2626 replies to this topic

[Sholrak]

Which good quality and price brand you can get on iHerb for forskolin?

[cat@]

two general questions to all users:

- has the stack an effect on your sleep?
- does anyone take the stack and is working out on a regular basis while on it (high intensity training etc.)?

I didn't sleep very many hours for the three days I took it so quit.

Does anyone have suggestions for those having sleep problems with the stack? I normally have difficulty sleeping so watch my sleep carefully. I do want to try out this stack though!

[MrRogersBestNeighbor]

I currently take Hydergine and Piracetam and had a question regarding this stack to those experienced/knowledgeable with it.
Would there be any expected interactions between CILTEP and Hydergine in particular? I've been taking Hydergine for the last year and it's literally turned my life around.
I'm assuming it would be wise to stop taking it for at least a couple days before attempting this stack as Hydergine increases serotonin and dopamine, no?
The reason I want to try it, despite the success I've had with Hydergine, is because I take Adderall occasionally for daytime fatigue. I'm not too fond of Adderall, so I'm looking for a replacement and this sounds promising.

[chung_pao]

two general questions to all users:

- has the stack an effect on your sleep?
- does anyone take the stack and is working out on a regular basis while on it (high intensity training etc.)?

1. It makes sleep deeper, and probably adds a 30-90 minutes for me. It makes the contrast between a 'waking-state' and 'sleep-state' more marked; I'm more awake and alert while awake and my sleep is heavier and deeper. It might also reduce my REM-sleep, not sure though.
2. I take it and "workout" almost daily (very short intense sessions of >5 minutes). I consider Cold therapy a form of workout, though.
I find CILTEP synergizes very well with all forms of "hormesis". (Referring to Cold therapy, fasting and muscle contractions)
CILTEP intensifies and facilitates a sympathetic state, due to its' effect on dopamine metabolism, especially.

Ugh. Cold showers are relegated to my pilot light blowing out somehow once in a blue moon and after I'm already wet lol. Otherwise, I might stroke out or something heh.

Riddle me this... subjectively speaking, what difference do you 'feel' when you take Zembrin as opposed to the Artichoke Extract? Is your experience different and exclusive to memory tasks or cognitive processing during a test? I'm interested in the variation between focus, alertness and any other subjective emotions, moods etc.

Zembrin makes me more Content. I'm less inclined to exert myself since I don't feel the need to.
I attribute this to its' effect on serotonin.
It could provide better LTP, but my inclination to be effective and productive in anything is significantly different and improved when using Artichoke instead.
I don't go to class, but If I did, I'd probably use Zembrin instead though. I think it's beneficial for learning in social situations, whereas Artichoke is better for Solitary work/learning.
For me, Zembrin promotes "bonding", while artichoke makes me more competitive and motivated to distinguish myself.
I hope that made sense.

Cold showers aren't that bad!
Just start small. Start with the feet and work your way up progressively. The quads are your biggest muscle groups anyway.

Edited by chung_pao, 17 August 2013 - 12:18 PM.

[darejz00]

After reading a big part of the thread I've understood that while taking this stack in the morning, ALCAR and dopamine support are helpful in preventing a crash later in the afternoon. If taken in two separate doses (AM/PM), is there any sense in taking ALCAR and dopamine support at the same time as the forskolin&artichoke? Should the dopamine ingredient only be taken late afternoon? L-phenylalanine converts to tyrosine, is it better to take both or is either one enough (maybe something like NOW True Focus...)?

[Sholrak]

What's better for sleepy relief in the afternoon?

ALCAR, L-Phenylalanine or L-Tyrosine?

I will start with ciltep + one of them.


Does ALCAR increase somehow dopamine?

Edited by Sholrak, 18 August 2013 - 03:09 PM.

[cylack]

Any idea of how nicotine would affect the CILTEP stack? Nicotine helps with working memory and it seems CILTEP, although good for long term memory, has a slight negative influence on working memory. I'm thinking about taking a 2 mg nicotine lozenge along with this stack.

[Sholrak]

I have ordered from iHerb artichoke, forskolin (20%), L-phenylalanine and ALCAR.

