1755 replies to this topic

[pleb]

Hi gramson. My last post was really for mikey as I had assumed he was also injecting rather than taking it through the mucus membrane which did nothing for me.
The Hayflick limit is generally refered to as cell death rather than telomere length.
Every time the cell splits the telomeres get shorter Reducing the amount they shorten increases the length of time the cell lives before dying.
When it reaches the Hayflick limit which is a certain number of divisions and the telomeres are gone the cell dies.
A new cell is made by the body to replace it with full telomares. Irrespective of your age. And that continues every time until that cell also reaches the Hayflick limit.
The problem is that each new cell uses the information in the cells DNA as a blueprint we age mainly as a result of damage to that DNA rather than telomere length. As each generation and Hayflick limit is reached the damage to the DNA is accumulating its only how long each cell lives rather than how long the telomeres are that determine how long we live. All lengthening telomeres do is increase the time until that cell reaches the Hayflick limit.
I stopped with the epitalon once I started with HGH as that causes the
liver to produce IGF-1 the IGF-1 cause the body to produce telomerase which increases telomere length. So my interest is in epitalon for the wrinkle reduction you and mikey mentioned.
I use throw away needles used once the antiseptic pads are for cleaning the skin as the needles are sterile as supplied. Most chemists here don't sell them even the nurse at the hospital admitted when I asked said that most people with diabetes who are injecting quite a few times a day don't use them because the needles are only used once. The problems with injecting arise when needles are shared by people who inject drugs.
I've yet to see a nurse or doctor wipe down a syringe these days everything is use once then throw away.

Edited by pleb, 07 July 2015 - 10:13 AM.

[Gramson]

Thanks Pleb, you always have great advice. I do have some MK677, which induces our own hgh production, which I shall use now. You mention results with telomerase growth with hgh.

 

note : My son has terrible psoriasis, and I have three psoriasis marks on my arms. I have injected Epitalon into these three sites over 4 days, then rubbed dmso into them. They are almost gone. This is NOT my imagination.  I thought Epitalon worked by working with the pineal gland, not the actual site.

 

Any comments ?

 

Rich

[Huckfinn]

If getting Epitalon in tablets, as opposed to administering IM or subq, would this be ok?:

http://www.super-nut...alon-3-mg--H644

[pleb]

The tablets may work. If you read the small print you have to let them disolve under the tongue not swallow them so the same effect in theory as taking epitalon through the mucus membrane. But they are pretty expensive compared to epitalon as a raw peptide.

Hi gramson I'm not sure about the DMSO and epitalon as I couldn't find DMSO here in the UK so decided to leave it for a while as I would have to import it from your side of the pond.
You could try DMSO on its own applied topically and see if it works if not then epitalon that way you will know which is the one that's working.
A lot of the things I've researched often give information in the footnotes at the end without going into to much detail. So amounts aren't always mentioned.
IGF-1 does increase telomerase but amounts are rarely mentioned.
Because of this there is a question mark against growth factors which may cause telomere increases in pre cancerous or sencient cells causing them to become cancerous by increasing their telomere length but this has not been proven. But many biochemists have a concern about this.
Various versions of IGF-1 are available from peptide suppliers aimed at body builders and as far as I know is not illegal in the states. But does need to be used intermittently as it can cause the IGF-1 receptors to stop working so needs an off period. There is talk that small amounts say under 10mg don't cause the receptors to close down. most body builders are taking much more than the amount I mention 40 to 60mg a day.
My first post on longecity a couple of years ago mentioned a stack of three vitamins which are cheap and according to my reading were 90per cent as effective as TA65 at a fraction of the price but I can't remember the amounts or exactly which vitamins they were I think it was vitamins B C E but you would have to go through the posts in the supplement thread the same again it was a footnote by a lab trailing TA65 to see if it did what was claimed. I remember upsetting Anthony loeara as he sells TA65 as he kept demanding links which I couldn't find.

[Gramson]

Thanks again Pleb, for your information.

