3585 replies to this topic

[pleb]

I don't think what happens to any member on here would be put down to taking C60 oo they are taking it because of the results with the rats,
I'm sure most would understand that if anything did happen to another person on here, it is more likely to be from accute health problems they had before they started the C60 oo

Edited by a pleb, 15 October 2012 - 05:42 PM.

[Turnbuckle]

I don't think fullerene acts primarily through mitoneogenesis, if at all.

Rather,akin to methylene blue, I suspect it acts directly on the electron transport chain within the mitochondria, possibly reducing / eliminating electron transport bottlenecks that occur along the chain.

Methylene blue acts on complex 4.

Speaking of methylene blue, I tried 1 mg in water this morning--along with 10 mg C60 in oil--to see if there was any synergy for running. Nope. Could be a coincidence, but I had all sorts of ankle and calf and thigh pains that discouraged me from running at all.

Turnbuckle, please don't take any other drugs than C60 because we could not understand what the changes of your health are caused by. If you get ill or die no one will dare touch C60 until at least the study is replicated. All eyes are on you now.

Ha! Just for you I've added a dead/not dead status update to my profile.

[Anthony_Loera]

Turnbuckle isn't dead yet... And neither am I.

I have taken lots of C60... Maybe even more than Turnbuckle since I have done the full rat dose per kg... For about 21 days... (3 different batches) And I feel fine.

Lately I have just lowered my dose to 1 full tablespoon of C60oo per meal... To see how different that seems.

Cheers
A

[niner]

I have taken lots of C60... Maybe even more than Turnbuckle since I have done the full rat dose per kg... For about 21 days... (3 different batches) And I feel fine.

Lately I have just lowered my dose to 1 full tablespoon of C60oo per meal... To see how different that seems.

So Anthony, do you mean that you've had 21 doses of ~140mg? You started a few month back, as I remember it. How long did you go between doses? Your new dose of 1 tbs per meal is still a lot, by my reckoning. Assuming 3 meals, that's 45ml * 0.8mg/ml = 36mg/day. (also ~240 Calories) I would guess that you feel basically pretty normal, and that's not bad. I think that your membranes are so saturated with C60 that it would take anywhere from months to years to get back to normal human status. (you are now a chemical - human hybrid. pretty cool.) As such, you probably won't be able to tell a difference in dosing models for quite a while. The amount you're taking now will keep you permanently saturated. The epidemiology on that quantity of olive oil is pretty good. The top cutoff in the Spanish cohort of the EPIC trial was 2 tbs/d, and they had a significant drop in all-cause mortality.

[Anthony_Loera]

Hi Niner,

Yes i took about 2 to 3 weeks between batches.

Downing close to a cup of oil is not the best experience in the world. Now with tablespoons.... Well one can add it to almost anything... Like my morning (Jugo Verde) green juice for example:

It has...
Celery, pineapple, grapefruit, parsley, and now a tablespoon of C60 Olive Oil.

This is sold everywhere (well except for the C60) in Mexico and it tastes pretty good.

I am hoping to get an interesting video up on C60.net by the end of the week. More about that when our media manager Vato (he pronounces it Vatu...) has it ready.

Cheers
A

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Edited by Anthony_Loera, 16 October 2012 - 01:48 PM.

[Kevin Johnson]

The rat dosage was not daily. I think that with the dispersal rate of 10 days, a medium basil rate should be acheived with 1.5 - 3 mg per day for an average person. Base 15 - 30 mg basil at all times. This could be easily diluted into EVOO in a solution easy to take.

[Andey]

Has anybody tried to dissolve activated carbon in olive oil ? If it also creates red colored solution it would be very intresting ) If no it would be clear that carbon didnt work like C60.

[Anthony_Loera]

The rat dosage was not daily. I think that with the dispersal rate of 10 days, a medium basil rate should be acheived with 1.5 - 3 mg per day for an average person. Base 15 - 30 mg basil at all times. This could be easily diluted into EVOO in a solution easy to take.

Nope the rat dose was only taken for 7 days in the study, then weekly, then monthly i believe. I do believe we have much better metabolisms than rats. I took 3 batches at the original dose per kg mentioned in the study (which was almost a cup of oil every day for 7 days for every batch)

Now i am taking a tablespoon or more a day. Kevin, are there C60 studies on humans that i am not aware of? or are your numbers based on estimates of some sort?

