816 replies to this topic

[chris106]

I tried B vitamins, and I tried Choline (which is depleted by piracetam - one part of my regimen). Neither had any effect. It didn't cause any problems with the vacation, but I did stop taking ash and 4 days later the headaches have gone from medium-bad to almost unnoticeable. Very likely I'll not experiment with it any more.

Recently I pop ashwagandha like candy again and I rarely have headaches anymore I guess because I took magnesium-bisglycinate for a week or two until I decided my urine is too yellow.

Anyways this form of magnesium seems to help with my tension headaches really well.

The reason I use a lot of ashwagandha lately is stress and too much modalert (Im a bit scared this turns me into an axe murderer I was really fucking angry the last few days but I blame it on the piracetam)
I should quit the moda, its just too weird and phenibut can barely but only barely smooth it out.

If I may ask, how long have you been taking Modalert?

I'm asking because I'm back on it too, for about two weeks now - and i succesfully tried a few things to take the edge of it. Ashwagandha worked to a certain amount, but oddly enough L-theanine seems to work just as well if not better!
Of course I know that many people use it for the same reason in addition to coffee, but I wouldn't have guessed that it worked for Modafinil,too.

Maybe you should give it a try before ditching the Moda?

EDIT: Also, sorry for getting off topic, I will shut my trap now

Edited by chris106, 11 July 2013 - 08:47 PM.

[machete234]

If I may ask, how long have you been taking Modalert?

I'm asking because I'm back on it too, for about two weeks now - and i succesfully tried a few things to take the edge of it. Ashwagandha worked to a certain amount, but oddly enough L-theanine seems to work just as well if not better!
Of course I know that many people use it for the same reason in addition to coffee, but I wouldn't have guessed that it worked for Modafinil,too.

Maybe you should give it a try before ditching the Moda?

EDIT: Also, sorry for getting off topic, I will shut my trap now

3-4 weeks, luckily I got off for a few days this week and dealt with a morning of fatigue and that was it.

I dont know whats up with my l-theanine (it was very cheap) because it causes vasoconstriction for a period of time almost as if theres caffeine in it too.
Anyways it gives me a headache together with the modalert, thats why I dont take it.
Taking the edge off could work with an antihistamine that doesnt cross the blood brain barrier, I happen to have a prescription for one and I believe it reduces the physical effects for example tension headaches.

Back to topic (at least somewhat): I think l-theanine and ashwagandha can be used the same way in many situations.Only that my l-theanine doesnt let me sleep which is odd.

Edited by machete234, 13 July 2013 - 09:55 AM.

[chris106]

Taking the edge off could work with an antihistamine that doesnt cross the blood brain barrier, I happen to have a prescription for one and I believe it reduces the physical effects for example tension headaches.

Admittedly I don't know much about histamine - but would it even be desired to have increased histamine levels in the brain? Why not go with a second gen Antihistamine that actually does cross the BBB?

That being said, I still have a pack of Benadryl/Ceterizine (first-generation antihistamine) lying around. Would that do the trick? Is there anything to be worried about if taking antihistamines for longer periods of time?

I think l-theanine and ashwagandha can be used the same way in many situations.Only that my l-theanine doesnt let me sleep which is odd.

Now that is really odd Maybe you should indeed think about getting some L-Theanine from another source.

Then again L-Theanine is highly dose-dependent for some people, in regards of it working either sedating or stimulating. Maybe start with 200mg and work your way up?

Edited by chris106, 13 July 2013 - 08:16 PM.

[machete234]

Admittedly I don't know much about histamine - but would it even be desired to have increased histamine levels in the brain? Why not go with a second gen Antihistamine that actually does cross the BBB?

They speculate that rising histamine in parts of the brain is one of modafinils modes of action.
So when you take one that does cross the BBB and that makes you drowsy then you reverse the stimulation.

Thats just from my limited understanding and my experience, but nobody really knows how modafinil works.
Generally antihistamines can work as anti-anxiety drugs.

With the l-theanine I kind of stayed too lucid to drift of if that makes sense.

Edited by machete234, 14 July 2013 - 08:52 PM.

