40 replies to this topic

[Potent]

Second day on the stack:
1. Moda: 400 mg
2. Luteolin: 50 mg
3. Agmatine: 50 mg

Feels amazing once again. Agmatine is great for reducing obsessional tendencies and the pushiness of Moda. Reading comprehension issues stemming from Moda feel close to abolished. I feel a better cognitive flow. Much thanks goes to Jeoshua for bringing Luteolin and Agmatine to my attention.

[Cade]

Second day on the stack:
1. Moda: 400 mg
2. Luteolin: 50 mg
3. Agmatine: 50 mg

Feels amazing once again. Agmatine is great for reducing obsessional tendencies and the pushiness of Moda. Reading comprehension issues stemming from Moda feel close to abolished. I feel a better cognitive flow. Much thanks goes to Jeoshua for bringing Luteolin and Agmatine to my attention.

That's a very small dose of Agmatine. I have 500mg caps from USP Labs.

Taking 1 pill on an empty stomach or with food (don't really notice a difference) gives me a slight mood boost for around an hour. I felt increased joint/back pain. Taking 1 gram (2 pills) made me feel very happy for about 30 minutes, than made my brain feel a little fuzzy and kind of introverted for the next few hours. Also, the higher the dose, the more my back hurts.

When doing research on Agmatine I had read that high-doses of Agmatine can produce some extra pain while taking smaller doses can actually help better tolerate pain. I found some really cheap bulk powder on Amazon (brand is Hard Rhino - not sure how reputable) - perhaps I will try that in doses of around 50-100mg and see what I notice.

Btw, Agmatine definitely helps potentiate opiates. The only practical use I have for these Agmatine caps I have is taking it when I dose Hydrocodone (spinal issues), which improves the effects I receive from the vicodin…It's a pretty interesting substance.

[Jeoshua]

The higher doses are due to the general usage of Agmatine: Bodybuilding. I've almost never seen a supplement for body building that didn't come in doses higher than half a gram. This is both due to the size of most body builders, and the tendency to push doses upwards if they aren't working correctly. In the case of a supplement like Agmatine, which only has a very short half-life systemically, the dosage naturally balloons. The half-life of Agmatine in the brain, however, is much longer, and the effects more pronounced.

I used 100mg in my stack for a good while, and it kept away the anxiety very nicely, as well as ameliorating somewhat my natural ADHD symptoms (Type 3: Oppositional, Uncontrollably Hyper-focused).

[Jeoshua]

I've just put in a bulk order for a big ol' bag of Agmatine Sulfate, and as such have been looking more deeply into its effects.

In addition to potentiating Cannabinoid and Opioid substances, Agmatine Sulfate also acts as Glutaminergic receptor agonist. This means that, coupled with a Glutaminergic Positive Allosteric Modulator, like nearly any of the Racetams, the effects should be greater. In this case, the Agmatine is not potentiating the Racetam, but rather it is the other way around. I have seen a few reports where the effects of Agmatine were extremely noticeable, to an uncomfortable degree for the tester, such as Abelard Lindsay on the CILTEP thread trying 250mg along with a half-dose of Piracetam. Given that these substances seem to be synergistic in respect to the Glutamate receptor types, I am not surprised.

I am currently planning on mixing low-dose sunifiram and unifiram in with a low dose of Agmatine, to see if the effects do indeed stack. I am thinking 5mg + 5mg + 100mg, respectively. I should have the ability to test this fully by the end of the week, as my supplies are currently in transit.

If successful, this could mean that Agmatine may be very useful in increasing the effect of racetams, as well as pain killers and anxiolytics, and be an extremely useful boosting agent for many, many different stacks. That is, of course, not even counting its own effects in regards to its anxiolytic and neuroprotective functions.

Edited by Jeoshua, 30 March 2014 - 03:18 PM.

[Potent]

Sweet, keep on experimenting mate. Keep us updated on how things go.

After a few days of Luteolin + Agmatine, I felt very loopy. I've never tried a dissociative, so I can't say I felt dissociated, but I felt extremely off. To the point where I stopped both Luteolin + Agmatine. I don't know if the loopiness was due to Luteolin, Agmatine, or both. However, I don't think the Agmatine was helping. As a NMDA receptor antagonist, caution is prudent.

However, I can say that Moda + Agmatine was amazing. The level of behavioral disinhibition/anxiolysis/energy was great. Seems like a good combo for a night out, not so much for studying.

Good luck.

Edited by Potent, 30 March 2014 - 05:44 PM.

