77 replies to this topic

[racetam_junkie]

I cant send private message to him, looks like profile is deleted.
My expierience with piracetam was exactly the same as his (god-like feeling), but now im having serious problems.

[chrono]

Yeah, he was having some serious problems too. Isochroma requested to have his profile deleted after a lot of inappropriate behavior and theatrics. And if you can't tell from his posts, he wasn't the best person to ask a serious question of.

If you achieved apotheosis through megadosing of piracetam, I would stop. Just because it has a great safety profile doesn't mean it can't throw your neurotransmitters out of wack.

Asking a question of the members here would be more helpful for you.

[Rational Madman]

Yeah, he was having some serious problems too. Isochroma requested to have his profile deleted after a lot of inappropriate behavior and theatrics. And if you can't tell from his posts, he wasn't the best person to ask a serious question of.

If you achieved apotheosis through megadosing of piracetam, I would stop. Just because it has a great safety profile doesn't mean it can't throw your neurotransmitters out of wack.

Asking a question of the members here would be more helpful for you.

If you are suffering from problems stemming from mega-dosing, it would be wiser to slowly wean off rather than ceasing use. While apparently safe, long term studies of use are lacking, so less is perhaps better.

[chrono]

it would be wiser to slowly wean off rather than ceasing use.

Yes, probably true. Though piracetam has a very short half-life, and doesn't behave like most substances with regard to tolerance.

Again, racetam_junkie (god, I didn't even notice your name before): more details about your usage and problems would be helpful.

[racetam_junkie]

I am not mega-dosing piracetam. My effective dose was about 1200g at morning and 800g afternoon.
I will continue posting on my other thread http://www.imminst.o...showtopic=37619

[spider]

I cant send private message to him, looks like profile is deleted.
My expierience with piracetam was exactly the same as his (god-like feeling), but now im having serious problems.

I remember now. Iso was that guy that took about 1 kg piracetam per month. Man, he was always carrying a bottle of piracetam powder with him. Eating the raw stuff while he was having conversations with people.
According to his experience-reports, it made him lightning fast. Other people around him seemed to be getting slower. Even computers were not efficient enough to keep up with him. He almost tossed his computer out of the window because it was to slow. lol

He was being accused of being manic and ridiculous by several forum members. Therefore he asked the moderators to delete his account.

Edited by spider, 12 April 2010 - 11:57 AM.

[Animal]

He was manic, god-like grandiosity delusions are a classical symptom of an episode. He didn't just 'request' to have his profile deleted, he threatened the moderators with his god-like hacking abilities if they did not comply.

Edited by Animal, 12 April 2010 - 05:49 PM.

[Yearningforyears]

LOL
that´s SO bipolar!

Guess you know what this means: Piracetam and bipolar = bad idea (I too became hypomanic when using it together with some other stuff. crazy times!)

[k10]

I have isochroma's facebook name if you want to contact him on facebook. Message me if interested.

I was so fascinated by his antics that I googled "isochroma piracetam" and he was posting in like 10 other forums the same nonsense back in October of 2009 when he was going through his manic period. Then on bluelight he threatened the mods that he'll spam the entire site up if they don't delete his account and was swearing in his posts -- must have been when he 'crashed'. Isochroma definitely sounded like a piracetam addict... his talking and behavior is something a meth or cocaine addict would sound like during a high.

Insane... but fascinating.

Edited by k10, 19 April 2010 - 05:47 AM.

[Viscid]

I have isochroma's facebook name if you want to contact him on facebook. Message me if interested.

I was so fascinated by his antics that I googled "isochroma piracetam" and he was posting in like 10 other forums the same nonsense back in October of 2009 when he was going through his manic period. Then on bluelight he threatened the mods that he'll spam the entire site up if they don't delete his account and was swearing in his posts -- must have been when he 'crashed'. Isochroma definitely sounded like a piracetam addict... his talking and behavior is something a meth or cocaine addict would sound like during a high.

Insane... but fascinating.

One of the best Internet forum characters ever.

