52 replies to this topic

[The Immortalist]

I was trying to find the life expectancy of pro bodybuilders but I couldn't find anything. What do you guy's think it is? Arnolds still alive (63 years old as of now). Many pros like Steve Reeves and Reg Park lived past their seventies.
Since medical science keeps advancing won't they be able to cure the potential side effects of all the drugs bodybuilders are taking?

[leha]

I don't know, but another aspect of this that makes it interesting is the whole protein angle. Body builders typically load up on protein, and CR science seems to support that all that protein will shorten their lives, so there is a question of how much benefit the exercise has, versus how much potential negative impact from excess protein. Teasing these factors apart could be tricky.

[firespin]

I was trying to find the life expectancy of pro bodybuilders but I couldn't find anything. What do you guy's think it is? Arnolds still alive (63 years old as of now). Many pros like Steve Reeves and Reg Park lived past their seventies.
Since medical science keeps advancing won't they be able to cure the potential side effects of all the drugs bodybuilders are taking?

When you say drugs do you mean steroids? The side-effects are basically the drug doing damage to the bodybuilder’s cells and even possibly their DNA, like aging does. Once medical science is advanced enough to end aging, it should also be able to repair a human’s body from drug damage…but we don’t know how fast medical science will advance in the future, so I would refrain from taking drugs. Just because there are some people who will have a normal lifespan while taking drugs, doesn’t mean everyone will. For example there are some centenarians who smoked cigarettes all their lives and never had health problems, but for most smoking will shorten your lifespan and increase the risk of getting cancer.
Why not just take the recommended amount of natural supplements to help build muscle?

[platypus]

I was trying to find the life expectancy of pro bodybuilders but I couldn't find anything. What do you guy's think it is? Arnolds still alive (63 years old as of now). Many pros like Steve Reeves and Reg Park lived past their seventies.
Since medical science keeps advancing won't they be able to cure the potential side effects of all the drugs bodybuilders are taking?

Why would you want to be a pro bodybuilder, are you developing a muscle-fetish? I cannot imagine hanging around with people taking high amounts of performance enhancing drugs is healthy in the long. Natural bodybuilding has less risks off course.

[Skötkonung]

I don't know, but another aspect of this that makes it interesting is the whole protein angle. Body builders typically load up on protein, and CR science seems to support that all that protein will shorten their lives, so there is a question of how much benefit the exercise has, versus how much potential negative impact from excess protein. Teasing these factors apart could be tricky.

Definitely interesting -- does a lifetime of exercise and mostly healthy eating counteract a hyper stimulation of mTOR. I would argue that to some extent it does.

I still think the holy grail of longevity for non CR people is regular exercise plus normal protein intake. You can build decent musculature this way.. there is no need to become a protein junkie.

[Robert C]

About 8 years ago I got to know a guy on a social basis (I have forgotten his name) who was at that time the number 3 ranked heavy weight bodybuilder in the US. Very friendly fellow and he seemed socially very normal. He looked like one of those strange looking guys on the cover of bodybuilding magazines. His wife told my wife that he was unable to have children (no surprise there) and his doctors advised him that if he kept up his drug abuse he had at most 10 years to live. He was probably about 32 or so then.

I think bodybuilders today use way more drugs than in the past. They inject a very high dose combo of testosterone, growth hormone and insulin. That is why they keep getting bigger and bigger as the years go. I doubt if many of today's top bodybuilders will live a long life.

[The Immortalist]

About 8 years ago I got to know a guy on a social basis (I have forgotten his name) who was at that time the number 3 ranked heavy weight bodybuilder in the US. Very friendly fellow and he seemed socially very normal. He looked like one of those strange looking guys on the cover of bodybuilding magazines. His wife told my wife that he was unable to have children (no surprise there) and his doctors advised him that if he kept up his drug abuse he had at most 10 years to live. He was probably about 32 or so then.

I think bodybuilders today use way more drugs than in the past. They inject a very high dose combo of testosterone, growth hormone and insulin. That is why they keep getting bigger and bigger as the years go. I doubt if many of today's top bodybuilders will live a long life.

Well Ronnie Coleman who's the best bodybuilder ever who also probably abused many different combinations of drugs is still alive at age 47 today. He's even making a comeback after a 3 year hiatus after having an injury.

