2844 replies to this topic

[Royanon]

Hey, been lurking in this thread (and forum, for that matter) for a while now and if it wouldn't be a problem I'd like to have a few things clarified.

1. There's a lot of talk about UMP and TAU being similarly effective, not much talk about dietary uridine/RNA. Is it similarly effective? Perhaps with higher dosages as compared to sublingual UMP?

2. I also understand that dietary RNA also contains purines as well as uridine, is this any cause for concern in a reasonably healthy individual?

3. I've seen some talk of people supplementing with DHA, others EPA, and others still none at all. What's the deal here? Is there a specific amount of either I should be aiming for, for optimal results?

Thanks in advance for answering my questions.

[Hope47]

How do you guys take DHA.After breakfast or quickly after Uridine administration.Also.Is my multi good enough for b vitamin supplementation.

Edited by Hope47, 05 September 2012 - 05:43 AM.

[MrHappy]

You who have tried both - how similar are the effects from uridine and Wellbutrin? Uridine made absolute wonders for me for a few weeks but has now stopped working, and I'm looking for something that gives a similar effect.

What doses are you taking and what cofactors?

At first I was only taking 25 mg TAU with 1000 mg EPA/600 mg DHA. The effects were amazing, but lasted only for a little more than a week. I've been suffering from something I believe to be a chronic hypodopaminergic state, somewhat similar to the negative symptoms of schizophrenia but much much weaker. Uridine completely alleviated all my symptoms and made me feel like a complete version of myself for the first time in years. Absolutely mind-blowing.

After that combo stopped working I experimented around a bit, and managed to regain the same effects by taking the same amount of fish oil, but with 1800 mg (!) UMP sublingually. The effects of this combo lasted for two weeks, and stopped working after that. The whole thing kind of reminds me of other people's description of Wellbutrin's honeymoon effects.

I've experimented around since then with different doses of TAU and UMP (orally and sublingually) together with 5-MTHF, Grape Seed Extract, vitamin E, inositol and a multi, but without being able to get the results back.

Currently I'm using 1000 mg EPA/600 mg DHA, 250 mg UMP sublingually, GSE, CDP-choline and a multi, but without any noticeable effect.

Very interesting.
What are your zinc and copper levels like? Maybe get a blood test?

Hey, been lurking in this thread (and forum, for that matter) for a while now and if it wouldn't be a problem I'd like to have a few things clarified.

1. There's a lot of talk about UMP and TAU being similarly effective, not much talk about dietary uridine/RNA. Is it similarly effective? Perhaps with higher dosages as compared to sublingual UMP?

2. I also understand that dietary RNA also contains purines as well as uridine, is this any cause for concern in a reasonably healthy individual?

3. I've seen some talk of people supplementing with DHA, others EPA, and others still none at all. What's the deal here? Is there a specific amount of either I should be aiming for, for optimal results?

Thanks in advance for answering my questions.

UMP is the best value.

RNA - less efficient with higher risj of gout.

DHA / EPA - try >700mg DHA + >350mg EPA, but it's not critical - just get enough.

How do you guys take DHA.After breakfast or quickly after Uridine administration.Also.Is my multi good enough for b vitamin supplementation.

Whenever.

Depends on the multi. Some are good.

[ScientiaPotentiaEst]

I don't know of this link concerning the study with the choline-uridine-dha cocktail has been posted but here you go :
http://www.touchneur...1/files/27.html

Very interesting, I must say.
Also, Mr. Happy, have you had your blood checked after using this combination, and if so, how long have you been taking this combo prior to said blood test?

Thanks a bundle!

[MrHappy]

I don't know of this link concerning the study with the choline-uridine-dha cocktail has been posted but here you go :
http://www.touchneur...1/files/27.html

Very interesting, I must say.
Also, Mr. Happy, have you had your blood checked after using this combination, and if so, how long have you been taking this combo prior to said blood test?

Thanks a bundle!

No blood tests, but it's been over a year. Next physical I'll let you know.