Have not picked a b complex as I intend to eat a rich diet which provides my body with all that vitamins. Also, B complexes are usually imbalanced in DV% in many vitamins so that could be a problem and a time wasting, choosing one. Also, picking one with methylcobalamine and with </=100% DV for B1, B2, B3 and B6 is really expensive.

I will use coffee, green tea, CILTEP, nicotine (cigarrettes) and L-PA to support dopamine metabolism. Finally, I will take ALCAR too for it's amazing properties for focus, mood and memory/motivation, and also as a force to counter posible working memory decline and/or sleepiness while on CILTEP.

It should arrive in a few days.

Edited by Sholrak, 18 August 2013 - 07:52 PM.

[xsiv1]

I've personally had success with the following and have now swapped back to 3 days per week use of CILTEP. I find that taking breaks from it and swapping it from Mon-Fri (2 day weekend break) and then reserving it for 3 days including Fri, Sat & Sunday. I've been on it consecutively for some time and then took a good break to try out another stack. I can say the following. I take it in the morning with my regular Vit/Min/EFA complex which included separate B-Right (my favorite B Complex from Jarrow), with NAC and a gram of C. The CILTEP stack follows as such. 450-900mgs of Artichoke Extract (or 25mgs of Zembrin). Depends on how I'm feeling for these two. I'll usually swap them from day to day. I always include 350mgs of N-Acetyl-L-Tyrosine and a medium coffee. Forskolin is also used at about 5mgs. If it's during the week and I experience an afternoon slump, I'll either proactively take PEAK ATP, Methyl B-12 and 10mgs of NADH just before lunch. Seems to help prevent afternoon fatigue...not always though heh. If I don't take this before lunch, I'll usually vary the pick-me-up compounds. One day it'll be 10mgs Noopept, 750 Aniracetam and 500mgs ALCAR with some Krill Oil. Other days I may use some more NALT or 200mgs of Sulbutiamine. Sometimes I only use Methyl B12 & NADH. I go by how I'm feeling energetic. At just a bit over 40, I still workout each weekday after work and then help prepare dinner and kids/family stuff so energy is such an asset. I just find mixing things up to be the best for me.

When I am swapping out CILTEP to my weekend regimen of Fri, Sat, & Sun - I normally don't need much of a pick-me up since I'm more relaxed and don't really do any 'critical' tasks like I need to do at work. It's during the work week than any of the aforementioned compounds should help including the other dopamine precursors. There'd also be nothing wrong with taking NOW's True Focus in the afternoon portion of your day as you "pick me up". Some people don't even need the pick me up. Guess it depends on your age, physiology, quality of sleep etc etc etc. With any of them, the only real thing you might want to look for is whether or not it's disrupting your sleep patterns, especially with sleep latency periods. Otherwise, you should be golden.

During my days off CILTEP, I'm using racetams, Noopept and some citicholine/Alpha-GPC.

Edited by xsiv1, 19 August 2013 - 02:22 AM.

[channeledfocus]

i used it for 14 days straight

never experienced a slump in the afternoon even if i slept not very well, had constant levels throughout the day (even to the extent that i actively had to calm myself down before going to bed with a relaxation exercise)

i was intermittent fasting (14-18hours) only fat in the morning as carbs and proteins break the fast i.e. grass fed butter+mct oil in the coffee and when eating trying to keep my insulin levels constantly low (no grains, sugar etc) and had a green tea a few hours after the morning coffee

Edited by channeledfocus, 20 August 2013 - 01:07 PM.

[Monte Cedillo]

I'm very interested in this. I will be ordering some Analyzed Supplements Forskolin-95% 25mg capsules. Has anybody used higher amounts of Forskolin and experienced similar success? Also has anybody stacked it with Resveratrol (Reservege 500mg) and has success or is the Artichoke extract the way to go for PDE inhibition?

Thanks

[jdeer]

two general questions to all users:

- has the stack an effect on your sleep?
- does anyone take the stack and is working out on a regular basis while on it (high intensity training etc.)?

