2626 replies to this topic

[calm--]

I've been experimenting with CILTEP for about 2 weeks. I can feel the positives effects like improved mood, sociability and motivation to learn. In the beginning, I followed the basic stacks written on the first page : Solaray 3.85 mg forskolin + 2 now artichoke extract + 750 mg alcar + 500 mg phenylalanine.

 

But I found out phenylalanine made me "dumb". I had trouble thinking. I had trouble making simple decisions. I also take piracetam 3 x 800 mg everyday. Before starting ciltep, I'm good at conversations because of piracetam. I said funny and smart things. But since taking ciltep with phenylalanine, that's all gone. When someone talked to me, I just stared at them, don't know what to say. I also tried b-complex with the phenylalanine, but it doesn't help.

 

When I drop phenylalanine, I feel good again. I can feel that I'm not being "dumb" anymore. I can feel my brain is back to normal. The good effects of piracetam is back. And I can feel that ciltep improve my mood and sociability. I talked to talk to people I usually don't talk to. I laughed more when watching comedy movie.

 

But another problem occurred. I'm getting more and more tired everyday. I took long nap. I had trouble concentrating during my soccer game. My appetite declined. I tried to increase alcar to 1g, but it didn't help.

 

Then this morning I tried adding phenylalanine again, but in 250 mg. Few minutes after taking it, I feel kinda sedated and "dumb" again. I had trouble making conversation and making decision again. But the good thing is, I'm not as tired as before.

 

So it seems that I do need a dopamine source to prevent fatigue, but for whatever reason, phenylalanine isn't working for me. 

 

Can anyone suggest other dopamine source, and in what dosage?

 

I have a bottle of 500 mg tyrosine, so I'm gonna tried 1 capsule tomorrow. But my experience with tyrosine in the past hasn't been very good. Mostly made me anxious, so I'm not putting much hope on it. I also have Now Ginkgo Biloba 60 mg, but I don't what's the dosage. Also have a bottle of 500 mg TMG, but I don't know if I can use TMG for this purpose.

Edited by looking at the sky, 13 August 2014 - 09:24 AM.

[calm--]

Forgot to state that I also have Manganese 8 mg. But I don't know whether I can use it for this purpose.

[monopoliya]

Hey, guys. I'm from Ukraine. Now it is very difficult period in my life. I have an average degree of depression and very strong anhedonia and apathy to everything. I think something with dopamine receptors. Previously, I played a lot of computer games, and the other was attractive. I am very afraid of the side effects of SSRIs, which can kill my potency and some more. But I realized I need to restore neurogenesis. I also increased cortisol judging by the daily urine analysis. But the disease of the adrenal and pituitary glands are excluded. Now I only accept moclobemide, which is safer. But he almost did not work on me. I thought to start with forskolin. Advise what better (I would not consider it for advertising). What else to add? 

[p3x888]

I've been experimenting with CILTEP for about 2 weeks. I can feel the positives effects like improved mood, sociability and motivation to learn. In the beginning, I followed the basic stacks written on the first page : Solaray 3.85 mg forskolin + 2 now artichoke extract + 750 mg alcar + 500 mg phenylalanine.

 

But I found out phenylalanine made me "dumb". I had trouble thinking. I had trouble making simple decisions. I also take piracetam 3 x 800 mg everyday. Before starting ciltep, I'm good at conversations because of piracetam. I said funny and smart things. But since taking ciltep with phenylalanine, that's all gone. When someone talked to me, I just stared at them, don't know what to say. I also tried b-complex with the phenylalanine, but it doesn't help.

 

 

 

I had this same issue. But as was suggested to me in this thread, I dropped tyrosine and upped the amount of phenylalanine. I use the already prepared CILTEP and I just added a sepraate pill of phenylalanine and the tiredness went away.

 

I don't know if this will help you or not.
 

[calm--]

 

I've been experimenting with CILTEP for about 2 weeks. I can feel the positives effects like improved mood, sociability and motivation to learn. In the beginning, I followed the basic stacks written on the first page : Solaray 3.85 mg forskolin + 2 now artichoke extract + 750 mg alcar + 500 mg phenylalanine.

