36 replies to this topic

[Louise101]

I might be bipolar II. Or not. Who knows. All I know is I'm so tired of it all. I've tried SO many supplements and various meds (SSRIs, SNRIs, Wellbutrin, lamictal). SSRIs worked ok....I felt much less irritable and happier. But the fatigue left me pretty much useless (I slept away a good portion of my 20s) and I gained a ton of weight (going from super-slim to obese in a few years was not fun). The weight was exercise-resistant too, so I assume it f**d up my thyroid or something.

ANYWAY, I'm off all meds for several years now. And it has been awful. I have way more energy than I did when I was on long-term SSRIs (yay), but all the crankiness, moodiness and sadness has come back. With a bonus...now I have periods of what I assume is "hypomania" thrown in for fun. From what I've read, I would say it is rapid-cycling, or irritable depression. I am able to carry on with my life and few people know anything is wrong with me. So I don't know if that could realllllly be "bipolar II"? It doesn't seem severe enough. Yet it IS bad enough that I plan to die if I cannot fix it. I can't stand it anymore. I can not enjoy life any longer. Every day is becoming more of a struggle. I'm taking klonopin to help me sleep, yet I still wake up with fear in the pit of my stomach and a sense of dread about facing yet another day.

The ridiculous thing is....NOTHING IS WRONG. Not really.....I have a fairly good marriage with children (oh the guilt ), an excellent job (which I'm barely motivated to do -- huge issues with motivation ), a loving family, etc etc. Nothing is really wrong. Yet I hate my life. I know 100% that there is something wrong/off balance in my brain. There is most certainly something preventing me from experiencing any joy. It has cut off all joy from my life and turned me into a walking zombie. I am either sad or irritable. Both states suck.

I have had extensive testing, and most things are ok (thyroid fine...tested T3, T4, TSH, etc). Iron and zinc a bit low, but I supplement and anyway I can't imagine a stupid vitamin issue would cause suicidal tendencies to this degree. I was on high doses of AOR Ortho Core previously and it did nothing for my moods. Neither has high doses of inositol, fish oil, B Vitamins, Ashwagandha, any adaptogen, etc. Nothing.ever.works.

So I am just wondering, out of desperation, if bacopa is any good if there is a possibility of bipolar? I have seen a psychiatrist and he suggested it sounded bipolar-ish, but he didn't want to label. I am seeing another one at the end of June. But I will NOT take any more drugs that cause me to gain more weight and sleep all day. Seriously, if that's all there is then I'd rather check out. Been there, done that. It sucks.

[nootrope]

I'm bipolar and have had good results from Bacopa. But I've also had good results from Ashwagandha (as discussed on my blog here). The nootropic effects of bacopa may take up to 12 weeks, but it may take much less time to lower anxiety. Best of luck as you keep trying to find a good remedy. Some people here speak highly of sub-clinical dose lithium, which can be ordered over the counter (I was on a clinical dose for about 20 years but now I take only ashwagandha and bacopa).

[Louise101]

I'm bipolar and have had good results from Bacopa. But I've also had good results from Ashwagandha (as discussed on my blog here). The nootropic effects of bacopa may take up to 12 weeks, but it may take much less time to lower anxiety. Best of luck as you keep trying to find a good remedy. Some people here speak highly of sub-clinical dose lithium, which can be ordered over the counter (I was on a clinical dose for about 20 years but now I take only ashwagandha and bacopa).

Nootrope, are you saying you are an unmedicated bipolar (1?) using only ashwagandha and bacopa? You don't have any issues with mania/depression while not medicated?

[nootrope]

Yes, I am unmedicated bipolar 1, using only ashwagandha and bacopa. The extremes in bipolar 1 can be greater than in bipolar 2, but the disorder is more episodic. Even unmedicated it's possible for me to go years between episodes, which usually happen after some kind of life stress. (And even medicated, it's possible for me to have an episode.) Population studies show that untreated bipolar 1 people, however, tend to have more and more episodes closer together. I've been doing well without meds since about December 2008, though I'm thinking of adding low-dose lithium myself. I don't "present any clinical symptoms" now but I'd like to keep it that way. Daily life can have its share of stresses, and diet/exercise/meditation/supplements can all be important to keep that from going over the tipping point!

