surprising there hasn't been some overhaul or miniaturization of the technology. The software available for the NP100 allows download of new programs. Very happy to see that neurofeedback hardware has decreased so dramatically in price; I originally investigated it around the time I purchased the NP100 & the hardware, iirc, averaged 3-5k. I'm mulling over the purchase of HeartMath's emWave PC at the moment.

I'm not aware of any specific protocols to write the programs, but haven't been involved in creation of the programs, just utilization. What a good source to learn about these?

Edited by castrensis, 24 September 2009 - 12:48 AM.

[Declmem]

I found the user manual for the device. I think using it, it would be possible to reconstruct some of the sessions using Neuroprogrammer. Though many of them don't mention the exact protocols used. It's actually relatively expensive given the market, pretty close to the price of pendant eeg, a neurofeedback hardware. Though that doesn't cover the software. It does have a lot of sessions though. How long have you been using it btw?

Three to four years. Nova Pro 100 has been their flagship products for quite a few years now & its surprising there hasn't been some overhaul or miniaturization of the technology. The software available for the NP100 allows download of new programs. Very happy to see that neurofeedback hardware has decreased so dramatically in price; I originally investigated it around the time I purchased the NP100 & the hardware, iirc, averaged 3-5k. I'm mulling over the purchase of HeartMath's emWave PC at the moment.

HeartMath is pretty cool. Some would argue its not real HRV "entrainment" unless there is a respiration strap involved. But its interesting software.

If you're looking for relaxation biofeedback though, nothing beats GSR, also called EDR or SCR: http://en.wikipedia....c_skin_response

Personally, I like the Wild Divine system more (now called IOM I believe). It does both HRV and GSR. But, it doesn't come with great software like the HeartMath does, so its kind of a trade off. You can get pretty decent third party software for it, but that adds to the price.

The ThoughtStream, BioScan or GSR2 are all also decent for this GSR use, though their technology is really ancient. If I had to pick one to use away from the computer, it would be the GSR2. You can get software for all of these, but they aren't going to be that great. The BioScan/GSR2 use analog output, so software isn't going to be accurate with it.

If you're not looking for relaxation biofeedback, but real HRV, then you could spring for the ProComp2. Its expensive as hell, but does EVERYTHING. And it uses fiber optics which is just cool

I use all these devices frequently so thought I would add my 2 cents

Edited by Declmem, 24 September 2009 - 12:51 AM.

[castrensis]

HeartMath is pretty cool. Some would argue its not real HRV "entrainment" unless there is a respiration strap involved. But its interesting software.

Personally, I like the Wild Divine system more (now called IOM I believe). It does both HRV and GSR. But, it doesn't come with great software like the HeartMath does, so its kind of a trade off. You can get pretty decent third party software for it, but that adds to the price.

The ThoughtStream, BioScan or GSR2 are all also decent for this GSR use, though their technology is really ancient. If I had to pick one to use away from the computer, it would be the GSR2. You can get software for all of these, but they aren't going to be that great. The BioScan/GSR2 use analog output, so software isn't going to be accurate with it.

I've looked at the Wild Divine system on Amazon before but its new-agey marketing & Deepak Chopra's prominent recommendation turned me off from it. I'll have to give it another look, though.

I have the GSR2 but the software is garbage & won't work properly on my XP box & is entirely incompatible with my Vista64 system. I've used it for hand-warming exercises but I can't seem to hear the tone properly with or without headphones & for some reason staring at the floating needle isn't conducive to conditioning. Plus, with my fingers directly on the device or with the finger straps the GSR varies with the slightest movement. Any tips or tricks you can share?

[Declmem]

I've looked at the Wild Divine system on Amazon before but its new-agey marketing & Deepak Chopra's prominent recommendation turned me off from it. I'll have to give it another look, though.

Yeah, I hate that f*cker. I know exactly what you mean. The software is so laden with Chopra's nonsense it is almost unusable. It does has some cool games I guess. The latest version "Healing Rhythms" is significantly better than the original at least. But still filled with hippy nonsense.

Still, I swear the hardware is the best out there for the price. If you ignore Chopra and dump the software that comes with it, it is undeniably the best unit on the market. The updated IOM is even up to clinical standards of accuracy.

I have the GSR2 but the software is garbage & won't work properly on my XP box & is entirely incompatible with my Vista64 system. I've used it for hand-warming exercises but I can't seem to hear the tone properly with or without headphones & for some reason staring at the floating needle isn't conducive to conditioning. Plus, with my fingers directly on the device or with the finger straps the GSR varies with the slightest movement. Any tips or tricks you can share?

All biofeedback is like that really, even HRV. If you press you finger on the sensor hard it will interfere with the signal. It's just an artifact you have to deal with.

The software for the GSR2 is absolute garbage as you said. Don't bother with it. What I do, is I just use the earplugs that come with it, lay down on my bed, and slowly move the dial as I relax. Its very simple but effective.

Tip: don't put the earplugs right in your ears. The analog signal it emits is so loud and shrill it will ruin the experience. Just wrap the plugs around your neck or put them on your chest.

As you know, the lower the pitch gets, the more relaxed you are. Adjust the dial as you relax. Try to get to setting 9. If you get there, you're a meditation master!

Good luck

Edited by Declmem, 24 September 2009 - 01:05 AM.