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Ashwagandha - a miracle herb

ashwagandha panic attack anxiety

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#661 VerdeGo

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Posted 28 April 2015 - 03:50 AM

@stan: How long have you been using ASH? Here is a thread from a similar experience with sore throat on ASH: http://www.curezone....asp?i=1688998 Ihave no experience with ASH, but I've heard of a similar subjective report from a reishi user (reishi is adaptogenic) on another forum. I don't know if this is part of your body's reaction to such an adaptogen or not. Of course there is no definitive proof that reishi was linked to the abscesses in this man's report. But people experience weird side effects from adaptogenic herbs and mushrooms, including sore throats, rashes, and so on. It could be a simple detox or allergic reaction, but there's no hard science to explain why such reactions occur.  http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/8052363

 

Within a week of starting to take them, I developed a terrible sore throat. I went to the hospital because of it and was diagnosed with strep. They gave me some antibiotics and sent me home. After about a week I was no better, and had to go back to the ER. They spent me to an ear/nose/throat doctor and he told me I was suffering from a peritonsillar abscess (apparently one of the most painful medical afflictions you can endure - lucky me). Again, I was put on heavy antibiotics and heavy pain killers. They also had to drain about 20 CC's of fluid out of the back of my throat.

I was fine for about a month, and I figured it was just bad timing. So, I started taking the extract again. Within a week, I started getting a sore throat, and it began turning into another abscess. Luckily the antibiotics they gave me this time kicked in and kept it from developing into anything worse.

 

@mangoa. I'm not ruling out placebo, but it seems to be a rather strong placebo I experience with small doses of many substances. It never used to be this way. I was enjoying the ride with this Tazo Calm tea, but when I drank the second cup in three days last night, I woke up today feeling very weird. I can't quite summarize the feeling in words, but I'll do my best. I felt a bit anxious, inhibited, feet were more sensitive, lights, colors and sounds were more intense, I felt nauseous, and I was dreading going into work (I usually enjoy going into work). I'm pretty in tune with my body (too much some times, which causes worry over something minor possibly being something major), and this took me by surprise, since I was expecting to be anxiety-free like the day after the first cup. Instead I had to take some theanine five hours later, and this did the trick like magic, making me feel like myself again. But after five hours or so the effects wore off and the feet sensitivity came back. B vitamins also cause this sensitivity in my feet, though nothing else does. The only thing (besides placebo) I can surmise would be highly sensitive GABA receptors. I went through Xanax withdrawal before. A few years later I took a single, small-dose Xanax and experienced major rebound anxiety a few days after that single use. I tried this again, a year or so later, and mild withdrawal symptoms appeared the following day. These withdrawal symptoms always involved sensitivity in my feet and unexplained anxiety and uneasiness. I will never take Xanax or another benzodiazepine ever again because of it. I should've been calm today following the tea last night, but I experienced the opposite effects. Is it possible that a similar GABAergic substance (or a blend of them, as in this tea), tricked my brain into bringing back symptoms of withdrawal I encountered years earlier? A sort of "cross-withdrawal" perhaps? If it is psycho-somatic then how can I reset my brain into thinking otherwise? It's as if my brain reacts badly to any GABAergic substance now, though theanine (works in a different fashion) is fine to use. For the record, I also drink two beers (never more than that) every night after work, and I have experienced GHB and alcohol withdrawal in the past as well (only GABAergic substances tend to bring out these symptoms, and my brain seems far less tolerant to GABAergic substances in general than it used to be).

 

@Godof Smallthings: Many good points, just like mangoa. I absolutely agree in regards to cordyceps. The energy is there for you to use it. Some times I was able to channel it into something more meaningful, like artwork. But when I use it simply for work, during downtime I've noticed this constant chattering in my head. It's as if I'm too alert and focused. I've always been highly perceptive of my surroundings, and this has disturbed some people in the past when I can recall information about them after meeting them only once or twice. I also get compliments nearly every day on my memory recall and attentiveness. Some times I'd like to quiet this and numb my mind, so I turn to theanine, and it works really, really well. The second paragraph you wrote really hit me. I find great joy and excitement in planning social engagements and trips with friends, but I dread going to a pre-planned social event for someone else. I feel like I have to be in control of a lot of things. Sleeping too long for me is worse than not sleeping enough. It zaps my motivation and drive. I will try your suggestion for a morning walk as soon as the sunshine returns to the Sunshine State by the end of the week. I agree that there are too many variables in diet, brain chemistry and other factors. I try to keep my diet as varied and routine as possible, eating a plethora of many types of healthy foods on a daily basis. Even if I ate the same things every day, I'm sure each day would be different in the way I feel, so trying to analyze this is mostly time consuming and pointless. I tried meditation a month back from a phone app, and it seemed to help. The problem is motivating myself for such meditation. Is it normal to get anxious and restless at the start of meditating?

 

Thanks for the input.  :)

 


Edited by VerdeGo, 28 April 2015 - 03:52 AM.