 

But I found out phenylalanine made me "dumb". I had trouble thinking. I had trouble making simple decisions. I also take piracetam 3 x 800 mg everyday. Before starting ciltep, I'm good at conversations because of piracetam. I said funny and smart things. But since taking ciltep with phenylalanine, that's all gone. When someone talked to me, I just stared at them, don't know what to say. I also tried b-complex with the phenylalanine, but it doesn't help.

 

 

 

I had this same issue. But as was suggested to me in this thread, I dropped tyrosine and upped the amount of phenylalanine. I use the already prepared CILTEP and I just added a sepraate pill of phenylalanine and the tiredness went away.

 

I don't know if this will help you or not.
 

 

 

Thanks. I just switched phenylalanine with tyrosine, and it actually works better for me. I still feel mental fatigue, but at least tyrosine doesn't make me "dumb".

 

What I meant with mental fatigue is, I have trouble doing things that require bigger mental effort like conversation and soccer game. Or even writing this reply. Sometimes I feel spacey and difficult to concentrate when doing those.

 

Right now my stack is : 3.85 mg forskolin + 2 now artichoke + 750 mg alcar + 500 mg tyrosine.

 

I'm gonna add B-complex tomorrow. If that doesn't work, I plan to increase tyrosine to 1000 mg.

 

If those still doesn't work, I have a shipment of some dopamine precursors coming : catuaba, nalt, dlpa

Edited by looking at the sky, 16 August 2014 - 11:43 AM.

[calm--]

Hey, guys. I'm from Ukraine. Now it is very difficult period in my life. I have an average degree of depression and very strong anhedonia and apathy to everything. I think something with dopamine receptors. Previously, I played a lot of computer games, and the other was attractive. I am very afraid of the side effects of SSRIs, which can kill my potency and some more. But I realized I need to restore neurogenesis. I also increased cortisol judging by the daily urine analysis. But the disease of the adrenal and pituitary glands are excluded. Now I only accept moclobemide, which is safer. But he almost did not work on me. I thought to start with forskolin. Advise what better (I would not consider it for advertising). What else to add? 

 

I also had depression, which has been helped tremendously by piracetam and ciltep. I definitely recommend you to try ciltep. I can already feel improved mood, motivation and sociability. The only problem I have with ciltep right now is mental fatigue, which I'm still working to fix.

 

I advise you to start with the basic requirement stack shown on the first page, which is forskolin + artichoke + alcar + phenylalanine + b complex. Then start tweaking it from there. I tried with only forskolin and artichoke before, and while I can feel the improved motivation, my mood wasn't very good. I got very tired and took some really long nap.

 

Like when trying any nootropics, I always have to go through a series of bad days before starting to see results.

[monopoliya]

I agree with you. But I think that all the precursors are not the main driving force. L-dopa is considered addictive and should be increasing the dose. Therefore, I will never use it. Now my diet is very good, but I will soon buy vitamin b complex. However, the main effect would be desirable to make pde4 inhibitors and forskolin (as high as possible dosage). By the way, I, too, there is some "stupid" in the head. It may even have the same biochemistry of the brain with you. Or at least it looks like. Piracetam is not bad, but yet at the level of placebo. I feel that I lack norepinephrine, as I fall into bed and constantly yawning. Memory is getting worse, if I do not rest for 10-12 hours. Moclobemide helped a little, but I'm afraid that then dismounting from him I do not get worse. And it is in my 17 years =) Very cool caffeine helps, but when it ceases to work even worse (((

[calm--]

You might be right that the dopamine precursor is not the main driving force. AFAIK, it is there to prevent fatigue. In simple term, from what I can understand, CILTEP burn dopamine in your brain, and you need to consume some dopamine precursor to replace them. I think the general consensus for phenylalanine is that it's pretty safe. But, there seems to be some people who don't need the dopamine precursor, so you may try without it first.

 

You shouldn't take forskolin as high as possible. The ideal dosage is around 4 mg. Too high might make you more tired.