[Logan]

What SSRIs have you tried?

Is Lamictal the only mood stabilizer you've tried? If so, I would consider sub clinical doses of both lithium and depakote.

Ashagandha and Bacopa are very good herbs that may benefit you. I think the ayurvedic herb with the most potential for mood stabilizing effects is Holy Basil. New Chaper's Supercritical Holy Basil is the best brand out there IMO.

How do you respond to exercise? I have always found fairly intense exercise followed by a meditative stretch to be one of the most beneficial things for my bipolar.

Just remember, most people with bipolar also have some underlying emotional issues from childhood, just like most people in general do. Your hate for you life is unlikely simply due to being bipolar. Actually, it is very likely your hate for things comes from a source that makes your bipolar predisposition manifest as something much worse. We hardly are ever only born with something that is the sole reason for our mental illness.

[Louise101]

which usually happen after some kind of life stress

Yes, that is my issue too. In fact, big stress (pregnancy/birth) is what initially tipped me over into this hell-on-earth. I started on Zoloft while still in the hospital after giving birth, and it didn't help at all. In fact, I spent two days pacing the halls and crying. I had just had a baby yet I felt like I was dying and the nurses all watched me, horrified. It was a rather unpleasant experience. And the months that followed weren't great either. Even now, several years later, it appears to be stress that causes my symptoms to show up the most. Even rather minor, everyday stress causes me to feel panicked/irritable. Basically, when I'm all alone in the house, I can stay calm and normal for days.

What SSRIs have you tried?

Is Lamictal the only mood stabilizer you've tried? If so, I would consider sub clinical doses of both lithium and depakote.

I tried Zoloft, Prozac, Paxil. And Effexor, although it isn't a pure SSRI. The Zoloft worked well for years, but stopped after I had a baby. Prozac worked after that, but I recently tried it again and it didn't seem to be helping....I felt more irritable, which scared me, so I didn't give it a good try. But I really hate SSRIs because they have all made me tired and fat. Seriously, I need a nap every day even on Prozac. I tried adding Provigil, but that had the paradoxical effect of making me "wired and tired (I respond that way to any type of non-drowsy cold medication too). And I get fat. Partly due to carb-cravings (I literally wake up in the morning thinking of donuts while on SSRIs), but even if I try hard to keep diet in check I still gain weight. They do something to my blood sugar I think because I have constant issues with hypoglycemia while on them. Unmedicated, my appetite is totally normal and I only need 7 hrs of sleep/day (not 12!!). Effexor made me even fatter and sweaty.

I am scared to try lithium and depakote because I simply would rather no longer exist than gain weight again. Honestly, for a woman weight gain is so horrible, especially when it puts you up into obese territory.

I have exercised at the gym religiously in the past (not so much now.....now it is just walking). But while it certainly did lift my mood (while on SSRIs), the effect was very short-lived for me. I was very interested in Holy Basil, but I read it can lower cortisol.. One thing (from saliva testing) is that my cortisol is low in the mornings and early afternoon. My naturopath put me on licorice last year, but of course I don't feel any better. So I'm kind of nervous to take anything that might further lower cortisol. I have no idea if perhaps years ago I had chronic high output of cortisol and it is now depleted (adrenal fatigue) or if I just always lacked a good amount of cortisol. It all makes me tired to think about.

Just curious: why do people always bring up childhood. Does it REALLY matter this much years and years later? I am so confused about that. Yeah I had a sucky childhood (young parents who argued non-stop but were not physically abusive, minor bullying in early school which scared me as a shy child and I think contributed to the social anxiety). But no horrifying trauma that I can remember which would cause me to be so unrelentingly SAD all the time and hate my life. My dad is SO MUCH like me that I feel it is genetic.

[Logan]

Just curious: why do people always bring up childhood. Does it REALLY matter this much years and years later? I am so confused about that. Yeah I had a sucky childhood (young parents who argued non-stop but were not physically abusive, minor bullying in early school which scared me as a shy child and I think contributed to the social anxiety). But no horrifying trauma that I can remember which would cause me to be so unrelentingly SAD all the time and hate my life. My dad is SO MUCH like me that I feel it is genetic.