I didn't sleep very many hours for the three days I took it so quit.

Does anyone have suggestions for those having sleep problems with the stack? I normally have difficulty sleeping so watch my sleep carefully. I do want to try out this stack though!

I didn't have that problem. I guess everyone reacts differently

[swen]

i used it for 14 days straight

never experienced a slump in the afternoon even if i slept not very well, had constant levels throughout the day (even to the extent that i actively had to calm myself down before going to bed with a relaxation exercise)

i was intermittent fasting (14-18hours) only fat in the morning as carbs and proteins break the fast i.e. grass fed butter+mct oil in the coffee and when eating trying to keep my insulin levels constantly low (no grains, sugar etc) and had a green tea a few hours after the morning coffee

I'm also a fan of bulletproof coffee. Do you also experience that the feeling of bulletproof coffee blends the feeling of the CILTEP? Maybe I'm saying it wrong but I start feeling the CILTEP stack more in the afternoon then in the morning. Does this sound familiar?

[channeledfocus]

I'm also a fan of bulletproof coffee. Do you also experience that the feeling of bulletproof coffee blends the feeling of the CILTEP? Maybe I'm saying it wrong but I start feeling the CILTEP stack more in the afternoon then in the morning. Does this sound familiar?

I honestly cannot separate it as I only took it together and had a constant level. How would you describe the both feelings?

[abelard lindsay]

Some new research that is rather interesting.

http://www.ncbi.nlm....pubmed/23948935

Abstract

Phosphodiesterase-4 (PDE4) inhibitors enhance memory, increase hippocampal neurogenesis, and reverse amyloid-β (Aβ)-induced memory deficits. Here, we examined whether long-form PDE4D knockdown by lentiviral RNA construct containing a specific microRNA/miRNA-mir hairpin structure (4DshR) reversed memory impairment caused by amyloid-β1-42 (Aβ42) in mice using the Morris water maze (MWM) and novelty object recognition tests. Western blotting analysis was used to assess protein levels of cAMP response element-binding protein (CREB, unphosphorylated and phosphorylated [pCREB]), brain-derived neurotrophic factor (BDNF), interleukin-1β (IL-1β), tumor necrosis factor-α (TNF-α), and nuclear factor-κB (NF-κB) to explore the neurochemical mechanisms. Aggregated Aβ42 (0.5 μg/side) bilaterally infused in dentate gyrus decreased cAMP levels (p < 0.01) and produced memory deficits in the MWM (p < 0.01) and object recognition tests (p < 0.01). Microinfusions of lentiviruses resulted in downregulated expression of PDE4D4 and 4D5 proteins and reversed Aβ42-induced cAMP decline (p < 0.05) and memory deficits. Treatment also concomitantly increased pCREB (p < 0.05) and BDNF (p < 0.01) and reduced IL-1β (p < 0.05), TNF-α (p < 0.01), and NF-κB (p65) (p < 0.05) in the hippocampus of Aβ42-challenged mice. These results suggest that long-form PDE4D knockdown may offer a promising treatment for memory loss associated with Alzheimer's disease.

[darejz00]

A few people are talking about combining the CILTEP stack with IF or a coffee. Optimally, should this stack be taken on an empty or full stomach? Before or after breakfast...?

Edited by darejz00, 22 August 2013 - 12:18 PM.

[chung_pao]

A few people are talking about combining the CILTEP stack with IF or a coffee. Optimally, should this stack be taken on an empty or full stomach? Before or after breakfast...?

The CILTEP stack capitalizes on cAMP, located in certain areas of the brain, and the concurrent inhibition of PDE-4, which is the enzyme that catabolizes cAMP in these areas.