[monopoliya]

Thank you. I will dispense forskolin. Also, I'll go a couple of tests intended endocrinologist. Maybe I have a problem with high prolactin

[Mr. Pink]

I tried CLTP in various doses and forms, with and without vinpocetine, among other things, for 6 months and kept a journal of my experiences.  I experienced  somewhat improved mood and sociability but decreased working memory.

i had this problem, until I added ALCAR. It was suggested that it may be from forskolin because it may increase acetylcholinesterase (the enzyme that decreases ACH), however I feel it was from the artichoke, since i've tried the ingredients seperately.

[Godof Smallthings]

Thank you. I will dispense forskolin. Also, I'll go a couple of tests intended endocrinologist. Maybe I have a problem with high prolactin

 

This sounds silly or banal perhaps, but I would not recommend it if I had not seen it working in myself:

 

Walk for 45 minutes - 1 hour every day (I prefer mornings). Fresh air, sunshine and the changing surroundings help to boost mood in depression (amongst others, it increases the size of the hippocampus, which is reduced in depression).

 

Repeating the walk every day turns it into a habit. Forming a new habit leads to motivation for other positive changes.

Edited by Godof Smallthings, 17 August 2014 - 07:06 AM.

[monopoliya]

thank you. But the sport does not help me very much. I've been with them for 14 years (running, pull-ups, gym). Now I'm 17 and the last two months, I gave up the case. It's not much I can help, except that a cold shower and jogging to refresh the bloodstream

thank you. But the sport does not help me very much. I've been with them for 14 years (running, pull-ups, gym). Now I'm 17 and the last two months, I gave up the case. It's not much I can help, except that a cold shower and jogging to refresh the bloodstream 

[Zenfood]

I might have discovered something new:

 

I get amazing effects from Benfotiamine (300mg) + Forskolin (4mg) and Artichoke extract (900mg)

I think I'm going to try to switch Benfotiamine to Sulbutiamine because its effects on dopamine.

 

Has anyone tried this combo? Benfotiamine actually crosses the BBB:
http://www.ncbi.nlm....pubmed/20385653

 

I am so goddamn energetic, happy and focused. Better than modafinil and ritalin(methylphenidate) in my opinion.

[DamnedOwl]

I've not tried Benfotiamine, but I have tried Forskolin (between 4 and 6mg), Artichoke Extract (900mg) and Sulbutiamine (400mg) a fair few times before.

 

Sulbutiamine alone is something I find to provide a reliable energy boost, but with the Forskolin and Artichoke Extract I find the normal unpredictable reaction of either extreme focus or extreme tiredness that I've always experienced from just taking Forskolin and Artichoke Extract alone.

[magta39]

Long-term potentiation is reduced in mice that are doubly mutant in endothelial and neuronal nitric oxide synthase.

Son H¹, Hawkins RD, Martin K, Kiebler M, Huang PL, Fishman MC, Kandel ER.

Author information

Abstract

Nitric oxide (NO) has been implicated in hippocampal long-term potentiation (LTP), but LTP is normal in mice with a targeted mutation in the neuronal form of NO synthase (nNOS-). LTP was also normal in mice with a targeted mutation in endothelial NOS (eNOS-), but LTP in stratum radiatum of CA1 was significantly reduced in doubly mutant mice (nNOS-/eNOS-). By contrast, LTP in stratum oriens was normal in the doubly mutant mice. These results provide the first genetic evidence that NOS is involved in LTP in stratum radiatum and suggest that the neuronal and endothelial forms can compensate for each other in mice with a single mutation. They further suggest that there is also a NOS-independent component of LTP in stratum radiatum and that LTP in stratum oriens is largely NOS independent.

 

Seems that nitric oxide is important to LTP.  Anyone else try adding 1 gram Arginine and 500mgs citrulline to forskolin?  Seems to help....any thoughts?

 

[Nordmann]

Long-term potentiation is reduced in mice that are doubly mutant in endothelial and neuronal nitric oxide synthase.

Son H¹, Hawkins RD, Martin K, Kiebler M, Huang PL, Fishman MC, Kandel ER.

