3585 replies to this topic

[SearchingForAnswers]

A couple of other things - I've noticed the the Paroxetine seems to be losing effectiveness. It feels as though it isn't working as well, or its clearing out of my system faster.
Also, muscle tone seems improved. I haven't been to the gym in a couple of weeks, however it feels as though I'm almost pumped like I've gone to the gym.

Or perhaps it's all hopelessly psychosomatic... time will tell.

[tintinet]

Just OO effects:

Olive Oil
"The main factor responsible for aging, wrinkly skin is ultraviolet radiation, or skin photoaging. A French study on 1,264 women and 1,655 men suggests that the monounsaturated fatty acid in olive oil is protective against severe photoaging. Photodamage, including blotchy pigmentation, wrinkling and skin sagging, is mainly caused by the production of reactive oxygen species (ROS) in response to sun exposure. This study suggests that olive oil in the diet increases the ability of the skin to resist damage caused by UV radiation."
ABC

[mikey]

It might not be much worse than all the crap Ive already been exposed to. Maybe it will fix some of it.

 

Risking getting another demerit from those who think that C60 can cause some kind of cytotoxicity, I'll assert that as a 60 year-old who has taken 7 mg of C60oo every morning (except for a week when I ran out) it has done nothing but good for me.

 

Hair thicker, wrinkles 1/5th as deep, scars on my face have faded to invisibility. 

I'm told, "If you died your hair, you'd look 40." 

 

I agree with Professor Fathi Moussa, the lead researcher of the study that showed nearly double the lifespan of Wistar rats when he said that C60 is "absolutely not toxic" "even taken long term" in the video interview that one can view on http://c60.net/ 

 

He's been studying it for 18 years, so that makes me tend to believe him, as he is a world authority.

 

It's safer than milk, which was shown to kill 155 babies, whose mother's breast milk contained dangerous drugs, according to the annual report of the American Association of Poison Control Centers.

[mikey]

 

can anyone explain to me why c60 has the same effect on me as taking anavar, 100 mg/day, but without the side effects? after three weeks of c60, my body is shredded to the max and the increase in my physical strength is just ridiculous. i'm 32 years old, 186 cm tall and i weigh 81 kgs. thanks.

You should have said that Anavar is an anabolic steroid. As for C60, the improved fat tissue burning comes from enhanced mitochondrial function. I experienced the same. About strength, it is more ATF produce. By the way Anavar is a mild steroid, so, it should not have had side effects.

 

 

Anavar, like all oral 17-alpha alkylated steroids, increases postheparin hepatic lipase, and so studies show reductions in subq abdominal and visceral fat.

 

As to side effects, it causes inversion of HDL and LDL, which predicts cardiovascular risk.

 

So you build some muscle, lose some fat and your arteries suffer.

Edited by mikey, 14 April 2014 - 02:48 AM.

[niner]

I agree with Professor Fathi Moussa, the lead researcher of the study that showed nearly double the lifespan of Wistar rats when he said that C60 is "absolutely not toxic" "even taken long term" in the video interview that one can view on http://c60.net/

Well, yeah, and if I thought it was dangerous, I wouldn't be taking it, but to be fair, wouldn't this technically be true only if you are a Wistar Rat? Moussa has never studied it in humans. Rats are a lot closer to us than are flies or worms, but they are still rodentia...

[mikey]

 

I agree with Professor Fathi Moussa, the lead researcher of the study that showed nearly double the lifespan of Wistar rats when he said that C60 is "absolutely not toxic" "even taken long term" in the video interview that one can view on http://c60.net/

Well, yeah, and if I thought it was dangerous, I wouldn't be taking it, but to be fair, wouldn't this technically be true only if you are a Wistar Rat? Moussa has never studied it in humans. Rats are a lot closer to us than are flies or worms, but they are still rodentia...

 

 

And Moussa said that he wasn't taking it.

 

So, you prudently point at the risk. But how do you rate the risk?

 

I guesstimate it as .01%.

 

The only negative effect that I've perceived is that it greatly increases my tolerance for alcohol, so I can't get that nice warm buzz without taking in too many calories.

[YOLF]

Just a reminder. The up and down voting arrows are for a post's content rather than to show your opinion. If you've been voting based on opinions, please stop.

