816 replies to this topic

[Andrey_81]

For me the best works the following.... 150 mg of rhodiola (less is more!!!) after I wake up on empty stomach, at 6:0. At 7:00 one espresso or any other caffeine + 250 mg of ashwagandha. This turns me into talkative, social and confident monster. If needed (if i'm sleepy or I start to feel that I'm getting anxious) i take again 150 mg of rhodiola at 6 pm + 250 mg ashwagandha (or just ashwagandha). Before bed I take 500 mg of schizandra extract. I sleep like a baby with very interesting and vivid dreams.

Believe me... this regime is worth trying!!! I had real problems with confidence, anxiety and fear but this changed my life completely. I cannot imagine my life without following this. In the morning, at my work, I feel like my IQ is raised. I think fast, smart, no brain fog, focused, confident, organized, able to make many tasks at once, stress free, anxious free... just perfect and what is the best... this feeling lasts whole day. Nothing can drain my energy, but when I go to bed I sleep in 5 minutes!

PS: coffee is not important! You can also skip it if you don't like it.

[Andrey_81]

One more update!

The same feeling is still present!

It seams that coffee is important and I'm sure that due to the caffeine rhodiola and ashwaganhda have better and stronger effect. Believe me, I'm completely new person. I used to take 750 mg of ashwagandha before, now only 250 mg in the morning (after rhodiola and coffee) boosts my confidence and anxiety is not present at all. This is even better feeling then when I tried phenibut. Something blocks panic in my brain and I always feel like I have full control over every situation. Amazing, but my speech abilities approved. I can speak and think really fast. I even speak much better foreign languages

Believe me, this what I take is worth trying (schizandra, rhodiola, coffee, ashwagandha). I make breaks only from coffee and from ashwagandha during the weekend. I take rhodiola and schizandra every day.

[Andrey_81]

It passed less than 10 days from my last update... What to say.. I'm OK but without that superior supermen feeling :( I can feel that my confidence is not so high. So what could be the reason of this sudden change?

I still take schizandra before bed and this is a must. I sleep deeply and better then ever in my life with interesting and vivid dreams. Strange, I did not expect to have this benefit from schizandra. I decided to try it after I read that it works like a coffee so I thought that it would be great coffee replacement. It turned that it's really amazing sleeping aid I take is as extract but I also have fruit powder (made by Natures way).

Today I stopped with rhodiola and I will make max one week (or more) break.

It seems that I had amazing effect on caffeine after more than a year without caffeine. I started to drink coffee 2-3 times a week and I was 'high' even on the day when I didn't take coffee. I had this afterglow effect and this is the reason why I thought that coffee is not a must (see my post from 28.3.). But now, Even though I had some breaks during the weekend it seems that it doesn't have the same effect and tolerance builds rapidly. I decided to take at least 5 days break from strong espresso. I'm not expecting hard time at work during next week so I will try to stay away from coffee even more.

Today in the morning was clean, without rhodiola and coffee. I felt strange and not so good with mild anxiety and lack of confidence. And guess what? I took 250 mg of ashwagandha and I feel great Not like supermen, but again confident and 'normal'.

I can get rid of all kind of stuff, but ashwaganhda is still no. 1.

Anyhow, I have to say that I like that supermen feeling, so I hope that after few days of break I will have the same benefits from coffee. When I drink strong espresso it's very important to take ashwagandha as soon as possible.

I also ordered noopept for special situations (meeting...). I know that this is not natural supplement (which I don't like), but I want to try how it works and will it boost my confidence like caffeine. Will see. If something will go wrong, there is always ashwagandha to save the day

[chris106]

Just to share my experience. I got all three adaptogens talked about most in this thread - Ashwagandha, Rhodiola Rosea, Schisandra (+ Mucuna Pruriens as well).

To give you some important information as to why these herbs work for me the way they do; I have been taking Ritalin for years and Amphetamines for a short period of time prior to this, and realized that I can't deal with "real" stimulants anymore.
My problem is not so much anxiety ( even though I do get anxious sometimes and am in a tough Life-situation right now) - mainly I have to deal with lack of motivation, apathy and my ADD-PI symptoms, as well as massive brainfog every now and then.