[Andrey_81]

I've been taking ashwagandha made by himalaya for the past year and a half without any break with amazing results. Once I contacted himalaya directly and asked about % active withanolides. If I remember corectly they told me it is 2.5%

I decided to try something stronger, just to see the diference. Today I ordered the one made by Jarrows with 8% Withanolides. This should be the most potent ashwagandha available on the market.

http://www.iherb.com...02?rcode=nnt354

I will keep you informed after I try it. As a cronic user I will notice the diference

[Galaxyshock]

I'm not sure what you're trying to achieve with that. You might as well take more of the lower % extract and it would do the same. And more isn't better with adaptogens. Looks like even Now Foods decreased their Ashwagandha extract from 4,5% to 2,5% at 450mg capsule = 11mg withanolides. Which seems to be quite optimal amount for dosing without side-effects.

Edited by Galaxyshock, 20 July 2013 - 09:02 AM.

[Andrey_81]

I just want to try other brand in order to see if there is something better than the one I'm taking. I will stop if I see bad results. Now my dose is up to 750 mg per day. Maybe with jarrows one pill will be enough for the whole day.

[Andrey_81]

Sorry for double post

Edited by Andrey_81, 20 July 2013 - 11:28 AM.

[Galaxyshock]

Alright, it may indeed be more cost-effective to use stronger extract. And you can of course split the caps in half if needed. I doubt there's any bad effects with full dose though especially as you have used Ashwa for a long time and gotten used to it. For some reason Ashwa doesn't seem to do much if anything to me anymore at least when I last time tried it not that long ago. I might give a new try soon though with Rhodiola and other things.

[Andrey_81]

Alright, it may indeed be more cost-effective to use stronger extract. And you can of course split the caps in half if needed. I doubt there's any bad effects with full dose though especially as you have used Ashwa for a long time and gotten used to it. For some reason Ashwa doesn't seem to do much if anything to me anymore at least when I last time tried it not that long ago. I might give a new try soon though with Rhodiola and other things.

I'm also using rhodiola, and I decided to try the one made by jarrow(russian root). I'm still waiting for my shipment. For the past one year I was using the one made by Now. Jarrow is stronger and more expencive, but according to internet research I've made it should be higer quality extract. Of course, I will spilt the dose, 500 mg of rhodiola is too much at once. Wish you luck with rhodiola.

[Ziah]

I tried L-Tyrosine - made me sleepy.... GRRR! Why must this be so freaking hard??? I just want some energy! sigh..... :(

Edited by Ziah, 21 July 2013 - 11:54 PM.

[Andrey_81]

I tried L-Tyrosine - made me sleepy.... GRRR! Why must this be so freaking hard??? I just want some energy! sigh..... :(

Try rhodiola

[Ziah]

rhodiola - hmmmmm trying to remember why I had to stop it. I have a large bottle of it here with only about 10 to 20 pills gone, but I can't recall what it's effects were that I stopped it :(
I was thinking of giving carnitine a try but have been reading if you have thyroid issues it can have some bad effects.

My thyroid was all but dead. Lab here normal range is 70 to 100 so Dr wants to see at least a 80 mine was 0.4 !! Yeah pretty much dead! Took over 4 yrs of tiny little increases to get a normal thyroid result on thyroid meds (prescription meds that is). I am finally at a 87, so I sure don't want to mess with that. My script started off at 0.05 mg and now am at 175.mg

Edited by Ziah, 27 July 2013 - 06:00 PM.

[Atropy]

Audrey_81,aren't you afraid that when you finally want to reduce the dosage of Ash or even stop that withdrawal will be a long sucky,irritable,depressing experience?

What would happen if Ash just stops working for you,and you have to stop ,withdrawal and the after effects may be really bad considering the length of time you have not cycled the herb?

In my experience,what goes up,must come down.

Im really not trying to bum you out at all,its just a subjective question from someone interested in trying out Ash.
I have self diagnosed adrenal issues,that could be helped with Ash.

1-Does Ash cause the down regulation of Cortisol in our bodies,as it does with Gaba?

2-Also,with the Himalayan Brand,I have no idea what is the overall weight of the caplets.Is it the sum of all the extracts combined? 670 mg's?

Edited by Atropy, 13 August 2013 - 02:45 AM.