Author information

Abstract

Nitric oxide (NO) has been implicated in hippocampal long-term potentiation (LTP), but LTP is normal in mice with a targeted mutation in the neuronal form of NO synthase (nNOS-). LTP was also normal in mice with a targeted mutation in endothelial NOS (eNOS-), but LTP in stratum radiatum of CA1 was significantly reduced in doubly mutant mice (nNOS-/eNOS-). By contrast, LTP in stratum oriens was normal in the doubly mutant mice. These results provide the first genetic evidence that NOS is involved in LTP in stratum radiatum and suggest that the neuronal and endothelial forms can compensate for each other in mice with a single mutation. They further suggest that there is also a NOS-independent component of LTP in stratum radiatum and that LTP in stratum oriens is largely NOS independent.

 

Seems that nitric oxide is important to LTP.  Anyone else try adding 1 gram Arginine and 500mgs citrulline to forskolin?  Seems to help....any thoughts?

 

 

80mg of a bioavailability enhanced curcumin supplement has been reported to increase nitric oxide in serum by 40% or so, which is significantly larger than many other dietary supplements. Examine

[Zenfood]

Yeah. 1 capsule of curcubrain (longvida curcumin) provides 80mg of super bioavailable curcumin.

Other things to consider for nitric oxide:

NADH

Benfotiamine

Grape Seed Extract

Citrulline Malate (actually raises plasma arginine levels, more than arginine itself)

 

[pdxer]

I might have discovered something new:

I get amazing effects from Benfotiamine (300mg) + Forskolin (4mg) and Artichoke extract (900mg)
....
I am so goddamn energetic, happy and focused. Better than modafinil and ritalin(methylphenidate) in my opinion.

I had a similar experience when I added 500 mg Sulbutiamine to the Adranafil I take in the morning. The first couple of times I took it, I felt extremely happy and mentally energized. Sulbutiamine doesn't have that impact on me anymore. My speculation was that I had low levels of thiamin in my brain and that Sulbutiamine corrected it, however there could be a tolerance effect occurring.

I added Sulbutiamine because I occasionally drink large amounts when I'm out with clients and am concerned about alcohol related brain damage. Acute temporary Thiamin deficiency has been identified as one of the causal factors.

I just started ciltep and haven't experienced clear results, so in my case sulbutiamine hasn't potentiated it.

[pdxer]

I might have discovered something new:

I get amazing effects from Benfotiamine (300mg) + Forskolin (4mg) and Artichoke extract (900mg)
....
I am so goddamn energetic, happy and focused. Better than modafinil and ritalin(methylphenidate) in my opinion.

I had a similar experience when I added 500 mg Sulbutiamine to the Adranafil I take in the morning. The first couple of times I took it, I felt extremely happy and mentally energized. Sulbutiamine doesn't have that impact on me anymore. My speculation was that I had low levels of thiamin in my brain and that Sulbutiamine corrected it, however there could be a tolerance effect occurring.

I added Sulbutiamine because I occasionally drink large amounts when I'm out with clients and am concerned about alcohol related brain damage. Acute temporary Thiamin deficiency has been identified as one of the causal factors.

I just started ciltep and haven't experienced clear results, so in my case sulbutiamine hasn't potentiated it.

[Charles J. Daniels]

This page on LTP is interesting: http://thebrain.mcgi...a_07_m_tra.html

[GrindersRus]

hey all, i've just discovered CILTEP and been trying to catch up with this thread with meh results. Any suggestions on how or what to change would be appreciated...

 

I'm a professional poker player who has trouble maintaining focus for long durations. A lot of days i would have brain fog and I want to find ways to get rid of this and operate at my best at all times. Many in my profession turn to things like adderrall but i've read about many side effects and addiction problems so I've never tried it. Seems like something I couldn't use every other day because it would be too harsh on my very sensitive body anyway (the few times i tried modafinil it gave me heart palpations). I'm looking for things that will give me that clarity of thought or boost I need but also won't be hard on my body--something I can take a few times a week for long work days. I tried piracetam for 2 weeks - didnt do anything for me. I'm currently trying CILTEP with mixed results. Tried it 5 days so far and only 1 out of those 4 days (my 4th day) i would say i felt something that i would consider a noticeable increase in focus/motivation. It only lasted 2hours or so and the other 4 days i just had brain fog and sometimes i felt even more slow and kinda of "duh duh" like i couldn't process simple things i normally would. Going to keep at it  but any suggestions would be appreciate it....