Absolutely yes it does really matter. Unfortunately, some of the damage has already been done in terms of how our environment impacted our brain development. That's not to say that through medication and healing through therapy(a combination of individual and group psychodynamic therapy would be best) it is not possible to get back to the functional state we should have been in given better nurture and environment.

You do NOT need to have horrifying trauma to have issues that follow you for a lifetime. Parents arguing nonstop and minor bullying is trauma and is very damaging. Just from one sentence it sounds like your parents were not able to provide you with the right amount of love and attention you needed, this will create anger and sadness in anyone and these will remain for a lifetime unless they are dealt with. Even more subtle things than what you experienced can negatively affect how one feels about oneself and how they operate in a relationship. If we have a genetic predisposition like bipolar, our environment can determine to what extent the predisposition develops and causes problems.

Wanting to believe that everything is genetic is a protective or defense mechanism used so that we do not have to face reality or take responsibility as parents. This may prevent us from confronting the pain of what is really going on, but it also prevents us from dealing with things and nurturing ourselves in order to grow and heal closer to how we may have been given proper nurture. The fact is, good parenting requires so so much, it really does not take much during the delicate years of development to throw a child off track. Even some of the seemingly most stable people will often admit that they have some issues that have interfered with their ability to have a healthy relationship at times. The problem with people that have had more traumatic experiences in childhood is they are more likely to have built up walls of denial in an attempt to protect themselves, making it harder for them to face the reality of what is really going on inside them-facing the reality would be more difficult than someone with lighter issues.

We would all love a simple explanation for why we turned out the way we did, "I was just born this way", but the truth of the matter is the human brain and psyche extremely complex.

It may be in your best interest to try to find a really good likable therapist and give therapy a shot for a while. Therapy can really open up your eyes. Some times people drop out because their anger and denial get the best of them and they just don't like what they are beginning to face.

Have you thought about trying to go back to Zoloft? It really is a great drug in many ways if you respond well to it. I believe it is superior to Prozac.

[Louise101]

The fact is, good parenting requires so so much, it really does not take much during the delicate years of development to throw a child off track.

Well this is truly horrifying. Not only am I royally f'cked up, apparently my kid will be too.

Have you thought about trying to go back to Zoloft? It really is a great drug in many ways if you respond well to it. I believe it is superior to Prozac.

Are you on it? I know several people on it (men) and they do well. However, it unequivocally caused me to gain a lot of weight (like about 60 lbs). The doctors continued to insist it wasn't causing the weight gain so I was totally perplexed at the time. The other thing it did was make me so tired that I slept every lunch hour in my car, and had naps after work. I would then get up and go for a jog to try to lose weight and drum up some energy. I would complain to the doctor that I was so exhausted, and he told me "well, so am I". I was only 24.

At this point, I really think I would rather just give up than go back to being fat and tired for the rest of my life. A doctor once asked if I'd rather be skinny and miserable, or fat/tired and happy. At this point, I think neither.

[aaron_e]

what is your diet like now, and what was it like when you started having issues?

[Louise101]

what is your diet like now, and what was it like when you started having issues?

It is good. Mostly lean protein, vegetables, some fruit, lots of greens. Dark chocolate and red wine. Sometimes rice or quinoa pasta. Sometimes orange juice. Various teas and one black coffee a day. Rarely popcorn. My diet is much healthier than it was years ago. While on SSRIs I had to fight the urge to eat simple carbs all the time....I wanted bread and sugar and Coke.

[The Immortalist]

what is your diet like now, and what was it like when you started having issues?

It is good. Mostly lean protein, vegetables, some fruit, lots of greens. Dark chocolate and red wine. Sometimes rice or quinoa pasta. Sometimes orange juice. Various teas and one black coffee a day. Rarely popcorn. My diet is much healthier than it was years ago. While on SSRIs I had to fight the urge to eat simple carbs all the time....I wanted bread and sugar and Coke.

How much chocolate and red wine? Do you get any fats in your diet?

[Louise101]

How much chocolate and red wine? Do you get any fats in your diet?