#662 Chris_T_Malta

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Posted 28 April 2015 - 04:17 AM

In those 2 weeks I was taking ASH, I had what was diagnozed with a throat bacterial infection and given anti-biotics. In light of the 2 previous post, I wonder whether this was related to ASH or not! This is surely a point that merits more investigation and will be monitoring it once I restart ASH in the future.

 

 


Edited by Chris Tanti, 28 April 2015 - 04:25 AM.


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#663 Chris_T_Malta

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Posted 28 April 2015 - 04:23 AM

 

 

BTW (completely off topic), I've heard a lot of great things about Malta. It seems to be a pretty unique place to live with a lot of history.

 

Excuse me for missing this part earlier on!

 

Yes, it's off topic so I'll be brief (PM me in case you want more details :)

 

Malta is a rather unique place to live - it's massively overcrowded and incredibly dense with tourist attractions, history items from all great Empires that dominated the Mediterrean including the Brits, the French, the Knights of Saint John, Arabs, Normans, Spanish, Sicilian etc. It's also a party island (a bit like Ibiza) and a scuba diving centre and whatever else the ambitious Maltese people try to do :) Right now we're enjoying an economic miracle although the Libyan war next door is not letting us sleep well!!



#664 stan08

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Posted 28 April 2015 - 12:13 PM

@stan: How long have you been using ASH? Here is a thread from a similar experience with sore throat on ASH: http://www.curezone....asp?i=1688998 Ihave no experience with ASH, but I've heard of a similar subjective report from a reishi user (reishi is adaptogenic) on another forum. I don't know if this is part of your body's reaction to such an adaptogen or not. Of course there is no definitive proof that reishi was linked to the abscesses in this man's report. But people experience weird side effects from adaptogenic herbs and mushrooms, including sore throats, rashes, and so on. It could be a simple detox or allergic reaction, but there's no hard science to explain why such reactions occur.  http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/8052363

 

Within a week of starting to take them, I developed a terrible sore throat. I went to the hospital because of it and was diagnosed with strep. They gave me some antibiotics and sent me home. After about a week I was no better, and had to go back to the ER. They spent me to an ear/nose/throat doctor and he told me I was suffering from a peritonsillar abscess (apparently one of the most painful medical afflictions you can endure - lucky me). Again, I was put on heavy antibiotics and heavy pain killers. They also had to drain about 20 CC's of fluid out of the back of my throat.

I was fine for about a month, and I figured it was just bad timing. So, I started taking the extract again. Within a week, I started getting a sore throat, and it began turning into another abscess. Luckily the antibiotics they gave me this time kicked in and kept it from developing into anything worse.

 

@mangoa. I'm not ruling out placebo, but it seems to be a rather strong placebo I experience with small doses of many substances. It never used to be this way. I was enjoying the ride with this Tazo Calm tea, but when I drank the second cup in three days last night, I woke up today feeling very weird. I can't quite summarize the feeling in words, but I'll do my best. I felt a bit anxious, inhibited, feet were more sensitive, lights, colors and sounds were more intense, I felt nauseous, and I was dreading going into work (I usually enjoy going into work). I'm pretty in tune with my body (too much some times, which causes worry over something minor possibly being something major), and this took me by surprise, since I was expecting to be anxiety-free like the day after the first cup. Instead I had to take some theanine five hours later, and this did the trick like magic, making me feel like myself again. But after five hours or so the effects wore off and the feet sensitivity came back. B vitamins also cause this sensitivity in my feet, though nothing else does. The only thing (besides placebo) I can surmise would be highly sensitive GABA receptors. I went through Xanax withdrawal before. A few years later I took a single, small-dose Xanax and experienced major rebound anxiety a few days after that single use. I tried this again, a year or so later, and mild withdrawal symptoms appeared the following day. These withdrawal symptoms always involved sensitivity in my feet and unexplained anxiety and uneasiness. I will never take Xanax or another benzodiazepine ever again because of it. I should've been calm today following the tea last night, but I experienced the opposite effects. Is it possible that a similar GABAergic substance (or a blend of them, as in this tea), tricked my brain into bringing back symptoms of withdrawal I encountered years earlier? A sort of "cross-withdrawal" perhaps? If it is psycho-somatic then how can I reset my brain into thinking otherwise? It's as if my brain reacts badly to any GABAergic substance now, though theanine (works in a different fashion) is fine to use. For the record, I also drink two beers (never more than that) every night after work, and I have experienced GHB and alcohol withdrawal in the past as well (only GABAergic substances tend to bring out these symptoms, and my brain seems far less tolerant to GABAergic substances in general than it used to be).