Edited by The Immortalist, 13 July 2011 - 12:48 AM.

[niner]

I doubt if many of today's top bodybuilders will live a long life.

Well Ronnie Coleman who's the best bodybuilder ever who also probably abused many different combinations of drugs is still alive at age 47 today.

47 isn't a long life. It wasn't even a long life a century ago. IMO today's 'bodybuilders' are just chemical freaks. I think they are bad examples. Look at a guy like Jack LaLanne. He never looked like a freak and he lived to 96. Probably would have lived a lot longer but he got pneumonia, which can kill a 30 year old.

[The Immortalist]

I doubt if many of today's top bodybuilders will live a long life.

Well Ronnie Coleman who's the best bodybuilder ever who also probably abused many different combinations of drugs is still alive at age 47 today.

47 isn't a long life. It wasn't even a long life a century ago. IMO today's 'bodybuilders' are just chemical freaks. I think they are bad examples. Look at a guy like Jack LaLanne. He never looked like a freak and he lived to 96. Probably would have lived a lot longer but he got pneumonia, which can kill a 30 year old.

So you think Ronnie Coleman's going to die some time this year or the next? I doubt it. We'll see.

Edited by The Immortalist, 13 July 2011 - 07:29 PM.

[VidX]

The extend of ABUSE that's going on in pro bb'ing is hardly imaginable by general ppl, and by ppl who have some knowledge of how hormones work. I'm a bodybuilder too, I know a lot of guys on diff levels of bb'ing, and honestly - even I am surprised guys doesn't drop dead like flies. It probably means just one thing - that abuse is not THAT dangerous as it may theoretically seem to be. Trust me - the amouns/doses are ridiculous, of everything. Insulin being the latest holy grail for the past 15 years or so. That stuff is a piece of crap, it basically ruined bb'ing, tho' it produces freaks, when used on the top of other goodies. Overall - if abusing hormones to that extent would be very dangerous - we'd see a LOT of guys having many health isuues, serious ones, but it does not really happen. BUT - life expectancy, esp. of the GH/slin generation remains a big question as most of these guys are still very young, in their 40's or so..

[VidX]

So you think Ronnie Coleman's going to die some time this year or the next? I doubt it. We'll see.

The amount of beating Ronnies body had is unbelieveable, and he's still damn huge, looking young and going strong. The magic of hormones still working...

[The Immortalist]

The extend of ABUSE that's going on in pro bb'ing is hardly imaginable by general ppl, and by ppl who have some knowledge of how hormones work. I'm a bodybuilder too, I know a lot of guys on diff levels of bb'ing, and honestly - even I am surprised guys doesn't drop dead like flies. It probably means just one thing - that abuse is not THAT dangerous as it may theoretically seem to be. Trust me - the amouns/doses are ridiculous, of everything. Insulin being the latest holy grail for the past 15 years or so. That stuff is a piece of crap, it basically ruined bb'ing, tho' it produces freaks, when used on the top of other goodies. Overall - if abusing hormones to that extent would be very dangerous - we'd see a LOT of guys having many health isuues, serious ones, but it does not really happen. BUT - life expectancy, esp. of the GH/slin generation remains a big question as most of these guys are still very young, in their 40's or so..

Can you please aware me on all the different stuff the pros take and estimates of what you think are the doses they take?

I'm a bodybuilder in training who's 18. I'm going to be a natural bodybuilder for now. My goal is to become the top natural bodybuilder in the world. After I complete that goal I'm going to start taking all the drugs the pros do and become Mr Olympia. Why you ask? I'm doing it as safeguard because if I can't even become the best natural bodybuilder, I couldn't possibly become Mr Olympia. Also if I take all the drugs and don't become mr olympia it will be for naught and I would sacrifice my health for nothing. At least knowing I'm the best natural body builder I have a really good chance at becoming the best real bodybuilder.

[niner]

So you think Ronnie Coleman's going to die some time this year or the next? I doubt it. We'll see.

47 just sounds ancient to you because you're so young. If Ronnie lives another twenty years, he will make it to 67. 67 = Longevity FAIL. Do you think he will make it that long?

[The Immortalist]

So you think Ronnie Coleman's going to die some time this year or the next? I doubt it. We'll see.

