2844 replies to this topic

[MrHappy]

Justchill - try 200-300mg via normal oral dose for the next week and see if you find it better? I find too much uridine makes me a little too focused. Personally, I save sublingual doses for high-stress/load days. Everyone is different, however!

PS. Try the 'follow this topic' button. Also, allow up to 2 weeks - 10 days seems to be the median.

Edited by MrHappy, 27 January 2012 - 12:18 PM.

[csrpj]

OK, so i've decided to take the plunge and try out the uridine combo!

i just ordered TAU and shall start in maybe 5 days when it arrives.

how much should i start with? 50mg, then raise to 75mg in a couple weeks, then 100mg?

also, i'd like to get this straight:
TAU i should take with food, along with EPA/DHA and vitamin E, right?
but ALCAR or A-GPC (not sure which yet i will use) should be taken on an empty stomach, right? if so, should i still time it so that it's close to the uridine?

my last question is about dosages for vitamin E and DHA.... for example, is it OK to be taking 400IU? is it truly optimal to be taking 1000? and for fish oil, taking three pills from the large bottle i have yields 1230/822 EPA/DHA - is this also OK?

i'll make sure to update the forum on my progress, whether it works out or not.

[MrHappy]

I'd suggest you try 75mg or 100mg of TAU to start.

Everything else, while not exactly within spec, is close enough that you should see some results.

Since you are waiting for ingredients, you could start dosing what you do have and then add things as they arrive. Benefit to you would be that you can tell if a particular component needs adjustment.

[Reformed-Redan]

Anyone know how to get 300mg/kg into your system, as one study showed as effective doses?

On what animal? I think we have to convert the dosages first, I think that would be about 50 mg/kg for humans if that dosage was tested on rats.

THat's still like around 4 g for effective dosage. Around... 10, 1000 mg fish oil tablets just to cover the DHA/EPA.

[nupi]

OK, so i've decided to take the plunge and try out the uridine combo!

i just ordered TAU and shall start in maybe 5 days when it arrives.

how much should i start with? 50mg, then raise to 75mg in a couple weeks, then 100mg?

also, i'd like to get this straight:
TAU i should take with food, along with EPA/DHA and vitamin E, right?
but ALCAR or A-GPC (not sure which yet i will use) should be taken on an empty stomach, right? if so, should i still time it so that it's close to the uridine?

I have come to the view that you need to take fat soluble compounds with fat (obviously) which generally means with meals. However, since it likely does not matter much for water soluble ones (full stomach will simply delay absorption but should not lessen it overall), I take them around meals, too.

THat's still like around 4 g for effective dosage. Around... 10, 1000 mg fish oil tablets just to cover the DHA/EPA.

I until recently took 2000mg EPA, 1000mg DHA. 4 pills (NOW makes pills with 500/250mg and there might be some even more concentrated ones out there)

Edited by nupi, 28 January 2012 - 09:32 AM.

[penisbreath]

Here were my cousin (who's a geneticist, not a chemist, fyi)'s thoughts on the nicotine/uridine study ..

I've had a quick read of the paper, so here are some basic thoughts:

1) The study was carried out on manipulated single-cell populations in petri dishes (the cells come from a human T-cell leukaemia cell-line) so I'm not sure if the results would be very relevant in a whole-body system, or if they could be extrapolated to other cell types e.g. neurons etc...

2) Yes, it seems that both caffeine and nicotine block the uptake of uridine through the two uridine 'transporter channels' (hCNT1, hCNT2) in these cells [see Table 2], but again I don't know if this is important in a whole body setting.

3) This study is 8 years old - a long time in molecular bio-science - and I don't see evidence of any large body of follow-up work to suggest that anyone thought this was important enough to look at in further detail.

[MrHappy]

Mmm..

I don't think it's been widely studied, but there were a small number of other papers and patents that discuss the relationship, not just that example..

From memory, there are some more links on this thread, but I have posted others in another thread or private message discussing nicotine withdrawal - I'll see if I can locate them for you.

Additionally, we now have some user experiences that seem to support the literature..?

[brunotto]

Would not be better take the much much cheaper RNA instead of URIDINE.... Uric Acid maybe a big concern if too much but is also one of the stronghest antioxidant having it at a good level... of course mega dosing RNA maybe bad.