 

@Godof Smallthings: Many good points, just like mangoa. I absolutely agree in regards to cordyceps. The energy is there for you to use it. Some times I was able to channel it into something more meaningful, like artwork. But when I use it simply for work, during downtime I've noticed this constant chattering in my head. It's as if I'm too alert and focused. I've always been highly perceptive of my surroundings, and this has disturbed some people in the past when I can recall information about them after meeting them only once or twice. I also get compliments nearly every day on my memory recall and attentiveness. Some times I'd like to quiet this and numb my mind, so I turn to theanine, and it works really, really well. The second paragraph you wrote really hit me. I find great joy and excitement in planning social engagements and trips with friends, but I dread going to a pre-planned social event for someone else. I feel like I have to be in control of a lot of things. Sleeping too long for me is worse than not sleeping enough. It zaps my motivation and drive. I will try your suggestion for a morning walk as soon as the sunshine returns to the Sunshine State by the end of the week. I agree that there are too many variables in diet, brain chemistry and other factors. I try to keep my diet as varied and routine as possible, eating a plethora of many types of healthy foods on a daily basis. Even if I ate the same things every day, I'm sure each day would be different in the way I feel, so trying to analyze this is mostly time consuming and pointless. I tried meditation a month back from a phone app, and it seemed to help. The problem is motivating myself for such meditation. Is it normal to get anxious and restless at the start of meditating?

 

Thanks for the input.  :)

 

I took ashwagandha for a week before stopping.  I've started and stopped it about 5 times over the last 2 years and every time I have the same effects...drastically reduced anxiety but also sore throat and constant clearing of my throat.  The only explanations I could come up with is that either I'm allergic or it's negatively affecting my thyroid.  My tsh levels are a little low (0.7) and I believe ashwagandha increases thyroid hormone production (?).  I have the same reaction if I take bacopa, pregnenolone and any kind of stimulant.  Of course, I also have a weird reaction to curcumin too (some itchiness all over my arms/neck and very watery eyes).  So, I'm probably just odd all-around.  :)



#665 jetmango

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Posted 28 April 2015 - 04:20 PM



 

 

@mangoa. I'm not ruling out placebo, but it seems to be a rather strong placebo I experience with small doses of many substances. It never used to be this way. I was enjoying the ride with this Tazo Calm tea, but when I drank the second cup in three days last night, I woke up today feeling very weird. I can't quite summarize the feeling in words, but I'll do my best. I felt a bit anxious, inhibited, feet were more sensitive, lights, colors and sounds were more intense, I felt nauseous, and I was dreading going into work (I usually enjoy going into work). I'm pretty in tune with my body (too much some times, which causes worry over something minor possibly being something major), and this took me by surprise, since I was expecting to be anxiety-free like the day after the first cup. Instead I had to take some theanine five hours later, and this did the trick like magic, making me feel like myself again. But after five hours or so the effects wore off and the feet sensitivity came back. B vitamins also cause this sensitivity in my feet, though nothing else does. The only thing (besides placebo) I can surmise would be highly sensitive GABA receptors. I went through Xanax withdrawal before. A few years later I took a single, small-dose Xanax and experienced major rebound anxiety a few days after that single use. I tried this again, a year or so later, and mild withdrawal symptoms appeared the following day. These withdrawal symptoms always involved sensitivity in my feet and unexplained anxiety and uneasiness. I will never take Xanax or another benzodiazepine ever again because of it. I should've been calm today following the tea last night, but I experienced the opposite effects. Is it possible that a similar GABAergic substance (or a blend of them, as in this tea), tricked my brain into bringing back symptoms of withdrawal I encountered years earlier? A sort of "cross-withdrawal" perhaps? If it is psycho-somatic then how can I reset my brain into thinking otherwise? It's as if my brain reacts badly to any GABAergic substance now, though theanine (works in a different fashion) is fine to use. For the record, I also drink two beers (never more than that) every night after work, and I have experienced GHB and alcohol withdrawal in the past as well (only GABAergic substances tend to bring out these symptoms, and my brain seems far less tolerant to GABAergic substances in general than it used to be).

 

All right, are you having any regular medications or maybe are very young (20-25 yo?).

 

I have some experience with GHB too, and yes it might have influenced your GABA receptors especially if you taken it recently - and now the chamomile which albeit weak, it might reacted to your over-sensitive receptors now. I would say if you were a casual xanax/ghb/alcohol user at least several months of abstinence are necessary to clear up old pathways. 

 

This way or another- you're lucky. I'd love to have casual chamomile tea to act this way on me. ;))

 

[I am also sensitive too]


Edited by mangoa, 28 April 2015 - 04:21 PM.


#666 VerdeGo

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Posted 28 April 2015 - 05:36 PM

Not on any medications and I'm 37. Was using GHB in late teens to mid 20s, off-and-on. Constantly having to redose to expell the rebound anxiety and encroaching withdrawal turned into a nightmare. It was so addicting because it was the most socially liberating and disinhibiting substance I've ever found. I had absolutely no fear of going into public places and doing cold approaches on women. In fact I felt compelled to meet strangers while on it, and I'd constantly be picking up the phone and calling whoever I could reach, talking for hours. It provided a consistent great mood, no matter the circumstances in which I took it. It actually helped me through a rough breakup and an out-of-state move. The withdrawal was by far the worse experience I've had to endure. I also became fearful and anxiety-ridden when talking to others during this time, which was the complete opposite effects I was enjoying it for, but this was during the withdrawal phase. I stopped altogether 10 years ago and I haven't looked back. 