Insulin, which is stimulated by food intake will diminish cAMP and reduce the effect of the stack.
That is why it works so well with fasting - this maintains your ciltep-effect for a longer time.
I've used this stack for several months, without interruption or diminution in effect. I've found it works best with fasting (at least for a few hours after waking up, 'til I feel depleted), and that every meal reduces the initial effect of the stack.
I've experimented a lot and found the stack to produce the best effects with the following regimen:
*Take 2-3x500 mg Artichoke extract and 10 mg Active Forskolin extract on an empty stomach upon waking.
Take a gradual cold shower immediately afterwards.
By gradual, I mean just to get in there and start the cold stream of water at your feet, and continue upwards for at least half of the body.
The point of the shower is to kick-start your alertness and catecholamine metabolism.
For me, this has a significant synergistic effect that can't be matched by any ingestable.

Of course, the stack is will be pretty useless if your body can't tolerate fasting without getting irritable, lethargic, or any other inhibition of mental acuity.
IMO, use the following progressive sequence, and experiment to find what works best for your Mental performance and alertness:
1. 1x500 Artichoke extract + 10 mg active Forskolin extract. This can be increased to 2 or 3x 500mg Artichoke. (I use Jarrow's capsules)
2. Add fasting. But only if you feel it facilitates cognitive performance. If it's unbearable, or detrimental, get a breakfast of at least 30g protein.
3. Add any form of Cold exposure (even just the feet, legs and waist area will suffice) immediately after intake of the stack. (in the morning)
The point of the cold exposure is the immediate arousal that is stimulates. This effect persists and synergizes with the CILTEP-stack.
It's also awesome for extra testosterone and fat-loss.

Caffeine; Tea, coffee or whatever, is optional. They help, but are not essential. Same goes for Tyrosine/Phenylalanine.
I occasionally use Chocamine, Green tea and some Espressos once in a while.

I recommend this stack because it's the ONLY nootropic I've been able to use consistently, on a daily basis, to actually improve all aspects of my physiological performance: athletic, social, mental, hormonal... etc. And I've tried just about everything.
The only side effect of the stack is that it compresses the energy of my day from 16 to 14 hours. I.e. I need a bit more sleep.

If you find any way to enhance this stack that I haven't thought of yet, please (!) post here.

Edited by chung_pao, 22 August 2013 - 09:17 PM.

[channeledfocus]

good post!
agree to the cold shower, forgot to mention that in my post.
it was part of my daily routine, too.

[xsiv1]

I've used the stack for some time as well and although I haven't tried the cold shower idea from Chung Pao (I'll personally have to look into that one lol), I've always used about 150mgs of caffeine and most recently exclusively rely on N-Acetyl-L-Tyrosine (350mgs) over any of the other dopamine precursors. Perhaps placebo, but I feel more alert with this variation. My problem has been at 2-2:30pm when I'll start to experience some mental fatigue. To address it, I'll alternate any given day between 500mgs of ALCAR, or 200mgs of sulbutiamine with some Krill oil or perhaps Peak ATP, Methyl B12 & 10mgs NADH or something similar. I've taken time off the stack though, either by reserving it to weekends or weekdays when I get to around 60-90 days. Still working nicely for me in this fashion and, by far, worthy of bang for the buck star status in the realm of nootropic regimens. :-)

Sent from my SGH-I337M using Tapatalk 4

[cylack]

I have been experimenting on the CILTEP stack with various permutations the last 3 weeks and have been keeping meticulous records. I have measured my cognitive performance by how I do on IQ Mindware's HighIQPro software for N-back training. I'm currently the world record holder on the application with a N=8.60 (I'm user SK on the sofware's Hall of Fame list).

Here is my current protocol:

AM (First thing in the morning, on empty stomach):