 

Immediately take upon waking up (Natural stacks Ciltep)

Day 1: 3 caps with water - nothing

Day 2: Take 3 caps out of the capsule and mix with orange & pineapple juice ( i have a hard time swallowing large pills) - no benefit, maybe a little slow with bad memory

Day 3: same as day 2

Day 4: 2 caps with orange & pineapple juice - 1.5hours later slight energy/motivation/focus increase lasting roughly 2 hours?

 

---break for 3 days---

Day 5: 3 caps mixed with OJ - nothing again

 

I'm not sure how to go about this. If anyone recommends getting the artichoke extract and other ingredients separtely, could you please recommend good brands to go with. I'd really appreciate it. I have a very limited understanding on how this stuff actually works so just randomly taking more or less of something would just be guess work on my part.

[ceridwen]

orange and pineapple juice are full of aluminium

[hephaestus]

I find that it helps if you include a stimulant, like caffeine. Theanine might be helpful too.

[explr9]

I tried the regular ciltep about 6 months ago (without phenylalanine or alcar) and got immediate over stimulation followed by fatigue a few hours later, so I stopped.

 

A subsequent blood test showed very low phenylalanine levels. So I tried to supplement with 500mg of L-PA and it made me feel restless and irritable, so I stopped. Same thing with D-PA form. Eventually, about a month ago, I decided I needed to make this work and opened a cap and poured 1/2 into my mouth and sat down. In about 15 minutes I felt tired, kind of spaced out. That feeling passed in a 30 minutes. I just dozed it off. Then I took the rest of the cap. Same thing. Then I took a third 1/2 cap. No fatigue. I kept this up for a few more rounds over the next two days and was able to take the recommended 2 grams a day with no problem, in 2 separate doses with no fatigue or irritability.

 

Fixed one problem.

 

I have tried ALCAR in the past and found it to be agitating, even in the 300mg range. I recently found out that this might be because ALCAR is reving up mithochondria and generating oxidative stress. So I plan on taking ALA for a while, with biotin, before taking alcar. I  found some lead in my urine on a different test, so I have to be careful with the ALA, which is another story...

 

But the point is I am introducing the ciltep formula one step at a time.

 

1. I think my b vitamins are finally right (p5p 50mg, sulbutamine 200mg, pantothenic acid 1000mg sustain release, Jarrow B-Right)

2. Building Phenylalanine levels. 

3. ALA > ALCAR, eventually to 500mg ALCAR (I'll probably add some b12 and folate at this point)

4. Then I'm going to try all of the above with zembrin, see how that works, Maybe I'll switch to artichoke.

5. Then, when all of that is groovy, I can add the forskolin, now available in a pure extract.

 

The cool thing is that even if I don't get the forskolin going, I still get value from the stack; each level adds benefits.

I'm at step 3 now. Might be trying zembrin in a month.

 

 

[gizmobrain]

Anyone who responds positively to the motivational aspects of the Ciltep stack... have you tried Fasoracetam or NSI-189?

 

CILTEP (plus 2.5mg dextroamphetamine), Fasoracetam, NSI-189, and Nefiracetam are the only effective treatments I have ever found for my complete and utter lack of motivation (and I've tried so many things over the last 4 years). 

 

Would love to have time to look into the common denominator (maybe they all work on different pathways to achieve the same net effects), but I'm too busy enjoying life without having to drag myself out of bed every morning.

[yborcity]

the ciltep stack seems to work pretty neatly with people tweaking it for personal comfort.

I read someone stacking it curcumin ( aka tumeric) pills but, as far i know, this compound is fat soluble, so i guess you would have to absorb it with some kind of coconut oil/mct oil , just like liquid d3 for example, anyone tried this combination: ciltep+ curcumin (taken w/mctoil) ? 

[Charles J. Daniels]

forskolin is also fat soluble

[BieraK]

first, I'm not a native english speaker, so I apologize for the mistakes in my writing


Could Piperine be a good additive to the stack? To increase the forskolin and luteolin (PDE-4 Inhibitor) absorption?

