28 replies to this topic

[JChief]

Idebenone seems to be old hat around this forum. It gets mentioned a lot but furious searching around these forums has returned little in what the actual benefits/side effects and experiences have been like. I would like to start a new thread for the purpose of coaxing all the nootropic vets/dinosaurs to chime in with their thoughts on the substance.

Why do you take it?
What did you like about it?
Do you still use it?
What dose?
How long do the effects last? (half life is 18 hours!)
Side effects?
Comparable to racetams?

I beg you all to spill the beans on this substance if you would, kindly.

Thank you so much in advance members!

Edited by JChief, 22 November 2011 - 12:18 PM.

[Justchill]

1. Why do you take it?
2. What did you like about it?
3. Do you still use it?
4. What dose?
5. How long do the effects last? (half life is 18 hours!)
6. Side effects?
7. Comparable to racetams?

1. Because I like to experiment with chemical substances
2. Everything! Better mood (relaxed energy), more energy, better concentration, good for skin, pain relief.
3. Yes, but I have to cap it, probably tonight
4. mourning 400mg, noon 300mg... still experimenting
5. At least half a day
6. None
7. Yes in some way, this feels more natural

It is expensive though, but I like it alot. Stacks very well with piracetam, but you need less piracetam than normal.

Cheers

[pycnogenol]

At that dose it would have to be on the pricey side. I don't take idebenone at the moment but I am reading up on it.

http://www.hubmed.or...enone&sort=date

[nupi]

How about tolerance?

[Baten]

I bought SmartPowders 80x500mg caps and experimented with 500mg and 1000mg. I didn't notice much with both, other than general well-being, anti-depression effects similar to omega3/fish oil.

I did notice at 1000mg that you can FEEL your gums and teeth get harder at times, idebenone or any CoQ10 seems crazy good for teeth/gum health.

As a nootropic, I don't find it worth the $$$.

[JChief]

That sure sounds like a high dose Baten! Do you think the $80 for 100grams is expensive? I think at 200mg or so that doesn't seem too bad. No effects on speech? I read multiple product reviews at random that mentioned this.

Thanks for everyone's input thus far. Hopefully more contribute.

[Baten]

I personally did not notice much of improvement of speech fluency. Going to finish up my remaining capsules since I think they're definitely healthy.
Will report back if I notice anything else.

[ScienceGuy]

Personally when I tried IDEBENONE I found it induced INSOMNIA and ANXIETY at any dosage... so it's not for me!

[evodude]

I bought SmartPowders 80x500mg caps and experimented with 500mg and 1000mg. I didn't notice much with both, other than general well-being, anti-depression effects similar to omega3/fish oil.

I did notice at 1000mg that you can FEEL your gums and teeth get harder at times, idebenone or any CoQ10 seems crazy good for teeth/gum health.

As a nootropic, I don't find it worth the $$$.

also got it from smartpowders, trying half month, and i second Batens opinion.

[manic_racetam]

I got a marketing email from SP about a sale on their 500mg caps around christmas time. I bought the 90 x 500mg cap bottle. I take one every morning. Makes my pee a rusty brown color which is easier to get used to than blue-pee (not nearly as cool however). It looks like everyone is leaning more towards PQQ now which I'll likely switch to when I run out of idebenone. I actually should be running out of idebenone and tianeptine at the same time, so I'll probably switch to the uridine-DHA stack after those two run out.

Idebenone increased energy levels tremendously the first three days or so. I don't really notice any effects subjectively these days besides the brown pee, but the long half-life makes it easy dosing just once a day. Nice to know I've got a strong anti-oxidant floating around my blood stream with a considerably good safety profile.

[nupi]

500mg Idebenone? That's a crazy high dose...

[manic_racetam]

500mg Idebenone? That's a crazy high dose...

True that it seems stupidly high. But according to this study it sounds like it's generally well tolerated and even on the low end.

[abelard lindsay]

I've been taking Idebenone on and off for years. It's good for skin and wound healing. I put it in cuts and it makes them heal very quickly. I think it's even a common ingredient in high-end skin cream. It's also good for calming down and relaxing and clearing up brain fog and/or too many catecholamines (i.e anxiety). It's a bit annoying because it's not really soluble, but the taste is fine when taken straight.

Here's a few studies:

Idebenone and Resveratrol Extend Lifespan and Improve Motor Function of HtrA2 Knockout Mice.

The effects of idebenone on mitochondrial bioenergetics.

Use of Noben (idebenone) in the treatment of dementia and memory impairments without dementia.

Don't take too much though:

Idebenone [in high concentration] induces apoptotic cell death in the human dopaminergic neuroblastoma SHSY-5Y cells.

[nito]

i got both idebenone and pqq. Take them both. Not sure i know what it has done if anything. Will try for a longer period.

[manic_racetam]

How much do you think it takes in per oral dose to reach the 25um level?

I've been taking Idebenone on and off for years. It's good for skin and wound healing. I put it in cuts and it makes them heal very quickly. I think it's even a common ingredient in high-end skin cream. It's also good for calming down and relaxing and clearing up brain fog and/or too many catecholamines (i.e anxiety). It's a bit annoying because it's not really soluble, but the taste is fine when taken straight.