[machete234]

2-Also,with the Himalayan Brand,I have no idea what is the overall weight of the caplets.Is it the sum of all the extracts combined? 670 mg's?

I think its like 3mg withanaloids the rest is root powder

[hani]

How long does it take to notice the effects of Ashwanghda? I've been taking it for a couple of days now, the Jarrows brand, 1 in the morning 1 at night and I haven't noticed any effects so far.

[andrewmartinuk]

I notice a certain effect when i take Jarrows ashwaghanda..

Jarrows is the patented extract called sensoril..

I dont know how The herb itself affects me but i do notice an effect from the Sensoril Extract.

Even though i have experienced effects, i havent experienced anything Life Changing!

[Andrey_81]

Audrey_81,aren't you afraid that when you finally want to reduce the dosage of Ash or even stop that withdrawal will be a long sucky,irritable,depressing experience?

What would happen if Ash just stops working for you,and you have to stop ,withdrawal and the after effects may be really bad considering the length of time you have not cycled the herb?

In my experience,what goes up,must come down.

Hi there. You could be right and this was my biggest concern in the past (what will happen if this stops working? Should I take more? Should I take less? Is break neede? How long....). I had so many questions in my head....

Now, so many days after I started, I still feel THE SAME benefits as before and my dosage is the same (usualy 500 mg, sometimes 750 mg). I take it every single day. I had some small breaks (2-3 day) and I cannot really say that I feel some bad withdrawal. After few days without ashwagandha I start to feel like I felt before I started to take it (lack of confidence, I care too much about other peoples opinion, I don't like public places, sweating, anxiety....). All this was still under my control because I didn't have long breaks.

In my opinion, I cannot expect bad withdrawal, I just think that after a long peroid without ashw. I will just be back to the start, and this is something I don't want to pass all over again.

Therefore I'm not planing to stop. If needed, I will take it for the rest of my life! I still don't know how, but it changed my life and it is amazing how I feel this good effect after less than 5 minutes after taking it.

I took a break from rhodiola and panax ginseng, so ashwagandha is the only adaptogen herb I've been taking (OK, I take schizandra before bed). With rhodiola you never know, sometimes it kicks you in a positive way, sometimes oposit.. but with ashwagandha I always get this great, positive and long lasting effect

[jetmango]

Hi everyone, this is my 1st post here btw so just wanted to say hello

I've started to take ashwagandha due to extensive neurosis/panic attacks/utterly stresfull life recently. I've got extensive experience with many supplements/other stuff.

Thanks to all of you as I've read all posts about Ash over here [wasn't an easy task hehe ]

So, something from me-

1. Most users recommend it. This herb definetely works.
2. Withdrawal symptoms / prolonged use is something that concerns me.
3. Headaches.

I've started to take Smarcity 'Super Ashwagandha' KSM-66 extract 5% withanolides - 300mg per tab [they advise to take 2 tabs / day ]

Today is my 7th day and I'm planning to give it a break for a few days to see how my body would react.

I am also concerned that several ppl mentioned that they 'rather prefer to take it for many years' than suffer from anxiety/stress etc. - this is correct but then what is the difference with being on Ash for 5 years and being on -let's say- Xanax for 5 years ... I'd say- dependency is still a dependency.


Before Ash -


As I'm very sensitive to caffeine, due to over-using it in the past so now I rather try to avoid it. My job is considered as v stresfull and demanding [you feel like doing mathematical tasks everyday, there r no 'easy days' and it is all connected with finance and dealing with angry customers - so you can try to imagine ;) Put angry client that is losing money + necessity to talk to him/her on the phone in a calm/profess. manner + reviewing the account and trying to found a sollution. So, my brain was boiling after 2 years over there. ]

I've experimented with Ginseng - at the beginning helped a lot, I was more energetic and anxious levels were lower than usual. This allowed me to do my job for an additional 2-3 months with great results. However, as with everything after that time tolerance build up and the 'magic' was gone. I've stopped with it and started with Rodiola. Now, this was fantastic - due to MAOi effect I felt euphoric, energetic and great - but after approx. 1,5 month 'magic' was gone and single dose lasted for 6 hours only, also it did not stopped my panic attacks at all.

