mitoQ
#31
Posted 05 January 2014 - 05:55 AM
#32
Posted 28 February 2014 - 01:55 AM
" Skulachev, who had pioneered the early work on the right-hand part of the molecule, picked up this thread early on, and has sponsored much of the research that has demonstrated the rejuvinating potential of the molecule. The molecular tugboat is known as a “Skulachev ion”, and the same molecule that is known as MitoQ in the English-speaking world is called SkQ in Russia."
http://hplusmagazine...targeted-coq10/
Edited by Kevnzworld, 28 February 2014 - 02:09 AM.
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#33
Posted 28 February 2014 - 02:34 AM
I've been reading more about MitoQ and have decided decided to add this to my regimen now that it's available, while reducing my C60oo to 15 mg per month. I had been reading about SKQ for years and I was surprised to find out its the same thing . I'm hoping that there is some synergism. There are more human studies with mitoQ, and the pool of knowledge somewhat larger regarding toxicity, side effects and effectiveness.
" Skulachev, who had pioneered the early work on the right-hand part of the molecule, picked up this thread early on, and has sponsored much of the research that has demonstrated the rejuvinating potential of the molecule. The molecular tugboat is known as a "Skulachev ion", and the same molecule that is known as MitoQ in the English-speaking world is called SkQ in Russia."
http://hplusmagazine...targeted-coq10/
H+ didn't get that quite right- MitoQ and SkQ1 are similar, but not the same molecule. There have been more publications about these mitochondrial antioxidants than c60-oo, but I'll bet c60-oo has been in more humans. MitoQ hasn't been widely available until recently, and as far as I can tell, there isn't much of a market for it. On the other hand, c60-oo has been in multiple thousands of humans, but the only paper I'm aware of is Baati.
Would there be synergism? Hard to say. I can see commonalities between MitoQ, SkQ1, and c60-oo. I don't see an obvious route to synergy, but you never know. Post your results.
#34
Posted 28 February 2014 - 02:43 AM
#35
Posted 26 March 2014 - 02:10 PM
#36
Posted 26 March 2014 - 05:11 PM
I still take 200 mg of ubiquinone, and from reading the following, that's a good idea. This is a reply to Josh Mitteldorfs blog
from Vladamir Skulachev..( the originator of the MitoQ mechanism and SKQ )
" (1) MitoQ cannot be regarded as a mitochondria-targeted form CoQ or CoQ precursor since it cannot replace CoQ in its master function, i.e. as a respiratory chain electron carrier. MitoQ can be reduced to MitoQH2 by the initial respiratory chain complexes I and II but MitoQH2 is very slowly oxidized by the next respiratory chain complex III. Moreover, MitoQ cannot be decomposed in a way resulting in CoQ release. This is why MitoQ can hardly help when CoQ level is lowered by aging or statin. As to another function of CoQ as an antioxidant, MitoQ is not the best one since the window between anti- and prooxidant concentrations of MitoQ is as small as several times. For SkQ (a MitoQ analog with plastoquinone instead of CoQ), this window is much larger (30 or even 1 000 times, depending on the method of measurement of this parameter). This is why plants use plastoquinone in chloroplasts (the O2-producing organelles) and CoQ in mitochondria (the O2-consuming organelles where the O2 level and hence, the oxidative stress, is always much lower than in chloroplasts).
Vladamir Skulachev "
http://joshmitteldor...targeted-coq10/
Edited by Kevnzworld, 26 March 2014 - 05:12 PM.
#37
Posted 28 March 2014 - 03:12 AM
#38
Posted 28 March 2014 - 04:14 AM
Is anyone taking MitoQ? And have you noticed anything?
I should be getting my 1gram soon and then I'll report back. Also still looking into sourcing SkQ1.
#39
Posted 28 March 2014 - 05:11 AM
#41
Posted 29 March 2014 - 10:03 AM
I received my 1 gram today.
Who made it?
#42
Posted 29 March 2014 - 10:11 AM
#43
Posted 29 March 2014 - 12:29 PM
I received my 1 gram today. Looks like a lot more than a gram. Anyone know what this stuff is supposed to look like?
Ubiquinone is yellow. The rest of the molecule is probably colorless- at least triphenylphosphine and decane are, on their own. The cosmetic version of MitoQ is described as light yellow. How big is that bag? If it's a sandwich bag, then you got a hell of a deal! I'm guessing it's smaller... I wouldn't expect that molecule to be very dense. Do you have a milligram scale? If you have more than you want to use orally, you could always put it in a skin cream.
#44
Posted 29 March 2014 - 02:01 PM
#45
Posted 29 March 2014 - 10:36 PM
Wow, this is a really nice result. They got a very nice knock-down of disease in a rodent model. Inflammatory bowel disease (IBD, not IBS, which is a much milder condition) is a pretty horrible condition and the current treatment is tons of corticosteroids that have a lot of nasty side effects of their own. An exciting aspect of this is that rather than waiting a decade for MitoQ to become available, you could just take C60 instead, which would probably work better anyway.