All that being said, a combination of Rhodiola, Schsiandra and Mucuna seems to work best for me, 500mg single doses of each up to 4 times a day. I only take 250mg Ashwagandha occasionaly, if I feel that I've overdone the others and get a little edgy and restless or anxious. For that it works well and pretty much instantly.
The funny thing is - if I take ashwaganda with my regular stack of the three others in the morning, it pretty much cancels out their stimulating effects and I oversleep for hours, even when setting two alarm clocks!

So I guess it really must be quite potent - but for me, needing motivation and drive, the others are a better basis in a daily regimen, they synergize well, too.

By the way, is any of you bying them in Bulk? There are a few good suppliers that sell organic powder of each. I think that is way cheaper in the long run. I think that's the best way to cosume them,too - even though filling them into caps can be a pain in the ass and time consuming... Guess I'll get a capsule fill - mashine next...

Anyhow, I have to say that I like that supermen feeling, so I hope that after few days of break I will have the same benefits from coffee. When I drink strong espresso it's very important to take ashwagandha as soon as possible.

I guess it's quite normal that you have to cycle these and take occasional breaks, especially with ashwagandha, being a GABA-A.
While these adaptogens are way cleaner and milder than "chemical meds" they work on the same mechanisms in the brain, they are no magic wonder-beans.
Maybe you should think about getting a second stack, which you can cycle with your adaptogens every now and then. You know, like many people on this board cycle The Uridine and the CILTEP stack. Both pretty much work on the same symptoms, but slightly different enough so you can switch back and forth between the too, once one stops working properly.

Also, have you tried the "ADAPT 232" formula from swedish herbal institute? It's supposed to be a high quality formula of Shisandra, RR and Ginseng, and supposedly works pretty well for some. You can get it pretty cheap from iHerbs. I just ordered some, and will see if it works better than my bulked versions + Mucuna. Will report back on that once I see results.

Also, Science Guys' "treating anxiety safely" thread is definetely worth a read - just in case you haven't read that allready. I hope you get that superman feeling back soon!

Edited by chris106, 17 April 2013 - 09:37 AM.

[machete234]

I also ordered noopept for special situations (meeting...). I know that this is not natural supplement (which I don't like), but I want to try how it works and will it boost my confidence like caffeine. Will see. If something will go wrong, there is always ashwagandha to save the day

I tried noopept a few times its really not bad and I guess I like it better than my pharma piracetam (which has to be 100% clean) it sometimes gives me a drive to do things especially when not taken everyday.
Experiencing things is sometimes just awesome like being in the forest and its like seeing every leaf there is when normally your brain would filter more of this visual information out.

Not sure if its great for panic but it can be dampened with something sedating for sure

[revenant]

The titular herb is of the nightshade family.. with this in mind..so are many other things that are fit to be eaten.

[Andrey_81]

I tried noopept a few times its really not bad and I guess I like it better than my pharma piracetam (which has to be 100% clean) it sometimes gives me a drive to do things especially when not taken everyday.
Experiencing things is sometimes just awesome like being in the forest and its like seeing every leaf there is when normally your brain would filter more of this visual information out. Not sure if its great for panic but it can be dampened with something sedating for sure

This morning I took only 5 mg of noopept (my first dose ever), together with some rhodiola, coffee and ashwagandha. I can only say WOW Will see how will it go through the day.

Tomorrow I will try 10 mg in the morning, without anything else and without coffee. I want to see hot it acts without other supplements in order to see the real benefit. Of course, this will be taken only in special cases when I want to avoid brain fog. When there is no brain fog I'm completely confident and there is no anxiety present or panic attacks.

Since I mention it, besides caffeine (I build tolerance to fast), is there something else that could be used against brain fog? I'm talking about natural stuff. Perhaps panax ginseng? Any experience?

[Andrey_81]

This morning at 6:00 I took 10 mg of noopept without ashwagandha, rhodiola and coffee. Not sure what to say. At 7:00 it was very hard for me to speak and my mind was not that clear and I felt minor anxiety. At 8:00 I was getting better, more focused and relaxed. At 9:00 felt OK but I felt that I'm little bit blocked while talking on the phone, like my mind is not that fast. At 9:45 I decided to take ashwagandha and from that time all is getting better and better. I feel calm, focused, concentrated but still talkative and confident.