I still like Rodiola for a quick 'happy' feeling fix - can take it and after 1 hour got a lot of serotonin and all other happy stuff working for me However, now if I take rodiola for 1 day, next day without it usually is great but the 2-3 after that feels like a withdrawal usually with depression and lack of motivation.

Before that I've tried choline [did very bad things to my anxiety, after first 2 weeks it just crashed my whole nervous system] , 5HTP - after few weeks tachycardia was too strong to continue, Inositol - okay but too weak to help on the long run... Got a romance with GHB in the past, too. Was great but probably f*kd up my GABA receptors, too.

I think I've just messed with the brain little too much [vata imbalance].

So, coming back to Ash - 1st day was okay, took one pill and felt instantly calmer. 2nd day took 2 pills as recommended and felt terrible weak, was tired and with amazing headache [I never take any painkillers, but I had to do it on that day....]. 3rd day took only one pill - still got a headache, but somewhat milder.

On continuous days I'm taking half of a pill afternoon and other half before bed. Headaches are not there, or very slight.

However, rather strong nausea-feeling is persistent for all these days. I'm wondering whether this will cease. Also, ayurveda dr told me to take it for at least 3 months and combine it with Gotu Kola - I've tried this but had to stop as the mix was making me waaay too agitated/nervous.

+ Ash makes me really calm, anxiety and panic attacks are gone
+ Lowers blood pressure
+ Moderate libido enchancement
- Tiredness
- Headache / nausea
- Addiction / withdrawal potential [ ? ]

edit: Also, what saddens me is that some users reported that most effects 'wear off' after stopping taking Ash, so therefore there seems to be no long-term positive lasting effect... : - (

Will continue to take it, however I wonder if it does not create withdrawal/addiction as already mentioned by others - I recognise that 'GABA' feeling - even after going sleep around 1AM I can be awake at 6AM and feel rested [which as GHB teached me is not the right thing]. I do not want something to be hooked on. However, if THIS does not help I am planning to just cut off everything and go on without caffeine, nicotine, alcohol, drugs, supplements and all of that. But I dont believe this will be easy in XXI world.

Sorry for the long post - hope you did not get too bored.

Edited by jetmangoa, 04 September 2013 - 03:20 PM.

[machete234]

I am also concerned that several ppl mentioned that they 'rather prefer to take it for many years' than suffer from anxiety/stress etc. - this is correct but then what is the difference with being on Ash for 5 years and being on -let's say- Xanax for 5 years ... I'd say- dependency is still a dependency.

AWG has a lot of mechanisms of action only one of them could be the GABA one.
They also found some cholinergic action in AWG.

I think that its impossible to overdose on most AWG products and that the withdrawals when they are present they are mild.
Also in contrast to xanax or other benzos you are not likely to black out and there seem to be no negative cognitive consequences.

[jetmango]

heh yeah, I love this herb

I rather prefer to be slightly nauseatic/with headache from time to time but my neurosis is being kept at bay and I'm waaay more calm - in a fresh, healthy way [not stoned like after diazepam or smthg] - yesterday I did not take it and there were no side effects and I was feeling great. Life is good again.

Unbelievable, as nothing was helping so far and I was seriously considering starting with Xanax or Cipralex or another s*it like that [and GP prescribed this without hesitation - they r doing more harm than any good]

Now I'm getting back to yoga and meditation to boost healing process.

I'm planning to do a week break from Ash after 2-3 weeks of taking it.

Edited by jetmangoa, 06 September 2013 - 12:00 PM.

[Adaptogen]

do you guys reckon that ashwagandha powder (non-extract) is fairly bioavailable? i plan on ordering some bulk and would like to be able to mix a teaspoon with water and down it....same question for rhodiola, eleuthero, gotu kola, and astragalus

[jetmango]

yes, it is. Some companies offer just a root powder, not an extract.

see here:
http://organicindiau...ha-powder-1-lb/

[Andrey_81]

yes, it is. Some companies offer just a root powder, not an extract.

see here:
http://organicindiau...ha-powder-1-lb/

Avoid root powder if you want fast working ashwagandha. For me it works like a 'rescue remedy' before some situations (presentations, public speach, meetings, wisiting crowded places like bars, shopping centers...) If taken two times per day confidence and lack of anxiety will be present. It somehow normalizes my whole negative body reactions (sweating, fear, hot flashes, panic, anxiety...). I can feel that is works after only 5 minutes (the peak is after half hour, up to one hour), and it lasts for 6 hours. Sometimes even more.