47 just sounds ancient to you because you're so young. If Ronnie lives another twenty years, he will make it to 67. 67 = Longevity FAIL. Do you think he will make it that long?

I don't see why he couldn't live to 80 or 90. And I don't know what your talking about 47 being ancient. IMO 47 is young.

Edited by The Immortalist, 13 July 2011 - 09:40 PM.

[VidX]

Can you please aware me on all the different stuff the pros take and estimates of what you think are the doses they take?

I'm a bodybuilder in training who's 18. I'm going to be a natural bodybuilder for now. My goal is to become the top natural bodybuilder in the world. After I complete that goal I'm going to start taking all the drugs the pros do and become Mr Olympia. Why you ask? I'm doing it as safeguard because if I can't even become the best natural bodybuilder, I couldn't possibly become Mr Olympia. Also if I take all the drugs and don't become mr olympia it will be for naught and I would sacrifice my health for nothing. At least knowing I'm the best natural body builder I have a really good chance at becoming the best real bodybuilder.

First: there's really no "natural bodybuilding". If you speak about foundation - then yes, a few years of building a natural foundation would make your chances better (tho read the second part).

Second: most of the current pros, these who started while in their teens, were on drugs from a get go, or almost like that. You'd up your chances of becoming a pro (at first. To become mr.O you need to have superios response to drugs + good structure.) if you'd start hormonizing now. I personally know 18yos who are on GH already. And this is not uncommon at all these days. Guys at an international level (lets take Europe as an example) are already on so much stuff it'd be enough to supply a whole hospital lol..
If you ask the doses. It depends. But it's in grams of certain products, and in grams of the sumf of these certain products. It's GH year round (really expensive) it's orals taken by extreme doses, at certain periods of preparation/growth, it's rotating your injectables certain way, upping the doses constantly and hoping your body will take it well (so being able to abuse hormones and avoid sides is genetics too). Later on it's BP meds, some can't avoid painkillers (which are teh actual cause of many health issues, regarding liver, etc.. usualy. As some guys can't stop booze, even being on meds like that.. Actually - many guys are stupid enough to do that). Harsh compounds like trenbolone, and abuse of it is a must if you want to become a freak. It's not a gym rat game, to become a professional. It takes an exptreme person to succeed in this extreme sport, trust me. There's no stop at anything if you've set your mind on becoming a pro, there can't be any.

So...in my personal opinion - hormones are a great thing to become a little bit more of a "super human"/trans-human (you really become a "machine"/a superman, if used right) but you need to know what are you doing, you need to know how are your body is dealing with all that, basically - you need to be conscious about that and be ready to sacrifice. maybe even your longevity.

[niner]

So you think Ronnie Coleman's going to die some time this year or the next? I doubt it. We'll see.

47 just sounds ancient to you because you're so young. If Ronnie lives another twenty years, he will make it to 67. 67 = Longevity FAIL. Do you think he will make it that long?

I don't see why he couldn't live to 80 or 90. And I don't know what your talking about 47 being ancient. IMO 47 is young.

You said Ronnie was 47 and still going strong as though it was an 'old age'. I was saying that 47 is young! I'm glad you think it's young also, but it kind of blows your argument about the safety of BB drugs. Do you really think a guy who has abused his body that much could live to 90? Only 43 years to go. We'll see...

[The Immortalist]

Can you please aware me on all the different stuff the pros take and estimates of what you think are the doses they take?

I'm a bodybuilder in training who's 18. I'm going to be a natural bodybuilder for now. My goal is to become the top natural bodybuilder in the world. After I complete that goal I'm going to start taking all the drugs the pros do and become Mr Olympia. Why you ask? I'm doing it as safeguard because if I can't even become the best natural bodybuilder, I couldn't possibly become Mr Olympia. Also if I take all the drugs and don't become mr olympia it will be for naught and I would sacrifice my health for nothing. At least knowing I'm the best natural body builder I have a really good chance at becoming the best real bodybuilder.

First: there's really no "natural bodybuilding". If you speak about foundation - then yes, a few years of building a natural foundation would make your chances better (tho read the second part).