Maybe is too early (my second day), or I'm taking lower doses (10 mg) but I can't say that noopept does wonders. For me it is nothing special. I have more benefits from ashwagandha. I expected more from noopept considering its strength. I'm not sure that it is for occasional use. I thought that noopept will work in similar way to caffeine and that it will speed up my brain and improve my speaking skills (again, like coffee does). It makes me more relaxed and I expected opposite reaction.

[machete234]

That is because noopept is not primarily anti-anxiety but more of a cognitive enhancer I can even see it making people more anxious thats somehow the price of feeling "sharper".

Panax ginseng (my bag says its from china) makes everything "a little better" for example you drank too much coffee and you take it and feel better less physically ill etc.
Ashwaganda feels very noticable in comparison, with ginseng its not such a day and night difference. (maybe beneficial in the morining with coffee, the morning is when I have brain fog)

A cheaper version of ginseng would be jiaogulan tea because it contains similar compounds, the tea used to make me tired a few years ago but not so much nowadays as with ginseng Im not sure how beneficial it really is, becuase its hard to say

[ScottSummers]

Also, Science Guys' "treating anxiety safely" thread is definetely worth a read - just in case you haven't read that allready. I hope you get that superman feeling back soon!

According to this ashwagandha should be avoided for anxiety disorders since it's a GABA RECEPTOR AGONISTS? I agree jiaogulan/gynostemma for caffeine replacement, or cheaper ginseng alternative. I rarely get tired from it no crash along with insomnia that caffeine causes for me.

[Andrey_81]

I have to update my post because it seams that noopept has great potential but according to my knowledge it has to be taken few days for real benefits. Yesterday i wrote my post at 9:25 and the whole day was in front of me. As the day was going on I felt better and better. My brain worked extremely fast and ashwagandha killed anxiety which was very mild and almost not noticeable. At 5 pm I was full of positive energy and this feeling lasted until I went to bed. All this happened without coffee.

This morning I took 10 mg of noopept at 6:00. At 7 I felt positive energy and very talkative like I had strong coffee. At 7:30 had my morning coffee and this even made my feeling better. Positive, talkative, organized, fast talking, speech skills improved, confident... At 8:00 had my ashwagandha. This is just amazing mix. After lunch at 11:30 had my second 10 mg pill of noopept and now I even feel more confident and focused but in the same time calm. If the anxiety will be present I will solve this with another ashwagandha

I weight 75 kg so my daily dose of noopept = 20 mg (according to what I read on internet).

So thumbs up for noopept + ashwagandha! This is really great mix to consider.

[chris106]

So thumbs up for noopept + ashwagandha! This is really great mix to consider.

Interesting, haven't tried this one yet... Might give it a shot sometime soon...

According to this ashwagandha should be avoided for anxiety disorders since it's a GABA RECEPTOR AGONISTS?

It probably is - not that I'd know, but Science Guy usually knows his stuff pretty well... :D
That's not too much to worry about though, I guess - Just means you should probably cycle it or at least not take it every day of the week....

Edited by chris106, 26 April 2013 - 11:36 PM.

[medievil]

I havent seen any case reports of ashwaghanda withdrawal only with regards to valerian wich is extremely rare, the withdrawal probably is a piece of a cake too so cant say scienceguy does ppl any good with hes warnings, well ment but severely ignorant of the treatment resistant people as he's suggestions will only help a certain group.

[estranged]

I have been using ashwagandha for a few weeks (himalaya brand) and I think this is an underrated herb. I am 32 years old and after my 20's I had depression, low libido, racing heart, anxiety, high blood sugar and tried various supplements for each problem. Used hawthorn for my racing heart, it didn't help but after using Ashwagandha this problem disappeared on the first day using it. My morning blood sugar was in the 100-120 range.Tried various things to lower it with no luck. After Ashwagandha it is between 80-90. And most importantly now I am calm. No more anxiety. No more racing heart when I went to bed. Libido and erections are much better. Actually I didn't even have the courage to have sex with the fear of failure. Now I am also much more confident in social situations. Also I have noticed something very strange. I don't have too much facial hair, only on the jowl and some moustache but there was none on my cheek. Now I have noticed that hair started to spread to the cheek area. Also the existing hair are coming out thicker and denser.

