26 replies to this topic

[FrequencyX]

Hello everyone. I have been a lurker for awhile now and finally decided to sign up and post. After many months of researching Nootropics and Supplements, I decided to order some Piracetam. My daily regimen of supplements for the past month include 1G ALCAR,1.5G Fish Oil, Multi, 200mg CoQ-10 and 1.2G of Lecithin. I started my attack dose of Piracetam on Saturday with about 5G of P followed by 2.5G of Lecithin. After about 30 minutes, I had intense energy and focus. I started cleaning and did not stop for about an hour. Shit was spotless..

On Sunday morning I started the day with 1/2 a teaspoon in the morning and afternoon along with my normal supplements and have not really noticed anything since. Being lethargic and somewhat unmotivated lately, I know it was not a placebo. It was very intense! It felt as if my mind was going a hundred miles per hour. Is this normal when starting Piracetam to have very intense energy?

This morning I took another 1/2 Teaspoon along with 1.2G of Lecithin and have not really noticed any increased concentration or cognitive effects. I plan on taking another dose around 12:00PM today and maybe something this evening as well.
I am not looking to get "high" or anything. I am mainly looking for that cognitive advantage or edge in the workplace. Should I bump up my Choline source or maybe try a smaller dose of Piracetam? I know that it sometimes can take a few weeks to notice anything, I am just curious if anyone else has experienced this.

[Yearningforyears]

Agitation / hypomania can happen with piracetam, and I think it is pretty common in those with various mood disorders (especially bipolar spectrum).
If you have recurrent periods of lethargy / low motivation, then there might be something more to it.
I have found some very good remedies to treat my somewhat unstable moods, but it took me several years to find out what worked.
But who knows? Maybe you just had a craaazy placebo reaction =)

[Heisenberg]

Sometimes I feel an increase in focus from even 400mg, sometimes nothing from even 1.6g of Piracetam. I have not quite narrowed down which parameters affect its effectiveness, but ultrahigh (~ 4g) and ultralow (40mg) dosages have done nothing for me. I have found Piracetam to be most effective for me on an empty stomach.

[FrequencyX]

Agitation / hypomania can happen with piracetam, and I think it is pretty common in those with various mood disorders (especially bipolar spectrum).
If you have recurrent periods of lethargy / low motivation, then there might be something more to it.
I have found some very good remedies to treat my somewhat unstable moods, but it took me several years to find out what worked.
But who knows? Maybe you just had a craaazy placebo reaction =)

HAHA if that was the Placebo, that would be one very powerful Placebo effect! It was almost like a mild Ritalin trip of sorts. I was very focused, energetic and my thoughts and eyes were going all over the place.

[FrequencyX]

So correct me if I am wrong but 1/4 Teaspoon is roughly 700MG right? Should I continue with a 1/2 teaspoon or 1/4 teaspoon for the next couple of weeks twice a day and see how that goes?

[chrono]

A level 1/4 tsp can be anywhere from 700-830mg, because piracetam clumps together so much.

I think 1/2 tsp for a couple of weeks is a good course. The improvements will be subtle, but should be noticeable. I might ditch lecithin and get choline bitartrate (or better); lecithin has trouble crossing the BBB, and has been pretty sporadically effective for me.

[FrequencyX]

A level 1/4 tsp can be anywhere from 700-830mg, because piracetam clumps together so much.

I think 1/2 tsp for a couple of weeks is a good course. The improvements will be subtle, but should be noticeable. I might ditch lecithin and get choline bitartrate (or better); lecithin has trouble crossing the BBB, and has been pretty sporadically effective for me.

I might have to do that. Does the Bitartrate cause any fishy smells at all that you have noticed? Also does the Bitartrate have much of a taste? OJ and Cranberry seem to totally eliminate the nasty taste. Will adding the Choline Bitartrate make much of a difference with my cocktail?

[Animal]

Agitation / hypomania can happen with piracetam, and I think it is pretty common in those with various mood disorders (especially bipolar spectrum).
If you have recurrent periods of lethargy / low motivation, then there might be something more to it.
I have found some very good remedies to treat my somewhat unstable moods, but it took me several years to find out what worked.
But who knows? Maybe you just had a craaazy placebo reaction =)

It was definitely a hypomanic reaction, I would avoid trying to replicate that if I were you Frequency. Then again you've likely never experience mania so this warning will be lost on you.

LoL your eyes were going all over the place? Do you mean nystagmus or something else?