Huckfinn,  I posted some very negative effects I had from taking the Super nutrtion Epitalon pills. I communicated these results to super nutrition.

 

These pills are made in a garage in New York/ New jersey , which may or may not be a state certified site..... and then shipped on order from super nutr in France. I got a lot of mouth ulcers from these pills, and almost died from bleeding stomach ulcers.. These ulcers may NOT have been caused by the pills, but if you try them, go slowly.

 

It is much safer to inject sub q from a certified manufacturer. Also, to get the same effects of about 5 mg inject epitalon, you need to sublingual 600 mg of epitalon pills. These pills cost about 300 dollars, and you get much less than even 600 mg for ONE DAY. Super Nutrition said they had no similar complaints from anyone else. Also, my order was lost in the mail ( new jersey to new jersey) but resent upon complaint.

 

Rich

[Dimi]

Hello,

You are speacking about IDF-1...
I read that the IGF -1 stops the bone loss cause to age, do you think that the IGF -1 can rebuild the worn (spinal discs carilage) ?

[Gramson]

I REPORTED THAT I HAD PSORIASIS ON MY FOREARMS, BUT AFTER SEEING MY DOCTOR YESTERDAY ) OOPS) , I found out these solar keratosis lesions, precursors to skin cancer. I now have an appointment with a dermatologist. I used dmso here for some time, and got minimal positive results, but ( as reported) injecting epitalon here has really helped, and the lesions are almost gone.

 

I went to ceretropics ( Epitalon 100 mg/ 120$) and found Melanotan for 50$, which is used for skin cancer. Sounds good.

 

oops... Side effects : causes erections.  ( ordered two) lol

[Gramson]

pubmed : after taking Melanotan, men experienced erections lasting an average of 38 minutes ( no stimulation, spontaneous) " shows promise in treating erectile dysfunction in men "      Mad scientist now taking Epitalon and Melanotan.  Apparently we shall all live to be 140, with erections.

 

[Dreamer]

I REPORTED THAT I HAD PSORIASIS ON MY FOREARMS, BUT AFTER SEEING MY DOCTOR YESTERDAY ) OOPS) , I found out these solar keratosis lesions, precursors to skin cancer. I now have an appointment with a dermatologist. I used dmso here for some time, and got minimal positive results, but ( as reported) injecting epitalon here has really helped, and the lesions are almost gone.

 

I went to ceretropics ( Epitalon 100 mg/ 120$) and found Melanotan for 50$, which is used for skin cancer. Sounds good.

 

oops... Side effects : causes erections.  ( ordered two) lol

OT  Basal cell carcinoma and squamous cell carcinoma  are both virtually 100% curable with CurADerm or Skin Answer.  Easily purchased online.  Amazon has it.  

 

It was developed in Australia, available over the counter (plant based) and the dermatologists there got it made prescription only and now do not prescribe.  Too inexpensive compared to the Big Pharma solutions and surgery.

 

But I personally know it works well and have for about 20 years.  We always keep some on hand.

 

DMSO is used by most/all vets and usually available in the feed stores or at the vets office.  Most sports therapists use it as well.  Check at the gyms.  Readily available online like at Amazon.

Edited by Dreamer, 09 July 2015 - 05:39 PM.

[Gramson]

thanks dreamer, I will order some

[Tom Andre F. (ex shinobi)]

Hello,

 

I m french so escuse for my english...

I read with many interrest this forum, i take epitalon since little time but it's so expensiove to take epitalon by "sublingual" cause no efficient..

 

Read VERY IMPORTANT :

 

Epithalon dosage and course (cycle) duration

Dosage depends on the purpose and severity of the damage which is treated. Epitalon can be used orally (less effective and large dose) or injected intramuscularly or under the skin (more effective at much smaller dose).