 

Since that time, I've become much more sensitive to GABAergics. It was much easier to induce withdrawal from mild Xanax use (low dose every day for a week or so) and alcohol as well. Because of this I haven't touched benzos in years. I'm guessing ASH would produce the same effects, as tolerance tends to build rapidly. I also have a compressed nerve after a mishap at a waterfall. When it really bothers me, the symptoms tend to mimic GABAergic withdrawal (along with burning sensations and back pain), so I don't know if there's a link or not.

 

I feel much more like myself today, so whatever the reaction to the GABAergics in that tea was short-lived, or the theanine corrected it. I still can't believe how intense the after-effects were from my first cup. I plan to test things out by having a cup every Friday evening, though this week I'll probably stick to a chamomile-only tea so I can better gauge what's going on. I just hope there's no surprises in store for me in regards to theanine. I've heard it been referred to as a very mild GHB-like substance, probably from the social and libido-boosting effects of theanine. 

 

As for the throat issue, what brand of ASH do you use, Chris and Stan? I didn't even think that it could be thyroid-related, though it sounds a lot like some experiences on reishi. I don't think reishi stimulates the thyroid however, just regulates it like cordyceps. Perhaps it's something in the brand or extract you use, or it could be ASH itself. I wish there was better research out there in regards to adaptogenic allergic reactions vs. detoxification reactions. 



#667 jetmango

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Posted 28 April 2015 - 05:40 PM

haha yah man... all true. been there, done that. magic of vitamin G ;)

 

Yet, I never experienced that bad withdrawals - you defo must be more sensitive to GABA.

 

I recommend 500-100mg of L-Lysine daily until your systems will back to normal. ;)

 

And Xanax is a pain in the ass, even if with short-term use. addicting and no fun at all because of side-effects.



#668 VerdeGo

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Posted 28 April 2015 - 05:53 PM

Yep, I carried sunshine in a bottle everywhere I went back in those days, though I'd often find myself waking up on the floor with drool running down my face. The threshold between good effects and horrible, out-of-control effects was a very fine line for me, and it ultimately became too dangerous and detrimental to use. At one point I was using it to induce lucid dreaming. My body would pass out immediately, the sound of the room would become muffled, and then I was in an altered, lucid state in which I could float around the room (which wasn't a true OBE, just the sensation of floating with closed eye visuals).

 

In regards to Xanax, I wonder if Ativan or similar benzos would cause the same issues? I'm guessing so. 

 

What are the effects for you with lysine in regards to mood elevation/serotonin, social acuity, relaxation, and libido? I'm seriously considering picking this amino acid up. Should it be taken with arginine or by itself?



#669 jetmango

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Posted 28 April 2015 - 06:11 PM

I'd suggest try it without arginine, as they counteract each other in a way (however they are also recommended in combo but it's better to 'feel out' the new thing first IMO )

 

I'd say it works great on social anxiety, and during the initial few weeks my mood was clearly elevated higher than it should (bordered with euphoria ;) but then it balanced itself out, which is good. 

 

Re libido - I dont know as I dont have any problems with it, and it's always on healthy high level ;) but no, it didn't made me more horny like GHB. I'm afraid G. is the only substance on this planet that happens to be such fantastic aphrodisiac. Nothing can every compare with it lol. Good old days. ;)



#670 VerdeGo

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Posted 28 April 2015 - 06:21 PM

Thanks mangoa, I will give lysine a shot then.  :)

 

After stopping GHB, I briefly looked for a substitute, but you're right, nothing comes close. I couldn't find a good food source of it, though I heard there's small quantities in some types of beer (obviously not enough to feel the effects of, since GHB and alcohol would cause instant unconsciousness in very low amounts). Since G is a nutrient and found in the body, and we have GHB receptors in our brain, you'd think more natural substances could stimulate these receptors, though I'm not sure exactly how G produces its social effects (GABA receptors or GHB receptors, or both). I've also read that the body produces a major amount of it upon the act of dying. If only it weren't such powerful stuff and caused so many accidental overdoses it would still be available at your local GNC. 



#671 Chris_T_Malta

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Posted 28 April 2015 - 08:13 PM

What is this GHB? (Noob-question :))

 

The ASH brand I used is healthtonic.co.uk - a small producer -  could try another product.

 

 



#672 jetmango

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Posted 28 April 2015 - 08:19 PM

oh c'mon maaan ;]

 

http://en.wikipedia....oxybutyric_acid



#673 jetmango

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Posted 28 April 2015 - 09:02 PM

L-Lysine is really a 'holy graal' - http://www.mouthulce...s.php?thread=34- helps not only with Herpes outbreaks, but also canker sores. 

