228 replies to this topic

[manic_racetam]

It just occurred to me that BrainCells Inc is trying to out-licence Coluracetam for the treatment of co-morbid depression and anxiety. (http://www.braincell...ipeline/bci-540). Does this mean they're trying to get a company to bring it to market? Their clinical trials were concluded in June of last year, I wonder what the hold-up is on getting this to market.

I'm thinking it might be a really expensive synth or something. Maybe difficult enough to make that would make it profitable to patent it in medicine form. Not sure, just speculation.

But honestly I think CH is more likely to get something like phenylpiracetam before coluracetam... although I can't find even one supplier of phenylpiracetam in China, and there's at least a couple for the coluracetam so maybe I'm wrong on that.

[computeTHIS]

I'm thinking it might be a really expensive synth or something. Maybe difficult enough to make that would make it profitable to patent it in medicine form. Not sure, just speculation.

It may have to do with the fact that Mitsubishi Pharma was the company who created it and funded its trials for Alzheimer's Disease, so now that both Mitsubishi and BrainCells Inc have invested money into it, it has an incredible markup attached to it. Generally, it seems somewhat futile for foreign-developed drugs to make it to US markets. That's US Big Pharma at work for you!

But honestly I think CH is more likely to get something like phenylpiracetam before coluracetam... although I can't find even one supplier of phenylpiracetam in China, and there's at least a couple for the coluracetam so maybe I'm wrong on that.

I noticed that. I'm beginning to think that phenylpiracetam has become obsolete to something else, possibly Wellbutrin, or some other Russian-developed stuff? Web reports seem to show that it has similar catecholamine-effects like Wellbutrin does. The problem is that there isn't very specific pharmacological information about phenylpiracetam published, so it's hard to compare it to anything.

[Baten]

"Coluracetam is the only known choline uptake enhancer to currently exist. Studies have shown that it may induce long-lasting procognitive effects by changing the choline transporter regulation system"

So, it could permanently change the choline transporter regulation system? Seems somewhat dangerous.

[synapse]

Hint Hint CerebralHealth.com aka Synaspe?~

I will look into it.

[Baten]

Hint Hint CerebralHealth.com aka Synaspe?~

I will look into it.

Great \o/.

[manic_racetam]

"Coluracetam is the only known choline uptake enhancer to currently exist. Studies have shown that it may induce long-lasting procognitive effects by changing the choline transporter regulation system"

So, it could permanently change the choline transporter regulation system? Seems somewhat dangerous.

This is a bit confusing to me. Aren't most of the racetams choline uptake enhancers? Or are they choline reuptake enhancers? Or is there a difference? Isn't that the whole reason people take choline with the racetams?

[Baten]

"Coluracetam is the only known choline uptake enhancer to currently exist. Studies have shown that it may induce long-lasting procognitive effects by changing the choline transporter regulation system"

So, it could permanently change the choline transporter regulation system? Seems somewhat dangerous.

This is a bit confusing to me. Aren't most of the racetams choline uptake enhancers? Or are they choline reuptake enhancers? Or is there a difference? Isn't that the whole reason people take choline with the racetams?

I guess the other racetams influence the mechanics of how the choline is used (uptake?) i.e. more choline gets used,
while coluracetam specifically alters the reuptake mechanism (among other things), which could mean
1) you may not need to take any extra choline with it
2) "studies have shown that it may induce long-lasting procognitive effects"

relevant: "it is estimated that 35-50% of the choline released from the breakdown of ACh in the synaptic cleft is taken up again by the presynaptic neuron"

Edited by Baten, 25 December 2011 - 12:58 AM.

[ScienceGuy]

Bump on a early next year bulk order, who wants this??

If you can find a decent source I'd definitely be interested in buying some Coluracetam!

[Reformed-Redan]

Any updates on this?

[ScienceGuy]

Hint Hint CerebralHealth.com aka Synaspe?~

I will look into it.

Hey Synapse,

Any update regards supplying COLURACETAM (a.k.a. MKC-231 and BCI-540)?

There's a bunch of people here who'd be VERY interested in buying some... and that includes me

[Ark]

Bump Bump Bump Bump..... on bulk Coluracetam order!~~~

Edited by Ark, 23 January 2012 - 12:13 AM.

[JChief]

bump I'd join in on this one..

[chroncile]

I'm particularly interested in Coluracetam for my MDD. Does anyone know what coluracetam's half-life is and if it's water-soluble or fat-soluble?