1. Oral Epithalon use (least effective):

• duration: between 10 - 20 days
• dosage: between 400 - 600 mg of Epithalon per day
• daily frequency:200 mg per serving, between 2 - 3 servings per day (depending on the dosage)

2. Epithalon as nasal spray or drops (medium effectiveness):

• duration: between 10 - 20 days
• dosage: between 15 - 30 mg of Epithalon per day
• daily frequency:total daily dosage split into 3 servings throughout the day

3. Injectable Epithalon use (most effective):

• duration: 10 - 20 days
• dosage: between 5 - 10 mg per day (20 mg intravenous for terminal patients)
• frequency of injection:1 injection per day for low dose, 2 injections for higher dose (divided between morning and late afternoon injection)

Each 10 - 20 days course of Epithalamin is followed by 4-6 months pause before repeating the course again. Epitalon treatment can be repeated indefintely.

SO CAN YOU TELL ME WHERE I CAN FIND EPITALON PUR as nasal spray OR injectable (where find syringe)

 

Hey frenchy

 

What about sublingual ?
 

[Tom Andre F. (ex shinobi)]

Hi gramson. My last post was really for mikey as I had assumed he was also injecting rather than taking it through the mucus membrane which did nothing for me.
The Hayflick limit is generally refered to as cell death rather than telomere length.
Every time the cell splits the telomeres get shorter Reducing the amount they shorten increases the length of time the cell lives before dying.
When it reaches the Hayflick limit which is a certain number of divisions and the telomeres are gone the cell dies.
A new cell is made by the body to replace it with full telomares. Irrespective of your age. And that continues every time until that cell also reaches the Hayflick limit.
The problem is that each new cell uses the information in the cells DNA as a blueprint we age mainly as a result of damage to that DNA rather than telomere length. As each generation and Hayflick limit is reached the damage to the DNA is accumulating its only how long each cell lives rather than how long the telomeres are that determine how long we live. All lengthening telomeres do is increase the time until that cell reaches the Hayflick limit.
I stopped with the epitalon once I started with HGH as that causes the
liver to produce IGF-1 the IGF-1 cause the body to produce telomerase which increases telomere length. So my interest is in epitalon for the wrinkle reduction you and mikey mentioned.
I use throw away needles used once the antiseptic pads are for cleaning the skin as the needles are sterile as supplied. Most chemists here don't sell them even the nurse at the hospital admitted when I asked said that most people with diabetes who are injecting quite a few times a day don't use them because the needles are only used once. The problems with injecting arise when needles are shared by people who inject drugs.
I've yet to see a nurse or doctor wipe down a syringe these days everything is use once then throw away.

 

Do you take pure HGF ? Very expensive. You can try fucoidan extract, especially from the seaweed undaria pinnatifida: http://www.ncbi.nlm....pubmed/18380923

 

 

[pleb]

Hi Tom did you read this correctly as you mention HGF which I have never heard of. I take HGH. human growth hormone.

[Tom Andre F. (ex shinobi)]

Hi Tom did you read this correctly as you mention HGF which I have never heard of. I take HGH. human growth hormone.

 

Hi,

 

oops ! sorry ! I confuse because you also spoke about IGF1 and I studied HGF but dont know any about HGH.

 

my apologize

[pleb]

No worries. I thought at first my kindle was changing words and letters again which it does especially with my spelling.

[Dimi]

 

Hello,

 

I m french so escuse for my english...

I read with many interrest this forum, i take epitalon since little time but it's so expensiove to take epitalon by "sublingual" cause no efficient..

 

Read VERY IMPORTANT :

 

Epithalon dosage and course (cycle) duration

Dosage depends on the purpose and severity of the damage which is treated. Epitalon can be used orally (less effective and large dose) or injected intramuscularly or under the skin (more effective at much smaller dose).