 

 



#674 VerdeGo

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Posted 29 April 2015 - 03:34 AM

I don't have either, but I'm very interested in its effects on mood elevation and increasing a sense of well-being. When I'm not on anything for a long time, I feel fine, but when I do eventually take something to brighten my day I look back and say "oh my!" It's as if I wasn't really living at all, and I've been in an apathetic funk, working day to day with the same routine. That's why I was so amazed when I woke up practically singing to myself three days in a row after taking taurine/theanine. It was a "high on life" feeling, and I felt invincible. The disinhibiting effects were similar to that of GHB, without the intoxication. Looking back, something must have elevated serotonin, GABA, and dopamine to high levels. Now I'm curious as to what triggered this reaction. I credit it partially to theanine, which always puts me in a jovial mood the following day, but I'm still curious about taurine and its regulation on the neurotransmitter system.

 

I've also been consuming foods now based on their amino acid profiles to get the effects on mood I desire, and The Mood Cure helped open my eyes to false moods and chemical deficiencies. Of course I still eat what the wife puts in front of me, but I keep it mostly healthy, and I feel a lot better because of it.

 

My mood is almost aways stable, though anxiety and obsessive thinking sometimes leads to paranoia if a stressful situation presents itself (a situation that cannot be resolved immediately, or a situation that is linked to a past stressor). I don't suffer from depression, but I believe I'm mildly OCD, but I don't really know. Anything that increases social interaction (though I'm not an introvert, I keep mostly to myself, and I love being disinhibited) is a good way to shut off this excessive analytical thinking. Lysine seems like a good alternative for boosting serotonin without the nasty side effects of SSRIs. I just hope it doesn't lower GABA or dopamine levels substantially, but if it does, I'll just take theanine. I'm looking forward to trying this as soon as I get a chance to. Thanks again for the suggestion mangoa!

 

I really don't need any of this stuff, as I've learned to cope on my own. However, since redirecting my diet and working with amino acids on a one-by-one basis again, I feel more alive than I have in years. Honestly, the last time I felt so animated and alive in general was in 2012 when I discovered phenylalanine/tyrosine and carnitine. The only downside is eventual tolerance if taken too frequently, but that is with just about anything in life. Moderation is key.



#675 Chris_T_Malta

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Posted 29 April 2015 - 04:37 AM

I've also been consuming foods now based on their amino acid profiles to get the effects on mood I desire, and The Mood Cure helped open my eyes to false moods and chemical deficiencies. Of course I still eat what the wife puts in front of me, but I keep it mostly healthy, and I feel a lot better because of it.

 

 

I have made the test on the website of "The Mood Cure".

 

According to this basic test, I could have issues (in probability order) with:

 

NOREPINEPHRIN or Thyroid

SEROTONIN 

GABA or Cortisol

 

VerdeGo, how did this book help you? I am quite interested in it. Yesterday, I spent a couple of hours watching 2 youtube videos about Adrenal Fatigue to try to understand what could be enhanced in my life in terms of nutrition and moood.



#676 jetmango

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Posted 29 April 2015 - 12:40 PM

Anyone got the 'mood cure' book? I can't find it anywhere on torr etc ;)

 

I am a bit confused- one source says that in order to fix endorphins issue you need to take phenylalanine to feel more at ease - yet here http://www.thesupper...-emotions-todayit states that it is converted to stimulants like norepinephrine, dopamine etc.

 

https://www.moodcure...rticle.docx.pdf

 

which one is correct? 

 

also: they recommend supplementing GABA, but... GABA does not cross blood-brain barrier, no?

 

http://nootriment.co...ba-supplements/

 

any info on this?


Edited by mangoa, 29 April 2015 - 12:50 PM.


#677 Chris_T_Malta

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Posted 29 April 2015 - 08:32 PM

Mangoa - check this presentation --> 



#678 jetmango

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Posted 29 April 2015 - 08:34 PM

thanks man , will watch it tonight



#679 Chris_T_Malta

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Posted 29 April 2015 - 08:42 PM

Currently watching it.. but I'll rewatch it cause I still need to determine under which of those 4 categories I fall...



#680 jetmango

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Posted 29 April 2015 - 08:44 PM

cant you be in more than one? 

 

human health is rarely just factor of 'one condition' and you can have both GABA and serotonin problem for example..



#681 VerdeGo

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Posted 30 April 2015 - 03:31 AM

I never picked up the book surprisingly. I plan to read it soon, but I learned about it from a website that breaks down false mood types from the neurotransmitter systems. I now can link unexplained agitation to low serotonin. When I'm in an apathetic funk, and nothing seems to be rewarding to me, I know I'm low in dopamine, and so on. I guess it makes sense now, but before I was just going with the flow, not really understanding the biochemistry behind why I might get suddenly agitated or lethargic for no reason. I wasn't a true believer until I started experimenting with high doses of foods high in the amino acids I was looking for (glutamic acid, phenylalanine, tryptophan, etc.). This approach seemed to help immensely, but I definitely overdid it by consuming too many cherry tomatoes (I first read they're a great source for raising GABA on various websites, probably from the glutamic acid, but the euphoria I felt each time I ate about 30 of them was probably due to the phenylalanine). Excess amounts of an amino acid-rich food typically acts like the supplement itself. Too many cacao nibs, for instance, can cause hallucinations, mood swings, and so on. But since moderation is my goal, I now use food to bring about subtle mood changes. Black beans and brown rice for me is a subtle mood elevator that can get me out of mild anxiety.