Some researchers think that IBD is due to insufficient production of antimicrobial peptides (AMPs). Normally, mucous layer is soaked with AMPs which kill bacteria on contact. This creates a barrier that prevents microorganisms from getting access to the host intestinal epithelium. Broken or insufficient barrier results in inflammation.
Now, ubiquinone (or CoQ10 on which MitoQ is based) was shown "essential for normal induction of anti-microbial peptides". http://www.ncbi.nlm....pubmed/21518260
So it's doubtful that C60-oo would work on IBD quite the same, unless it too induces AMPs production -?
I wonder what gwgaston's experience was with both substances.
#46
Posted 30 March 2014 - 02:09 AM
Some researchers think that IBD is due to insufficient production of antimicrobial peptides (AMPs). Normally, mucous layer is soaked with AMPs which kill bacteria on contact. This creates a barrier that prevents microorganisms from getting access to the host intestinal epithelium. Broken or insufficient barrier results in inflammation.
Now, ubiquinone (or CoQ10 on which MitoQ is based) was shown "essential for normal induction of anti-microbial peptides". http://www.ncbi.nlm....pubmed/21518260
So it's doubtful that C60-oo would work on IBD quite the same, unless it too induces AMPs production -?
I wonder what gwgaston's experience was with both substances.
That was in flies, probably in mutants that were defective in CoQ production. I really don't think that MitoQ is related to AMP production. Once you hook a big hydrophobic cation on the molecule, its character is rather profoundly changed. FWIW it's really more like Idebenone than ubiquinone, because the linker is decyl instead of isoprenyl. At any rate, the animals with the IBD model surely had normal levels of ordinary ubiquinone. The reason that I think c60-oo might work similarly is that I suspect it is a mitochondrial antioxidant, as is MitoQ.
It's pretty hard to say what gwgaston's results are due to, as there were multiple mitochondrial compounds involved. The improved performance in the gym and sense of well-being have been reported by users of more than one of those compounds individually.
#47
Posted 30 March 2014 - 04:42 AM
That was in flies, probably in mutants that were defective in CoQ production. I really don't think that MitoQ is related to AMP production. Once you hook a big hydrophobic cation on the molecule, its character is rather profoundly changed. FWIW it's really more like Idebenone than ubiquinone, because the linker is decyl instead of isoprenyl. At any rate, the animals with the IBD model surely had normal levels of ordinary ubiquinone. The reason that I think c60-oo might work similarly is that I suspect it is a mitochondrial antioxidant, as is MitoQ.
It's pretty hard to say what gwgaston's results are due to, as there were multiple mitochondrial compounds involved. The improved performance in the gym and sense of well-being have been reported by users of more than one of those compounds individually.
Re "That was in flies": AMPs are the the most ancient form of "immunity" shared by all eukaryotes, so whatever works for flies works for mammals too.
Of course I don't know how MitoQ, idebenone or ubiquinone are metabolized but it's the cation part that makes a peptide an AMP. ..and it's not uncommon for a compound to have multiple roles in metabolism, so it could be both mitochondrial antioxidant and essential for induction of AMPs
Re gwgaston, from his post I surmised that he had issues with IBS so I thought, if MitoQ helped it more than C60oo, that would be interesting.
#48
Posted 30 March 2014 - 11:08 AM
That was in flies, probably in mutants that were defective in CoQ production. I really don't think that MitoQ is related to AMP production. Once you hook a big hydrophobic cation on the molecule, its character is rather profoundly changed. FWIW it's really more like Idebenone than ubiquinone, because the linker is decyl instead of isoprenyl. At any rate, the animals with the IBD model surely had normal levels of ordinary ubiquinone. The reason that I think c60-oo might work similarly is that I suspect it is a mitochondrial antioxidant, as is MitoQ.
It's pretty hard to say what gwgaston's results are due to, as there were multiple mitochondrial compounds involved. The improved performance in the gym and sense of well-being have been reported by users of more than one of those compounds individually.
Re "That was in flies": AMPs are the the most ancient form of "immunity" shared by all eukaryotes, so whatever works for flies works for mammals too.
Of course I don't know how MitoQ, idebenone or ubiquinone are metabolized but it's the cation part that makes a peptide an AMP. ..and it's not uncommon for a compound to have multiple roles in metabolism, so it could be both mitochondrial antioxidant and essential for induction of AMPs
Re gwgaston, from his post I surmised that he had issues with IBS so I thought, if MitoQ helped it more than C60oo, that would be interesting.
If it was the case in normal flies, that would be a data point, but the abstract mentioned coq2 mutants. I don't have the full text, though. There are just so many 'ifs' in this AMP idea- ubiquinone is purportedly required for AMP induction, but MitoQ isn't ubiquinone, and we already have actual ubiquinone in our membranes. The mouse IBD result was a disease model that may or may not represent human IBD. gwgaston didn't have IBD, he had IBS (as have I, in the past) and had already gotten rid of it before starting any of these compounds (see post #23). IBD and IBS are entirely different diseases with very different mechanisms- they really don't have much in common.