However ashwagandha does not help with depression. Actually it seems to make it worse. I'm using 10 mg paxil daily and with this combination I'm really feeling good. I stopped paxil to see how it would go but bad mistake.

I am taking one ashwagandha tablet in the morning. Should I increase it? Does it get any better with two tablets?

After reading this thread I started thinking of adding Schizandra to my supplement regimen. Which brand works best? Any suggestions?

Thanks.

[carlsonbjj]

Look into functional medicine. I have the same symptoms and he was saying it was chronically elevated cortisol. I have my test results/app. in 2 weeks, Ill let you know what he prescribes. Currently taking phosphatidylserine, which is the shit. Expensive though

[Andrey_81]

I am taking one ashwagandha tablet in the morning. Should I increase it? Does it get any better with two tablets?

After reading this thread I started thinking of adding Schizandra to my supplement regimen. Which brand works best? Any suggestions?

Thanks.

Hi there. I've been using himalaya ashwagandha more than year with some short breaks (few days per month), and my daily doses are from 250-750 mg per day. 250 mg (one capsule) is nothing, you should take one more pill afternoon. One in the morning, one afternoon and before bed if needed. If you compare himalaya with other brans, himalaya extact is not that strong, and other brands have 500 mg capsules and they suggest 2 tablets per day so you should take more. Even himalaya says that you should take 1 tablet 2 times per day. I used to take one tablet in the morning for few weeks, but all became much better after adding this another pill afternoon (one at 8 another at 1:00). During some period I was taking 1000 mg, but only for one week. I had better sucess with 2 per day.

[Galaxyshock]

The dosage should be based on the amount of withanolides, that it's extracted to.
"500mg" doesn't say anything, you can consume the whole herb like 10 grams a day but the active constituent is what matters.

Now brand is at 20mg withanolides per capsule. This was too much when taking 3 caps a day, made my thyroid hyperactive and I had withdrawal issues when ceasing. Also if I took two capsules at once it had tranquilizing effect and I would sometimes be dizzy the whole day. Good as a sleep aid though.

Life Extension / "Sensoril" is 10mg withanolides, which for me is the optimal dosage, couple times a day.

Himalaya is only 3mg withanolides if I'm correct? At least the product in iHerb is. In my opinion one can go up to 6 caps a day if needed.

[estranged]

I am taking one ashwagandha tablet in the morning. Should I increase it? Does it get any better with two tablets?

After reading this thread I started thinking of adding Schizandra to my supplement regimen. Which brand works best? Any suggestions?

Thanks.

Hi there. I've been using himalaya ashwagandha more than year with some short breaks (few days per month), and my daily doses are from 250-750 mg per day. 250 mg (one capsule) is nothing, you should take one more pill afternoon. One in the morning, one afternoon and before bed if needed. If you compare himalaya with other brans, himalaya extact is not that strong, and other brands have 500 mg capsules and they suggest 2 tablets per day so you should take more. Even himalaya says that you should take 1 tablet 2 times per day. I used to take one tablet in the morning for few weeks, but all became much better after adding this another pill afternoon (one at 8 another at 1:00). During some period I was taking 1000 mg, but only for one week. I had better sucess with 2 per day.

Thanks for the reply. But one himalayan ashwaganda tablet is 670 mg. Not 250 mg and on the bottle it says take one per day before a meal not two. So I'm not sure we are talking about the same brand here. I'll try and see how two tablets would feel though.

[estranged]

The dosage should be based on the amount of withanolides, that it's extracted to.
..

Himalaya is only 3mg withanolides if I'm correct? At least the product in iHerb is. In my opinion one can go up to 6 caps a day if needed.

I have read a lot about this herb lately and it looks like amount of withanolides is not the only important thing with this herb. The parts of the herb used is also very important. It is said that only the roots of the herb should be used for consumption. Leaves are not considered suitable in ayurvedic medicine and they are never used although they are higher in withanolides. Leaves are used in order to increase the amount of withanolides in a product but root is more effective. Leaves are only used topically. Himalaya uses only the roots but sensoril is a combination of root and leaves. Now foods also uses roots only.