Second: most of the current pros, these who started while in their teens, were on drugs from a get go, or almost like that. You'd up your chances of becoming a pro (at first. To become mr.O you need to have superios response to drugs + good structure.) if you'd start hormonizing now. I personally know 18yos who are on GH already. And this is not uncommon at all these days. Guys at an international level (lets take Europe as an example) are already on so much stuff it'd be enough to supply a whole hospital lol..
If you ask the doses. It depends. But it's in grams of certain products, and in grams of the sumf of these certain products. It's GH year round (really expensive) it's orals taken by extreme doses, at certain periods of preparation/growth, it's rotating your injectables certain way, upping the doses constantly and hoping your body will take it well (so being able to abuse hormones and avoid sides is genetics too). Later on it's BP meds, some can't avoid painkillers (which are teh actual cause of many health issues, regarding liver, etc.. usualy. As some guys can't stop booze, even being on meds like that.. Actually - many guys are stupid enough to do that). Harsh compounds like trenbolone, and abuse of it is a must if you want to become a freak. It's not a gym rat game, to become a professional. It takes an exptreme person to succeed in this extreme sport, trust me. There's no stop at anything if you've set your mind on becoming a pro, there can't be any.

So...in my personal opinion - hormones are a great thing to become a little bit more of a "super human"/trans-human (you really become a "machine"/a superman, if used right) but you need to know what are you doing, you need to know how are your body is dealing with all that, basically - you need to be conscious about that and be ready to sacrifice. maybe even your longevity.

What do you mean there is no such thing as "natural" bodybuilding? Isn't there natural bodybuilding contests that are strict about the types substances you can take? What about Layne Norton? He's natural right?

All of those hormones must be extremely expensive. How do they possibly afford all of that stuff year round? How do they even find out how to buy that stuff without getting arrested? How does one even learn how to use all those hormones in the most effective way? PM me since mods will probably delete any post related to getting illegal hormones and stuff.

[platypus]

What do you mean there is no such thing as "natural" bodybuilding? Isn't there natural bodybuilding contests that are strict about the types substances you can take? What about Layne Norton? He's natural right?

On Superhumanradio someone called himself an over-the-counter bodybuilder instead of "natural".

How are your genes? I mean, if your genetics are not top notch for BB I doubt you can make the gains to be the world's best "natural" BB. And then there's the real issue of muscle proportions & genes too (aesthetics).

edit: also, hanging around pro bodybuilders is not healthy. Those people have lost all sense of proportion and one has to wonder if their obsession is actually a fetish (i.e. somehow sexually motivated).

Edited by platypus, 14 July 2011 - 08:16 AM.

[VidX]

[
What do you mean there is no such thing as "natural" bodybuilding? Isn't there natural bodybuilding contests that are strict about the types substances you can take? What about Layne Norton? He's natural right?

All of those hormones must be extremely expensive. How do they possibly afford all of that stuff year round? How do they even find out how to buy that stuff without getting arrested? How does one even learn how to use all those hormones in the most effective way? PM me since mods will probably delete any post related to getting illegal hormones and stuff.

"natural bodybuilding" is a joke. Guys take the same stuff, just in doff. forms (like suspension, orals or other stuff that leaves the system very fast. GH of course..). Layne is just one of the liars out there, who makes money out of naive people, nothing more.

They won't delete anything, it's a board partly about self-enhancement on a mollecular level, anyway. It is expensive, tho' many up and comming guys manage to raise the funds needed (later on sponsors help, but ity's a LONG way).. It's really sacrifising your life, if you aren't millionaire. Many are doing something illegal to bring the money in, because you really don't have much time/energy to work 8 to 5 type of work. Bodybuilding is a diff world. If you'll be determined enough - you'll get money, and you'll find good sources (not that hard. Well, LEGIT ones may be difficult, I mean these who doesn't sell underdosed/bunk stuff). I'm not sure about getting arrested, but there are few places in the world where you'd have probs with keeping hormones for your own usage. It's really not an issue at all. In many places you can even sell and be calm...
How to use in an effective ways - it's either trial and error, or finding so called "guru", guys who prepared many other guys and know how to work these substances in the right way.

p.s. - and really, you won't see much of the potential you have being a "natural", ecxcept maybe muscle shape, how you hold water on your body.. the real revelation will come only when you'll get on hormones, the right ones, in the right way, of course. So find clever people to help you. You can be skinny f*ck, somewhat muscular as a natural, but nothing to talk about, but if you have a good response - you'll become a freak, while some other guy who's seemingly "thicker" and "bigger" as a natural may have a poor reaction or more susceptible to sides and won't make it anywhere...