 

In fact I turned to black beans/rice today after waking up with mild anxiety. I tend to get this mild anxiety after theanine now, so I believe the reports in that it can cause rebound anxiety. It's better used for short term stress relief as opposed to something to take every day. At any rate, I did see a sizable reduction in my anxiety about 30 minutes after eating this for lunch. Of course there's many variables present. If you're low on vitamins B6 and B9, then this may also cause low dopamine levels. And tryptophan should be consumed with complex carbs like brown rice, otherwise it may convert to melatonin (which may be why some people report sedation after supplementing with l-tryptophan itself). 

 

Chris, I do believe l-phenylalanine (the natural form found in foods) bumps up your dopamine levels, but there's a lot of information pointing to it increasing endorphin levels by blocking the enzyme that breaks them down. FAAH inhibitors are currently being studied at Yale to help with cannabis withdrawal, because they also block the enzyme that breaks down beta-endorphins. D-phenylalanine, only available in supplement form, sounds even more interesting as far as endorphins go. http://www.beautynhe...ges/D-Phen.html(sorry, not a medical publication, but there's plenty out there).

 

GABA technically isn't supposed to cross the BBB. But it depends on each person's BBB and the amount they consume. High doses will probably affect you. If you are already sensitive to substances, have a leaky BBB, etc., then you're probably more likely to feel its effects. Check out the verified purchase reviews on Bulk Nutrition's GABA on Amazon. I'd say it does indeed cross the blood brain barrier. http://www.amazon.co...s/dp/B00E7TWV4I The reason I haven't tried it yet (yes, I did buy a bag of it, and it's collecting dust alongside my sulbutiamine and aniracetam) is because of the strange "flushing sensation" that many people experience. It's similar to a niacin flush, but a different type of flush, and it can bring on anxiety itself. 

 

You can try some experimentation yourself. I doubt anyone falls into just one category. If you're agitated or generally unhappy, try eating tryptophan-based foods with complex carbs. Even warm milk may do the trick for its lactalbumin and tryptophan content (or you can try l-lysine, which seems to have worked for mangoa quite well). If you're lethargic and apathetic, I'd try cacao, cherry tomatoes, cayenne peppers (also boosts endorphin levels, and it's available in supplement form), and so on. For GABA I like brown rice, cherry tomatoes, and glutamic-rich foods. It doesn't all have to be all about diet. Supplementation to correct whatever mood imbalances you may have at the time seems to be just as beneficial, if not more practical for immediate relief. 

 

Just look for the warning signs that you may be low in a certain neurotransmitter, and gently bump it up and see how you get along. 



#682 Chris_T_Malta

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Posted 30 April 2015 - 03:52 AM

Yes, it's clear that anything we do we must strive to achieve a healthy balance. And this is especially important for anything we try to do with our brain.

 

My diet is nowadays quite healthy but I need to tweak it according to this "Mood Cure" theory. Another approach worth considering (on top of the Mood Cure approach) is the Soylent approach (total complete daily nutrition) and of course, exercise!

 

I stopped all supplements for the time being. I would like to establish a new baseline to restart experimenting. I still have to rely on caffeine, green tea and cacao powder to get going, but the intake is moderate and I am hoping this will not affect negatively my adrenals. Caffeine is definitely the most effective - it's partly psychological. Sometimes I am totally apathetic, I decide to take a coffee and even before the water is boiling I am already productive!

 

My dilemma is that in 2013 I was so much better and my nutrition at that time was not that healthy (burgers, fries, red meat, turkish food, massive amount of white bread and pasta intake) and my supplement knowledge was very limited (but I still took Vitamin B Complex, Vitamin C, Fishoils and Multi-Bionta (Multi-vitamins, minerals and probiotics). So lately I decided to move towards the good aspects of that diet but I watched so many anti-grains videos (Dr. Perlmutter etc) that I cannot really eat a lot of bread or pasta without feeling I am doing something wrong! 

 

 

 

 

 



#683 VerdeGo

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Posted 30 April 2015 - 04:29 AM

Part of it is indeed psychological. And nobody knows for sure if diet is going to lead them to a long life. Hear about the 104 year old woman who swears by drinking 3 cans of Dr. Pepper every day for her longevity? In fact her birthday cake was in the shape of a Dr. Pepper can! And she outlived the doctors who told her it would kill her lol http://time.com/3752...-dr-pepper/ Butwe know from modern science that carbonated beverages are bad for so many reasons, and she probably has better genetics than the soda is harmful for her. It just comes down to your own biochemistry, environment, genetics and physiology. 