Edited by estranged, 01 May 2013 - 11:39 PM.

[machete234]

The most natural thing is probably to order a kg of root and cook about 3g of it in milk per dose, I might try that in the future but Im not running out of supplies any time soon.
Several bottles of himalaya and at least 100g of my own extract/ root mix and my need for ashwagandha gets lower recently.

Ordering by the kg would roughly come close to the himalaya tablets price/withanoloid-wise but I havent tried pure root yet

Edited by machete234, 02 May 2013 - 04:32 PM.

[cuprous]

Throwing in my own $0.02 that I've found Ashwagandha to be a potent anxiolytic. Just 500mg before bed the night before leaves me just .. comfortably me .. the following day. Not like benzo which sort of leaves one null or propranolol (which is great but leaves one tired).

[Methos000]

Sperm quantity? You count 'em?

Yes, just so I don't waste any. God gets quite irate, ya know.

Edited by Methos000, 02 May 2013 - 09:14 PM.

[Andrey_81]

Thanks for the reply. But one himalayan ashwaganda tablet is 670 mg. Not 250 mg and on the bottle it says take one per day before a meal not two. So I'm not sure we are talking about the same brand here. I'll try and see how two tablets would feel though.

I always buy on ebay this one which is 250 mg extract and I know it's not that strong extract (I contacted producer a year ago and now I can't remember % of withanolides but it was much lower than the extract from Jarrow's or NOW foods). I buy this because it's cheap and it works!

http://store.himalay...ashvagandha.htm

The one you are mentioning is for the US market.

[Andrey_81]

Since I have such amazing reaction and great success with ashwagandha and other adaptogen herbs you can find the list of my favourite products I use at http://www.iherb.com...ge/adaptogenius

Edited by Andrey_81, 09 May 2013 - 10:26 PM.

[estranged]

After a month the relaxing effects of ashwagandha wore off. Instead it started to make me more anxious and restless. Very strange feeling. I couldn't sleep. I've been taking one tablet every day of Himalaya U.S version. I do not notice the libido effects anymore either. I stopped using it for a few days and started again and the relaxing effects came back. Looks like this is not suitable for long term usage, at least for me but I've also read similar experiences in iherb rewievs.Everything was too good to be true For once I thought I'd feel this good as long as I take this herb as I had read the statement below when researching about this herb.

http://sensoril.com/...sked-questions/

For how long a period can I take Sensoril®?

Sensoril® can be taken 365 days a year because it is GRAS-affirmed (Generally Regarded as Safe). Human clinical research has also demonstrated that Sensoril’s effectiveness in improving health continues to increase the longer it is taken. This is consistent with what we know about adaptogens. Their benefits are cumulative in nature; the longer they are used the greater the benefit.

This is definetly not true for me. Anyone have similar experiences? Do you use it everyday or you have to take breaks?

Edited by estranged, 11 May 2013 - 03:30 AM.

[quixote]

I for one can speak of no positive effects from taking ashwagandha. I've taken it both on its own (the Organic India product) and in combos with either (or alternatively both) rhodiola and quercetin, in various dosages, consistently for 3 weeks or with breaks of a few days, and nothing, zilch, nada. The reason I started taking it was to get some sexual enhancement (i.e. better erections and a libido boost), and I'm sorry to say it had no effect on me in this or any other regard whatsoever.

Then again, something must be wrong with me, because I haven't felt any effect from taking around 15 various and highly-praised supplements (all reputable brands, both 'western' and Indian stuff). Come to think of it, I must admit to being jealous of people getting enthusiastic about one or another supplement, I have never felt any benefits from taking any supplement, it's about time I stopped squandering my money on them, I guess.

Edited by quixote, 15 May 2013 - 10:53 AM.