Not too much red wine and chocolate. Maybe a few pieces of dark chocolate per day. 3 or 4 glasses of wine/week. For fats, I get walnut oil, olive oil and 2 grams of EPA daily. Actually I feel a bit better today, thanks The Immortalist.

[Logan]

Well this is truly horrifying. Not only am I royally f'cked up, apparently my kid will be too.

You're kid will be o.k. as long as you and your husband have a stable loving relationship and you give unconditional love with the right amount of structure. You do have to be cautious about what is going on with you and how this may affect your child. The best thing you can do now is find a good therapist that you really like and feel comfortable with and maybe take a parenting class and a life span development class(the professor is going to make a difference here).

I only mentioned Zoloft because you said you did well, you had not mentioned the other stuff. I don't blame you for not wanting to take it again. What dose were you on?

You may want to consider a low dose of lithium and a low dose of depakote, it works well for me, maybe it would work for you too. I think weight gain from lithium and depakote are dose dependent, lower doses may not be an issue. Also, if you feel better and have just enough energy, proper exercise, along with diet, should help stave off any potential for weight gain. I also take 10 mg Lexapro but may return to Zoloft at some point for several reasons.

So you are not currently taking anything right now, correct? If not, I think taking a low dose of extended release lithium, starting at 150 mg, would be a good idea at least for now. Lithium is likely neuroprotective and may enhance neurogensis. It may also protect the brain from the ravages of stress. A lower sub clinical dose, at least for most people, is nothing to be scared about IMO.

Other natural treatments to consider:
New Chapter Supercritical Holy Basil-use on your most stressful days and when anxiety/instability is at it's worst
Curcumin
Fish Oil-probably should be taking this anyway if not already
Theanine
Lemon Balm

Edited by MorganM, 27 April 2011 - 04:44 PM.

[aaron_e]

I have some similar issues as you. I was under alot of stress in the navy and eating a not so great diet when I started having problems. My cortisol is low as well, I have actually been prescribed hydrocortisone tabs in the past.

few things you might try:

metafolin - the active form of folate for people with problems converting.
methylcobalamin - the active form of b12 for people with problems converting.
increasing your fish oil dose
ginkgo
rhodiola
vitamin D from sun exposure

and if none of those are particularly helpful:

low carb diet + all of the above

I am doing the low carb approach now to address a possible fatty acid imbalance. Apparently arachidonic acid can do undesirable things and insulin stimulates its production. My personal theory is some people's ancestors ate a whole lot of fish and fewer carbs than the modern diet offers.

[Louise101]

I don't take any meds now except klonopin as needed. Yes, I totally worry about my kid. I was very ill after I had her and not "present" or able to be fully attached. I took 100 mg of Zoloft. Then 20 mg of Prozac. So lithium CARBONATE, not Orotate is what you suggest? That is quite a lot below therapeutic dose values, right? So I'm just wondering if I would get lithium from the dr and just split it (because I doubt he would think going so low is going to be helpful).

I do take fish oil (higher dose EPA, but I've tried DHA too), New Chapter Curcumin. I'll look at the others.

Thanks for the suggestion re: low carb aaron. This is my second day of lower carb. Feel not bad so far.

[Logan]

I don't take any meds now except klonopin as needed. Yes, I totally worry about my kid. I was very ill after I had her and not "present" or able to be fully attached. I took 100 mg of Zoloft. Then 20 mg of Prozac. So lithium CARBONATE, not Orotate is what you suggest? That is quite a lot below therapeutic dose values, right? So I'm just wondering if I would get lithium from the dr and just split it (because I doubt he would think going so low is going to be helpful).

I do take fish oil (higher dose EPA, but I've tried DHA too), New Chapter Curcumin. I'll look at the others.

Now that I think about it, you can't get the extended release lithium carbonate in anything lower than 300mg. Maybe just tell your doctor that you've done quite a bit of reading(which you should do on lithium) and you think that a low dose may be helpful. Ask him to prescribe you 150 mg tablets/capsules to start with the intention of upping the dose if both of you see it is necessary. If you find out 300 mg works, I would try the extended release version, then play with the times you take it to figure out if night or morning dosing is best. If you don't have any luck with the doc, maybe just order lithium orotate online, I've heard Vitamin Research Products has a reliable one.