1. CILTEP --> 3 Now brand Artichoke Extract capsules (3x450mg) + 8.675 mg Forskolin
2. Creatine Ethyl Ester --> 5mg; this form of creatine has been proven in a double blind study to increase cognitive performance. (Cognitive effects of creatine ethyl ester supplementation. Jonathan Linga, Minos Kritikosb and Brian Tipladyc Pharmacology 20:673–679)
3. Niacinamide --> 500 mg
4. Piracetam --> 2.5 g; I have taken Piracetam in the past with no effect. I was taking too little, around 800 mg. I'm finding that 2.5g does make a significant impact on mental clarity. I use Newstar Nootropics brand.
5. Pyrroloquinolone Quinone (PQQ) --> 20mg. Phosphorylates CREB. See Fisetin in the PM stack.
6. Krill Oil --> 300 mg, MegaRed brand
7. Phosphatidyl Serine (Sharp-PS) --> 150 mg
8. Dextrose --> 4 mg. I don't eating in the morning (intermittent fasting), but since I'm studying for my USMLE Step 1 medical school board exam now I REALLY need to optimize memorization ability. I've read studies that show that Gluocose+Caffeine helps in memory so this is my compromise between not eating and having some glucose in the system.
9. Caffeine mixture (I find that caffeine helps me greatly on this stack, but too much caffeine makes me jittery so its important to calibrate to your personal preference): ShanTea Englightened Mind Mate/Kukicha tea + Japanese Matcha green tea
10. Optional: Protein Shake (Muscle Milk naturals brand) - 12g. Don't really feel any effect mental performance wise. Depends on if I'm really feeling hungry or not.

PM (around 4 pm)
1. Bulletproof Coffee (BTW, I'm trying the new ultra expensive MCT Oil that Asprey's pitching "8x stronger than other MCT oils" and I don't notice any difference between it and NOW MCT Oil, so once this batch is done I'll be going back to NOW brand). My take on bulletproof coffee --> Butter, MCT Oil, 1 Egg, Taurine (1/8 tsp), Ribose (5 mg), Black Pepper (1/8 tsp), Cayenne Pepper (1/8 tsp), Chocolate (1/8 tsp), and Turmeric (1/4 tsp). The Turmeric is key to giving this coffee a big neuro boost.
2. Piracetam 2.5 g
3. Phenylalanine --> 250 mg.
4. NOW brand True Focus --> 1 pill
5. Fisetin (Cognisetin) --> 100 mg. Fisetin has been shown in double blind studies to improve memory by phosphorylating CREB, which is what increased levels of cAMP ultimately does. cAMP increases Protein Kinase A, which phosphorylates CREB. So using Fisetin and PQQ along with CILTEP is hitting CREB from all angles.
6. Tangut brand Memory Fortifier --> 2 pills. The company claims to have done a double blind study that shows that this combination actually activates neuronal growth. The ingredients are Gingko, Goji Berry, and Cistanche Tubulosa.
7. Choline Bitartrate --> 500 mg

I'll admit that taking both stacks is somewhat pricey. But ordering online from suppliers such as Swanson's vitamins has saved me a lot of money. As I mentioned, I'm studying for an exam that will literally determine my life going forward so to use a quote from the first Transformer's movie "I'm bringing the rain and hitting the USMLE Step1 with 105 Sabot rounds! "

BTW, don't forget the N-back training. It'll literally make you smarter and I would pay the money to buy the HighIQ Pro software (instead of free online sources) as it uses the exact same protocols that Jaeggi et al. used in their groundbreaking study.

Also, I will try Chung_Pao's suggestion of cold shower in the AM, but since I'm too much of a wuss for actually standing under a cold shower I'll use this device I have called the Cool Fat Burner (https://www.coolfatburner.com). I've been using it at night immediately after I take a shower to help me fall asleep, but I'll try it in the morning and see if I get any cognitive benefits out of it.

Edited by cylack, 23 August 2013 - 12:30 AM.

[Godof Smallthings]

^Your n back average is impressive, but to see whether this stack has helped or not, it would be helpful if you could show us your development over time, especially since you started with this stack.

[swen]

I've used the stack for some time as well and although I haven't tried the cold shower idea from Chung Pao (I'll personally have to look into that one lol), I've always used about 150mgs of caffeine and most recently exclusively rely on N-Acetyl-L-Tyrosine (350mgs) over any of the other dopamine precursors. Perhaps placebo, but I feel more alert with this variation. My problem has been at 2-2:30pm when I'll start to experience some mental fatigue. To address it, I'll alternate any given day between 500mgs of ALCAR, or 200mgs of sulbutiamine with some Krill oil or perhaps Peak ATP, Methyl B12 & 10mgs NADH or something similar. I've taken time off the stack though, either by reserving it to weekends or weekdays when I get to around 60-90 days. Still working nicely for me in this fashion and, by far, worthy of bang for the buck star status in the realm of nootropic regimens. :-)

Sent from my SGH-I337M using Tapatalk 4

So you take NALT instead of the L-phenylalanine taken with the forskolin and artichokes?