In a qualitative level, I can say that CILTEP works, I have felt their unique effects, as my mind is opened to the images of the books, and my concentration its like a laser while my eyes are absolutely open, it's like all the information entered easily, I feel a strange sensation in the forehead... 

The problem is that it has only worked only a few times and I don't know the cause or the factors involved.

I have tried many combinations: Forskolin/Rutin/Luteolin.... Forskolin/Rutin/Luteolin/Quercetin

(QUERCETIN, is so powerful, 100 mg rutin+400 mg quercetin gives me so much energy, concentration and mood all day, plus selegiline is the best I've tried, I really love the COMT inhibition+MAO-B inhibition. Maybe this was the destiny of my CILTEP pathway and explorations, know the benefits of quercetin with selegiline)

 

 

I have also tried Luteolin/Quercetin/Rutin/Forskolin/Kanna.... I can't get the desired effect, That I have only felt on five or six occasions with CILTEP.  The only ingredient that I have not included in the stack is ALCAR, instead of phenylalanine I use NALT. I still have not gotten ALCAR, here is sold as medicine, and I have not yet purchased overseas

Today I start testing with Piperine, the great CYP3A4 inhibitor, my stack today was:

Rutin 100mg
Forskolin 20% 20 mg
Luteolin 60 mg
Raw Kanna 100 mg
Piperine 10 mg

I achieved an initial effect stronger than usual, but nothing compared to CILTEP magnus-power can really be. I will keep trying other combinations. I use sunifiram or noopept to combat the working memory problems, however since I've started using TDCS in the left DLPF, working memory problems are a thing of the past, DIY TDCS is a good ally, as having the roman empire in your side :D

Well, too much blah blah, time to the important thing....

(1) Has anyone tried CILTEP with piperine? Could effectively increase the absorption of compounds like forskolin or luteolin?

(2) Could selegiline block CILTEP effects?.    Selegiline according to some studies decrease TH activity, and CILTeP works increasing TH activy... but other studies shows that selegiline induces the tyrosine hydroxylase activy.

1992 May;41(5):839-44. Mol Pharmacol.

Chronic selegiline administration transiently decreases tyrosine hydroxylase activity and mRNA in the rat nigrostriatal pathway.

Vrana SL1, Azzaro AJ, Vrana KE.

Spoiler

​Abstract

Selegiline, a selective monoamine oxidase type B inhibitor, is beneficial in the treatment of Parkinson's disease. However, this beneficial effect is only transient, and patients must ultimately resort to treatment with standard levodopa therapy. We studied the effects of chronic selegiline treatment on the rat nigrostriatal pathway, to elucidate a neurochemical correlate for this adaptive clinical response. Selegiline treatment for 3, 7, 14, or 21 days decreased tyrosine hydroxylase (the enzyme that catalyzes the rate-limiting step in catecholamine biosynthesis) activity in the cell body regions (substantia nigra) of the nigrostriatal pathway. However, tyrosine hydroxylase activity measurements in the major terminal field region (corpus striatum) of the pathway did not correspond to those in the substantia nigra; in the corpus striatum, tyrosine hydroxylase activity was decreased at 3 and 7 days of treatment and recovered by 14 days. We tested whether the decrease in tyrosine hydroxylase activity was mediated by a decrease in tyrosine hydroxylase mRNA. Northern blot and RNA dot blot analyses (using a tyrosine hydroxylase-specific cDNA probe) of substantia nigra homogenates revealed a significant decrease in tyrosine hydroxylase mRNA at 3, 7, and 14 days of selegiline treatment, compared with controls. Conversely, after 21 days of selegiline, tyrosine hydroxylase mRNA levels were significantly higher (3-fold) than controls; this finding was not reflected in substantia nigra tyrosine hydroxylase activity. The 21-day increase in mRNA may be associated with the rebound in tyrosine hydroxylase activity observed in the corpus striatum. Thus, it is possible that the recovery in tyrosine hydroxylase activity in the corpus striatum is mediated through an increase in tyrosine hydroxylase protein transport from the substantia nigra to the corpus striatum and/or that the tyrosine hydroxylase enzyme exists in a more stabilized state during this period of time. These results demonstrate that monoamine oxidase type B-selective inhibitory doses of selegiline are capable of inducing transient decreases in tyrosine hydroxylase activity and tyrosine hydroxylase mRNA levels. Furthermore, these reversible effects may represent adaptive responses associated with pharmacological tolerance and the transient beneficial actions of this drug in Parkinson's disease.