[Kevnzworld]

 
And Moussa said that he wasn't taking it. 
So, you prudently point at the risk. But how do you rate the risk?
I guesstimate it as .01%.
The only negative effect that I've perceived is that it greatly increases my tolerance for alcohol, so I can't get that nice warm buzz without taking in too many calories.

There is no way to gauge the longer term risks to humans, or the benefits. Those of us that choose to take C60 are human guinea pigs, lab rats.
We await further studies and or confirmation of the Baati study, until then?

[mikey]

 

 
And Moussa said that he wasn't taking it. 
So, you prudently point at the risk. But how do you rate the risk?
I guesstimate it as .01%.
The only negative effect that I've perceived is that it greatly increases my tolerance for alcohol, so I can't get that nice warm buzz without taking in too many calories.

There is no way to gauge the longer term risks to humans, or the benefits. Those of us that choose to take C60 are human guinea pigs, lab rats.
We await further studies and or confirmation of the Baati study, until then?

 

 

True about inability to gauge risks. However, the benefits have been noted by several of us.

 

Turnbuckle and I growing more hair, his being able to run 4 miles again after suffering statin damage that made running 100 yards feel like he ran a marathon, scars fading for both he and I, dogs that couldn't jump into a car's back seating finding it easy, my wrinkles proven by photos to be 1/5th as deep or gone, chaps noting improvements in lifting weights and such. There are a long list of anecdotal benefits, and not just by one person, but by multiple people saying the same things.

 

Then there are those who say they experience problems when they take C60oo every day, who don't when they take it intermittently.

 

And those, like me, who experience no problems other than I can't get buzzed from alcohol.

 

So far the anecdotal benefits seem to far outweigh reports of risks.

[platypus]

 

True about inability to gauge risks. However, the benefits have been noted by several of us.

 

Turnbuckle and I growing more hair, his being able to run 4 miles again after suffering statin damage that made running 100 yards feel like he ran a marathon, scars fading for both he and I, dogs that couldn't jump into a car's back seating finding it easy, my wrinkles proven by photos to be 1/5th as deep or gone, chaps noting improvements in lifting weights and such. There are a long list of anecdotal benefits, and not just by one person, but by multiple people saying the same things.

 

Then there are those who say they experience problems when they take C60oo every day, who don't when they take it intermittently.

 

And those, like me, who experience no problems other than I can't get buzzed from alcohol.

 

So far the anecdotal benefits seem to far outweigh reports of risks.

 

Very interesting mikey, thanks. Can you tell us more about extra hair-growth & reduction in wrinkles? 

 

BTW, many steroids have very beneficial effects in the short/medium term, which does not mean that they will increase longevity. 

[mikey]

 

 

True about inability to gauge risks. However, the benefits have been noted by several of us.

 

Turnbuckle and I growing more hair, his being able to run 4 miles again after suffering statin damage that made running 100 yards feel like he ran a marathon, scars fading for both he and I, dogs that couldn't jump into a car's back seating finding it easy, my wrinkles proven by photos to be 1/5th as deep or gone, chaps noting improvements in lifting weights and such. There are a long list of anecdotal benefits, and not just by one person, but by multiple people saying the same things.

 

Then there are those who say they experience problems when they take C60oo every day, who don't when they take it intermittently.

 

And those, like me, who experience no problems other than I can't get buzzed from alcohol.

 

So far the anecdotal benefits seem to far outweigh reports of risks.

 

Very interesting mikey, thanks. Can you tell us more about extra hair-growth & reduction in wrinkles? 

 

BTW, many steroids have very beneficial effects in the short/medium term, which does not mean that they will increase longevity. 

 

 

Yes, early on Turnbuckle, who remains one of the most intelligent contributors, noted that the crown of his head that was bald was filling in with hair. He noted a study showing this hair-growing effect  with rats. http://www.ncbi.nlm....pubmed/19223242

 

As has happened several times, he said it and then I noticed it happening to me. My hair appeared thicker and seemed to darken slightly over some months.

 

Then he noted scars fading. I noticed the same, but also it was clear that wrinkles that had begun to form around my eyes had faded. A photo of me from April, 2011 compared to a photo of me in July, 2013 showed this clearly AND people who know me and hadn't seen me in a while or people I just met said things like, "If you died your hair, you'd look 40." or "You look younger than the last time I saw you." I'll be 61 in May. I simply don't have much as far as wrinkles on my face.

