3585 replies to this topic

[david ellis]

Only one person here has replicated the rat dose exactly, with no scaling; that would be Anthony. For something like this, it's common to use a conversion factor that takes into account the difference between rat and human metabolism, which would scale the rat dose by 1/6. If you do that, each dose would be 150/6 = 25mg. If you want to follow Baati's protocol exactly, then you wouldn't split the dose up into daily doses, but would have a single dose every one or two weeks in the later phases.

However, there's really no reason to believe this is optimal, though it worked pretty good for the rats. I could make an argument that it would be better to take large doses even less frequently.

People here have tried a variety of doses, ranging from as little as 0.5mg/day to 140mg/day. There is absolutely no correlation between dose and "feeling something", at least as far as people have reported here. The minimum dose required is probably less that 1mg/day, so if you take a lot more, you just load up your membranes with C60. That's not a bad thing- it means you don't have to take it for some number of days, weeks, or months, until it finally clears out.

You're assuming that 1ml = 1mg, which is probably not right. Sarah Vaughter says her stuff is 0.9mg/ml, while Carbon says his is 0.8. People who've made their own have often used slightly lower concentrations- I have a batch that's ~0.67mg/ml, for example.

Niner, I am guessing that you use the "loading up your membranes" option. Am I right?

[Mind]

As far as we know, no healthy human "C60oo lab rat" has died, right? Some people have been taking it for a few months, it seems. Lends some credibility to the non-toxicity of C60 claimed in a lot of research.

[tintinet]

As far as we know, no healthy human "C60oo lab rat" has died, right? Some people have been taking it for a few months, it seems. Lends some credibility to the non-toxicity of C60 claimed in a lot of research.

You're taking attendance?

[Turnbuckle]

As far as we know, no healthy human "C60oo lab rat" has died, right? Some people have been taking it for a few months, it seems. Lends some credibility to the non-toxicity of C60 claimed in a lot of research.

You're taking attendance?

Exactly. There's no way to know if the lab rats are still alive unless they keep posting.

[Hebbeh]

As far as we know, no healthy human "C60oo lab rat" has died, right? Some people have been taking it for a few months, it seems. Lends some credibility to the non-toxicity of C60 claimed in a lot of research.

You're taking attendance?

Exactly. There's no way to know if the lab rats are still alive unless they keep posting.

Has anybody heard from Metrodorus lately???

[niner]

The minimum dose required is probably less that 1mg/day, so if you take a lot more, you just load up your membranes with C60. That's not a bad thing- it means you don't have to take it for some number of days, weeks, or months, until it finally clears out.

Niner, I am guessing that you use the "loading up your membranes" option. Am I right?

Initially, I was using low daily doses. I'm in the midst of switching to an intermittent dosing schedule that would be more of a loading the membranes option. I need to work out exactly what the schedule will be- I've developed a purely hypothetical concern about daily dosing which I'll bring up in a new thread sometime soon.

[maxwatt]

...
Initially, I was using low daily doses. I'm in the midst of switching to an intermittent dosing schedule that would be more of a loading the membranes option. I need to work out exactly what the schedule will be- I've developed a purely hypothetical concern about daily dosing which I'll bring up in a new thread sometime soon.

An man with one leg was teased abd hounded by the boys in his town, who constantly asked how he lost his leg. Finally, exasperated, he agreed to tell them how he lost the leg "...on one condition: you boys agree to stop following men an to never to ask me about my leg again." The boys agreed and swore an oath. "Okay", the man said, "I'll tell you, but you must never ask me about it again." He paused, leaned forward and said "It was bit off." HE then turned and walked away.

We are waiting for the other shoe to fall from your wooden leg.

[Anthony_Loera]

Well, tonight i am trying C60oo in a watermelon drink along with some snacks...

About your concern niner, i have one of my own. It seems you may start acting (in my case) less like an INTJ that i have been scoring at previous companies for years and more like an ENTP...

Maybe its my perception, but i recently took the myers briggs and noticed some borderline results. Having a good partner that makes you feel like a million bucks probably helps as well.

A

Attached Files

•  uploadfromtaptalk1352081820194.jpg   50.56KB   2 downloads

Edited by Anthony_Loera, 05 November 2012 - 02:38 AM.

[Junk Master]

I know I'm concerned about c60/oo's purported free radical and ROS scavenging effects in blunting adaptive response to physiological stimuli.

If high doses of anti-oxidants can negate training adaptations, then shouldn't c60/oo do so as well?