[Animal]

I have to admit, regardless of his asinine behaviour and grandiosity delusions, he was quite an entertaining character. What with him believing he was becoming God and superhuman, and that he now saw the rest of the world and the people in it, in a matrix sort of bullet time.

[tjcbs]

I REALLY want to know how he is doing now.

[tjcbs]

Type 'isochroma' into google and 'piracetam' comes up as a suggestion.

[k10]

http://www.bluelight....php?t=482526#4

lolol

[k10]

The Ramblings of a Piracetam Addict:

The day before yesterday I ran out of piracetam - first time in about a year. So yesterday & all of today before 3:45p I got to understand the washout.

Yesterday without was fine, but less dreams at night. The night before last I slept about the same but didn't wake up so refreshed. Not groggy per se. but just slow-minded. It took me about 15% longer than usual to do the daily wakeup chores.

Last night I looked at the orange sodium streetlights. They're my gauge for saturation and luminance dynamic range at night. They were duller, less colourful. Their edges weren't razor sharp anymore - instead, a bit blurry. I had few significant thoughts, and went to bed. Sleep came quicker but without the splendid dreams.

Fish oil can't do much alone - even combined with the other boatload of supplements I take. Everything combined is only at most five percent of my brain function - the other 95% is piracetam.

Waking up this morning, brain was really slow. Totally unlike the last year. Took 60% longer to complete morning chores. Through the day, even though vision was still relatively sharp - I had the sense of forgetting something. The quick fear that comes, the scramble through stuff in my backpack, making sure that the critical item in question is still there. That I didn't forget it. Because I couldn't remember if I'd forgotten it or not.

That absolutely never happened in the last year. Even two days of washout and the old problems start coming back, like weeds cracking through old concrete. Today I noticed a tiredness and inability to fully concentrate, to be fully awake, a small sample of the terrible state I was in for many years prior to starting piracetam.

Lurking behind the splendid, shiny and bright surface is a weak substructure. With good propping and lubrication it can work like a dream machine. But without it quickly regresses into dilapidation. How is it possible to understand one state while living in another? State-dependent memory is a horror on both sides of its fence.

I understand these things in a technical sense, but the heart is another matter. To be dependent on this magic molecule to keep myself functional as a normal person would be - somewhat better - but without it, to retreat into darkness again. Because I can't make it, it must be imported.

The mail and shipping are an extended intravenous line, roughly speaking. The fear of losing myself due to loss of piracetam supply, is something I may never come to terms with psychologically. It is truly my hidden prosthetic. Just like a person with a lost limb who couldn't walk, but gets a new leg that's even better than a regular person's. But it needs constant maintenance. Without that it becomes a useless deadweight.

Thus, I am a drug addict. But far worse than the kind that gets a fix from heroin or cocaine. Those people can clean up and will get healthier. In my case, I will lose what function I've got without a constant supply. There is no cure, just perpetual mitigation.

I realized months ago... maybe even within days after first starting, or maybe during that two-week period last year when the supply ran out - that I would be taking this material until the day I die or the supply runs out.

When I think of the commitment that entails, like when I was in hospital last year and had to walk around with an IV pump stand. Being connected to something external to survive. Even more of a commitment than marriage, because those come and go.

To live a normal life makes me so very happy. To have found out how to do it myself was great too. But by doing so I cannot ever go back now. It was like walking through a one-way door. When I think of the future it's so scary because of not being able to guarantee a supply, yet it's also so wonderful because while I have access, I can be normal. It's easy to remember everything, there is no fog, I can think and even learn new things, which I had stopped being able to do before.

But all of those gains will evaporate like dew on a hot summer day if the supply stops. Last year's two-month interruption and the last two days reaffirmed that. So piracetam liberated me to live normally, but as part of the deal it trapped me too. When I think of it tears come to my eyes, yet are they tears of joy or tears of sadness, or both? They are both, because for me it is the freedom from a prison worse than death, yet it is a new prison that I will be confined in for life - one which I will pay for in money each month, and each three hours with that bitter taste. One or the other, but at least I can choose - for now.