[FrequencyX]

Agitation / hypomania can happen with piracetam, and I think it is pretty common in those with various mood disorders (especially bipolar spectrum).
If you have recurrent periods of lethargy / low motivation, then there might be something more to it.
I have found some very good remedies to treat my somewhat unstable moods, but it took me several years to find out what worked.
But who knows? Maybe you just had a craaazy placebo reaction =)

It was definitely a hypomanic reaction, I would avoid trying to replicate that if I were you Frequency. Then again you've likely never experience mania so this warning will be lost on you.

LoL your eyes were going all over the place? Do you mean nystagmus or something else?

Hopefully it was not a manic episode! I didn't want to morph into Isochroma that easily! I felt fairly good like I was in the "zone" but not grandiose like. I just felt 100% more focused and had very intense energy. Reaching out to old friends seemed appropriate as so did listening to some music. As for the eyes, they weren't anything like nystagmus. It was just as if my scanning rate of objects seemed to be amplified. It seemed like I could scan 100 items in my general vicinity with ease. Without Piracetam it would be slower than normal.

[unregistered_user]

I wouldn't expect these effects to last. I noticed something similar from the beginning of my Piracetam experience and after a few days the effects had become far less noticeable.

[FrequencyX]

I wouldn't expect these effects to last. I noticed something similar from the beginning of my Piracetam experience and after a few days the effects had become far less noticeable.

I think you are right. I have not noticed anything close to that since I started.

[kenj]

>>> Hopefully it was not a manic episode! I didn't want to morph into Isochroma that easily! I felt fairly good like I was in the "zone" but not grandiose like. <<<

Yeah, there's a (mad) world in difference from 'Isochromas' reaction to "being in the zone" from piracetams possible mental effects. AFAIK a manic episode is not enjoyable, and may end with some kind of psychosis. The guy was not even faking it, or smarten up his subjective understanding of the effects of pir.; you can trace his posts rambling about piracetam, with thoughts about taking over the world IIRC getting more and more frequent, - pretty impressive, but I suspect more substances were involved, and piracetam was just intensifying and/or 'fueling' the mania.

His compulsions were indeed real (from bluelight.ru; trying to delete his posts):

Not only can I not delete my account, but I cannot delete my own posts!

Please help me remove all traces of my account.

The admins are perfectly capable of removing accounts.

If you don't I will spam this board into oblivion. That's a promise. You admins are going to have to take action or I will make a crisis.

Oh yes you are. You are going to remove any and all materials I have posted along with my account.

You have forty-eight hours to comply. If you do not, I will fill this board to overflowing with so much crap that you will have to remove my account.

YOUR DISRESPECT OF MY WISHES TO HAVE CONTROL OVER MY OWN POSTS AND ACCOUNT FUCKING SUCKS.

I WILL HUNT YOU DOWN PERSONALLY AND KILL YOU IF YOU DO NOT COMPLY.

And yes, I do know where you live.

Your ignorance is illustrative. You DIDN'T EVEN READ MY FUCKING POST!

I CANNOT DELETE MY POSTS! I CANNOT DELTEE MY ACCOUNT!

DELETE THESE THINGS NOW OR GIVE ME THE POWER TO DO SO, OR I WILL TAKE ACTION.

And rarely do I laugh out loud when reading the Internet (yeah, I'm dry like that), but one of Isochromas earlier posts just had me, kudos to his writing talent (from this forum):

Saturation dosing of piracetam with large quantities of fish oil is extreme. It's for the extreme folks who want to become crazy fast and a bit over the knife-edge of sharpness - and want to stay there for good. Unlike the stimulant addicts who inevitably burn out as they wear out, the piracetam & fishoil combo is the opposite - it burns in and gets stronger with time Burn baby burn!

A mandatory warning though: power is corrosive, and this level is very difficult to control. It wants to fulfill its own agenda. I must make a daily, conscious effort to stay sane and physically move at a speed that's compatible with externalities like other people, keyboards, etc. A few days ago I was paying my local ISP and the chick at the counter was amazed at my speed. She had to get me to slow down my speaking. She noticed how intense I was, and she saw the shine in my eyes. I can tell because she asked me why I was so different than the rest of the herd in line. So I told her as I pulled out the portable piraetam jar and dosed right then and there, at the counter A full tablespoon swallowed dry, but I don't care. I cold eat a pound dry. It doesn't matter anymore.

I know it's not funny, and bless his soul, but dude's got some writing skills. ;-)

[FrequencyX]

>>> Hopefully it was not a manic episode! I didn't want to morph into Isochroma that easily! I felt fairly good like I was in the "zone" but not grandiose like. <<<

Yeah, there's a (mad) world in difference from 'Isochromas' reaction to "being in the zone" from piracetams possible mental effects. AFAIK a manic episode is not enjoyable, and may end with some kind of psychosis. The guy was not even faking it, or smarten up his subjective understanding of the effects of pir.; you can trace his posts rambling about piracetam, with thoughts about taking over the world IIRC getting more and more frequent, - pretty impressive, but I suspect more substances were involved, and piracetam was just intensifying and/or 'fueling' the mania.