I'm also concerned that if used on a regular schedule (who's to say how fast it really clears?) c60/oo might lead to overtraining in highly trained athletes, especially if you are a subscriber to the "central governor" theory.

[Logic]

Initially, I was using low daily doses. I'm in the midst of switching to an intermittent dosing schedule that would be more of a loading the membranes option. I need to work out exactly what the schedule will be- I've developed a purely hypothetical concern about daily dosing which I'll bring up in a new thread sometime soon.

Hmmm... Turnbuckle mentioned feeling the effects of C60oo wane after continious dosing for a week.
I think I may be experiencing a similar effect.
I look forward to your new thread and his input Niner.

[randomaxion]

I know I'm concerned about c60/oo's purported free radical and ROS scavenging effects in blunting adaptive response to physiological stimuli.

If high doses of anti-oxidants can negate training adaptations, then shouldn't c60/oo do so as well?

I'm also concerned that if used on a regular schedule (who's to say how fast it really clears?) c60/oo might lead to overtraining in highly trained athletes, especially if you are a subscriber to the "central governor" theory.

I'm new, so I cant link to the post I'm referencing here. But a friend of mine who is an athlete of the multi-discipline variety, (29, slightly above average weight) after reading a post here that has now been, ah, re-worded, mixed c60 with another oil he saw mentioned in the post. An oil that has had its anti-cancer properties known since, oh 1970ish, and one can easily get in certain US states.

So that out of the way, he was worried about cancer. What he actually found when he took a weekly dosage, was that after a one day hangover period, he had increased his dexterity, mental focus, and started to heal some nerve damage from previous injuries. He also reports increased stamina. Jury is still out on the cancer.

Now, I realize this is not a c60-oo anecdote, but it is a c60+oil anecdote.

[Logic]

I'm new, so I cant link to the post I'm referencing here. But a friend of mine who is an athlete of the multi-discipline variety, (29, slightly above average weight) after reading a post here that has now been, ah, re-worded, mixed c60 with another oil he saw mentioned in the post. An oil that has had its anti-cancer properties known since, oh 1970ish, and one can easily get in certain US states.

So that out of the way, he was worried about cancer. What he actually found when he took a weekly dosage, was that after a one day hangover period, he had increased his dexterity, mental focus, and started to heal some nerve damage from previous injuries. He also reports increased stamina. Jury is still out on the cancer.

Now, I realize this is not a c60-oo anecdote, but it is a c60+oil anecdote.

Ah yes... There was a post about a guy who started growing taller again from a supp combo when I 1st found this forum. Its no-where to be found any more...?

If you are looking for some attention and 'please tell' before divulging the oil type; here it is!
If the plan is commercial gain; Im curious to hear how you plan to achieve that without divulging the oil type??

[niner]

He paused, leaned forward and said "It was bit off." HE then turned and walked away.

We are waiting for the other shoe to fall from your wooden leg.

This parable has moved me to action. Here is the new thread. (continuous dosing may be a shark attractant...)

[Turnbuckle]

I'm new, so I cant link to the post I'm referencing here. But a friend of mine who is an athlete of the multi-discipline variety, (29, slightly above average weight) after reading a post here that has now been, ah, re-worded, mixed c60 with another oil he saw mentioned in the post. An oil that has had its anti-cancer properties known since, oh 1970ish, and one can easily get in certain US states.

You're saying that it was in a post here but was edited out? That seems unlikely as the window for editing posts is very short. Seems more likely that you will soon tell us about an oil that you, ah, are selling.

[kenj]

Ah.

[mikey]

Initially, I was using low daily doses. I'm in the midst of switching to an intermittent dosing schedule that would be more of a loading the membranes option. I need to work out exactly what the schedule will be- I've developed a purely hypothetical concern about daily dosing which I'll bring up in a new thread sometime soon.

Hmmm... Turnbuckle mentioned feeling the effects of C60oo wane after continious dosing for a week.
I think I may be experiencing a similar effect.
I look forward to your new thread and his input Niner.

I"m curious as to what you perceive as it "waning."

Please elaborate.

[Mind]

Initially, I was using low daily doses. I'm in the midst of switching to an intermittent dosing schedule that would be more of a loading the membranes option. I need to work out exactly what the schedule will be- I've developed a purely hypothetical concern about daily dosing which I'll bring up in a new thread sometime soon.

Hmmm... Turnbuckle mentioned feeling the effects of C60oo wane after continious dosing for a week.
I think I may be experiencing a similar effect.
I look forward to your new thread and his input Niner.