[swen]

A few people are talking about combining the CILTEP stack with IF or a coffee. Optimally, should this stack be taken on an empty or full stomach? Before or after breakfast...?

The CILTEP stack capitalizes on cAMP, located in certain areas of the brain, and the concurrent inhibition of PDE-4, which is the enzyme that catabolizes cAMP in these areas.

Insulin, which is stimulated by food intake will diminish cAMP and reduce the effect of the stack.
That is why it works so well with fasting - this maintains your ciltep-effect for a longer time.
I've used this stack for several months, without interruption or diminution in effect. I've found it works best with fasting (at least for a few hours after waking up, 'til I feel depleted), and that every meal reduces the initial effect of the stack.
I've experimented a lot and found the stack to produce the best effects with the following regimen:
*Take 2-3x500 mg Artichoke extract and 10 mg Active Forskolin extract on an empty stomach upon waking.
Take a gradual cold shower immediately afterwards.
By gradual, I mean just to get in there and start the cold stream of water at your feet, and continue upwards for at least half of the body.
The point of the shower is to kick-start your alertness and catecholamine metabolism.
For me, this has a significant synergistic effect that can't be matched by any ingestable.

Of course, the stack is will be pretty useless if your body can't tolerate fasting without getting irritable, lethargic, or any other inhibition of mental acuity.
IMO, use the following progressive sequence, and experiment to find what works best for your Mental performance and alertness:
1. 1x500 Artichoke extract + 10 mg active Forskolin extract. This can be increased to 2 or 3x 500mg Artichoke. (I use Jarrow's capsules)
2. Add fasting. But only if you feel it facilitates cognitive performance. If it's unbearable, or detrimental, get a breakfast of at least 30g protein.
3. Add any form of Cold exposure (even just the feet, legs and waist area will suffice) immediately after intake of the stack. (in the morning)
The point of the cold exposure is the immediate arousal that is stimulates. This effect persists and synergizes with the CILTEP-stack.
It's also awesome for extra testosterone and fat-loss.

Caffeine; Tea, coffee or whatever, is optional. They help, but are not essential. Same goes for Tyrosine/Phenylalanine.
I occasionally use Chocamine, Green tea and some Espressos once in a while.

I recommend this stack because it's the ONLY nootropic I've been able to use consistently, on a daily basis, to actually improve all aspects of my physiological performance: athletic, social, mental, hormonal... etc. And I've tried just about everything.
The only side effect of the stack is that it compresses the energy of my day from 16 to 14 hours. I.e. I need a bit more sleep.

If you find any way to enhance this stack that I haven't thought of yet, please (!) post here.

Awesome post!

Are you familiar with bulletproof coffee? It's coffee + grassfed butter + mct oil. It keep your insulin levels low, activates autophagy and it's a nootropic in its own (clear headed)

I'm a big fan, if i take this i'm full till 13:00-14:00 and then I eat something because I work-out around 15-16:00.

[xsiv1]

I've used the stack for some time as well and although I haven't tried the cold shower idea from Chung Pao (I'll personally have to look into that one lol), I've always used about 150mgs of caffeine and most recently exclusively rely on N-Acetyl-L-Tyrosine (350mgs) over any of the other dopamine precursors. Perhaps placebo, but I feel more alert with this variation. My problem has been at 2-2:30pm when I'll start to experience some mental fatigue. To address it, I'll alternate any given day between 500mgs of ALCAR, or 200mgs of sulbutiamine with some Krill oil or perhaps Peak ATP, Methyl B12 & 10mgs NADH or something similar. I've taken time off the stack though, either by reserving it to weekends or weekdays when I get to around 60-90 days. Still working nicely for me in this fashion and, by far, worthy of bang for the buck star status in the realm of nootropic regimens. :-)

Sent from my SGH-I337M using Tapatalk 4

So you take NALT instead of the L-phenylalanine taken with the forskolin and artichokes?

