10 replies to this topic

[Matt79]

Hi All

I've done a few blood tests over a 6 month period

S-Lithium mmol/L Monthly 0.1 0.2 0.21 0.26

My lithium levels are below the reference range by quite a large factor. 0.6 (low) to 1.2 (high). I'm averaging 0.2 :(

Is this a problem long term? What do you think causes it? All my other levels are mostly normal. TST and SHBG very high and IL-6 is super high (but thats cos of my rheumatoid arthritis).

Could it be from drinking purified water?

Edited by Matt79, 31 August 2011 - 10:15 PM.

[JLL]

Purified water is a likely cause in my opinion. See this post:
Lithium in Drinking Water May Lead to Longer Life


I'm taking a lithium supplement since it seems like a pretty good bet. Too bad there's no data on the lithium content of tap water in Finland.

[Lufega]

I found I had the same problem a while back. Even though I was using lithium orotate for a while, my levels where extremely low. In my case, I have a type of congenital emphysema that leads to lung destruction. Lithium is used by the body to activate the Wnt/Beta-catenin pathway by inhibiting GSK3b and this in turn, leads to regeneration of the lung. In fact, lithium is now on my anti-copd protocol and it's one of the only things out there that can help the lungs heal effectively.

You say you have RA ? From what I remember reading, this pathway is overly activated in RA in an attempt to induce repair (?). I'm not sure what effect supplementing with Lithium would have on the outcome of the problem but this is the direction your research should be focused on.

[Lufega]

[Mechanism of cartilage matrix remodeling by Wnt].

Wnt proteins play central roles in a variety of developmental processes and regulate cell differentiation, cell fate and cell proliferation. It has been also demonstrated that Wnt proteins profoundly participate in cartilage development. Interestingly, activation of Wnt/beta-catenin signaling in chondrocytes induces a profile of matrix degradation enzymes quite similar to that of cartilage matrix degradation such as osteoarthritis and rheumatoid arthritis. In this review we discuss the involvement of Wnt/beta-catenin signaling in pathological cartilage matrix degradation.

Would be a good idea to read the entire paper. The part in bold seems to be an observation, not a conclusion.
PMID:19798028 This study says that preventing the inhibition of Wnt helps repair bone erosion in joints. So using Lithium in therapeutic doses might be a good idea. Some caution is warranted though. Wnt beta catenin is activated in cancers. This is not worrisome if you don't already have cancer. The problem is, most popular supplements (curcumin, resveratrol, quercetin) and have anti-inflammatory properties, are also anti-cancer by inhibiting the beta catenin pathway. So they may retard healing in your case and mine.

Edited by Lufega, 01 September 2011 - 10:02 PM.

[Lufega]

This one seems conclusive.

Tipping the balance: modulating the Wnt pathway for tissue repair.

The Wnt signaling pathway has a crucial role in regulating cell growth and differentiation and is required for tissue homeostasis and repair. Although constitutive activation of the Wnt pathway can lead to abnormal cell growth and cancer, modulation of Wnt signaling might have a therapeutic benefit for tissue regeneration in numerous diseases. Recently, preclinical studies have demonstrated that treatments with antibodies against the Wnt inhibitor Dickkopf1 (DKK1) and with the positive Wnt modulator R-Spondin1 (RSpo1) were sufficient to repair the bone lesions in multiple myeloma and rheumatoid arthritis and to restore the damaged mucosa in experimental colitis, respectively. A remarkable balance is set for Wnt signaling by secreted proteins such as RSpo1 and DKK1, which help to regulate tissue homeostasis. As physiological Wnt response is essential for the regeneration of damaged tissues, modulation of the Wnt pathway might be beneficial for the treatment of multiple human diseases.
PMID:19187992

Edited by Lufega, 01 September 2011 - 10:08 PM.

[Brainbox]

Naproxen, often used by RA patients, is able to increase lithium levels, resulting in the need for screening when taking this combination, but also might be part of a solution?

http://www.ncbi.nlm..../pubmed/3711365



Lithium interaction with sulindac and naproxen.

Ragheb M, Powell AL.

Abstract

The interaction of lithium with sulindac and naproxen was studied in six sulindac-treated and seven naproxen-treated patients admitted to a geropsychiatry ward. Patients under a steady state lithium level received lithium for 3 days, then lithium + sulindac (300 mg/day) or naproxen (750 mg/day) for 6 days, and then lithium alone for 5 days. Sulindac failed to affect serum lithium levels and lithium clearance. The results with naproxen showed marked interindividual variations ranging from no increase to a 41.9% increase in serum lithium levels within 5 days. There was a corresponding decrease in lithium clearance in naproxen-treated patients. Patients undergoing lithium therapy might need a reduction of their lithium dosage following naproxen administration. More frequent serum lithium level determinations are required following initiation of naproxen therapy until the magnitude of the lithium-naproxen drug interaction can be adequately assessed in a given individual.

PMID: 3711365 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]

Edited by Brainbox, 04 September 2011 - 12:44 PM.

[Lufega]

I just checked mine again for comparison. The result was <0.20 mmol. It's so low, it couldn't be quantified exactly. Mind you, I've been taking 15 mg every night for months. Maybe I should increase the dose, or perhaps, combine it with something and increases renal absorption.

What do you all think ?

[August59]

Vimmortal has some lithium in it. so shouldn't it have sme benefit?

[Matt79]

Thanks guys, I've just been scared to take it. But I think a deficiency could be bad. It's better to have serum levels in the normal range I reckon.

[Matt79]

Furthermore I read somewhere that lithium deficiency was linked with autism :(

[Cephalon]

Regarding Finland and Lithium in drinking water:
As far as I know glacier water is very low in minerals, so I conclude the lithium content is also low. The deeper the spring the better. At least does that match to my observations. In case you drink bottled glacier water, you should look for spring water.