#49
Posted 01 April 2014 - 12:48 AM
Well I've been gradually ramping up the dose I take. Started on Sat with what was probably around 2mg or less. On Sunday probably took somewhere between 10 and 30mg and gave a fairly large dose to a dog to check for safety. Last night (Monday) I took somewhere between 50 and 80mg. BAM!!!!! I suddenly realise that I felt very relaxed and calm with an overall good feeling, not quite euphoria but more a sense of contentment and warmth. I took a bit more just before bed and some this morning and have experienced a sense of calm contentment but at a much lower level ever since. I feel better in myself, less tired, more clear headed and more in control. My social skills seem to have gone up a notch too but that could just be coincidence.
So far, I'm loving this stuff but the taste is aweful!! I'll keep updating here as I get more experience with this stuff.
#50
Posted 01 April 2014 - 02:16 AM
Well I've been gradually ramping up the dose I take. Started on Sat with what was probably around 2mg or less. On Sunday probably took somewhere between 10 and 30mg and gave a fairly large dose to a dog to check for safety. Last night (Monday) I took somewhere between 50 and 80mg. BAM!!!!! I suddenly realise that I felt very relaxed and calm with an overall good feeling, not quite euphoria but more a sense of contentment and warmth. I took a bit more just before bed and some this morning and have experienced a sense of calm contentment but at a much lower level ever since. I feel better in myself, less tired, more clear headed and more in control. My social skills seem to have gone up a notch too but that could just be coincidence.
Good to hear that it's doing something. Or at least that it feels good. I don't really know how to interpret it mechanistically, though. Some things to watch for would be effects on performance in the gym and impact on your response to alcohol. Keep us posted.
#51
Posted 02 April 2014 - 12:14 AM
I decided that it may be a good idea to try sublingual to get as much out of a limited supply as possible. I opened a cap and poured the contents under my tongue. After a while, it dissolved. I started to notice that my mouth/jaw was aching, kinda like I had a major head cold. It was quite intense and certainly something I would like to avoid.
This aching persisted but I decided that I wanted to try some more of the MitoQ I recently acquired so I popped some of that under my tongue. In a couple of minutes, I found that teh aching subsided and eventually disappeared. I didn't link the two at first.
Later I decided to take 3 more Niagen caps sublingually. I tipped all 3 under my tongue and aching came back very strongly. It was very unpleasant. Once it finally dissolved, I decided to take more of the MitoQ because I was now suspecting that this may have helped the first time. It helped again and was a big relief because I don't think I could continue to take Niagen sublingually without this relief.
I am not sure why Niagen causes such pain and discomfort. Perhaps the molecule is very big or maybe it reacts with the nerves or something like that. I also don’t understand why the MitoQ reverses this, could it be the stuff it is buffered with?
I would be very interested to find out more, what are others experiences?
#52
Posted 02 April 2014 - 12:21 AM
#53
Posted 02 April 2014 - 12:52 AM
I've been taking Niagen (2 caps q AM) for months. Never noticed any effects, but I haven't tried higher doses yet.
Have you tried it sublingual? I am keen to know if I'm the only one who experiences pain/aching. What dose are you taking? How old and fit are you? I think like most things, it will be more noticable in people who are not in optimal health and are a bit older.
#54
Posted 02 April 2014 - 12:56 AM
Edited by tintinet, 02 April 2014 - 12:58 AM.
#55
Posted 02 April 2014 - 01:19 AM
#56
Posted 02 April 2014 - 02:34 AM
#57
Posted 03 April 2014 - 01:28 AM
Edited by tintinet, 03 April 2014 - 01:28 AM.
#58
Posted 07 May 2014 - 02:29 AM
Hi All, I am the CEO of MitoQ. I found your thread and thought I would check in to see if there are any specific questions you might have. I have applied for a sponsored thread and will start the conversation there once it is activated.
<br>
We had some interesting research published this week. I am unable to post links so please Google "Novel antioxidant makes old arteries seem young again, CU-Boulder study finds" - if of interest.
<br>
It is great to see interest in our compound here. We are getting some good feedback from people taking MitoQ, especially those with some specific neurodegenerative conditions.
<br>
As mentioned above, happy to answer any specific questions.
<br>
Best regards, Greg
#59
Posted 07 May 2014 - 05:14 AM
Here it is:
http://www.scienceda...40506094940.htm
but Im curious is 10mg enough to do anything for humans?
Edited by mrwhitee, 07 May 2014 - 05:17 AM.
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#60
Posted 07 May 2014 - 07:30 AM
Hi, yes, 10mg will have an effect.
It just depends on your goals. 10mg will give extra energy, correct oxidative stress imbalances and improve mitochondrial function.
20mg can be used for those looking to accelerate the above or if someone has a condition associated with oxidative stress (diabetes, MS etc) and is looking to support the condition.
I take 20mg and it is plenty (44yo male with an autoimmune condition).
Doses above this may deliver further benefit but with diminishing returns vs cost.
FYI some folk see benefit with just 5mg.
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