Thanks for the suggestion re: low carb aaron. This is my second day of lower carb. Feel not bad so far.

Go to Mark's Daily Apple for ideas on moving more towards a primal/paleo diet.

[The Immortalist]

How much chocolate and red wine? Do you get any fats in your diet?

Not too much red wine and chocolate. Maybe a few pieces of dark chocolate per day. 3 or 4 glasses of wine/week. For fats, I get walnut oil, olive oil and 2 grams of EPA daily. Actually I feel a bit better today, thanks The Immortalist.

Have you ever got your cholesterol tested? Low levels of cholesterol can cause depression.

[Logan]

How much chocolate and red wine? Do you get any fats in your diet?

Not too much red wine and chocolate. Maybe a few pieces of dark chocolate per day. 3 or 4 glasses of wine/week. For fats, I get walnut oil, olive oil and 2 grams of EPA daily. Actually I feel a bit better today, thanks The Immortalist.

Have you ever got your cholesterol tested? Low levels of cholesterol can cause depression.

I doubt it's low cholesterol with the symptoms she presents and her history. It sounds like it may be bipolar II.

[Louise101]

Well that was a short-lived respite from symptoms. 1 day of feeling COMPLETELY normal. But I'll take it. But by last night I felt the symptoms returning, which is par for the course and why I imagine I'm rapid cycling (ultra rapid) or mixed or whatever.

You may want to consider a low dose of lithium and a low dose of depakote, it works well for me, maybe it would work for you too. I think weight gain from lithium and depakote are dose dependent, lower doses may not be an issue. Also, if you feel better and have just enough energy, proper exercise, along with diet, should help stave off any potential for weight gain. I also take 10 mg Lexapro but may return to Zoloft at some point for several reasons.

Morgan, you take a lower dose of both lithium and depakote along with Lexapro? And you do not have any issues with fatigue or weight? This combination is totally controlling your symptoms and you feel normal?

[xdopamine]

(thyroid fine...tested T3, T4, TSH, etc)

Do you have the results handy? Or did your doc just tell you that everything is fine?

[Louise101]

(thyroid fine...tested T3, T4, TSH, etc)

Do you have the results handy? Or did your doc just tell you that everything is fine?

TSH: 1.60 (range: .35 - 5)

T4 Free: 16 (range: 12 - 22)

Free T3: 4.2 (range: 2.6 - 5.7)



DHEAs: 4.1 (range: 1.65 - 9.15)



Free Cortisol Rhythm

morning: 10 depressed (range 13 - 24)

noon: 3 depressed (5 - 10)

p.m.: 3 normal (3 - 8)

10 p.m.: 1 normal (1 -4)

Cortisol Load: 17 (23 - 42)



Total Salivary Siga: 8 depressed (normal range is 25 - 60)

[aaron_e]

another supp that may be helpful is l-serine. it seems to work well in conjunction with tryptophan.

[Logan]

Well that was a short-lived respite from symptoms. 1 day of feeling COMPLETELY normal. But I'll take it. But by last night I felt the symptoms returning, which is par for the course and why I imagine I'm rapid cycling (ultra rapid) or mixed or whatever.

You may want to consider a low dose of lithium and a low dose of depakote, it works well for me, maybe it would work for you too. I think weight gain from lithium and depakote are dose dependent, lower doses may not be an issue. Also, if you feel better and have just enough energy, proper exercise, along with diet, should help stave off any potential for weight gain. I also take 10 mg Lexapro but may return to Zoloft at some point for several reasons.

Morgan, you take a lower dose of both lithium and depakote along with Lexapro? And you do not have any issues with fatigue or weight? This combination is totally controlling your symptoms and you feel normal?

I only take one or two lithium orotate tablets a day. My symptoms are not totally under control, but I have a very high tolerance for things like anxiety. My condition will likely improve with continuing to get back in shape, healing all my musculoskeletal issues, and some further tweaking of meds.