 

 

Edited by Arsonista, 28 September 2014 - 01:31 AM.

[abelard lindsay]

Bioperine is certainly something to try since it would counteract the glucuronidation that happens to many plant flavanoids when taken orally. Endogenous Beta glucuronidase which can deglucurondiate flavanoids such as quercetin in vivio(http://www.ncbi.nlm....pubmed/25076013) differs from person to person. For example, it influences the severity of a person's symptoms in lyme disease ( http://www.ncbi.nlm....pubmed/24334460 ).

I can't test this particularly well because I'm a high responder so I'm waiting for some more confirmation from non-responders before I make this an official recommendation.

Edited by abelard lindsay, 30 September 2014 - 10:01 AM.

[BieraK]

I've only done two tests with piperine, day two was: 

 

60 mg luteolin 

100 mg rutin 

------ Basic PDE inhibition ---- 

Forskolin 20 mg 

10 mg Piperine 

200 mg NALT

Nice boost of energy and motivation, but still nothing compared to the real effect that has occurred in my with CILTEP in the past, the best dosage . The occasion in which the effects were stronger, it was very similar to the photographic memory... ... That's the reason behind my insistence to the stack.

Today I took a break with piperine, for the possible side effects in liver enzymes . I want to do a blood test to check the effect of piperine in liver enzymes soon. Maybe another problem could be the absorption of some toxic substances and the reduction of detoxification capacity of the body. The latter, is based on speculation and readings  that I have done of some threads of this forum.

I'm planning to do more tests with piperine, some days on, some days off.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Moreover, Perhaps selegiline it is a bad combination with CILTEP? Mabye increasing the amount of forskolin to 20 mg (plus piperine?), can counteract the selegiline reduction effect in Tirosine Hydroxylase. Striatum is one of the parts of the brain where neurogenesis is generated.


Reduced striatal tyrosine hydroxylase activity is not accompanied by change in responsiveness of dopaminergic receptors following chronic treatment with deprenyl.
  Abstract  

Deprenyl is the only selective monoamine oxidase B (MAO-B) inhibitor that is in clinical use for the treatment of Parkinson's disease. Our previous studies showed that chronic treatment of rats with low (MAO-B selective) doses of deprenyl inhibited dopamine (DA) re-uptake and enhanced DA release in the striatum. These changes could affect DA synthesis rate by activation of negative feedback loops. Chronic deprenyl treatment has also been suggested to cause down-regulation of release-modulating DA receptors. The effects of chronic and acute treatment with deprenyl on ex vivo striatal tyrosine hydroxylase activity were therefore studied, by determination of steady-state tissue level of DOPA following administration of NSD-1015 (100 mg/kg i.p.). In addition, we assessed changes in the in vivo sensitivity of dopaminergic receptors from the reduction in DOPA extracellular level after systemic apomorphine administration (2.5 mg/kg s.c.), following elevation of microdialysate DOPA by systemic or local aromatic amino acid decarboxylase inhibition with NSD-1015. Chronic treatment with deprenyl (0.25 mg/kg s.c. daily for 21 days) caused a significant reduction in tyrosine hydroxylase activity to 60% of control, with no change in the apomorphine-induced reduction of microdialysate DOPA and DOPAC. The reduction in tyrosine hydroxylase activity is compatible with our previous results showing an increase in striatal DA extracellular level following chronic treatment with deprenyl. The increased extracellular striatal DA level could reduce tyrosine hydroxylase activity through activation of a negative feedback loop, by activation of either presynaptic or postsynaptic DA receptors.

 

Edited by Arsonista, 01 October 2014 - 12:08 AM.