Edited by VidX, 14 July 2011 - 09:44 AM.

[The Immortalist]

How are your genes? I mean, if your genetics are not top notch for BB I doubt you can make the gains to be the world's best "natural" BB. And then there's the real issue of muscle proportions & genes too (aesthetics).

This is me at 15. I don't have a camera right now so I don't have any up to date pics. Do I got that dere bb'ing genetics?

(picture deleted at request)

Edited by Shannon Vyff, 12 December 2011 - 06:35 PM.

[platypus]

The estimated chances for reaching the top level in several sports:

http://www.ncaa.org/...ob of Competing

[VidX]

Jim Morris at 75, after 50years of bb'ing (and I'm sure - not much less decades on being on hormones) seems to be doing pretty well, to say the least (actually I think he may be the most jacked person at that age). Just look at that: http://www.ironmanma...s-lt-interview/

[The Immortalist]

The estimated chances for reaching the top level in several sports:

http://www.ncaa.org/...ob of Competing

Bodybuilding isn't a sport it's a male beauty contest lol

[platypus]

You want to make a living by competing in beauty contests? h

[platypus]

Do you want to make a living by competing in beauty contests? I just posted the link to make the point that trying to reach the top in any highly competitive area is extremely hard and therefore not the safest bet career-wise.

Edited by platypus, 16 July 2011 - 05:45 PM.

[InquilineKea]

Jim Morris at 75, after 50years of bb'ing (and I'm sure - not much less decades on being on hormones) seems to be doing pretty well, to say the least (actually I think he may be the most jacked person at that age). Just look at that: http://www.ironmanma...s-lt-interview/

well, he's vegan.

but SHEESH. he easily could pass off as someone 30 years younger. I've NEVER seen a 75-year old look so young.

[TheFountain]

I was trying to find the life expectancy of pro bodybuilders but I couldn't find anything. What do you guy's think it is? Arnolds still alive (63 years old as of now). Many pros like Steve Reeves and Reg Park lived past their seventies.
Since medical science keeps advancing won't they be able to cure the potential side effects of all the drugs bodybuilders are taking?

When you say drugs do you mean steroids? The side-effects are basically the drug doing damage to the bodybuilder's cells and even possibly their DNA, like aging does. Once medical science is advanced enough to end aging, it should also be able to repair a human's body from drug damage…but we don't know how fast medical science will advance in the future, so I would refrain from taking drugs. Just because there are some people who will have a normal lifespan while taking drugs, doesn't mean everyone will. For example there are some centenarians who smoked cigarettes all their lives and never had health problems, but for most smoking will shorten your lifespan and increase the risk of getting cancer.
Why not just take the recommended amount of natural supplements to help build muscle?

It is a foregone conclusion that we do not really need to point out the exceptions to the rule in this context.

[JohnD60]

Jim Morris at 75, after 50years of bb'ing (and I'm sure - not much less decades on being on hormones) seems to be doing pretty well, to say the least (actually I think he may be the most jacked person at that age). Just look at that: http://www.ironmanma...s-lt-interview/

well, he's vegan.

but SHEESH. he easily could pass off as someone 30 years younger. I've NEVER seen a 75-year old look so young.

Since you bumpted this two year old thread, I will say that to me Jim Morris looks like a 70 year old with a great body, there is a guy at my gym that could be his slightly younger cousin.

[nowayout]

Lou Ferrigno looks pretty good for 61. Not that old yet, but impressive compared to the typical 61 year old.

[renfr]

Too much muscle is as harmful as too much fat, so if you're talking about massive bodybuilders then most of them won't really live very long.
Overall those who abuse steroids, AIs and diuretics, AIs increase significantly risk of stroke and steroids reduce heart ejection fraction which in turns can lead to stroke and permanent organ damage (Andreas munzer got heart hypertrophy and bouts of cancer).
A healthy bodybuilder will certainly live long but those who go to the extremes might not for the vast majority.