[abelard lindsay]

I am currently planning on mixing low-dose sunifiram and unifiram in with a low dose of Agmatine, to see if the effects do indeed stack. I am thinking 5mg + 5mg + 100mg, respectively. I should have the ability to test this fully by the end of the week, as my supplies are currently in transit.

If successful, this could mean that Agmatine may be very useful in increasing the effect of racetams, as well as pain killers and anxiolytics, and be an extremely useful boosting agent for many, many different stacks. That is, of course, not even counting its own effects in regards to its anxiolytic and neuroprotective functions.

I took 2g of piracetam + agmatine and had some disturbing effects. Nothing really bad happened, but then again I'm pretty experienced with dealing with negative nootropic experiences and I know what to take to counteract bad things. Unifiram and especially sunifiram would be even more dicey especially since there have been sporadic reports of bad stuff happening with sunifiram over in the sunifiram thread so potentiating it is, IMHO, a bad idea.

[Jeoshua]

Well I have received my digital scales in the mail now, so I am able to make a better report.

Currently I am testing a stack consisting of:

Unifiram 5mg
Sunifiram 7mg
Agmatine Sulfate 100mg

Along with my more basic supplements:

DHA 600mg
EPA 200mg
Activated B Complex (50-100% of various B vitamins in their active coenzyme forms)

Thus far the Agmatine at such a low dose seems to not be potentiating the *unfirams, but instead seems to be acting to remove the pushiness of them. I think I may have misread the information, and it might be modulating the effects instead of potentiating them. In either case, I had one of the most productive days at work today, ever, taking my experimental stack every few hours when I felt that it was wearing off. No crash, no loopiness, no negative effects at such a low dose. I will look more into it and report back, but thus far it's working extremely well. All of the benefits without the pushiness. I think that, like other NMDA antagonists, it may be working to prevent exitotoxicity, which is kind of a problem normally with the 'firams.

[Jeoshua]

Day 2, same stack.

Not as productive of a day at work, but I noticed today that my mood was great and my memory extremely sharp. Definitely more of the good effects from Uni/Suni and far less pushiness. The halflife of Agmatine is the only thing that concerns me, especially coupled with such a quick acting ampakine like Unifiram. I redosed at lunch and noticed that the effects of the Agmatine were still rising, while the Unifiram and Sunifiram had long since reached the end of their useful lifespan. In addition, I did notice a rise in the effect of Unifiram, above and beyond the normal effects for 5mg. That might be the potentiation, or something in my neurochemistry may be up/downregulating. The longer term effects remain to be seen.

Stay tuned

[socialpiranha]

i tried it and didn't like it, can't really explain the feeling.

[celebes]

i tried it and didn't like it, can't really explain the feeling.

 

 

Ditto. Strange and unpleasant.

[chris106]

Thus far the Agmatine at such a low dose seems to not be potentiating the *unfirams, but instead seems to be acting to remove the pushiness of them. I think I may have misread the information, and it might be modulating the effects instead of potentiating them. In either case, I had one of the most productive days at work today, ever, taking my experimental stack every few hours when I felt that it was wearing off. No crash, no loopiness, no negative effects at such a low dose. I will look more into it and report back, but thus far it's working extremely well. All of the benefits without the pushiness. I think that, like other NMDA antagonists, it may be working to prevent exitotoxicity, which is kind of a problem normally with the 'firams.

 

 

I'm not familiar with the exact working mechanisms of the unifirams, but this bit of information from examine could clear things up:

http://examine.com/s...ine/#summary3-3
 

"Agmatine binds to two sites of the NMDA receptor (neither of which bind glutamate) and functions as a noncompetitive inhibitor. It can competitively inhibit polyamines from activating the receptor, and the inhibition of NMDA receptors does not extend to the other two glutaminergic receptors (AMPA and kainate)"

 

 

I once had amazing results with Modafinil (or rather Adrafinil ) and Agmatine. The effects of the combo didn't seem to be sustainable over time though, and when I recently got hold of Modafinil and Agmatine again, I failed to replicate that effect.

Then again I dosed way too high on the Agmatine (1g for 200mg Moda), so I might have to try lower doses. I will check my journal entry from that one time it worked, I allways write down compounds, doses and effects.

It seems like combining these compounds could be rather finicky in the long term, though. Both have a lot of MOAs in different part of the brain, and both have ridiculously long half lifes - which makes it rather unpredictable.

Hell, even Moda itself becomes less predictable with every consecutive day of use - a build up of high levels of Histamine and Glutamate over time  is nothing to sneeze at... cycling might be prudent.

That being said , Potent - are you still using Modafinil + Agmtine (+Luteolin)? Have you found a way to make it sustainable?

Edited by chris106, 02 May 2014 - 08:28 PM.