Both uric acid and ascorbic acid are strong reducing agents (electron donors) and potent antioxidants. In humans, over half the antioxidant capacity of blood plasma comes from uric acid.^[13]

Probably the trick with Uric Acid is to drink a lot and keep a low proteine & low fructose diet (also good not to have cancer or kidney trouble)... also having good Copper level (and low Iron) helps to reduce Uric Acid.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Uric_acid

Urate has been shown to be a major antioxidant in human serum and was postulated to have a biological role in protecting tissues against the toxic effects of oxygen radicals and in determining the longevity of primates. This possibility has been tested by determining if the maximum lifespan potentials of 22 primate and 17 non-primate mammalian species are positively correlated with the concentration of urate in serum and brain per specific metabolic rate. This analysis is based on the concept that the degree of protection a tissue has against oxygen radicals is proportional to antioxidant concentration per rate of oxygen metabolism of that tissue. Ascorbate, another potentially important antioxidant in determining longevity of mammalian species, was also investigated using this method. The results show a highly significant positive correlation of maximum lifespan potential with the concentration of urate in serum and brain per specific metabolic rate. No significant correlation was found for ascorbate. These results support the hypothesis that urate is biologically active as an antioxidant and is involved in determining the longevity of primate species, particularly for humans and the great apes. Ascorbate appears to have played little or no role as a longevity determinant in mammalian species.

http://www.sciencedi...167494384900335

Edited by brunotto, 28 January 2012 - 10:42 PM.

[choqueiro]

Hey.

My eight day taking Uridine + DHA + Multivitamin + Vitamin E. Unfortunately I can´t report anything positive. All my symptoms (depression, anxiety, memory issues, brain fog, etc.) continue there and I have not experimented any improve. In fact yesterday my symptoms got worse. I was playing a football match in the afternoon (I took the Uridine stack in the morning) and I felt really brain fogged (I don´t know if it has any relationship but the true is that I felt really horrible).

I´m start thinking that I´m one of those "non responders" to any nootropic. Since I began taking nootropics I have tried with no positive results: piracetam, alpha gpc, alcar, ginkgo, gotu kola, bacopa and now this combo (uridine + dha + mutlivitamin + vitamin E).

MrHappy suggested for those that we suffer from depression to avoid Alpha GPC the first days. After one week taking the combo without choline maybe today I should begin with Alpha GPC. Even though, all those new threads in the forum, talking about Choline side effects and the inconveniences of this substance for those with depression or OCD, do not offer me any confidence and I think that maybe Alpha GPC is going to harm instead of improve the Uridine combo.

Today I´m going to order LEF Magnesium L-Threonate. It´s my last attempt with nootropics. If it does not work, maybe I´ll have to satrt thinking in live "permanently" with brain fog, memory issues, anxiety, depression, etc.

[ddd2011]

Wow Chequeiro, I've been taking 50-75mg UMP twice daily for the past 4 days, and I notice quite strong brain fog! I also take concetrated Omega 3 (1000mg epa/dha), 250mg Choline Bitrate + 200mg Piracetam (been taking them for few months now). I'm extremely sensitive to any medication, hence low dosing of Uridine. I also experienced brain fog from CDP Choline (I tried it for few days back in November). CDP Choline also gave me a bit of irritability, while uridine didn't. If I take second dose of uridine late in the afternoon, noticed problems with falling asleep. ALCAR also gave me brain fog (evenm in small dose of 125mg). On positive side, I definitely noticed boost in my mood since I added uridine.

[MrHappy]

Choq - try adding the a-gpc or alcar and see what happens over the next week. If not, try changing the DHA levels around.

[GhostBuster]

Hey.

My eight day taking Uridine + DHA + Multivitamin + Vitamin E. Unfortunately I can´t report anything positive. All my symptoms (depression, anxiety, memory issues, brain fog, etc.) continue there and I have not experimented any improve. In fact yesterday my symptoms got worse. I was playing a football match in the afternoon (I took the Uridine stack in the morning) and I felt really brain fogged (I don´t know if it has any relationship but the true is that I felt really horrible).

I´m start thinking that I´m one of those "non responders" to any nootropic. Since I began taking nootropics I have tried with no positive results: piracetam, alpha gpc, alcar, ginkgo, gotu kola, bacopa and now this combo (uridine + dha + mutlivitamin + vitamin E).

MrHappy suggested for those that we suffer from depression to avoid Alpha GPC the first days. After one week taking the combo without choline maybe today I should begin with Alpha GPC. Even though, all those new threads in the forum, talking about Choline side effects and the inconveniences of this substance for those with depression or OCD, do not offer me any confidence and I think that maybe Alpha GPC is going to harm instead of improve the Uridine combo.

Today I´m going to order LEF Magnesium L-Threonate. It´s my last attempt with nootropics. If it does not work, maybe I´ll have to satrt thinking in live "permanently" with brain fog, memory issues, anxiety, depression, etc.

