9 replies to this topic

[j03]

I was taking 5MG of lithium orotate, but just got a prescription for lithium carbonate. The prescription is for 300mg. I'm totally confused with the dosages.

I'm not taking it to treat anything. I'm taking it mostly for neuroprotection and for a slight mood boost. I want to keep it at the equivalent 5MG of orotate which worked good for me.

How much lithium carbonate would equal 5 MG of orotate?

[chrono]

19% of the lithium carbonate dose is elemental Li. So about 25mg would contain 5mg elemental.

See this post for an idea about dividing up the dose.

[rwac]

Thing is, they're not really equivalent.

5mg of elemental Lithium from Lithium Orotate is supposed to be more effective than 5mg of elemental lithium from Carbonate.
So titration might be a good idea.

[chrono]

Thing is, they're not really equivalent.

5mg of elemental Lithium from Lithium Orotate is supposed to be more effective than 5mg of elemental lithium from Carbonate.
So titration might be a good idea.

I looked through the orotate literature recently, and didn't see anything corroborating the notion that it's more bioavailable. This paper suggests that pk is the same in most respects, but it's quite old.

Titration might not be a bad idea, anyway, but any differences due to absorption/etc are likely to be so small that I doubt there's much reason for it.

[rwac]

Rat brain and serum lithium concentrations after acute injections of lithium carbonate and orotate

Rat brain and serum lithium concentrations after acute injections of lithium carbonate and orotate.

Kling MA, Manowitz P, Pollack IW.

Abstract

Eight hours after intraperitoneal injections of 1.0, 2.0, and 4.0m equiv Li kg-1, the serum and brain lithium concentrations of rats were significantly greater after lithium orotate than after lithium carbonate. While little serum lithium remained at 24 h after injection of 2.0 m equiv kg-1 lithium carbonate, two-thirds of the 2 h serum lithium concentration was present 24h after lithium orotate. Furthermore, the 24 h brain concentration of lithium after lithium orotate was approximately three times greater than that after lithium carbonate. These data suggest the possibility that lower doses of lithium orotate than lithium carbonate may achieve therapeutic brain lithium concentrations and relatively stable serum concentrations

Edited by rwac, 25 May 2010 - 02:28 AM.

[chrono]

Thanks, I hadn't noted that one. The study I posted only tested acute injection pk after 40min and 4.5h, so they wouldn't have found the difference at 24h. Possibility of methodological error aside, it's hard to say which of these is correct.

I will say that it seems more problematic to extrapolate long-term human oral pk from a study of single injected dosage. The study showing no differences employed a 20 day oral rat trial, and measured both serum and brain concentrations (among others).

Still, titration might be more warranted, if you're going for a certain level of psychological effect.

[Guacamolium]

Wow, mood boost. If you guys react that way to it then awesome. I basically get into "surfer dude" role, and get mellow as hell. I tried including it into my night stack, but I felt so tired the next morning, that the only use I could possibly think for it was dosing about 4-5 hours before sleep. I hadn't touched it since, but I believe it helps some people - maybe not me though...

[rwac]

Wow, mood boost. If you guys react that way to it then awesome. I basically get into "surfer dude" role, and get mellow as hell. I tried including it into my night stack, but I felt so tired the next morning, that the only use I could possibly think for it was dosing about 4-5 hours before sleep. I hadn't touched it since, but I believe it helps some people - maybe not me though...

Have you tried maybe taking half or quarter pill ?

[Guacamolium]

Wow, mood boost. If you guys react that way to it then awesome. I basically get into "surfer dude" role, and get mellow as hell. I tried including it into my night stack, but I felt so tired the next morning, that the only use I could possibly think for it was dosing about 4-5 hours before sleep. I hadn't touched it since, but I believe it helps some people - maybe not me though...

Have you tried maybe taking half or quarter pill ?

Yes.