[REBUILDER]

I emailed synapse at cerebral health dot com about this. Maybe other interested people should, too?

Edited by rebuilder, 19 February 2012 - 02:47 PM.

[stillwater]

I'd definitely be interested in ordering some.

[pinnacle]

I'd be well interested in ordering this one too.

[greekpsychonaut]

Someone just quoted me $50,000 for 100 grams of this. I wanted to slap him over the internet.

[Baten]

Someone just quoted me $50,000 for 100 grams of this. I wanted to slap him over the internet.

Maybe it gives you superpowers.

[greekpsychonaut]

It's a proven choline uptake enhancer. No way it's that hard to synthesize.

[focus83]

I am very interested, too. I would buy it immediately if a reliable source offered it for a decent price.

[CIMN]

Indeed This one is really interesting. I find this most interesting "It may also have potential use in prevention and treatment of ischemic retinopathy and retinal and optic nerve injury." So.. it be applied to the eyes by use of eye drops?

But. That said, BCI-540, obviously has nootropic effects such as Ampa potentation, choline uptake enhancer of "high affinity",( more research needs be done, it might have side effects.. thats my opinion, not saying thats a fact)

Edited by CIMN, 03 September 2012 - 12:10 AM.

[focus83]

Not sure people here are so keen on the optic nerve thing. Is it common to have an injured optic nerve? I find the potential as a nootropic with long-lasting / permanent effects much more interesting.

[CIMN]

Not sure people here are so keen on the optic nerve thing. Is it common to have an injured optic nerve? I find the potential as a nootropic with long-lasting / permanent effects much more interesting.

perhaps, but i find that really interesting. Im sure there is a need for a substance that help optic nerves. check wikipedia on retinopathy, lots of info.

Edited by CIMN, 03 September 2012 - 01:00 AM.

[CIMN]

"Coluracetam is the only known choline uptake enhancer to currently exist. Studies have shown that it may induce long-lasting procognitive effects by changing the choline transporter regulation system"

So, it could permanently change the choline transporter regulation system? Seems somewhat dangerous.

i heard that it is a high affinity uptake enhancer, and i heard piracetam is a enhancer also, but perhaps piracetam is weaker.

[greekpsychonaut]

It's the only legitimate, proven choline uptake enhancer as I understand it.

[CIMN]

It's the only legitimate, proven choline uptake enhancer as I understand it.

Summary: Oxiracetam at 100 and 300 mg/kg i.p. dose levels increased acetylcholine (ACh) utilization in the rat cerebral cortex and hippocampus. ACh utilization was assessed by measuring, with a gas chromatographic method, the decrease in ACh level after inhibiting its synthesis by 15 [mu]g intracerebroventricularly (i.c.v.) injection of hemicholinium (HC-3). ACh steady state levels were not affected. Piracetam (300 mg/kg i.p.) also increased ACh utilization in the hippocampus. Repeated daily administration of oxiracetam 100 mg/kg i.p. caused a 31% increase in high-affinity choline uptake (HACU) in the hippocampus. A single administration of 300 mg/kg i.p. of oxiracetam and piracetam also increased HACU rate in the hippocampus. However, the effect of piracetam was over within 3 h, while 3 h after its administration oxiracetam still caused a 40% increase in HACU rate. Oxiracetam (100 mg/kg i.p.) significantly antagonized the impairment in the acquisition of an active-avoidance conditioned response (pole climbing) associated with the inhibition of ACh synthesis by HC-3. These results indicate that oxiracetam enhances the activity of the septohippocampal cholinergic pathways, and to a lesser extent, of the cortical cholinergic network.

Edited by CIMN, 03 September 2012 - 07:02 AM.

[Crispy Cat]

id be interested....
also from a quick google search http://acccorporatio...805.aspx<br />seem to have american and indian offices?
although im guessing china would be the cheapest option

[greekpsychonaut]

Well here's Wikipedia:

"Coluracetam enhances high-affinity choline uptake (HACU) which is the rate-limiting step of acetylcholine (ACh) synthesis, and is the only known choline uptake enhancer to currently exist."

[CIMN]

Well here's Wikipedia:

"Coluracetam enhances high-affinity choline uptake (HACU) which is the rate-limiting step of acetylcholine (ACh) synthesis, and is the only known choline uptake enhancer to currently exist."

unfortunately i don't have the answer for that. it is confusing. i read ginseng and oxiracetam and piracetam can effect choline uptake..

[greekpsychonaut]

Well that may be but Coluracetam has been proven in research.

Maybe others can chime in.