 

As a super-potent antioxidant, with something like 170 - 280 times more antioxidant potential than vitamin C, C60 appears to enhance the "health" - maybe regenerative ability of elastin and collagen in skin. If we can remove the damage of free-radicals, which C60 appears to do, then skin elastin and collagen can regenerate without the assault of free-radicals contributing to aging. Just a theory.

 

Anabolic steroids do have a "youth-promoting" cosmetic effect, but there is no question that oral 17-alpha alkylated steroids increase cardiovascular risk by their effects on HDL/LDL, where beta-esterified testosterone (in oil) or sublingual or transdermal CAN improve health for those that are deficient if administered with intelligence.

 

The problem with testosterone replacement therapies is that they don't mimic the diurnal (natural) ebb and flow of natural daily testosterone production. Administration should attempt to replicate the natural daily ebb and flow. Rather most methods of T administration do not in any manner come close to replicating the normal pattern.

[hav]

Fwiw, I got a haircut the other day, and besides my wife commenting how it looked like I got my ears lowered and my face enlarged, she mentioned that my hair looked a little thicker on the back of my head.  Its not something I can see in the mirror myself but I understand it usually looks thin there but not bald in exactly the same spot as my dad.  Been taking c60oo a few years now but never got that comment before.  But for the last 3 months or so I also have been applying c60 in jojoba once a week or so to my hair.  So maybe that's where the effect is coming from.  My hair has been slowly greying over the last few years but I don't think c60 has had any effect on that.  Btw, I also have not seen any visible effect to applying c60/jojoba to old scars other than the jojoba makes my skin feel really nice.

 

Howard

 

[mikeinnaples]

Just a reminder. The up and down voting arrows are for a post's content rather than to show your opinion. If you've been voting based on opinions, please stop.

 

I honestly wish you good luck with that. This forum (and nearly every forum everywhere) has a long history of people getting down voted based on opinion.

Edited by mikeinnaples, 14 April 2014 - 07:57 PM.

[Dazzcat]

I've been following c60 for some time now and can't help but notice that it's the older folk on this forum who are most interested in c60. Would it be fair to say that c60's beneficial effects would be more noticeable the older one is?

 

Also would it be considered premature to start to consume this substance at an early age? I'm 30, not too young really, but I plan on trying out c60 with the hope I can at least partly counteract the oxidative stress from previous tobacco use. While my tobacco use accounts to <2 pack years over my entire life, I still have a concern that any powerful anti-oxidant may do more harm than good in those who have undergone some extreme stress from carcinogens. Though on the other hand, c60 being highly lipophilic may have the advantage where it targets the cellular membranes where alot of the tar may also reside in lung tissue, note this is speculation from my very limited understanding of anti-oxidants.

Edited by Dazzcat, 14 April 2014 - 10:50 PM.

[mikey]

I've been following c60 for some time now and can't help but notice that it's the older folk on this forum who are most interested in c60. Would it be fair to say that c60's beneficial effects would be more noticeable the older one is?

 

Also would it be considered premature to start to consume this substance at an early age? I'm 30, not too young really, but I plan on trying out c60 with the hope I can at least partly counteract the oxidative stress from previous tobacco use. While my tobacco use accounts to <2 pack years over my entire life, I still have a concern that any powerful anti-oxidant may do more harm than good in those who have undergone some extreme stress from carcinogens. Though on the other hand, c60 being highly lipophilic may have the advantage where it targets the cellular membranes where alot of the tar may also reside in lung tissue, note this is speculation from my very limited understanding of anti-oxidants.

 

I wish that I had started taking it in my 20's. I believe that taking it at a younger age would keep one younger than their peers going forward, by far.

 

It doesn't solve all health concerns, but it certainly solves more than any other single compound that I'm aware of.

 

If a young person started taking it and adhered to an optimal diet with smart exercise it seems likely that they might live incredibly long and healthy.

 

Moussa said that they had passed a study design on to an American research team that would keep giving the rats C60 indefinitely to see how long they live. Maybe they will never die.

 

One problem is that C60 doesn't resolve cardiovascular issues. It doesn't change blood pressure, or lipids.

 

So it might be anti-cancer, grow hair, reduce risk of Alzheimer's and other such anti-aging effects, but both Turnbuckle and I have noted no seeming change in cardiovascular parameters.