1. Oral Epithalon use (least effective):

• duration: between 10 - 20 days
• dosage: between 400 - 600 mg of Epithalon per day
• daily frequency:200 mg per serving, between 2 - 3 servings per day (depending on the dosage)

2. Epithalon as nasal spray or drops (medium effectiveness):

• duration: between 10 - 20 days
• dosage: between 15 - 30 mg of Epithalon per day
• daily frequency:total daily dosage split into 3 servings throughout the day

3. Injectable Epithalon use (most effective):

• duration: 10 - 20 days
• dosage: between 5 - 10 mg per day (20 mg intravenous for terminal patients)
• frequency of injection:1 injection per day for low dose, 2 injections for higher dose (divided between morning and late afternoon injection)

Each 10 - 20 days course of Epithalamin is followed by 4-6 months pause before repeating the course again. Epitalon treatment can be repeated indefintely.

SO CAN YOU TELL ME WHERE I CAN FIND EPITALON PUR as nasal spray OR injectable (where find syringe)

 

Hey frenchy

 

What about sublingual ?
 

 

 

Hello,
1.I have already mentioned above on this issue of the sublingual , the laboratory that produces the purest Epitalon market confirmed to me that the sublingual is as effective as the injection.

2.I keep the product 30 minutes under my tongue ...
the Epitalon I take is 99% pure.
3.it is also necessary to maximize the product eat holy, most raw food as possible and lots of natural vegetables

HIHI yes i m frenchy, awake frenchy...  
 

[Dimi]

Hello,

Somebody can say me if IGf-1 peptide is secure or not...secondary effects

IGF-1 can used only with injection ?
 

[pleb]

Hi Dimitri. I haven't heard or read of anyone having any bad side effects from epitalon. It seems very benign.
It's unlikely you will find this sold as a nasal spray it's mostly sold as a raw peptide that needs dissolving before use. You could possibly buy one of the old fashioned scent bottles that have a small squeeze ball on one side that you can use as a nasal spray.

Syringes are the same as those used to inject insulin. You can find them on ebay sold in various quantities.

Your own earlier post answered your question about if they could only be injected as you had posted a list of amounts for all three methods of how to use it.

Edited by pleb, 10 July 2015 - 10:59 AM.

[dz93]

I think I may make a nasal version sometime to try it out.

http://link.springer...1055-007-0095-3

[Gramson]

www.hetoghemedicalschool.eu  is giving degrees on Dr khavinsons work on epitalon. It is an online video course that costs @ 150 euros.

 

I find it of great interest that this is happening.  It is also interesting that apparently no further studies beyond Khavinson have taken place. However, his studies are listed on PubMed.

 

It includes studies on various peptides and how they influence various health issues. This could be a start of something.

 

[Gramson]

you can google Hertoghe  khavinson and you will get the correct course page.

[pleb]

I think the reason it's not more widely known or trailed is because Khavinson had it patented or the name epithalon copyrighted 18 or more years ago.
Epitalon is the name given to it by the Chinese company that produces it after sciwalk got them to make the first batch before he then bought into the company in China. also khavinson has about another five or six peptides for various parts of the body that his organization? sells

Edited by pleb, 11 July 2015 - 01:05 AM.

[DeepBluC]

fantastic discussion. just joined and appreciate this topic. ceretropics is where i bought mine. been on it for 15 days. i for myself have not seen anything in particular but was told this takes time and the harvest is best picked later in the year. as far as superficial effects like skin improvement. sleep and loss of wrinkles mk677 has been greatly appreciated...must be managed well because hunger and weight gain has to be balanced. love this topic i but not quite sure what to expect from epitalon...thank you...

[Tom Andre F. (ex shinobi)]

 

 

Hello,

 

I m french so escuse for my english...

I read with many interrest this forum, i take epitalon since little time but it's so expensiove to take epitalon by "sublingual" cause no efficient..

 

Read VERY IMPORTANT :

 

Epithalon dosage and course (cycle) duration

Dosage depends on the purpose and severity of the damage which is treated. Epitalon can be used orally (less effective and large dose) or injected intramuscularly or under the skin (more effective at much smaller dose).