[ScientiaPotentiaEst]

I don't know of this link concerning the study with the choline-uridine-dha cocktail has been posted but here you go :
http://www.touchneur...1/files/27.html

Very interesting, I must say.
Also, Mr. Happy, have you had your blood checked after using this combination, and if so, how long have you been taking this combo prior to said blood test?

Thanks a bundle!

No blood tests, but it's been over a year. Next physical I'll let you know.

Thanks! Do you still feel the same mental clarity from the combo, after a year?
Also, I really enjoyed reading the entire thread. And I'm happy for you and especially your wife!

[MrHappy]

I don't know of this link concerning the study with the choline-uridine-dha cocktail has been posted but here you go :
http://www.touchneur...1/files/27.html

Very interesting, I must say.
Also, Mr. Happy, have you had your blood checked after using this combination, and if so, how long have you been taking this combo prior to said blood test?

Thanks a bundle!

No blood tests, but it's been over a year. Next physical I'll let you know.

Thanks! Do you still feel the same mental clarity from the combo, after a year?
Also, I really enjoyed reading the entire thread. And I'm happy for you and especially your wife!

Yes, it still makes a significant difference to my quality of life and cognitive ability.

PS. Thanks for your kindness and well done for getting through the whole thread!

[mrak1979]

I remember reading one post saying they have broken sleep from this combo. I seem to have more trouble falling and maintaining sleep ever since. Anybody else have this symptom?

[MrHappy]

I remember reading one post saying they have broken sleep from this combo. I seem to have more trouble falling and maintaining sleep ever since. Anybody else have this symptom?

Actually, it normally sorts out sleeping issues when taken at night. Are you following the standard schedule? How much time do you spend in front of LCD screens (including phones) at night?

[chairofgold]

How longe does uridine work? I find it gives me s mild high feeling that can last up to 2 hrs. In contrast Cerebrolysin wiped away my depression in several days of treatment and the effects are continuous.

[Raza]

I remember reading one post saying they have broken sleep from this combo. I seem to have more trouble falling and maintaining sleep ever since. Anybody else have this symptom?

I get insomnia from the SN 'Enhanced Sublingual Formula', presumably due to the added B vitamins, for what that's worth.

[MrHappy]

I remember reading one post saying they have broken sleep from this combo. I seem to have more trouble falling and maintaining sleep ever since. Anybody else have this symptom?

I get insomnia from the SN 'Enhanced Sublingual Formula', presumably due to the added B vitamins, for what that's worth.

The B9/B12 content is pretty extreme.. I'd do the normal 250g UMP.

How longe does uridine work? I find it gives me s mild high feeling that can last up to 2 hrs. In contrast Cerebrolysin wiped away my depression in several days of treatment and the effects are continuous.

Depends on which effects. Some are long-lasting/"permanent" (growth factors) others are months (dopamine modulation), some are days (neural bloodflow), some are hours (circadian rhythm influence).

[Raza]

It's not that bad. The B9 is below the RDA and the B12, while several thousand percent of it, is still a dose that is common in multis and much less than the dose recommended for beneficial effects on circadian rhythm. Taken first thing in the morning, it should help sleep cycle issues better than ordinary UMP. It's just not suitable for nighttime use.

Edited by Raza, 07 September 2012 - 01:49 PM.

[MrHappy]

It's not that bad. The B9 is below the RDA and the B12, while several thousand percent of it, is still a dose that is common in multis and much less than the dose recommended for beneficial effects on circadian rhythm. Taken first thing in the morning, it should help sleep cycle issues better than ordinary UMP. It's just not suitable for nighttime use.

It's definitely not for nighttime use. The other issue is balancing the rest of the B group with it.

[Raza]

That's probably beyond me. Where would I start looking for the word on how B-vitamins should be balanced against each other?

[MrHappy]

That's probably beyond me. Where would I start looking for the word on how B-vitamins should be balanced against each other?

There is a distinct lack of easy information without a large amount of google searching. In a nutshell, some B vitamins are antagonistic to other B vitamins. B6 is antagonistic to B1,2,3. B9 masks a B12 deficiency. There is a lot more to it than that, of course.