 

So diet is important, because damage to the cardiovascular system is mostly caused by what one consumes - or smokes.

 

The typical American is grossly deficient in some important nutrients, such as vitamin K2 (MK-7 and 4), which is one reason we have higher rates of cardiovascular disease than countries that feed their beef grass, rather than corn.

 

I think the French Paradox has more to do with the high amounts of vitamin K2 that the French get than the red wine.

 

The lowest level of cardiovascular disease in France is in the Perigord, the region where they produce Foie Gras, which is one of the richest sources of vitamin K2, I think second only to Japan's natto.

 

Only about five percent of the beef and dairy here in the US are grass-fed - fully pasture-raised. That's the likely reason that Harvard researchers published a study that showed that a 3 oz serving of beef a day predicted more cardiovascular disease, cancers and a shorter lifespan. They were looking at the average American, 95% of which eat grain-fed beef.

 

I only eat fully grass-fed beef or butter, if I eat it.

 

Here's the link to an interesting perspective on why Harvard's team found such dire associations with CVD, cancers and a shorter lifespan - 

http://www.michaelmo...MeatandDie.html

 

The rest of an optimal, heart-healthy diet is relatively obvious.

 

Eat foods with the highest Nutrient Density Score, meaning the foods that give us the least calories with the most nutrients and fiber.

 

Therefore, grains are gone or strictly limited.

 

So, if you're young you have incredible options for longevity. You just have to make the right choices.

[smithx]

Just one cautionary remark which needs to be said again:

 

 

If a little of something is good, that does not imply that a lot of it is better.

 

 

It may very well be that taking 7mg a day of C60oo for some period of time is very beneficial and produces all kinds of wonderful benefits.

 

It may also very well be that taking 7mg a day for a longer period of time is very detrimental and causes all kinds of damage.

 

We know that C60 is a very potent molecule. We don't know if there is an overdose level of it or what could happen at an overdose level.

 

I am concerned that 7mg/day for a long period of time could very well be an overdose level.

 

I have to return to the story of Eben Byers who thought that radium water was doing wonderful things for him, so he kept on taking more of it until it killed him. He's the man about whom the Wall Street Journal said "The Radium Water Worked Fine until His Jaw Came Off".

http://en.wikipedia....wiki/Eben_Byers

 

Until we know more, caution is prudent with a powerful molecule like C60.

 

 

[Turnbuckle]

 

 

I agree with Professor Fathi Moussa, the lead researcher of the study that showed nearly double the lifespan of Wistar rats when he said that C60 is "absolutely not toxic" "even taken long term" in the video interview that one can view on http://c60.net/

 

He's been studying it for 18 years, so that makes me tend to believe him, as he is a world authority.

 

 

 

 

We had this discussion a few months ago, and this was my response. In summary, Moussa says that "pristine C60 has no acute or sub-acute toxicity in a large variety of living organisms," but that  "some C60 derivatives can be highly toxic. Furthermore, under light exposure, C60 is an efficient singlet oxygen sensitizer."

 

I haven't seen the interview you quoted from, but this "absolutely not toxic" appears to refer only to C60, not to C60 with adducts and not to C60 in sunlight. 

[niner]

I haven't seen the interview you quoted from, but this "absolutely not toxic" appears to refer only to C60, not to C60 with adducts and not to C60 in sunlight.

 

It was Anthony Loera's interview of Moussa, the one on c60.net with the crazy legal restrictions that caused me to never watch it.  Mikey linked it above, although maybe you didn't watch it for the same reason I didn't.  I think they were talking about c60-oo, although as I noted above, that would only be true if you're a Wistar rat...

[Turnbuckle]

 

I haven't seen the interview you quoted from, but this "absolutely not toxic" appears to refer only to C60, not to C60 with adducts and not to C60 in sunlight.

 

It was Anthony Loera's interview of Moussa, the one on c60.net with the crazy legal restrictions that caused me to never watch it.  Mikey linked it above, although maybe you didn't watch it for the same reason I didn't.  I think they were talking about c60-oo, although as I noted above, that would only be true if you're a Wistar rat...