Here's a few studies:

Idebenone and Resveratrol Extend Lifespan and Improve Motor Function of HtrA2 Knockout Mice.

The effects of idebenone on mitochondrial bioenergetics.

Use of Noben (idebenone) in the treatment of dementia and memory impairments without dementia.

Don't take too much though:

Idebenone [in high concentration] induces apoptotic cell death in the human dopaminergic neuroblastoma SHSY-5Y cells.

[abelard lindsay]

How much do you think it takes in per oral dose to reach the 25um level?

Not sure.... Looked for some Pharmokinetic studies and found this:

http://www.ncbi.nlm....pubmed/20955109

TAKE HOME MESSAGE:

After absorption, idebenone is rapidly metabolized by first pass metabolism and shows dose-proportional pharmacokinetics in healthy subjects in daily doses up to 2250 mg. The recent development of advanced analytical techniques allows the detection of idebenone and unconjugated metabolites in plasma and consequently opens the possibility for evaluation of pharmacokinetic/pharmacodynamic relationships which will be helpful to further understand the metabolism and therapeutic potential of idebenone. In clinical studies, idebenone was safe and well tolerated at doses up to 2250 mg/day

[manic_racetam]

How much do you think it takes in per oral dose to reach the 25um level?

Not sure.... Looked for some Pharmokinetic studies and found this:

http://www.ncbi.nlm....pubmed/20955109

TAKE HOME MESSAGE:

After absorption, idebenone is rapidly metabolized by first pass metabolism and shows dose-proportional pharmacokinetics in healthy subjects in daily doses up to 2250 mg. The recent development of advanced analytical techniques allows the detection of idebenone and unconjugated metabolites in plasma and consequently opens the possibility for evaluation of pharmacokinetic/pharmacodynamic relationships which will be helpful to further understand the metabolism and therapeutic potential of idebenone. In clinical studies, idebenone was safe and well tolerated at doses up to 2250 mg/day

Awesome! Thanks so much Abelard So I'm probably safe with 500mg, especially since I plan on doing it only 3 months and then switching to PQQ. Thanks again

[Introspecta]

The rusty brown pee doesn't have anything to do with dehydration or liver problems? Does it stay that color no matter how much water you drink?

[manic_racetam]

The rusty brown pee doesn't have anything to do with dehydration or liver problems? Does it stay that color no matter how much water you drink?

Nope... it's a listed side effect on high dose idebenone. If I drink a bunch of water the rusty color is diluted, but still there. I hope I don't have kidney problems... It's something I worry about sometimes with all the supplements I take though

[Justchill]

I second that.. light orange pee.. However I didn't have that with the Primaforce brand..
Next stack will be IDB + L-tyrosine + rhodiola

Cheers

[evodude]

Smartpowders doesnt sell idebedone anymore. To much complaints?

[Baten]

Smartpowders doesnt sell idebedone anymore. To much complaints?

A quick search show they still sell their capsule bottles, did they sell bulk powder before?

[evodude]

Yeah i still got one of 25g . Orange powder.

[rasgyle]

I e-mailed them about it and they said they're not going to carry the powder anymore because the pills are "almost the same price". As of 9/9/2011, Smartpowders' Idebenone 30g tub (orange) was $33.99. 90x500mg caps are $54.99. That is ~$1.22/g. A ~7% price increase.

Considering the inflation of other market goods in the past year, it's surprising it has only risen by 7%, and also comes in capsules now. Unfortunately you also have to buy 45 grams at once and put down $55. They also have 180mg caps but it's appearing that doses of idebenone once considered "crazy high" could be crazy more beneficial.

[neuropill]

I've been taking Idebenone on and off for years. It's good for skin and wound healing. I put it in cuts and it makes them heal very quickly. I think it's even a common ingredient in high-end skin cream. It's also good for calming down and relaxing and clearing up brain fog and/or too many catecholamines (i.e anxiety). It's a bit annoying because it's not really soluble, but the taste is fine when taken straight.

Here's a few studies:

Idebenone and Resveratrol Extend Lifespan and Improve Motor Function of HtrA2 Knockout Mice.

The effects of idebenone on mitochondrial bioenergetics.

Use of Noben (idebenone) in the treatment of dementia and memory impairments without dementia.

Don't take too much though:

Idebenone [in high concentration] induces apoptotic cell death in the human dopaminergic neuroblastoma SHSY-5Y cells.

I'm confused by your last statement why wouldn't I want to kill cancer cells in my brain?

[jly1986]

I noticed New Star just added idebenone to their roster of other noots.

[Justchill]

They sell at 42$ for 20 grams +11$ shipping. That's expensive!
Do you know other suppliers?

[Greek86]

Yeah but NSN gives you 3rd party testing. I would rather go with something that's been thoroughly tested then some random amazon brand.

[AlexCanada]

Any updates on this?

 

If I had problems with CoQ10 will I have problems with this? CoQ10 even at lower doses gives me a rash on my nipple and it just keeps getting larger if I take it :(.  Also I get some itchy red skin on my arms at times.

 

Please let me know.  Generally speaking is it different enough from Coq10 to warrant a purchase? I can get it around $20.