[Andrey_81]

I for one can speak of no positive effects from taking ashwagandha. I've taken it both on its own (the Organic India product) and in combos with either (or alternatively both) rhodiola and quercetin, in various dosages, consistently for 3 weeks or with breaks of a few days, and nothing, zilch, nada. The reason I started taking it was to get some sexual enhancement (i.e. better erections and a libido boost), and I'm sorry to say it had no effect on me in this or any other regard whatsoever.

Then again, something must be wrong with me, because I haven't felt any effect from taking around 15 various and highly-praised supplements (all reputable brands, both 'western' and Indian stuff). Come to think of it, I must admit to being jealous of people getting enthusiastic about one or another supplement, I have never felt any benefits from taking any supplement, it's about time I stopped squandering my money on them, I guess.

I cannot say that ashwagandha is sexual enhancement. It could only be sexual enhancement in a way that is reduces stress and calms you down so you fill have more optimistic and anxious free mind and therefore be in a mood for sex. Moreover, ashwagandha made by organic india is not an extract so it's possible that it isn't strong enough (not sure about this).

For better erections you can try this:
http://www.iherb.com...24?rcode=nnt354

I took this after I read that it's also good for anxiety (maca & hgw) but it turned out to be extremely strong libido booster if taken 20-40 minutes before intercourse. Makes you hard as wood.

This is also worth trying but I cannot say if it works because I didn't try this:
http://www.iherb.com...59?rcode=nnt354

I'm sorry, I'm not sure if is allowed to show some links from another sites (iherb). If somebody knows please tell me and I will remove this in a minute. Thank you!

[quixote]

I cannot say that ashwagandha is sexual enhancement. It could only be sexual enhancement in a way that is reduces stress and calms you down so you fill have more optimistic and anxious free mind and therefore be in a mood for sex. Moreover, ashwagandha made by organic india is not an extract so it's possible that it isn't strong enough (not sure about this).

For better erections you can try this:
http://www.iherb.com...24?rcode=nnt354

I took this after I read that it's also good for anxiety (maca & hgw) but it turned out to be extremely strong libido booster if taken 20-40 minutes before intercourse. Makes you hard as wood.

Thanks a lot for your response, Andrey. True enough, it may well be that the Organic India is not the best available Ashwagandha, it says on the bottle "Organic Ashwagandha root - Withania somnifera 400 mg", apparently it's not an extract then and maybe that's the problem with it. Having said that, after past experience I'm somewhat sceptical regarding ashwagandha anyway.

Horny Goat Weed and Tongkat Ali are two supplements that I'll probably give a try next time. Anybody has an idea as to which producers are worth a try for TA? With HGW it's probably the percentage of icariins that matters (isn't 3 percent with the NOW product too little considering that other brands such as Planetary Herbals have 10 percent?), any other relevant criteria? How about a good Tongkat Ali brand? Preferrably a western producer rather than some obscure brand from Asia. Sorry for digressing though; if necessary, I'll create a new thread. Thanks

[Andrey_81]

With HGW it's probably the percentage of icariins that matters (isn't 3 percent with the NOW product too little considering that other brands such as Planetary Herbals have 10 percent?), any other relevant criteria? How about a good Tongkat Ali brand? Preferrably a western producer rather than some obscure brand from Asia. Sorry for digressing though; if necessary, I'll create a new thread. Thanks

This is not right. On the NOW HGW bottle it's indicated that is has minimum 3% icariins and on some sites you can find it has 10%. This is probably due to the marketing

Example (Extract is standardized to 10% Icariins...)
http://www.puritan.c...upplements.html

Edited by Andrey_81, 15 May 2013 - 12:44 PM.

[machete234]

I still take schizandra before bed and this is a must. I sleep deeply and better then ever in my life with interesting and vivid dreams. Strange, I did not expect to have this benefit from schizandra. I decided to try it after I read that it works like a coffee so I thought that it would be great coffee replacement. It turned that it's really amazing sleeping aid I take is as extract but I also have fruit powder (made by Natures way).

Im trying the dried shizandra berries right now, I put them in a tea or hot water where they soften up again when eating them they taste very sour, smell of the tea is incense like and it hardly has a red colouring.

So far theres a feeling of heat (not unusual when drinking tea) and kind of a moodlift.
When I came home I felt kind of like im getting ill and I feel fine now, I drank ginseng+shizandra tea.