I do. I've tried all the variations including DLPA and based on only my subjective feeling of alertness, I prefer the 350 mgs of NALT from Jarrow. No anxious feelings as I can sometimes find with 500mgs of L-Tyrosine or L-PA..just right.

Also, question for cylack, do you find any other beneficial properties to using that cool belt? Is their any truth to the claims made on the site and you've stated it helps you fall asleep? This, could very well be since sleep latency tends to be reduced in a cool room as opposed to one that is not. I'm not sure about the comfort of wearing one in bed though...might defeat this purpose for me who sleeps without a shirt on and prefers it.

Edited by xsiv1, 23 August 2013 - 01:47 PM.

[cylack]

I started out an N=6 3 weeks ago, I floating between n=8 and 9 now. I cant say for sure if the stack caused this jump or if it was just natural improvement over time.

As for that cooling belt, I put in on for 20 minutes after I take a shower at night just before I fall asleep. I wear it over a t-shirt. You definitely can't sleep with it on, as it's probably not safe and it would be uncomfortable. It definitely helps me fall asleep quicker and have a more restful sleep. I haven't noticed any fat burning effects with it because I don't ever reach the point where I'm shivering and activating adiponectin and brown fat (I assume). The instructions say for maximum fat burning, you want to wear the belt on an empty stomach (fasting) and wear it until you shiver (around an hour) and preferably wear it directly on your chest without a shirt.

[channeledfocus]

that sleep enhancing effect sounds interesting, do you have a link to the belt please?

[xsiv1]

that sleep enhancing effect sounds interesting, do you have a link to the belt please?

Look up a few posts for the link. Believe it's 1820 channeledfocus.

Edited by xsiv1, 23 August 2013 - 03:25 PM.

[Godof Smallthings]

I started out an N=6 3 weeks ago, I floating between n=8 and 9 now. I cant say for sure if the stack caused this jump or if it was just natural improvement over time.

As for that cooling belt, I put in on for 20 minutes after I take a shower at night just before I fall asleep. I wear it over a t-shirt. You definitely can't sleep with it on, as it's probably not safe and it would be uncomfortable. It definitely helps me fall asleep quicker and have a more restful sleep. I haven't noticed any fat burning effects with it because I don't ever reach the point where I'm shivering and activating adiponectin and brown fat (I assume). The instructions say for maximum fat burning, you want to wear the belt on an empty stomach (fasting) and wear it until you shiver (around an hour) and preferably wear it directly on your chest without a shirt.

A two level jump in three weeks is pretty significant! How much time do you spend each day?

I've got the stack coming in next week, so look forward to seeing if my experience will mirror yours. I stopped n backing for the past three months, but prior to that I was playing at n=7 on the good days, and n=6 on the not so good ones.

[chung_pao]

Awesome post!

Are you familiar with bulletproof coffee? It's coffee + grassfed butter + mct oil. It keep your insulin levels low, activates autophagy and it's a nootropic in its own (clear headed)

I'm a big fan, if i take this i'm full till 13:00-14:00 and then I eat something because I work-out around 15-16:00.

Thanks.
The addition of butter to the diet is interesting.
It does provide a slight boost in cognition, but at the same time, it does make me salivate a lot and stimulates all the indicators of insulin-release. I've experimented a lot with adding butter to the diet, but recently decided against it.
I tried excluding it and went from 16% bodyfat to 10.5% bf pretty quickly, so I don't really see the point in including it. The great reduction in BF definitely outweighs the slight, transient cognitive benefits of butter.

If anyone is having trouble losing weight, I'd definitely recommend excluding it. However, a few grams of grass-fed butter would probably be beneficial. I do think Asprey's marketing trick of recommending hundreds grams of butter daily just for the sake of being controversial is just moronic, and completely destroys his credibility.

[Sholrak]

I've heard something about the increased testosterone or at least bring back the 'manhood' sensation (if lost) with this stack. What do you think?