As far as fatigue is concerned, things have improved considerably since starting this regimen. I don't have the fatigue issues you have in response to SSRIs and other meds. As long as I get my brain closer to functioning normally and alleviate my depression and anxiety, my fatigue issues improve. I would say that I'm 60 percent improved upon where I was 5 months ago, to me that is huge. Shooting for 70- 75 percent improvement should always be the goal with medicaiton. Expecting 90 to 100 percent remission primarily as a result of medication is unrealistic. You have to do the work to get the rest of the way there.

[The Immortalist]

and if none of those are particularly helpful:

low carb diet + all of the above

I am doing the low carb approach now to address a possible fatty acid imbalance. Apparently arachidonic acid can do undesirable things and insulin stimulates its production. My personal theory is some people's ancestors ate a whole lot of fish and fewer carbs than the modern diet offers.

Here's a very good straight forward guide for getting into keto diets: http://forum.bodybui...php?t=132598293

Edited by The Immortalist, 29 April 2011 - 06:48 PM.

[aaron_e]

lots of good info at that link. thanks for posting it.

[Louise101]

Thanks everyone. I tried Bacopa (well, only for 2 days so far) but I couldn't find Ashwagandha yet. I do have Lithium Orotate but I just never felt anything from it. What I hate (HATE) the most is the rapid cycling, if that's what it is. Like I can feel totally normal all day. But then, like today, I get stressed over something unavoidable and I feel that horrible shift. Where suddenly I start to feel agitated and it grows. And that's when I start having suicidal thoughts, etc. It is so ridiculous! I can't believe I can't keep an even keel going for more than one day.

Perhaps I do need a mood stabilizer. :(

[Logan]

Thanks everyone. I tried Bacopa (well, only for 2 days so far) but I couldn't find Ashwagandha yet. I do have Lithium Orotate but I just never felt anything from it. What I hate (HATE) the most is the rapid cycling, if that's what it is. Like I can feel totally normal all day. But then, like today, I get stressed over something unavoidable and I feel that horrible shift. Where suddenly I start to feel agitated and it grows. And that's when I start having suicidal thoughts, etc. It is so ridiculous! I can't believe I can't keep an even keel going for more than one day.

Perhaps I do need a mood stabilizer. :(

Are you open to therapy? I get the sense that you have reservations about going.

I think starting a low dose of lithium, say 300 mg, would be a good start. If lithium does not work, talk to your doctor about Depakote ER generic, starting at 500 mg. A doctor is going to want to give you lamictal, but I think this drug is bad news. If all else fails, go for it, but only take it as a last resort.

[Logan]

Thanks everyone. I tried Bacopa (well, only for 2 days so far) but I couldn't find Ashwagandha yet. I do have Lithium Orotate but I just never felt anything from it. What I hate (HATE) the most is the rapid cycling, if that's what it is. Like I can feel totally normal all day. But then, like today, I get stressed over something unavoidable and I feel that horrible shift. Where suddenly I start to feel agitated and it grows. And that's when I start having suicidal thoughts, etc. It is so ridiculous! I can't believe I can't keep an even keel going for more than one day.

Perhaps I do need a mood stabilizer. :(

Are you open to therapy? I get the sense that you have reservations about going.

I think starting a low dose of lithium, say 300 mg, would be a good start. If lithium does not work, talk to your doctor about Depakote ER generic, starting at 500 mg. A doctor is going to want to give you lamictal, but I think this drug is bad news. If all else fails, go for it, but only take it as a last resort.

Try doubling or quadrupling the dose of lithium orotate and see what happens. One lithium orotate capsule containing 5 mg elemental lithium really won't do much of anything for most people.

Have you tried magnesium? Another one to try is New Chapter's Holy Basil supercritical extract in the softgel.

Edited by MorganM, 30 April 2011 - 03:24 AM.

[Louise101]

Are you open to therapy? I get the sense that you have reservations about going.