It seems most people take it for the extra edge or enhancement. I get these things too, except that if I stop I return to a state that is far, far under what could be considered 'normal'. A normal person would fall back to the ground from that state, but for me there lies a chasm in wait. Inside that chasm I could never believe escape was possible, and today outside that chasm I can't believe that it exists because I can't remember it as a state, at least not clearly. It is an abstract concept in my mind, totally unlike the way I remember a smell, or a colour, or a taste, or the sound of a person's voice. It's exactly like a dream, especially one remembered weeks or months later. Details come but the real implications, the real feeling of the state, can't be recaptured except by reliving the state itself once again.

Yet if I stop taking piracetam, then like a shadowy mouth it slowly begins to swallow my life once again. The bitterness of piracetam is absolutely nothing, let me tell you, compared to the chasm. I would swallow a powder thousands of times worse-tasting to stay above that darkness. That place was a hell that was almost finished eating my life away, but I left it behind - temporarily. Piracetam's like an anti-gravity device. It doesn't provide thrust but it does provide static repulsion, keeping me hovering easily hundreds of feet above the chasm's gaping maw. It's so easy to feel superior - even elevated - in that state. But the supply disruptions taught me that such elevated thoughts are a fool's. I will be dependent on piracetam for the rest of my life - just like a diabetic needs his insulin. And just like a diabetic, as I get older the difference between piracetam and none will get wider - making the regularity of supply ever more crucial.

So that's about all I have to say for now. I do envy people who use it just for enhancement. They probably won't ever understand what it is to me, but I'm glad because that means they also won't have to ever suffer the badness of such a state.

In my head a perpetual clock ticks. It counts every group of three hours, and thanks to the piracetam itself I can remember with uncanny ability to take the next dose on time or very close to on time. Every three waking hours, forever. Just like prisoners count the bars on their cell, I count the hours between doses. It's a life sentence, with me as the judge, jury, warden and prisoner all wrapped into one.

I am proud that in the last month my brain has improved to a state that I can remember the exact minute of the hour that the previous dose was taken on. Yet it is sickening to think how nicely precise and quantized the process is. There is an ugly compulsiveness to that precise repetition. Far worse too than the cravings of a heroin addict, since the dosing is always inside the limits of saturation, thereby making dosing a totally voluntary affair within a fairly large time period.

Rather than being driven by craving like the street-drug addict, a person like me is driven by this totally voluntary process. It sounds nice that it's voluntary and without immediate withdrawal effects, but it is really far worse precisely because of those things. It's so very hard to explain, but by being totally voluntary and totally needed to live normally, it is made the most perfect horror of them all. Perhaps if it was the sweet oxiracetam, it wouldn't be such a problem. Or maybe that sweetness would turn sickening in time. Like killing a few trees to save a forest, the constant regular dosing, the careful counting of hours and minutes - maybe seconds soon, if things keep improving - is itself like some kind of rot inside my brain. A real Faustian bargain.

Diabetics must feel this way - except they have to use needles. I hate needles, but if I had to... if piracetam wouldn't absorb otherwise... I would. Needles - like the often illegal drugs they serve to inject - are the same kind of love-hate relation, except one that is visually obvious to others and the Self. In contrast, taking a powder by mouth leaves no trace except for the transient bitterness.

It is silent absolution - silent love, and also the most perfect razor which leaves neither scar nor bloodstain upon the wrist of its user. That is its horror.

It is beautiful and I love it almost more than life itself. It is awful, and I hate it almost more than death itself.

This post has been edited by Isochroma: Dec 22 2009

Edited by k10, 19 April 2010 - 05:38 PM.

[Animal]

http://www.bluelight....php?t=482526#4

lolol

LOL, extremely similar behaviour was exhibited on this forum, including the puerile impotent threats. As long as you don't take him seriously he really is quite amusing, and obviously in the grip of a potent mania when making some of his more delusional posts, God grandiosity delusions are not exhibited in hypomania. He appears to cycle between the two states however, with the majority of his time spent in a hypomanic state.