Thanks
A

[Kevin Johnson]

Hi Anthony. Nice to get a response from you as I have a question you may be able to answer about the TA-65 as well. First, the 10 dispersal rate was an average I assessed from several studies, but on animals. I don't really have any human studies to rely on so I used what info I had and yes, the human rates would be different. I think in a long term therapy a mean serum level would be more appropriate than a "loading dose" type scenario. As far as the quantity, we have no idea of what a therapudic level would be. I am thinking of dispersal rate of a small particulate in the body with a nanopartical and a continual mean serum level wouldn't need as high a doseage as what they gave the initial rats. Other studies on rats, mice and large mouth bass seem to have pushed the treatment size in an attempt to test the toxicity and limits of use, but that's normal science. On a pratical standpoint, I don't think most people are going to take that much OO daily. If the product gets commercialized, a lower amount will have to be used, I hope it is an effective doseage.

On a second note. I would love to get your thoughts on the telomerase enzyme prepared solution out there (phoenix labs and now other makers) versus the TA-65 extract. I was thinking that the stimulation of the human body to produce natural telomerase would be more efficient and better used by the body, but I don't really know if the prepared enzyme is any less effective. Your thoughts or has your company done any studies?

[niner]

The rat dosage was not daily. I think that with the dispersal rate of 10 days, a medium basil rate should be acheived with 1.5 - 3 mg per day for an average person. Base 15 - 30 mg basil at all times. This could be easily diluted into EVOO in a solution easy to take.

Nope the rat dose was only taken for 7 days in the study, then weekly, then monthly i believe. I do believe we have much better metabolisms than rats. I took 3 batches at the original dose per kg mentioned in the study (which was almost a cup of oil every day for 7 days for every batch)

Now i am taking a tablespoon or more a day. Kevin, are there C60 studies on humans that i am not aware of? or are your numbers based on estimates of some sort?

You guys might want to take a look at this post, along with the first post in the thread. I've derived a minimal daily dose based on human data and a marker that I think is legit. On the basis of that, I'm now taking a bit less than a milligram per day.

Kevin, where did you find that 10 day dispersal rate? Is that based on a particular dose?

Anthony, how many doses have you had? Did you follow the Baati schedule exactly? (24 doses in 7 months?)

[Kevin Johnson]

Hey Niner, that was as abstract from several reviews of the initial and other studies. There is so much information and stuff that I don't want to call disinformation but just abstracts from unclear sources. Then I'm trying to base my knowledge on this so it gets even more unclear. But this info is all based on small animals, not human subjects.

[Anthony_Loera]

I hope the smaller dose works for you. I will side on a larger dose for now. Also lets keep this thread about C60 on point, as it appears (at least for now) that C60 maybe better at keeping animals living longer than all the other drugs and supplements we have looked into.

Cheers
A

[Anthony_Loera]

Homemade strawberry juice and C60oo.

I think i will start making recipe posts on C60.net as i am finally getting to the point where i can post things on the website and not worry about legal issues.

In the next few days a few posts will be released on that site, and a video... The video is actually pretty incredible because of who is in it with me... Yes i apologize in advance, as i still do not remotely appear like captain america even after all the c60 this rat has taken.

Needless to say, i feel i am not very good on camera at all... But the person that was with me... Well, he is great on camera.

Cheers! And i hope when the video is finally posted, you guys might visit the informational site to check the video out... For now, the site is still a little desolate.

Well, hopefully not for long.

A

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[keflex]

I hope the smaller dose works for you. I will side on a larger dose for now. Also lets keep this thread about C60 on point, as it appears (at least for now) that C60 maybe better at keeping animals living longer than all the other drugs and supplements we have looked into.

Cheers
A

Have you noticed any differences in your health/physical well-being so far? I know a lot of other users reported their subjective experiences, but I think you're the only one who's taking that high a dosage of C60.

[mikey]

I remember seeing someone post in this topic that the healing springs around the world, like Lourdes and Bhutan have been shown to have high levels of fullerenes.

If anyone knows where that post is, please let me know.

[Turnbuckle]

I remember seeing someone post in this topic that the healing springs around the world, like Lourdes and Bhutan have been shown to have high levels of fullerenes.

If anyone knows where that post is, please let me know.

It was in Russia, in an area with a carbon mineral that contains fullerenes. This mineral--shungite--dates from 2 billion years ago. Back then there wasn't oxygen in the atmosphere to supress the formation of C60.

Vaughter has an article about it--
http://c60antiaging....old-health-spa/

Edited by Turnbuckle, 26 October 2012 - 02:14 PM.

[Turnbuckle]

Turnbuckle isn't dead yet... And neither am I.

I have taken lots of C60... Maybe even more than Turnbuckle since I have done the full rat dose per kg... For about 21 days... (3 different batches) And I feel fine.

Lately I have just lowered my dose to 1 full tablespoon of C60oo per meal... To see how different that seems.

Cheers
A

I've taken a good deal less--about 750 mg over 7 months. This is about 3.5 mg/day on average, but I didn't take it every day. Recently I've been taking .5 mg every other day.