 

There's been times in the past when I wasn't eating healthy, and I felt great. But I also remember being more sluggish and seeking out rewarding activities to make the times more interesting. Now that I'm nearing 40, I don't want to feel responsible if I get seriously ill and never made an attempt to eat healthy and exercise (meditation is next on the list) to possibly prevent such an illness from occurring. I've also noticed I no longer need an afternoon nap before work (I work evenings), so I must have been more sluggish than I thought at the time. One thing that is not in short supply these days is energy.

 

I think streamlining your diet to get a baseline and starting fresh is a great idea. I've never heard of the Soylent approach before, can you elaborate or send me a good link? It's been what I've been trying to achieve through diet, if I understand it correctly: getting all needed nutrients from all types of food consistently every day. Since I follow a routine, it's easy to eat hummus, blueberries, spinach, turkey, whole wheat, nuts, celery/carrots, and oatmeal every day, day after day. But there's other stuff I'm forgetting that goes beyond my Mediterranean-based diet (I replaced butter entirely with olive oils). BTW is Dr. Perlmutter against all grains or just processed grains? Whole grains, high in fiber, should be healthy, and I read that they can extend life: http://www.nbcnews.c...y-finds-n279756

 

I seem to learn something new every time I visit this thread.  :)



#684 Chris_T_Malta

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Posted 30 April 2015 - 05:01 AM

I have been following the soylent approach to nutrition since the founder's first blog. They have a massive community (forums) found here --> http://discourse.soylent.me/- to really get into the spirit of their approach you must first read what started it all.. Rob Rhinehart's first blog post --> http://robrhinehart.com/?p=298. The approach has a lot of eager supporters and aggressive critics. I wouldn't consider it for 100% of my nutrition but it could be used as a backup for healthy food whenever you're too busy to cook etc.

 

From what I read, Dr. Perlmutter is a bit of an extremist anti-Carbs but otherwise reasonable. I believe he's anti-grains in their totality. He does cite studies all the time in his interviews and presentations so he must be on something. The anti-grains community is very popular online and somehow I always end up watching some related video. I particularly like to watch this interview one in a while:   

 

As regards to learning new things, right now I must have a sort of OCD to learn new stuff which is related to these kind of topics. I actually find nothing else which is interesting right now. But the complexity of the subject can be overwhelming. Just yesterday I watched 2 very long videos on the adrenal system and started taking notes to memorize some stuff.. feels like studying in a way!

 

 



#685 jetmango

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Posted 30 April 2015 - 08:33 PM

I must admit that we override our natural systems by chronic caffeine use [for example] and then try to re-balance & calm it down through ashwagandha...

 

it indeed does make sense to me.
 
 
 
especially comments are interesting.

 



#686 VerdeGo

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Posted 01 May 2015 - 03:17 AM

I didn't realize Soylent was a food in and of itself. I was thinking it was a list of foods to consume on a daily basis that would cover all nutrients and vitamins. I'll be on vacation soon (I currently work 7 days a week), and I'll have more time to read up on it and watch your video links. I am a terrible cook. I nearly lit my kitchen on fire at one point when I followed an online recipe stating to heat olive oil in a frying pan on high before adding chicken. Before I knew it, the pan was engulfed in flames! But getting back to Soylent. It's a neat concept, but I do love eating different types of food with their various textures. Do people do this in conjunction with healthy eating, or would you be consuming too many calories and carbs?

 

Unfortunately my healthy diet is making me shed pounds I don't want to, as I am already lean and a little underweight with a high metabolism. I plan to add whole milk (I don't like the idea of dairy because it's linked to premature death, along with red meat and high caloric intake) to granola cereal and a banana with my oatmeal for breakfast. I also plan to start eating peanut butter, more red meat (only eat red meat about twice a month, in small portions, but I eat chicken and turkey almost daily), along with working out to add muscle mass. I don't mind being thin, but I'm not getting enough calories or carbs in my diet to stop myself from losing weight, and I have a physically active job. I really don't want to have to add things I've avoided in my past back into my diet, but weight gain for me is somewhat of a priority right now, and I'd like to do it as healthy as possible without increasing blood glucose. My last fasting blood glucose was 101, but I was also under immense stress with CNS issues following my final sulbutiamine dose. 

 

I also agree about caffeine. It can deplete serotonin, cause a crash, has its own withdrawal symptoms, and so on. Same with the stimulants and the PEA in raw chocolate. But I'm not one to suggest anything, as I vape nicotine every day for my stimulation. 

 

Right now I'm also being OCD with all this nutritional and diet stuff. It's good to make changes and evolve spiritually and physically. I think you're moving in the right direction by establishing a baseline before experimenting with supplements further.

 

Mangoa, I wish there was a natural way to increase GHB levels in the brain besides the act of death itself, but so far I'm coming up short. Not that I'd ever do it again because of its addiction potential, but it would be nice to boost it naturally through a certain diet. Theanine is often referred to as a weak form of G because it produces similar effects, but much much more mild, and there's no evidence it influences G receptors. I guess I'm being nostalgic right now, because G seems forever lost to the sands of time.