I also have had a limited success with nootropics. However, I got a huge relief from brain fog after playing intensively three weeks lumosity brain games. Then I had a crystal clear and lucid mind, finally, first time in years. This was accompanied with substantial increase in my performance, I started to get several +1600 BPI scores in different games. On the other I had been using several nootropics (including fish oil, uridine, alpha gpc, lecithin) at the same time.

[Justchill]

Justchill - try 200-300mg via normal oral dose for the next week and see if you find it better? I find too much uridine makes me a little too focused. Personally, I save sublingual doses for high-stress/load days. Everyone is different, however!

PS. Try the 'follow this topic' button. Also, allow up to 2 weeks - 10 days seems to be the median.

OK - 5 days of 250-300 mg of sublingual Uridine.
Effects:

- There is a moodlift, you feel OK
- Increased motivation, confidence
- increased concentration

However all very subtle.
This stuff definately influences dopamine, feels a bit like L-tyrosine but different.
Still, I feel there is something wrong with this supp as I feel there is a small come-up and come-down and that is never good.

Mr Happy stated that you would feel its full effects after a week, so we'll report back then.

Cheers!

PS/ Where can I check "direct email notification" here?

Also that stuff gave me a dry mouth...
I don't know, I feel there is something wrong with this supp... will try again later with oral ROA.

[nupi]

After 15 days I am beginning to doubt it does much of anything for me. Maybe I am too low on Vitamin E, but other than that, I am not sure what could be wrong. I'll try some more when I get my Vitamin E delivery, but from my current point of view I am not sure I will keep it... I might give Agomelatine a try, it's MoA is very interesting....

Edited by nupi, 30 January 2012 - 02:50 PM.

[MrHappy]

It'd be good to work out what the issue is for slow / non responders. I know everyone has differences, but there probably is a common genetic sub-type for which a dose adjustment would make all the difference... The question is what?

Nupi, you used to be on a different fishoil ratio - perhaps try the old ratio and let us know? Failing that, perhaps go for a larger dose of uridine?

[nupi]

The ratio is the same, but I reduced consumption. It's not that I feel significantly worse before, I just do not seem to get the Uridine benefits everyone is raving about.
I will try with more Uridine once I get those Vitamin E pills.

Maybe the rest of my stack already covers those bases and I need to go look for more potent agents (been thinking about Agomelatine, Selegiline or Methylphenidate - first one is easy to get, the other two the psychiatrist was not too eager to prescribe) to get to the next level... Another thing I was looking at it is Tim Ferriss' musings about boosting testosterone with high doses of D3 and (presumably) MK7 as well as Selenium (although that last one will need proper blood monitoring, Selenium toxicity is not a nice thing)

Edited by nupi, 31 January 2012 - 07:54 AM.

[stillwater]

I'm on Day 19 today of taking Choline, Vit E, Fish Oil and sublingual Uridine. I do notice a difference on it, it's not monumental and what I think I notice most is that the days of "low lows" have dissappeared, the days when I would be extremely tired or depressed have faded away. On the other side though there hasn't been any exceptional highs in terms of energy, memory or mood....which is ok, I kind of knew this would happen going in.

I'm going to stick with it at least till I run out and re-assess then. I really hope down the road there's no news release that pops up saying that long term uridine use causes something like scrotal skin cancer because that would suck.

Edited by stillwater, 31 January 2012 - 06:48 PM.

[X_Danny_X]

Danny - vitamin E is an antioxidant to go with the largish fish oil intake, it's vital for membrane health and there is a citation on page 24 of this thread discussing Fortasyn Connect that is worth reading.. as well as others earlier. Google:

uridine "vitamin e" "longecity"

..for earlier posts.

By fine tuning, I mean ascertaining a useful dosing protocol for yourself. If it's working for you now, stick to it. Play around with the doses if not..

I read that but other vitamins were mentioned such as Vitamin C and B12. I wanted to know if melatonin can be used instead of Vitamin E. It is a powerful anti oxidant and life extension supplement. It goes after free radicals that attacks proporties that help weaken immune system.

What foods contain a good amount of Vitamin E.

[MrHappy]

Sorry, I don't see that working. Here is a list of food sources for alpha-tocopherol:
http://ods.od.nih.go...ts/vitamine/#h3

[nupi]

No real reason you cannot use Vitamin E AND Melatonin, though I am quite skeptical whether ongoing melatonin supplementation is healthy

Edited by nupi, 01 February 2012 - 07:47 AM.