[hav]

I'm partway between Anthony and the crowd on dosage. I went with a shot glass, measured to hold 45 ml of solution or 36 mg of C60. Figuring that this was somewhat below the Baati mg/kg dosage that I would take the loading dosage for a somewhat longer time. Did about 3 three-week cycles with one week off in between. Been following up with what I think of as maintenance dosages once a week ever since. I figure 45 ml weekly puts me roughly on par with the terminal level used monthly in the Baati study without ever having to swallow 4/5 of a cup at a time.

Howard

[mikey]

I remember seeing someone post in this topic that the healing springs around the world, like Lourdes and Bhutan have been shown to have high levels of fullerenes.

If anyone knows where that post is, please let me know.

It was in Russia, in an area with a carbon mineral that contains fullerenes. This mineral--shungite--dates from 2 billion years ago. Back then there wasn't oxygen in the atmosphere to supress the formation of C60.

Vaughter has an article about it--
http://c60antiaging....old-health-spa/

Thanks. That isn't the post that I am seeking, though. The post had clearly linked shown that these healing springs had high levels of fullerenes in them, which might explain why people could soak in them and heal from serious health conditions.

[Anthony_Loera]

C60oo with a Hawaiian pizza with jalapenos... Yumm!

Oh and a Pepsi.

:lol:

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Edited by Anthony_Loera, 29 October 2012 - 10:43 PM.

[bdelfin]

Would the consumption of this with 10 grams of soluble fiber affect the uptake? I know that you're not supposed to take many fat-soluble supplements (or certain fats, like the Omega-3's in Lovaza prescription fish oil) with high-fiber meals, so I'm wondering if this effect carries over to C60 in olive oil. And if it has to be taken away from meals, does it matter if it's accompanied by enough fat to ensure absorption of fat-soluble nutrients, or can it just be downed on it's own?

[niner]

Would the consumption of this with 10 grams of soluble fiber affect the uptake? I know that you're not supposed to take many fat-soluble supplements (or certain fats, like the Omega-3's in Lovaza prescription fish oil) with high-fiber meals, so I'm wondering if this effect carries over to C60 in olive oil. And if it has to be taken away from meals, does it matter if it's accompanied by enough fat to ensure absorption of fat-soluble nutrients, or can it just be downed on it's own?

These are really good questions. I've mostly been taking C60-oo with a meal that has a reasonable amount of fat. My reasoning is that the gallbladder might want to see a decent amount of fat before it gets the signal (via CCK, I think) to release bile to aid in digestion of lipids. Sometimes I just down the c60-oo on its own, too. To be honest, I don't know if it makes a difference- you'd need to do a pharmacokinetic study and see if it shows up in the bloodstream under different dosing protocols. Good question about fiber. I have no idea what fiber would do, but it would probably be better to avoid it, to be on the safe side.

[hav]

Would the consumption of this with 10 grams of soluble fiber affect the uptake? I know that you're not supposed to take many fat-soluble supplements (or certain fats, like the Omega-3's in Lovaza prescription fish oil) with high-fiber meals, so I'm wondering if this effect carries over to C60 in olive oil. And if it has to be taken away from meals, does it matter if it's accompanied by enough fat to ensure absorption of fat-soluble nutrients, or can it just be downed on it's own?

I've been avoiding ingestion of fiber supplements for at least a few hours after taking any supplements in oil-filled softgels (eg, D3 and Ubiquinol) and treat c60/evoo the same way. Chitosan, btw, has the same fat absorbing and eliminating behavior as soluble fiber so I take the same care with that. Some supplements, like astragalus extracts, increase their uptake in the presence of soluble fiber and chitosan. But my sense is that most vitamins and supplements absorb better in the presence of fats.

Howard

[xtronics]

Interesting thread.

I mag stirred some of this up and set it aside for a few months while digging through saftey issues. It did get a brown color in just the first days of mixing.

Centrifuging is sperating out some cloudy material - not somthing that looks like the black powder.. Hmm?

The clear bit has the reddish tint.

I've been on a ketogenic diet for years now - plan to take some later today. N+1

Something not mentioned here is that C60 does occur in small quanitites in soot etc..

My hunch is that C60 works as an ROS absorber - holds radicals in place for other molicules to deal with. The stable nature of the bonds could make this a long term agent, thus explaining why those mice lived on even after they no longer got dosed.

[YodaTW]

It seems to me that C60 mostly effects the liver which in turn keeps the blood and body clean of toxins. In 2009 White Rabbit candy (and other prod) made it to taiwan. I ate a whole bag, the news states a week later that White Rabbit Candy contains the contaminent melamine causing cancer but it gathers in the liver, destroying the organ.

What I am asking is…is it possible that C60 EVOO might gather in the liver and thus deliver the EVOO over years to a vital organ that cleanses the body, and the C60 itself might assist in the filtration of the blood (less likely) and deliver energy (acting as a superconductor in our cells).