I tried all kinds of stuff (bromazepam, propranolol, phenibut...) but only ashwagandha keeps me 'normal' and I'm still the same person. It doesn't chage my peronality, it doesn't make me sleepy, it doesn't kill my emotions (like bromazepam). As I wrote, it just 'normalize' my body reactions and somehow kills anxiety and fear and in the same time awakes confidence.

Such a great feeling that lasts whole day

Stick with the extract. I personaly take this one:
Himalaya

Edited by Andrey_81, 02 October 2013 - 04:35 PM.

[machete234]

do you guys reckon that ashwagandha powder (non-extract) is fairly bioavailable? i plan on ordering some bulk and would like to be able to mix a teaspoon with water and down it....same question for rhodiola, eleuthero, gotu kola, and astragalus

You can put it into a cup 1/4 full with water and microwave it for 30s just so that it doesnt boil over and then fill it up with milk. I mixed root powder with extract for myself and what I described works.

Stick with the extract. I personaly take this one:
Himalaya

Did you take the indian and the american one and did you notice a difference?

Avoid root powder if you want fast working ashwagandha. For me it works like a 'rescue remedy' before some situations (presentations, public speach, meetings, wisiting crowded places like bars, shopping centers...)

I took 3 before an interview like situation and it went pretty well in a similar thing I took a benzo and I wont do that again because I lacked some clarity and didnt find the right words when under stress.So ashwagandha it is from now on.Ill only use it as a remedy for the reason that I feel normal when not bothered by anyone but with things like speeches I think I simply have too much "fight or flight" and thats how it is and always will be.

Edited by machete234, 04 October 2013 - 08:54 PM.

[unregistered_user]

I've been taking ashwagandha made by himalaya for the past year and a half without any break with amazing results. Once I contacted himalaya directly and asked about % active withanolides. If I remember corectly they told me it is 2.5%

I decided to try something stronger, just to see the diference. Today I ordered the one made by Jarrows with 8% Withanolides. This should be the most potent ashwagandha available on the market.

http://www.iherb.com...02?rcode=nnt354

I will keep you informed after I try it. As a cronic user I will notice the diference

So Andrey, what did you think of the Jarrow brand compared to the Himilaya brand you've been taking? The Jarrow has a higher withanolide content but I'm not convinced that necessarily means it is any better.

[taktikz]

For some reason I feel tired whenever I take Ashwaganda. I've always taken it in the AM on an empty stomach and have the Himalaya brand which has 10mg Organic Root (8% Withanolides), 280mg Organic root standardized extract (0.5% Withanolides), and 380mg organic root powder (0.2% Withanolides).

[jetmango]

Then you need to take one capsule [at least] PM, like 4PM and then one before sleep - this is recommended by every Ayurveda Dr that I have spoken with... [worked for me also because it also made me tired which supposedly is caused by having nervous system out of balance..]

http://bearmedicineh...g-vitality.html

btw, I've just found this article above- probably it was not posted here yet

Edited by jetmangoa, 06 October 2013 - 11:49 PM.

[unregistered_user]

Then you need to take one capsule [at least] PM, like 4PM and then one before sleep - this is recommended by every Ayurveda Dr that I have spoken with... [worked for me also because it also made me tired which supposedly is caused by having nervous system out of balance..]

http://bearmedicineh...g-vitality.html

btw, I've just found this article above- probably it was not posted here yet

So are you saying that he should take it 3 times daily? Once in the early AM, then again at 4PM and then once more before bedtime?

[jetmango]

No. Two times daily.

One caps approx. 4PM [or what one considers afternoon ]

And one before bed.



Worked fine for me, and now I can easily take one cap. even during morning and it does not make me utterly tired/sleepy. So it is true that this herb balances the nervous system, but you need to find your own dose as like with everything.