[JChief]

I am quite skeptical whether ongoing melatonin supplementation is healthy

I agree with this. Consider me in the minority. I currently only take it to help regulate sleep cycles when I work the overnight shift. A dose before bed in the morning works wonders to get to sleep in a timely fashion. I will not be taking it long term.

[nupi]

This reads like a good summary of Melatonin dangers: http://www.longecity...dpost__p__81414

I am also quite unsure whether the stuff does much for jetlag. I still take it for east bound trips, but I am not very convinced...

[choqueiro]

Hi.

Day 10. Since yesterday I´m taking Alpha GPC. So, right now I´m taking daily:

- 250 mg. Uridine UMP sublingually.
- 1.800 mg. DHA and 360 mg. EPA.
- 250 mg. Alpha GPC.
- 6 capsules of the multivitamin "Ortho Core" from AOR.
- 1 or 2 capsules of "Total E" from AOR.

No positive effects. I don´t know if it would be good rise Alpha GPC to 500 mg. daily. Maybe I´m not taking the correct dosage of DHA/EPA as MrHappy suggested. More vitamin E could be necessary also. Even though, I think that the stack doesn´t suit with me.

Any recommendation??


Thanks

[MrHappy]

Go to 500mg, if no issues, then see how it goes over the next week. Assess at that time, relax in the meantime.

[MrHappy]

Also, try oral instead of sublingual and see if you feel different..

[X_Danny_X]

So without Vitamin E, Uridine, GPC, and DHA combo will be much weaker?



I read all that about Melatonin and some of that information was incorrect, such as when taking melatonin, your body stops making it. It is not a steroid that when you take it, the body stops producing its own. Melatonin is anti-aging, powerful antioxident and no known causes of any dangers have been shown when taking it long term.

Your body produces less and less melatonin as you age, for some folks a lot.

Man that list sucks, I dont even rarely eat thos foods. I guess I have to buy a supplement.

Edited by X_Danny_X, 01 February 2012 - 11:03 PM.

[autocratica]

HI all,

Ok So I and my Girlfriend have been taking UMP from cardio research 300mg once daily on an empty stomach. I would consider myself a healthy 28 year old who suffers from not getting things done :P. I am about 6 days in and so far the effects are apparent. I feel very relaxed and confident, and no longer suffer from my slight anxiety from stressful actions. Waking up knowing I have a lot of work to do would make me feel awful. Now that feeling is gone. I look forward to its continued affects. I currently take 500mg of ALCAR, 600mg of DHA, and a bvitamin with it.

The bad thing is it has affected my Libido. where I can certainly preform sex but have no urgency to do so...unlike before I was taking it. I had a pretty good libido too.

The really big difference I must say and also thank everyone in this thread for has been my Girlfriend. She suffered from mood swings, depression, and I would bet good money Schizophrenia. Since taking uridine I have noticed a 100% improvement in her attitude and my interaction with her. She was on a lot of meds but now only takes this cocktail, a small dose of adderall, and gotu kola. She swears by it, she says she feels normal. She has been taking it for 3.5 weeks now and I must say it is night and day. I really want to thank everyone Mr Happy and that other guy who has the guy made of pills in his avatar especially.

Edited by autocratica, 02 February 2012 - 12:02 AM.

[MrHappy]

You're very welcome. JChief is the guy with the awesome 'drug-person' avatar.

Everyone here deserves credit though, as without all the self-testing, contributions and feedback, this kind of knowledge-building just wouldn't be possible. Longecity is such a great community!

Next item that definitely needs group help:
What are the reasons for slow or non-responders? Genetics? Dose? Hepatic / renal function? Sleep? Other supplements / medication?

While blood and hepatic tests would be extremely useful, maybe with more data we could correlate some factors and solve this. Would people be willing to share some more info, if I drafted a template?

[rogerthat]

Effect of uridine of presynaptic NMDA and kainate receptor of rat brain cortex
Bulletin of Experimental Biology and Medicine (March 2008), 145 (3), pg. 320-322

It was demonstrated that uridine affects presynaptic NMDA and kainite receptors of rat brain cortex. Uridine considerably inhibited ⁴⁵Ca²⁺ uptake into synaptoneurosomes (IC₅₀=7.1×10⁻¹² M) under conditions NMDA stimulation and increased it under conditions AMPA stimulation (157.8%).

Any thoughts how this might interact with stimulants? Particularly Adderall/Dexedrine?

I am taking Lithium Orotate to reduce amphetamine tolerance rising and am a little concerned that tolerance may increase at a faster rate.

[csrpj]

besides it being lowered for autocratica, any effects on libido?