#687 Godof Smallthings

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Posted 01 May 2015 - 02:19 PM

Is it normal to get anxious and restless at the start of meditating?

 

Yes. I would say it is very normal. Happens to me a lot. So does the lack of motivation, so I end up having down periods from meditation too. Which is silly, because I want to do it and I am 100% convinced of its benefits, having experienced some of them already.

Remember there are many meditation objects you can take. Mindfulness/vipassana type meditations are the most popular these days, but apart from those there are also meditations more heavily focused on cultivating calm, concentrated states. You can repeat a mantra (and it can actually be any word, although some are more popular than others and are said to have particular power in some traditions, for example the famous 'Oooohhhhmmmm'). But you could also theoretically reach these states repeating 'watermelon' enough times, as long as it is a mantra that feels right.

 

Another practice (from the Theravada Buddhist meditation manual Path of Purification, or Visuddhimagga) is kasina practice, calmly concentrating on coloured discs in front of you while alternating between open and closed eyes, until the residual colour-inverted image on the inside of your eyelids turns into a solid image which increases in luminescence until it is unbearably strong and stable, and you merge with it into the first absorption state.

Yet another one is to try to meditate on a question - 'Who am I' is a classic. Trying to sit with a zen koan is another. Trying to catch each perception as it arises is another - or as it disappears - yet another. Trying to 'look back' at 'who is doing the watching' is interesting too. Many things to try.

 

Regardless of method, actually pretty much any sensation can come up during meditation. Prepare the red carpet for all eventualities.

Apart from pain, itching, numbness, muscle tension, repetitive melodies, boredom, anxiety, repetitive thoughts, rapidly shifting inner imagery, irritation, anger, sorrow, nausea and fear, I've experienced calm peace, being steeped in sparkling energy, rising tingling energy through the spine, audio hallucinations, a sensation of entering an enormous, empty, luminous space, body part distortions (e.g. the feeling of my hands being enormous and my torso virtually disappearing), blasts of sexual arousal, a sense of all pain fading away into non-importance and being inside a bubble of warmth and light, a sense of locking in with the breath and being very focused without a sensation of effort etc. None of these states have been lasting, some were extremely brief, and some persisted for a bit longer than others.

 

Try to learn to just sit with whatever is there at that moment, without thoughts or judgements getting the better of you.


  • Informative x 1

#688 VerdeGo

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Posted 02 May 2015 - 04:23 AM

Wow, very informative post. Thank you! I plan to get a meditation routine going once I take a week off of work in 8 days. I'll finally have time to myself then, and this is something I've been wanting to get into. In the past I used an Android app called Insight Timer, which allows me to access guided meditations ranging in time and type and submitted from all over the world. 

 

How long did it take before meditation started eliciting a positive, substantial response for you? Is it okay to use herbs or amino acids that calm the mind during this process to help ease into meditation, or should it be done under the influence of no substance? 

 

I have tried chakra meditation when I was a teenager to try to induce an out-of-body-experience. The closest I got wasn't with meditation, but from waking up in the middle of the night and counting in my head. My mind stayed alert while my body drifted back to sleep. I dreamt I was in a race car, and from this dream I was able to project myself out of the dream to where I could see the room. I started lifting out of my body, but suddenly a loud ringing (like an old-fashioned alarm clock was buzzing next to my left ear) startled me awake and ruined the experience. I later read this ringing is a tell-tale sign that you're about to leave your body. But I digress...



#689 jetmango

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Posted 02 May 2015 - 04:19 PM

guys can somebody else also confirm eating cherry tomatoes [20-30 ;] ] really can give you a high? or at least boost your mood? is that because of phenylalanine? 

 

and also I will test this today- just going for shopping :D

 

also, is that only with cherry tomatoes?

 

http://www.whfoods.c...odspice&dbid=44

 

[love this site btw]

 

Cant find good info about how much it is in tomatoes as such

 

http://foodb.ca/foods/172


Edited by mangoa, 02 May 2015 - 04:24 PM.


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#690 jetmango

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Posted 02 May 2015 - 07:27 PM

Well I've found only info on wiki:

 

L-Phenylalanine is biologically converted into L-tyrosine, another one of the DNA-encoded amino acids. L-tyrosine in turn is converted into L-DOPA, which is further converted into dopaminenorepinephrine (noradrenaline), andepinephrine (adrenaline). The latter three are known as the catecholamines.

Phenylalanine uses the same active transport channel as tryptophan to cross the blood–brain barrier. In excessive quantities, supplementation can interfere with the production of serotonin and other aromatic amino acids as well asnitric oxide due to the overuse (eventually, limited availability) of the associated cofactors, iron or tetrahydrobiopterin. The corresponding enzymes in for those compounds are the aromatic amino acid hydroxylase family and nitric oxide synthase.

 

http://en.wikipedia....i/Phenylalanine







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