His compulsions were indeed real (from bluelight.ru; trying to delete his posts):

Not only can I not delete my account, but I cannot delete my own posts!

Please help me remove all traces of my account.

The admins are perfectly capable of removing accounts.

If you don't I will spam this board into oblivion. That's a promise. You admins are going to have to take action or I will make a crisis.

Oh yes you are. You are going to remove any and all materials I have posted along with my account.

You have forty-eight hours to comply. If you do not, I will fill this board to overflowing with so much crap that you will have to remove my account.

YOUR DISRESPECT OF MY WISHES TO HAVE CONTROL OVER MY OWN POSTS AND ACCOUNT FUCKING SUCKS.

I WILL HUNT YOU DOWN PERSONALLY AND KILL YOU IF YOU DO NOT COMPLY.

And yes, I do know where you live.

Your ignorance is illustrative. You DIDN'T EVEN READ MY FUCKING POST!

I CANNOT DELETE MY POSTS! I CANNOT DELTEE MY ACCOUNT!

DELETE THESE THINGS NOW OR GIVE ME THE POWER TO DO SO, OR I WILL TAKE ACTION.

And rarely do I laugh out loud when reading the Internet (yeah, I'm dry like that), but one of Isochromas earlier posts just had me, kudos to his writing talent (from this forum):

Saturation dosing of piracetam with large quantities of fish oil is extreme. It's for the extreme folks who want to become crazy fast and a bit over the knife-edge of sharpness - and want to stay there for good. Unlike the stimulant addicts who inevitably burn out as they wear out, the piracetam & fishoil combo is the opposite - it burns in and gets stronger with time Burn baby burn!

A mandatory warning though: power is corrosive, and this level is very difficult to control. It wants to fulfill its own agenda. I must make a daily, conscious effort to stay sane and physically move at a speed that's compatible with externalities like other people, keyboards, etc. A few days ago I was paying my local ISP and the chick at the counter was amazed at my speed. She had to get me to slow down my speaking. She noticed how intense I was, and she saw the shine in my eyes. I can tell because she asked me why I was so different than the rest of the herd in line. So I told her as I pulled out the portable piraetam jar and dosed right then and there, at the counter A full tablespoon swallowed dry, but I don't care. I cold eat a pound dry. It doesn't matter anymore.

I know it's not funny, and bless his soul, but dude's got some writing skills. ;-)

Yeah he was definitely teetering on the deep end. I would have to say though, his writing was fantastic. I think along with Isochroma's permission and help, someone could easily throw together a small book or compilation on his writings and postings from various forums. Something along the lines of "Memoirs of Isochroma" or "The Ramblings of Isochroma, The Piracetam Edition"

But on a serious note, it was sad and it can be very unhealthy to be in this state. I have heard that he is doing better though.

Edited by FrequencyX, 20 July 2010 - 05:57 PM.

[Rags847]

All this talk about Piracetam needing to be used consistently for weeks on end is BS. I have used it for years and tried various approaches. Right now I think Piracetam should be used very selectively and not daily. Use it for a day when you a need to rock and roll. Talking time off will make Piracetam fly again when you return to it. If I have a free day to devote to just reading or studying, or an exam day, an important interview or a hot first date, then I'll take Pirtacetam and get that real intellectual, creative, frontal brain kick.

There needs to be a paradigm shift regarding the great nootropic Piracetam. Just like you enjoy unwinding with a beer after a long day (yet you wouldn't enjoy life if you drank 1 beer every four hours, day in and day out, seven days a week), enjoy Piracetam when you are really ready for it and really need it. Then it will be there for you.

Edited by Rags847, 20 July 2010 - 06:02 PM.

[Animal]

Hopefully it was not a manic episode! I didn't want to morph into Isochroma that easily!

Nah, don't get the wrong impression, what you experienced was nowhere near a full manic episode, it was just a mild and temporary hypomanic state, nothing to be worried about unless you pursue it.

[FrequencyX]

All this talk about Piracetam needing to be used consistently for weeks on end is BS. I have used it for years and tried various approaches. Right now I think Piracetam should be used very selectively and not daily. Use it for a day when you a need to rock and roll. Talking time off will make Piracetam fly again when you return to it. If I have a free day to devote to just reading or studying, or an exam day, an important interview or a hot first date, then I'll take Pirtacetam and get that real intellectual, creative, frontal brain kick.