B vitamins found in whole foods are normally used as the guideline for ratios in multi-B vitamin supplements. This doesn't mean that they are absorbed with the same efficiency, so a blood test every now and again is a good idea to ascertain your own requirements.

[stablemind]

Day 2 of Fishoil + Vitamin E + Uridine + Multivitamin

After taking the Uridine, I notice enhanced processing in general and short term memory. Enhancement is definitely evident. I go through all my flash cards really quickly and I notice that when I get it wrong, the next time around I don't make as many mistakes as I usually do. This could be very useful when taken right before an assignment that requires a lot of concentration.

Although my long term memory isn't enhanced as much as my short term, I still believe this will be very useful. Who knows, maybe this stack will eventually help long term memory as well after all this is only day 2.

My mood is also better. I have an overall sense of well being. It feels like my brain is actually working when I'm trying to think rather than feeling "out of it" no matter how much I try to concentrate.

Should I increase the dosage? I'm taking 250mg in the day and 250mg in the afternoon.

Edited by stablemind, 09 September 2012 - 05:41 AM.

[MrHappy]

Day 2 of Fishoil + Vitamin E + Uridine + Multivitamin

After taking the Uridine, I notice enhanced processing in general and short term memory. Enhancement is definitely evident. I go through all my flash cards really quickly and I notice that when I get it wrong, the next time around I don't make as many mistakes as I usually do. This could be very useful when taken right before an assignment that requires a lot of concentration.

Although my long term memory isn't enhanced as much as my short term, I still believe this will be very useful. Who knows, maybe this stack will eventually help long term memory as well after all this is only day 2.

My mood is also better. I have an overall sense of well being. It feels like my brain is actually working when I'm trying to think rather than feeling "out of it" no matter how much I try to concentrate.

Should I increase the dosage? I'm taking 250mg in the day and 250mg in the afternoon.

I'd stick to your current schedule for a couple of weeks, if not continuously.

[ScientiaPotentiaEst]

Does anyone know a good supplier of UMP in Europe? I saw eurofitness.fr but their shipping costs are high and their delivering time tends to take quite some time so I've read.

[stablemind]

Its almost been a week since I've started taking this and I have to say it is very valuable. The past three days I've had 6 hrs of sleep which would normally send me into a mixed state but I've been feeling very well. My mood has been stable. Although my memory still isn't up to par (this may be due to the lack of sleep), my mood is very stable with this. I'm thinking of letting my parents try this since they refuse meds. Once I move back to the west, my body will undergo tremendous stress and my circadian rhythm will be thrown off. If Uridine can prevent relapse this will be HUGE progress since no other supps, not even meds, could prevent sleep deprived associated relapse.

[csrpj]

Does Phosphatidyl Serine has a role as a super-stack member with the uridine+?

[MrHappy]

Does Phosphatidyl Serine has a role as a super-stack member with the uridine+?

Uridine already increases levels of PS.

[MrHappy]

Its almost been a week since I've started taking this and I have to say it is very valuable. The past three days I've had 6 hrs of sleep which would normally send me into a mixed state but I've been feeling very well. My mood has been stable. Although my memory still isn't up to par (this may be due to the lack of sleep), my mood is very stable with this. I'm thinking of letting my parents try this since they refuse meds. Once I move back to the west, my body will undergo tremendous stress and my circadian rhythm will be thrown off. If Uridine can prevent relapse this will be HUGE progress since no other supps, not even meds, could prevent sleep deprived associated relapse.

Just a word of caution on that - while uridine is amazing at ameliorating the effects of sleep deprivation, my experience has been that 'the wall' has been moved a lot further away, not removed completely. You'll hit it again eventually. Sleep is absolutely critical for proper cognitive function and memory.

[Raza]

So Im pretty sure now that Uridine has either a normalizing or a stimulating influence on Glutamate/NMDA receptor activation on top of its known effect on Dopamine.