My reservations are due to the fact that I can't really imagine a lot of benefit from it. It costs lots of money and takes time. And I really feel like this is a physical problem. I just don't "get" how something that might have happened in childhood would cause rapid cycling like this. If I were triggered every time I saw a red car or if talking about money set me off, then I would see the point. But I just am just normal/depressed/irritable/normal/despondent all week long with no clear reason. It feels like my brain is broken. I've had work stress lately, and I became very escalated this week at one point (lots of crying, feeling out of control, suicidal). That is not a normal response. I have lots of relationships with normal types and I know for a fact that my brain is completely different from theirs. They respond appropriately to stress. They do not throw things or wish to jump off a bridge. And one of my best friends had a far more traumatic childhood than I did (ex: mom committed suicide and step mother was passive aggressive). Yet she's totally normal....her baseline is calm and happy, and when bad things happen she snaps back quickly. I envy that. In fact, most of the people in my life are like this, so that's what I am assuming NORMAL looks like. And it sure ain't me.

I will definitely try upping the dose of Lithium Orotate, thanks for that info. I always read that Lamictal was great for bipolar II. I absolutely hate drugs. I don't want to take any of them...I despise all the side effects and potential long-term issues. I think I read that Lamictal does something to calcium levels and could potentially cause issues with bone loss (but don't quote me on that). But there is always SOMETHING. The two people I know who are on Lithium are fat and have acne. I only mention it because those are two side effects that I am not interested in. But I did listen to you, Morgan re: low dosing it.

Edited by Louise101, 30 April 2011 - 04:13 AM.

[Logan]

Are you open to therapy? I get the sense that you have reservations about going.

My reservations are due to the fact that I can't really imagine a lot of benefit from it. It costs lots of money and takes time. And I really feel like this is a physical problem. I just don't "get" how something that might have happened in childhood would cause rapid cycling like this. If I were triggered every time I saw a red car or if talking about money set me off, then I would see the point. But I just am just normal/depressed/irritable/normal/despondent all week long with no clear reason. It feels like my brain is broken. I've had work stress lately, and I became very escalated this week at one point (lots of crying, feeling out of control, suicidal). That is not a normal response. I have lots of relationships with normal types and I know for a fact that my brain is completely different from theirs. They respond appropriately to stress. They do not throw things or wish to jump off a bridge. And one of my best friends had a far more traumatic childhood than I did (ex: mom committed suicide and step mother was passive aggressive). Yet she's totally normal....her baseline is calm and happy, and when bad things happen she snaps back quickly. I envy that. In fact, most of the people in my life are like this, so that's what I am assuming NORMAL looks like. And it sure ain't me.

I will definitely try upping the dose of Lithium Orotate, thanks for that info. I always read that Lamictal was great for bipolar II. I absolutely hate drugs. I don't want to take any of them...I despise all the side effects and potential long-term issues. I think I read that Lamictal does something to calcium levels and could potentially cause issues with bone loss (but don't quote me on that). But there is always SOMETHING. The two people I know who are on Lithium are fat and have acne. I only mention it because those are two side effects that I am not interested in. But I did listen to you, Morgan re: low dosing it.

I only mention therapy because you mentioned childhood was not always good with your parents fighting all the time. This causes inner anger and anxiety that just do not disappear. Since these elements may be lingering within, you're biological reactions may be much greater as a result. You sound like everyone else that does not want to deal with reality. Just blame it on the brain, there's nothing else going on here. I'm sorry, I hope you don't take this too personally. Until you've actually taken time to study psychology some and spent some time in therapy, you may not ever fully understand the complex interaction between biology and psyche and the impact on behavior. The two really are one and the same. If you really want to do what's best for yourself and your child, you will go to therapy. I would suggest talking to friends or anyone that has had a positive experience with it and had a good therapist.

What that I mentioned in my previous posts did not make sense to you? I'm only assuming it did not because you had no response and still seem to be in denial that you have any issues that could be affecting your daily life and behavior. This is the sad state of much of the world, complete utter denial.

As far as drugs are concerned, if you continue to worry about ever side effect you might experience and this interferes with being open to new treatments, you will never be better. I think therapy is similar for most people, they subconsciously fear the reality and truth that they may have to fact, so they don't go and they don't ever truly get better and grow. You know there are measures you can take to try to counteract potential side effects of medications. I can almost guarantee if you eat a more primal or paleo diet and get proper exercise 4 to 5 times a week, you will not have a real weight gain issue on moderate doses of some medications.

Edited by MorganM, 30 April 2011 - 06:19 AM.