So since the liver filters…the C60 gathers in it…in turn spreading cleaner blood throughout our body…with C60. The two parts of the body with the most C60 in it turned out to be the liver and spleen.

I noticed in the studies that, "C60 effects on CCl4 induced liver damage. Circulating levels of alanine amino-transferase activity (ALT), used as a biochemical marker of liver injury [29], confirmed liver-protection by C60."

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Edited by YodaTW, 01 November 2012 - 04:29 AM.

[Turnbuckle]

What I am asking is…is it possible that C60 EVOO might gather in the liver and thus deliver the EVOO over years to a vital organ that cleanses the body, and the C60 itself might assist in the filtration of the blood (less likely) and deliver energy (acting as a superconductor in our cells).

According to the Baati paper, "A complete biodistribution study including intestine, skin, bone and fatty tissue is in progress in our laboratory." They did present some data, however, which shows that the liver accumulates less than 1% of the oral dose--

3.2.2. Biodistribution

At day 1 (D1) after administration, C60 contents in livers and spleens represent 0.14% and 0.18% of the administered dose by the oral route, respectively, and 4.73% and 1.55% by the i.p. route, respectively (Table 2).

After 7 successive days of administration (D8), C60 contents in livers and spleens correspond to 0.39% and 0.51% of the total administered dose by the oral route, respectively, and 5.54% and 2.39% by the i.p. route, respectively (Table 2).

[niner]

There are two phases to the pharmacokinetics of C60-oo; a rapid clearance phase and a slow clearance phase. The measurement at day 1 was looking at the effects of the rapid clearance phase. Liver and spleen are highly exposed to blood, and would be expected to have more C60 early on, but it very likely equalizes fairly quickly, on the order of a couple days. The liver protection is due to the antioxidant effect of C60. Carbon Tetrachloride toxicity is due in large part to oxidative damage.

If melamine toxicity is oxidative, then C60 probably would have been protective, if you had been using C60 at the time you ate the melamine candy. I wouldn't expect C60 to help much long after the fact, but chances are that any damage incurred at the time is probably mostly repaired now anyway. The liver regenerates rapidly.

[xtronics]

Can I ask folks to post the dosage of saturated C60-OO they are taking?

I took 10ml the first day - don't notice a thing - which is what I expected. If it does what I think it does - there should be little improvement, mostly a slowing of health decline.

Dosage question: - at 1.7mg/kg - works out to be about 150mg for me - the paper says "reiterated" but does not how often ( I don't think daily as rats are herbivores and would get sick on that much oil? ) .. <time passes> Ok

..we treated the rats daily only during 7 days and weekly during the
&#64257;rst two months, then every two weeks until one control rat died.

That would be 150ml for 7days loading - then 150ml/week (21ml/day) for two months - then 21ml/2weeks - or 11ml/day for a 90kg human. Is this what others calculated?

The high initial loading could make a difference - change the adaption from carbs to lipids.

[Anthony_Loera]

I have a weakness for Reese's Peanut butter Cups...

So... This was just a delicious C60 treat meant just for me... Hahaha

Cheers

A

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[niner]

Can I ask folks to post the dosage of saturated C60-OO they are taking?

Dosage question: - at 1.7mg/kg - works out to be about 150mg for me -

..we treated the rats daily only during 7 days and weekly during the
&#64257;rst two months, then every two weeks until one control rat died.

That would be 150ml for 7days loading - then 150ml/week (21ml/day) for two months - then 21ml/2weeks - or 11ml/day for a 90kg human. Is this what others calculated?

Only one person here has replicated the rat dose exactly, with no scaling; that would be Anthony. For something like this, it's common to use a conversion factor that takes into account the difference between rat and human metabolism, which would scale the rat dose by 1/6. If you do that, each dose would be 150/6 = 25mg. If you want to follow Baati's protocol exactly, then you wouldn't split the dose up into daily doses, but would have a single dose every one or two weeks in the later phases.

However, there's really no reason to believe this is optimal, though it worked pretty good for the rats. I could make an argument that it would be better to take large doses even less frequently.

People here have tried a variety of doses, ranging from as little as 0.5mg/day to 140mg/day. There is absolutely no correlation between dose and "feeling something", at least as far as people have reported here. The minimum dose required is probably less that 1mg/day, so if you take a lot more, you just load up your membranes with C60. That's not a bad thing- it means you don't have to take it for some number of days, weeks, or months, until it finally clears out.

You're assuming that 1ml = 1mg, which is probably not right. Sarah Vaughter says her stuff is 0.9mg/ml, while Carbon says his is 0.8. People who've made their own have often used slightly lower concentrations- I have a batch that's ~0.67mg/ml, for example.