[acantelopepope]

Isochroma is actually the Lorax. You scared him away.

[tjcbs]

What a great post. Junkies? A bunch of crybabies. He is truly hardcore, a PIRACETAM addict.

Someone needs to call him a waaaambulance.

[Runner]

What a loon. Typical hypomania.

[Rational Madman]

Maybe its just me, but I'm having difficulty finding humor in another individual's suffering. And, since it wouldn't be inconceivable for Isochroma to wander back into this forum and discover these disparaging posts, perhaps we should end this discussion. His tale is a tragic tale, and deserving of our utmost sympathy.

Edited by Rol82, 26 April 2010 - 12:47 PM.

[chrono]

^^ this discussion will never end if people keep bumping this thread every week.

I understated the situation in my first post because I was hoping the thread wouldn't turn into yet another showing of the Isochroma Piracetam Mania Theater. If anything, I'm sure Isochroma is loving all of this. All of the drama was not accidental. Personally, I think the posts (over the course of months) are so full of florid language and metaphor that he was having a good time with how seriously everyone was (and is) taking it all. To a certain extent, at least.

I think "tragedy" might be going a little overboard. Anyone who thinks that loving the functional improvement of piracetam is worse than heroin addiction is applying both self-delusion and self-pity pretty liberally.

And trying to make sure someone isn't offended after they've physically threatened members is taking empathy a little too far, IMHO.

Edited by chrono, 26 April 2010 - 04:30 AM.

[Rational Madman]

^^ this discussion will never end if people keep bumping this thread every week.

I understated the situation in my first post because I was hoping the thread wouldn't turn into yet another showing of the Isochroma Piracetam Mania Theater. If anything, I'm sure Isochroma is loving all of this. All of the drama was not accidental. Personally, I think the posts (over the course of months) are so full of florid language and metaphor that he was having a good time with how seriously everyone was (and is) taking it all. To a certain extent, at least.

I think "tragedy" might be going a little overboard. Anyone who thinks that loving the functional improvement of piracetam is worse than heroin addiction is applying both self-delusion and self-pity pretty liberally.

And trying to make sure someone isn't offended after they've physically threatened members is taking empathy a little too far, IMHO.

Besides exhibiting palpable symptoms of a rapid cycling mood disorder, he is suffering from two autoimmune disorders, which in concert, created a debilitating case of cognitive dysfunction. To add to this, he is unemployed, and because of his socioeconomic status, dependent on the charity of the state. If he were here to defend himself, I'm sure he could add a few more depressing details. But, with these biographical details alone, I think the criteria for the definition of tragedy should be satisfied.

Because of his past behavior, I think many members are rightfully upset, and feel that he should be held accountable for his actions. But, because of the effects that glutamergic dysfunction has on decision making, I think he should be given a pass.

As for the death threat against the former owner of Bulk Nutrition, I think it should have been evident to every discussion participant that Isochroma's threat was not serious, and likely due to the combination of acute stress and hypomania. At the same time, its striking how this aforementioned owner continues to exaggerate the threat that Isochroma posed to his enterprise and safety. Not to mention his suspicious dismissal of critics as agents of competitors.

From what I've gathered, a number of troubled individuals have gravitated to this forum for some solace from problems that range from mild to pervasive. Again, each of these individuals is deserving of our sympathy---even when they excel at alienating those with good intentions and helpful advice. Although instances of disdain for such individuals remain isolated deviations from the norm, I think we could afford to be more empathetic, or at the very least, hold our tongues. Otherwise, our community will remain insular and ineffectual. With that being said, I think we should let this thread of discussion die.

Edited by Rol82, 26 April 2010 - 06:52 AM.

[haha]

seeing that the post is still active, I would like to say that regardless of his character that 'ramblings of a piracetam addict' is the best piece of writing I have read on this forum, A beuatiful eulogy.

[chrono]

Indeed. He certainly doesn't write like someone with "debilitating" cognitive impairment. He seems to be precisely aware of what ideas he's conveying. And all these comments were being made while he was writing here; he was perfectly aware of how his ideas were being received, as well.