I"m curious as to what you perceive as it "waning."

Please elaborate.

I am not taking C60oo, so I am just opening my mouth where it doesn't belong....again. I would say it is just adaptation. People who have a crappy diet, that suddenly start eating nutritious, most often talk about how awesome they feel right away. The "feeling wanes" over time, because you get used to the "new normal". In the case of drugs, many people get the "high/great" feeling right away, but then what happens/ The mind adjusts to the new feeling the "new normal" and you have to take more to experience the same feeling.

If C60oo improves mito function, then there will probably be a subjective "feeling" in the body (possibly proven objective with further research). I would not expect a person to feel the "feeling" into the future because your brain adapts to it. If C60oo made you feel great everyday forever into the future, it would be in a class of substances all on its own in the history of human health.

Edited by Mind, 07 November 2012 - 06:50 PM.

[mikey]

I'm new, so I cant link to the post I'm referencing here. But a friend of mine who is an athlete of the multi-discipline variety, (29, slightly above average weight) after reading a post here that has now been, ah, re-worded, mixed c60 with another oil he saw mentioned in the post. An oil that has had its anti-cancer properties known since, oh 1970ish, and one can easily get in certain US states.

So that out of the way, he was worried about cancer. What he actually found when he took a weekly dosage, was that after a one day hangover period, he had increased his dexterity, mental focus, and started to heal some nerve damage from previous injuries. He also reports increased stamina. Jury is still out on the cancer.

Now, I realize this is not a c60-oo anecdote, but it is a c60+oil anecdote.

Ah yes... There was a post about a guy who started growing taller again from a supp combo when I 1st found this forum. Its no-where to be found any more...?

If you are looking for some attention and 'please tell' before divulging the oil type; here it is!
If the plan is commercial gain; Im curious to hear how you plan to achieve that without divulging the oil type??

Sounds like one of these: shark liver oil, coconut oil or apricot kernel oil. I can't believe it's flax seed oil.

[JamesNV]

It is pretty clearly a hemp related oil........

Edited by JamesNV, 06 November 2012 - 10:38 AM.

[pleb]

Initially, I was using low daily doses. I'm in the midst of switching to an intermittent dosing schedule that would be more of a loading the membranes option. I need to work out exactly what the schedule will be- I've developed a purely hypothetical concern about daily dosing which I'll bring up in a new thread sometime soon.

Hmmm... Turnbuckle mentioned feeling the effects of C60oo wane after continious dosing for a week.
I think I may be experiencing a similar effect.
I look forward to your new thread and his input Niner.

I"m curious as to what you perceive as it "waning."

Please elaborate.

I am not taking C60oo, so I am just opening my mouth where it doesn't belong....again. I would say it is just adaptation. People who have a crappy diet, that suddenly start eating nutritious, most often talk about how awesome they feel right away. The "feeling wanes" over time, because you get used to the "new normal". In the case of drugs, many people get the "high/great" feeling right away, but then what happens/ The mind adjusts to the new feeling the "new normal" and you have to take more to experience the same feeling.

If C60oo improves mito function, then there will probably be a subjective "feeling" in the body (possibly proven objective with further research). would not expect one to feel the "feeling" into the future because your brain adapts to it. If C60oo made you feel great everyday forever into the future, it would be in a class of substances all on its own in the history of human health.

i am taking it and have the same feelings as Mind regarding the idea that you don't have to feel a rush or buzz every time you take it,
i had intended posting the same sentiments earlier but he beat me to it and probably much more eloquently,
initially the feeling and changes early on as it takes effect then a levelling out as it works away in the background,

[Chopperboy]

I think the reason the mice lived longer is that they were asleep for half their lives!
I seem to sleep for up to 10-11 hours now with these vivid technicolour movie like dreams.
Before, if I woke up i often couldn't get back to sleep - now whatever I was thinking about becomes the start of the next movie dream.

[niner]

A lot of people are reporting more vivid dreams. That's not something I'm seeing, and I'm not sleeping any more or less, as far as I can tell. Chopperboy, how much are you taking?

[pleb]

I had the opposite i had insomnia for years, started C60 oo from SV and within about 4 or 5 days fell asleep within 10 or 15 minutes and just blackness for 6 or 7 hours,

a month later started Epitalon and found it interfered with the previous sleep pattern i had established so now take the C60 at night and Epitalon first thing in the morning,

[xtronics]

IMO it is rather silly to expect to feel something from C60-OO - It appears likely to be a membrane antiox - ( membranes are where the action is in mitocondria - what separates the protons that get pumped to the other side. Where, if things go wrong., ROS get produced. ) The inside of membranes are made of lipids - C60 is lipophilic and may not have much reason to leave once in the membrane walls.