 

 

Yeah, I didn't watch the interview for the same reason you didn't. But I give greater credence to what Moussa wrote in a peer-reviewed paper than what he might have said in an interview. And if he said that C60 was non-toxic, that is what he says in his papers, even though some are generalizing that to C60 in olive oil. If he actually said anything to indicate that C60 in olive oil was "absolutely non toxic," no one has yet quoted it.

[to age or not to age]

niner, it's funny you said that about Anthony and his clip.  I have known him a bit since 2007, and have detected

a change in his tone.  

[malbecman]

 He did megadose on the C60 for awhile there if I recall correctly.....

[mikey]

Just one cautionary remark which needs to be said again:

 

 

If a little of something is good, that does not imply that a lot of it is better.

 

 

It may very well be that taking 7mg a day of C60oo for some period of time is very beneficial and produces all kinds of wonderful benefits.

 

It may also very well be that taking 7mg a day for a longer period of time is very detrimental and causes all kinds of damage.

 

We know that C60 is a very potent molecule. We don't know if there is an overdose level of it or what could happen at an overdose level.

 

I am concerned that 7mg/day for a long period of time could very well be an overdose level.

 

I have to return to the story of Eben Byers who thought that radium water was doing wonderful things for him, so he kept on taking more of it until it killed him. He's the man about whom the Wall Street Journal said "The Radium Water Worked Fine until His Jaw Came Off".

http://en.wikipedia....wiki/Eben_Byers

 

Until we know more, caution is prudent with a powerful molecule like C60.

 

 

 

Yes. It's true that there are a lot of things that we don't know. And prudence is a good thing.

 

There are also things that have a high probability of being true.

 

When Moussa said that C60 was "...absolutely not toxic...", and I'm sure that he was referring to C60 as used in the rat study, because it was during Anthony's interview with him about the study, he appeared to be very clear about his use of the words.

 

So, the contrary question is what do you base your notion that "7 mg/day for a long period of time could very well be an overdose level."

 

I find no data to support that notion.

 

Do you have supportive data?

 

Not to be rude, but really, what do you base your notion on?

 

 

 

I agree with Professor Fathi Moussa, the lead researcher of the study that showed nearly double the lifespan of Wistar rats when he said that C60 is "absolutely not toxic" "even taken long term" in the video interview that one can view on http://c60.net/

 

He's been studying it for 18 years, so that makes me tend to believe him, as he is a world authority.

 

 

 

 

We had this discussion a few months ago, and this was my response. In summary, Moussa says that "pristine C60 has no acute or sub-acute toxicity in a large variety of living organisms," but that  "some C60 derivatives can be highly toxic. Furthermore, under light exposure, C60 is an efficient singlet oxygen sensitizer."

 

I haven't seen the interview you quoted from, but this "absolutely not toxic" appears to refer only to C60, not to C60 with adducts and not to C60 in sunlight. 

 

 

I will clarify. I only consider C60 mixed in olive oil, exactly as in the study to be consumable.

 

And that's the only version that I'm referring to.

 

I've seen the data on its potential for toxicity, but how does not apply to C60oo?

[Turnbuckle]

http://www.landesbio...3ChanMoussa.pdf

 

The above paper should clarify Moussa's thoughts about the toxicity of C60. It’s the full text of the chapter abstract I linked to previously.

 

[mikey]

 

I haven't seen the interview you quoted from, but this "absolutely not toxic" appears to refer only to C60, not to C60 with adducts and not to C60 in sunlight.

 

It was Anthony Loera's interview of Moussa, the one on c60.net with the crazy legal restrictions that caused me to never watch it.  Mikey linked it above, although maybe you didn't watch it for the same reason I didn't.  I think they were talking about c60-oo, although as I noted above, that would only be true if you're a Wistar rat...

 

 

Well, how can one form an opinion without considering all options, Niner?

 

Watching Moussa in that video was quite interesting, as he is obviously very detail oriented and clear about what he says. Highly recommended.

 

I believe that I'm fairly good at reading people and he reads easily.

 

I figure that if I'm taking considerably less (28%) than the human bioequivalent (1/6) dose that was given to the rats, that was shown to be completely without toxicity AND nearly double their lifespans which ended with no cancers, then why not?

 

The risk seems low and the reward, so far, has been the greatest of all the "life-extension" molecules that I've experimented with over the last 46 years.

 

But that's me. I'm a bit of a daredevil, so I wouldn't recommend that anyone do as I do.  I've been taking high dose niacin since I was 14. I like the niacin flush that some people can't stand.