I don't know in what way he could be "held accountable." The only reason he's gone in the first place is that he made it literally impossible for the administration not to delete his account. It's all very well to dismiss threats against other people, but I think it's clear that Mike let it slide pretty gracefully, with only a few comments at the time.

I think giving him a "pass" based on a diagnosis of his neurochemistry is a pretty reductionist, and does him a disservice more than anyone. If he wants to explain the way he acted toward some people, then I think extending him every understanding would be wonderful, and I would argue for it vehemently. Though admirably well-meaning, this apology coming from you doesn't carry quite as much weight. And his actions (esp. threats) do require both explanation and apology, whether they were caused by neurotransmitter imbalances or factors more inside his control.

Don't get me wrong, I don't agree with making fun of any of this either. Guess I'm just playing devil's advocate as much as you are.

Edited by chrono, 26 April 2010 - 08:25 AM.

[Animal]

Yeah maybe no-one should ever take responsibility for their actions since obviously they are at the mercy of their neurochemistry! What self-righteous bullshit, Isochroma deserves everything he gets, and using his unemployment as evidence of why he should be pitied? LoL, he spent ridiculous amounts of money on stockpiling piracetam, he was hardly struggling to get by. I'm sure all his so called ailments were purely self-diagnosed, he seemed like one of those arrogant, self-edifying armchair experts who decides they know exactly what they are suffering from, regardless of what any professional says.

Unless we accept people like him "our community will remain insular and ineffectual"? Absurd, ostracising individuals like him is healthy for our community, since he creates the opposite impression to the naive that we are trying to cultivate here.

[pinnacle]

^ Agreed, I can't really see the amusing side to this. However I do find it very fascinating!

Could this be an example of what happens if you take an ungodly amount of Piracetam? Or more importantly, if you have an underlying condition which may be exacerbated by Piracetam use?

I've found data on any possible ill-effects from long term use to be non-existent. Its interesting with the use of 'racetam; more than once now I've heard of individuals tending towards some kind of ultimate power state of mind. A 'pretty soon I'll be able to take over the world' type of trait.

[chrono]

I think that's a strong possibility. "Nootropic" doesn't necessarily mean it won't screw up your neurotransmitter levels if you take 10-20x what most people dose, over a long period. And this would probably be exacerbated by, or exacerbate, certain existing conditions.

[Lallante]

nah, all the best humour is related to the suffering of others.

[Animal]

I think that's a strong possibility. "Nootropic" doesn't necessarily mean it won't screw up your neurotransmitter levels if you take 10-20x what most people dose, over a long period. And this would probably be exacerbated by, or exacerbate, certain existing conditions.

I would expect a bipolar II temperamental tendency is indicated in the individuals who are sent manic by Piracetam. Although everyone is capable of having a manic episode if they are given the right quantities and ratio's of catecholaminergic drugs.

[Rational Madman]

Indeed. He certainly doesn't write like someone with "debilitating" cognitive impairment. He seems to be precisely aware of what ideas he's conveying. And all these comments were being made while he was writing here; he was perfectly aware of how his ideas were being received, as well.

I don't know in what way he could be "held accountable." The only reason he's gone in the first place is that he made it literally impossible for the administration not to delete his account. It's all very well to dismiss threats against other people, but I think it's clear that Mike let it slide pretty gracefully, with only a few comments at the time.

I think giving him a "pass" based on a diagnosis of his neurochemistry is a pretty reductionist, and does him a disservice more than anyone. If he wants to explain the way he acted toward some people, then I think extending him every understanding would be wonderful, and I would argue for it vehemently. Though admirably well-meaning, this apology coming from you doesn't carry quite as much weight. And his actions (esp. threats) do require both explanation and apology, whether they were caused by neurotransmitter imbalances or factors more inside his control.

Don't get me wrong, I don't agree with making fun of any of this either. Guess I'm just playing devil's advocate as much as you are.