1. Oral Epithalon use (least effective):

• duration: between 10 - 20 days
• dosage: between 400 - 600 mg of Epithalon per day
• daily frequency:200 mg per serving, between 2 - 3 servings per day (depending on the dosage)

2. Epithalon as nasal spray or drops (medium effectiveness):

• duration: between 10 - 20 days
• dosage: between 15 - 30 mg of Epithalon per day
• daily frequency:total daily dosage split into 3 servings throughout the day

3. Injectable Epithalon use (most effective):

• duration: 10 - 20 days
• dosage: between 5 - 10 mg per day (20 mg intravenous for terminal patients)
• frequency of injection:1 injection per day for low dose, 2 injections for higher dose (divided between morning and late afternoon injection)

Each 10 - 20 days course of Epithalamin is followed by 4-6 months pause before repeating the course again. Epitalon treatment can be repeated indefintely.

SO CAN YOU TELL ME WHERE I CAN FIND EPITALON PUR as nasal spray OR injectable (where find syringe)

 

Hey frenchy

 

What about sublingual ?
 

 

 

Hello,
1.I have already mentioned above on this issue of the sublingual , the laboratory that produces the purest Epitalon market confirmed to me that the sublingual is as effective as the injection.

2.I keep the product 30 minutes under my tongue ...
the Epitalon I take is 99% pure.
3.it is also necessary to maximize the product eat holy, most raw food as possible and lots of natural vegetables

HIHI yes i m frenchy, awake frenchy...  
 

 

 

Ok interesting, just to let you know guys im able to produce any peptide at the best price and purity.. third usa lab certified. The market is very small but I plane to sell some for the few here.. and I admit also for my own :p
 

[chris106]

Just a heads up:

There's a somewhat new european based nootropic vendor, that as of today carries N-Acetyl Epitalon:

http://www.mind-difference.com/

I'm in no way affiliated with them, by the way. Up until now I've only tried their Tianeptine-Sulfate - which produced the expected effects and seemed legit to me.

 

[Nuke]

Ordered 98% from Genscript. It arrived 2 weeks early and at 99.2%. Well done Genscript, will definitely use you again.

 

Now to find bacteriostatic water, because it arrived earlier than excepted, I don't have all the accessories ready yet.

 

I'll report back on my experiences, but I don't expect to see much. It will replace my nightly melatonin. I'm already in good condition, I will take this more as prevention. To see if my regimen works will likely take around 100-200 years.

 

Has anyone watched the coursework at the Hertoghe site? I would like to know if its worth it.

 

[zorba990]

I don't think Epitalon needs the nasal route, but here are good diy instructions on peptides via nasal spray.

http://melanotanforu...ray-experiment/

I do have to sa,y that the idea makes me a little uncomfortable with melanotan, would hate to develop a pigmented polyp or some other crazy sinus thing....but that might be over thinking it...

[dz93]

I was wondering if this has any significance? It talks about the effects of nasal administration of epitalon on rats.

http://link.springer...1055-007-0095-3

I'm sure this was probably already posted on here but since I usually view this on my phone its really annoying to go back through and read everything. I thought I would bring it up since a few were considering nasal administration.

[Nuke]

I have read that study's abstract, but they just found activity. Have no idea it it actually good activity. Does anyone have the full paper?

 

Will try nasal a few times, but I'm thinking of rather going subQ. Less waste for a pretty expensive substance. 

[dz93]

I have read that study's abstract, but they just found activity. Have no idea it it actually good activity. Does anyone have the full paper?

Will try nasal a few times, but I'm thinking of rather going subQ. Less waste for a pretty expensive substance.

I tried SubQ 1mg twice daily for about two weeks then switched to 5mg IM twice daily for the remainder of my 100mg vial. After trying IM injection it became my preferred route. I was pinning myself in the stomach too much so I kinda had to switch spots. I then purchased another 100mg vial and started on 5mg IM once daily for 20 days. I just purchased another 100mg vial and am now taking it vial nasal administration. I cannot tell a difference in effects from any of RoAs. Nasal has a small effect on my mind but its too small to fully tell so I have count it as a placebo for now. I take 1mg in each nostril as many times as I feel like it throughout the day. Usually between 1 to 3 times daily.