Other - so called antiox ( so called as there is no accepted definition of what an antiox is - most are defined by food storage anti-ox - some which become pro oxidants in-vivo. See Edwin Frankel's book Antioxidants in Food and Biology, Facts and Fiction for some details. ) don't seem to want to stay in membranes. (BTW vit C - considered to be an anti-ox can act as a pro-ox at high dosages - possibly fueling fenton reactions as an electron donor. ) The standard tests for being an antiox are for food storage - NOT in-vivo or where it counts.

I've been taking 10ml/day and feel nothing - much more interested to see the results of markers on my next blood test - Lp(a), CRP oxLDL IL-6 IL-8 etc.. If I was feeling something, I would be worried that it was toxic.

[Logic]

I"m curious as to what you perceive as it "waning."

Please elaborate.

After reading the other posts here and some introspection I think it is just me getting used to the feeling of slower breathing, increased exercise capacity, better memory and thinking ability and general wellbeing.
There has been no drop off in these on average.

I do however worry that old Mitos are not dying off and being replaced as they should be?
This is a point that Turnbuckle brought up, along with a synergy between C60oo and PQQ.
Id love to have more insight and opinion on this hypothesis?

[AdamI]

I think I got all that as well Logic but then I take some other stuff to lately... I do sleep alot less, and can manage with ease throughout the day even though I only sleept for 4 hours, mainly I sleep a maximum off 6 hours, now after I started with oo C60
Before I guess 8-9

[Mind]

If it helps people sleep, I might have to start taking the stuff!

[mikey]

I"m curious as to what you perceive as it "waning."

Please elaborate.

After reading the other posts here and some introspection I think it is just me getting used to the feeling of slower breathing, increased exercise capacity, better memory and thinking ability and general wellbeing.
There has been no drop off in these on average.

I do however worry that old Mitos are not dying off and being replaced as they should be?
This is a point that Turnbuckle brought up, along with a synergy between C60oo and PQQ.
Id love to have more insight and opinion on this hypothesis?

Well, a differing thought is that since Fathi said in his interview that C60 is not at all toxic - that the notion that there is some kind of harm to mitos, which is a type of toxicity, is contrary to what he said.

When a dietary supplement with anti-aging properties is known to produce no toxicity I tend to take high doses of it, as with the tocotrienols that grew hair on my head and later darkened it. I take four a day rather than 1 or 2, as the label directs. Since it's a strong anti-prostate cancer nutrient, with good effects on blood lipids, the more the better, for anti-aging purposes, the great majority of the time - up to a point of diminishing returns.

I'm seeing efforts to find the least amount of C60 that works, which, to me is like finding the RDA for a vitamin. Thousands of published studies show that RDA levels of vitamins do not produce optimal effects. They are just subsistence levels, survival levels where one doesn't get nutrient deficiency diseases. They are not optimal levels where anti-aging effects occur.

For nutrients and, really, for everything we consume, there is an optimal dosing range

Therefore, since C60 is non-toxic it seems that finding a lowest working dose would be counter to the goal of utilizing its optimal life-extension effects.

I hear very intelligent people here reporting subjective feelings of benefits when they take breaks from C60oo, so I'm definitely interested in that notion, even though it is contrary to Fathi's statement.

But the counterpoint is that since it's non-toxic, isn't it more logical to err on the side of saturation rather than find the lowest dose that does something?

[Chopperboy]

A lot of people are reporting more vivid dreams. That's not something I'm seeing, and I'm not sleeping any more or less, as far as I can tell. Chopperboy, how much are you taking?

As per SV's instructions 2 half shots = 1 full pipette per day.
I am super sensitive to supplements though.

[Chopperboy]

I had the opposite i had insomnia for years, started C60 oo from SV and within about 4 or 5 days fell asleep within 10 or 15 minutes and just blackness for 6 or 7 hours,

a month later started Epitalon and found it interfered with the previous sleep pattern i had established so now take the C60 at night and Epitalon first thing in the morning,

When I am not dreaming I get the black in a comma thing - but I had put that down to sleep hypnotism [Eddini Youtube] which I have been doing every 6 weeks for about a year now. BTW my answer to insomnia is hypnotism, C60, Jujube and melatonin in that order.

Edited by Chopperboy, 08 November 2012 - 10:14 AM.