Although cognitive dysfunction might not be apparent to those on this messageboard, it may nonetheless be present and pervasive---varying in acuity and being masked by drugs, supplements, and the advantages that individuals enjoy through this mode of communication. Indeed, while communicating in cyberspace, we have the luxury of being able to carefully craft our messages over times of our choosing, and although these messages may sometimes appear cogent and of a high quality, that doesn't mean that the composition of such messages is without significant labor, or that the presence of cognitive dysfunction is anything less than debilitating, or at least, deeply dispiriting. Having witnessed his erraticism, belligerence, and intransigence, I can understand the frustration of bewildered and angered observers. However, it would not be improbable---nor unprecedented---for hypomania to impair the decision making of those suffering from mood disorders. Indeed, diminished reasoning is one of the criterions for hypomania. In such elated states, rationality becomes bounded, and divorced from less polarized states where the subject's capacity for reasoning is closer to the norm. It might be comforting to believe that the mentally ill are able to exercise complete control over their actions, but a substantial amount of literature states otherwise. And, because the presence of a severe mood disorder appears to be a certainty, I'm inclined to hold him to a completely different standard. In the absence of these distinguishing features, contempt for his actions would be completely warranted.

Individuals such as Isochroma are held accountable through reputational damage, which Isochroma undoubtedly suffered, and likely prompted his departure. The wildly hypomanic side that manifested on occasion was probably deeply disturbing to him, and by compelling the deletion of his account, he likely deluded himself into thinking that the memory of his past actions would be less haunting. Unfortunately, he'll have to live with his actions, and the consequential reception. And, judging by the severity of his disorder, and details that he imparted to me, his case is likely to remain refractory.

Further, given his current socioeconomic status, and his residence in British Columbia, he would have been hard pressed to make a trip to Washington state---much less the state of Virginia. Given the evidence of his temperament, and signs of his dire situation---the absence of a telephone---there should have been no controversy over the seriousness of his impotent threats. Rather than cruelly mocking his state of mind, it would have been wiser and decent to calmly reason with him, or ignore his antics. Despite his rapidly fluctuating mood, he is not impervious to reason, and as evidenced by his ardent desire for self-improvement, receptive to reason. But, instead of pursuing this course of action, community members blew the situation way out of proportion, and unwittingly contributed to the exacerbation of his illness.

Based on credible anecdotes that I've read from several different forums, there is sufficient reason to question the integrity of supplement vendors---since they operate in an anarchic state of loose regulation. The proprietor in question capitalized on this instance to neutralize legitimate criticism by falsely portraying the unfortunate events that transpired, and emerged from this dispute hardly tarnished---although it doesn't seem that he was very much at fault for the seizure of the disputed shipment.

Like it or not, a mood disorder is deeply affecting, and antagonistic to everyday living. The features may be quite unsettling, but this affliction and the associated behavior is not always a conscious choice. Since we have the capacity to conduct ourselves decently and with tolerance, I believe we should endeavor to do so. I don't relish the idea of confronting others about their conduct, but in instances where I deem it to be appropriate, I will do so, because it needlessly perpetuates the suffering of members of this community. Many of which suffer from deep seeded problems---including some of whom took disturbing pleasure from sociopathically mocking Isochroma's illness.

Ultimately Isochroma will have to confront his demons, since positive progress is contingent on him doing so, but it is my sincere hope that he'll have the support of members of this board, since it's quite likely that he has alienated many friends and family members, and is residing on an island of desolation and loneliness. His problems, which are indisputably extensive, will require a colossal amount of fortitude to remedy. At the very least, we could be empathetic, and spare him this abuse. In such a climate, he would likely be much more forthcoming about his problems, and we would be spared these unpredictable outbursts.

Given the mission statement of the Immortality Institute, the forum that it sponsors is not ideal for rehabilitation, but there is no reason that we need to make it uninhabitable for the mentally ill, since mental illness constitutes a serious and under-appreciated obstacle to life extension.

Edited by Rol82, 27 April 2010 - 01:01 PM.