 

To each their own.

[mikey]

 

http://www.landesbio...3ChanMoussa.pdf

 

The above paper should clarify Moussa's thoughts about the toxicity of C60. It’s the full text of the chapter abstract I linked to previously.

 

 

 

Once more, thank you, Turnbuckle.

 

After reading that paper I might increase the dose I take!

 

 

I haven't seen the interview you quoted from, but this "absolutely not toxic" appears to refer only to C60, not to C60 with adducts and not to C60 in sunlight.

 

It was Anthony Loera's interview of Moussa, the one on c60.net with the crazy legal restrictions that caused me to never watch it.  Mikey linked it above, although maybe you didn't watch it for the same reason I didn't.  I think they were talking about c60-oo, although as I noted above, that would only be true if you're a Wistar rat...

 

 

Yeah, I didn't watch the interview for the same reason you didn't. But I give greater credence to what Moussa wrote in a peer-reviewed paper than what he might have said in an interview. And if he said that C60 was non-toxic, that is what he says in his papers, even though some are generalizing that to C60 in olive oil. If he actually said anything to indicate that C60 in olive oil was "absolutely non toxic," no one has yet quoted it.

 

 

Well, then, please watch that video. 

 

I am quoting him.

 

Because not only did he say that "C60 is absolutely not toxic" but later in the video he reiterated it and added words to the effect "even taken long term."

Edited by mikey, 16 April 2014 - 05:15 AM.

[smithx]

Moussa seems to be a serious researcher, but a statement like "C60 is absolutely not toxic" "even taken long term"  is just irresponsible based on the amount of data we have so far (or rather, the lack thereof).

 

And no, I don't have any data to show that 7mg/day taken every day for 20 years is toxic. The point is that this is a very powerful molecule and it very well could end up having a narrow therapeutic window.

 

It's probably much more prudent to stop while you're ahead rather than to continue with massive doses indefinitely.

[mikey]

Moussa seems to be a serious researcher, but a statement like "C60 is absolutely not toxic" "even taken long term"  is just irresponsible based on the amount of data we have so far (or rather, the lack thereof).

 

And no, I don't have any data to show that 7mg/day taken every day for 20 years is toxic. The point is that this is a very powerful molecule and it very well could end up having a narrow therapeutic window.

 

It's probably much more prudent to stop while you're ahead rather than to continue with massive doses indefinitely.

 

Haha. You should know me better than that, smithx.

 

First, I'm taking 28% of the 6 to 1 bioequivalent human dose - compared to rats - for my bodyweight. I would be taking 25 mg if I took the bioequivalent dose.

 

So, I'm taking far less than Moussa showed has absolutely no toxicity when given to Wistar rats.

 

Unless someone actually has some solid data to refute the solid data that exists, it's not prudent to abstain from using C60oo.

 

Prudence is to take advantage of the most potent anti-aging antioxidant (protective) molecule known to science and even reverse some of the effects of aging and maybe extend one's lifespan. 

 

I'm definitely raising the dose, based on the great read that Turnbuckle presented earlier.

 

It might do even more than it's done for me so far!

[platypus]

It is a risk as the might be epigenetic effects that affect one's offspring. I guess it would be prudent not to be on C60 if trying to conceive?

[Logic]

It is a risk as the might be epigenetic effects that affect one's offspring. I guess it would be prudent not to be on C60 if trying to conceive?

 

http://www.longecity...ndpost&p=654858

 

From the above it seems that C60oo may be a good idea for woman having trouble conceiving..!??

[steelheader]

I'm 77 and have been taking taking C60oo for six weeks.  I started at a rate of 15mg every two weeks but am switching to 15mg every 10-12 days because the effect appears to wear off at about that time.  When the effect is wearing off I experience energy loss, back pain, and my life becomes less pleasant.  All of which vanish within an hour of taking another dose.

 

Overall I have nothing novel to report.  My experience with exercise and conditioning, energy level, sense of wellbeing, etc., has been similar to that most posters have reported.

 

My sexual activity has continued to be good for my age but with no change.

 

There has been no change in baldness, turkey neck, or wrinkles. :-)

 

My only concern about C60 is that I appear to have become dependent on it.   Has anybody else experienced a sense of dependency on C60?