When you do different drugs and miss sleep as much as I do, you start to learn to tell apart different forms of mental malfunction/tiredness by the way they feel and by which stimulants do or do not help against them. Some forms you can fix with dopaminergic or adrenalergic stimulants. Another, you can help with cholinergics. One comes out of your biological clock deciding that it's your bedtime and only slowly retreats for daylight or its imitators. But one particular kind, characterized by severe lack of focus, losing track of your thoughts even while you're trying to voice them, and a certain... mental retreat from your environment, to where it gets difficult to respond positively to external stimuli, I associate with low glutamate/NMDA activity because it is brought on without fail by dissociative psychedelics and alcohol, all NMDA antagonists, when you drop to a certain level of sleep deprivation on them - and also because stimulants specific to other excitatory neurotransmitter systems do nothing to alleviate it.

I've already reported once that Uridine fixed the unpleasant after effects of 4-meo-pcp (a dissociative) for me, but I've now experienced that it helps against this kind of mental malfunction regardless of its source. This is a benefit that cannot be explained by dopaminergic and/or serotonergic modulation alone, nor as far as I can see by receptor regrowth (NMDA antagonism itself causes receptorgenesis, so there should have been no lack of that).

I have some D-Aspartic Acid and Sarcosine on the way to explore NMDA receptor activation with; I'll keep you guys informed when I can confirm through those wheter the effect in question is glutamergic. Also note that glutamate and the NMDA receptor are strongly implicated in OCD, which if I remember reading this thread correctly has been affected one way or another by those who have it and took Uridine in this thread.

Edited by Raza, 13 September 2012 - 09:38 PM.

[ScientiaPotentiaEst]

Interesting post Raza.
Where do you get your Uridine btw? Btw, I'm from Belgium

[stablemind]

Does anyone know if an extended release pill for uridine has been made? It would be more convenient and probably more effective.

[MrHappy]

So Im pretty sure now that Uridine has either a normalizing or a stimulating influence on Glutamate/NMDA receptor activation on top of its known effect on Dopamine.

When you do different drugs and miss sleep as much as I do, you start to learn to tell apart different forms of mental malfunction/tiredness by the way they feel and by which stimulants do or do not help against them. Some forms you can fix with dopaminergic or adrenalergic stimulants. Another, you can help with cholinergics. One comes out of your biological clock deciding that it's your bedtime and only slowly retreats for daylight or its imitators. But one particular kind, characterized by severe lack of focus, losing track of your thoughts even while you're trying to voice them, and a certain... mental retreat from your environment, to where it gets difficult to respond positively to external stimuli, I associate with low glutamate/NMDA activity because it is brought on without fail by dissociative psychedelics and alcohol, all NMDA antagonists, when you drop to a certain level of sleep deprivation on them - and also because stimulants specific to other excitatory neurotransmitter systems do nothing to alleviate it.

I've already reported once that Uridine fixed the unpleasant after effects of 4-meo-pcp (a dissociative) for me, but I've now experienced that it helps against this kind of mental malfunction regardless of its source. This is a benefit that cannot be explained by dopaminergic and/or serotonergic modulation alone, nor as far as I can see by receptor regrowth (NMDA antagonism itself causes receptorgenesis, so there should have been no lack of that).

I have some D-Aspartic Acid and Sarcosine on the way to explore NMDA receptor activation with; I'll keep you guys informed when I can confirm through those wheter the effect in question is glutamergic. Also note that glutamate and the NMDA receptor are strongly implicated in OCD, which if I remember reading this thread correctly has been affected one way or another by those who have it and took Uridine in this thread.

There is a paper about its influence on NMDA and AMPA receptors earlier in the thread. It's an NMDA inhibitor and an AMPA promoter.

[MrHappy]

Does anyone know if an extended release pill for uridine has been made? It would be more convenient and probably more effective.

Not that I'm aware of. Blood plasma levels are increased for quite some time, so I don't think there's really a need. When taking flights, etc., I take a bottle of TAU capsules for convenience at security checkpoints.

[owtsgmi]

Does Phosphatidyl Serine has a role as a super-stack member with the uridine+?

1 take 200mg daily, and noticed more clarity but it might be overkill. Give it a try and see if it helps.

[dear mrclock]

im to ask why is DHA the prefered fatty acid in fish oil for this ? recently i was shown studies showing actually EPA to be involved in the brain more. maybe switch ?