There needs to be a paradigm shift regarding the great nootropic Piracetam. Just like you enjoy unwinding with a beer after a long day (yet you wouldn't enjoy life if you drank 1 beer every four hours, day in and day out, seven days a week), enjoy Piracetam when you are really ready for it and really need it. Then it will be there for you.

Thanks for the insight Rags! How much do you personally take when you come off of the cycle?

[chrono]

We need a new version of Godwin's law: how many posts in a piracetam thread will it take before we all start talking about isochroma? Guy is a good writer, but it's all so fanciful and masturbatory. Over time it stopped being useful for describing the effects of the drug accurately, and became more an examination of his psyche.

I can identify to some extent with what the OP describes. But I never took 5g at once, so my beginning experiences were more gentle. As semi-retarded said, I wouldn't expect this to last, or try to make it. If you use it constantly, the cognitive enhancement will remain, but the more subjectively apparent effects will fade.

There needs to be a paradigm shift regarding the great nootropic Piracetam. Just like you enjoy unwinding with a beer after a long day (yet you wouldn't enjoy life if you drank 1 beer every four hours, day in and day out, seven days a week), enjoy Piracetam when you are really ready for it and really need it. Then it will be there for you.

This is an interesting thought. I agree that piracetam doesn't need to be used constantly to have an effect, as many people have suggested over the years. But I don't think there's much to suggest that it needs to be used as sporadically as in your example (and certainly can't be compared with the consequences of constant alcohol usage). But maybe it's just wishful thinking; I use piracetam as part of a regimen to counteract attentional difficulties, and find it hard to go without for longer stretches of time.

[babcock]

We need a new version of Godwin's law: how many posts in a piracetam thread will it take before we all start talking about isochroma? Guy is a good writer, but it's all so fanciful and masturbatory. Over time it stopped being useful for describing the effects of the drug accurately, and became more an examination of his psyche.

Isochroma has definitely become the folk legend of the Nootropics board.

[Duster]

We need a new version of Godwin's law: how many posts in a piracetam thread will it take before we all start talking about isochroma? Guy is a good writer, but it's all so fanciful and masturbatory. Over time it stopped being useful for describing the effects of the drug accurately, and became more an examination of his psyche.

Isochroma has definitely become the folk legend of the Nootropics board.

Def.

I dunno, maybe it's because I never had to deal with him personally, but to me it's a joy reading his old posts. Like a Chuck Palahniuk novel. Interesting stuff

[outsider]

We need a new version of Godwin's law: how many posts in a piracetam thread will it take before we all start talking about isochroma? Guy is a good writer, but it's all so fanciful and masturbatory. Over time it stopped being useful for describing the effects of the drug accurately, and became more an examination of his psyche.

Isochroma has definitely become the folk legend of the Nootropics board.

Something similar happened with nootropi but on a much lower scale a couples of years ago. His stack was too much dopamine stimulating it seems and he mixed piracetam, oxiracetam and aniracetam.

[pheonickx]

some pple have all the luck ....... engery on piracetam damn!

[FrequencyX]

some pple have all the luck ....... engery on piracetam damn!

Well I have not really experienced or noticed anything since that night. I have 100Grams worth of it and plan to use it all and make a decision on its effectiveness for me. I have been experiencing with higher and lower doses over the past few days with not really any cognitive changes.

I would have to say though after a few cups of coffee in the morning, it can really help potentiate the effects.

[Animal]

some pple have all the luck ....... engery on piracetam damn!

There are much better substances for enhancing energy levels.

[Yearningforyears]

piracetam and coffee. Things really start to spin off after that =)

[Duster]

piracetam and coffee. Things really start to spin off after that =)

Just a bit of caffeine will do, for me. I love tea (several dozen different kinds in my cabinet; not bags, real tea), but I completely stopped drinking it so that I could ease into my piracetam. I felt pretty good after getting the dosage down, but I sorta missed the energy I had on the first dose.

I had a hankering for some tea, and having no reason not to, I brewed up a cup of Irish Breakfast. One of the best combos ever. Most people want to sit around and relax after a hard day of work/school/whatever; I feel like suiting up to fight a dragon. Same warnings as usual apply for caffeine (don't drink too much, don't drink too late, etc...), but this is definitely something I'd recommend trying

[nito]

some pple have all the luck ....... engery on piracetam damn!

There are much better substances for enhancing energy levels.

What would you suggest?

[Animal]

some pple have all the luck ....... engery on piracetam damn!

There are much better substances for enhancing energy levels.

What would you suggest?

What effects are you looking for, an immediate boost in energy, or something that increases energy reserves over time in a more sustained way? Sulbutiamine is an excellent alternative to caffeine for example, while modafinil is less stimulating but has a more sustained 'wakefulness' effect.