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NSI-189

nsi-189

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#1171 gnappi

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Posted 21 August 2013 - 03:16 PM

Headaches are not in the brain, they are on the outside of the skull - usually in the muscle tissue. The brain does not feel pain.


um no. They are not outside the skull. That is ridiculous. It is true brain tissue itself does not have pain receptors but the nerves, arteries, veins, and other supporting structures do have pain receptors and those supporting structures within the brain are the source of headaches.

Headaches are not in the brain, they are on the outside of the skull - usually in the muscle tissue. The brain does not feel pain.

But feel pressure. Thus, this may be an indication of the growth of intracranial structures such as the hippocampus, for example. What strengthens the argument is the location of that pressure, which coincides with the hippocampus.


I was getting headaches by the second day. The brain can't possibly grow that fast. The headaches and feeling of pressure is not from growth. It's more like a mild nagging hangover.....but not quite.

The growth may begin with the increase of blood circulation at the site and a higher fluid retention in the tissue, for example. Only after the cells begin to multiply and differentiate.


True. Actually probably the case. I was just thinking about the hangover analogy and the dilation of veins and arteries are the source of most hangover headache. I believe that could be the source of these headaches...dilation of arteries and veins...maybe.

Quite possible. A way of knowing this would be making a brain PET Scan before and other after the start of the use of NSI-189.

#1172 Hebbeh

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Posted 21 August 2013 - 04:11 PM

Another thing I've noticed the past couple days and more so today is my neck feels a little tight with tension....a sure sign of excessive acetylcholine.

I've also noticed my appetite has increased and I feel the need for more carbs...for a very long time I've ate a strict diet that is moderate to lower carb and recently I feel the need to increase carbs as if I have a hint of low blood sugar...it seems my carb metabolism has increased.

Have another headache this morning that is hanging on and does feel like a mild hangover....although I haven't experienced one of those in a very long time.

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#1173 sunshinefrost

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Posted 21 August 2013 - 04:33 PM

Another thing I've noticed the past couple days and more so today is my neck feels a little tight with tension....a sure sign of excessive acetylcholine.

I've also noticed my appetite has increased and I feel the need for more carbs...for a very long time I've ate a strict diet that is moderate to lower carb and recently I feel the need to increase carbs as if I have a hint of low blood sugar...it seems my carb metabolism has increased.

Have another headache this morning that is hanging on and does feel like a mild hangover....although I haven't experienced one of those in a very long time.


I too have the headache but its very mild and i welcome it as a sign that neurogenesis is happening. Nsi has a noticable boosting effect that is driving the brain... Feels like its jolting the beta brainwaves... Or at least changing something in its bioelectricity. Could this be what's causing headache ? Anybody has an EEG ?

Why is it that i have extra energy on this ? Is the drug is driving neurogenesis because of high neural activity ? Could Some kind of instant hebbian learning be happening and caused by higher electric drive coupled with stem cell caracteristics ?
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#1174 ranza

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Posted 21 August 2013 - 04:39 PM

Quite possible. A way of knowing this would be making a brain PET Scan before and other after the start of the use of NSI-189.


I'll be doing a head and body MRI scans before and after the treatment - for science.
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#1175 cATsE

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Posted 21 August 2013 - 04:41 PM

Another thing I've noticed the past couple days and more so today is my neck feels a little tight with tension....a sure sign of excessive acetylcholine.

I've also noticed my appetite has increased and I feel the need for more carbs...for a very long time I've ate a strict diet that is moderate to lower carb and recently I feel the need to increase carbs as if I have a hint of low blood sugar...it seems my carb metabolism has increased.

Have another headache this morning that is hanging on and does feel like a mild hangover....although I haven't experienced one of those in a very long time.


I too have the headache but its very mild and i welcome it as a sign that neurogenesis is happening. Nsi has a noticable boosting effect that is driving the brain... Feels like its jolting the beta brainwaves... Or at least changing something in its bioelectricity. Could this be what's causing headache ? Anybody has an EEG ?

Why is it that i have extra energy on this ? Is the drug is driving neurogenesis because of high neural activity ? Could Some kind of instant hebbian learning be happening and caused by higher electric drive coupled with stem cell caracteristics ?

Good energy or more like nervousness/anxiety? I must say that these headaches many of you are reporting worry me a bit...

#1176 Hebbeh

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Posted 21 August 2013 - 05:31 PM

Another thought I had in regards to the headaches and possible vascular dilation.....I believe the main MOA of ginkgo is vascular dilation and every time I tried ginkgo I had to stop due to similar headaches.....I'm leaning more and more to vascular dilation as the source of the headaches.

I too am feeling the "speedy" energy and sleeping a little less.....and believe it is due to increased acetylcholine which would also fit some of the other effects.

#1177 Hebbeh

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Posted 21 August 2013 - 05:36 PM

I want to clarify that although the energy has a slight "speedy" component to it, it is more subtle and unlike a stimulant...more like extra acetylcholine IME.

#1178 gnappi

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Posted 21 August 2013 - 07:53 PM

Quite possible. A way of knowing this would be making a brain PET Scan before and other after the start of the use of NSI-189.


I'll be doing a head and body MRI scans before and after the treatment - for science.

Fantastic ranza!!! I can barely wait for the results ... ;)

#1179 sunshinefrost

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Posted 21 August 2013 - 11:47 PM

I just came back from a game of golf. I have to say that i was 110% in the ZONE !! This is easily one of my best games. I could measure distances easily and could also calculate the strength i had to put in the ball. Wether it needed power or finess, my swing way very fluid and it felt right. Golfers will know what i'm talking about when i say that i hit the sweet spot on most of my shots. I really had fun because i was laser focused. Its Unbelievable how i was able to understand the game today.

The car ride from golf to home was equally enjoyable... the music was amazing, the girls were pretty, the sunset was fantastic and i had a thrill just driving my car flawlessly in a fast but calm kinda way. I'm sounding a bit intense right now i realise this... But i think i just stared in the eye of nsi 😎. I think understand it better now and it is definitly a nootropic. This is day 7.... Can't wait to see what this will be in a week.

Edited by sunshinefrost, 21 August 2013 - 11:49 PM.

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#1180 therein

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Posted 22 August 2013 - 03:14 AM

I came back from work. I am on Longecity, Hacker News and Reddit at the same time. I am listening to music and chatting with a couple of friends on Facebook. Music is euphoric, posts are interesting and for some reason I am appreciating the eloquence and the suddenly humorous nature of my internal voice a lot. It is definitely a blissful state. Oh, of course there is this mild headache in the background.
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#1181 rikelme

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Posted 22 August 2013 - 04:46 AM

It is definitely a blissful state.


Exactly how I felt too on days I took the substance. Minus headache. Maybe tiny, barely noticeable pressure behind and above ears. The effects seem to fade away over night, though.

I've been supplementing with 2g EPA/DHA + 1g l-methylfolate + pure b complex plus, to assure there's enough building material around.

Too early to say anything, but for now looks promising.

#1182 xks201

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Posted 22 August 2013 - 11:15 AM

Okay okay science guy is killing me lets the start the 2nd buy already befor e everyone runs out.
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#1183 Amorphous

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Posted 22 August 2013 - 12:15 PM

Is there any improvement of n-back or Cambridge brain sci ? I would love to see more objective improvement from this compound.

#1184 ranza

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Posted 22 August 2013 - 03:50 PM

Could this be what's causing headache ? Anybody has an EEG ?

I have a very simple one electrode EEG, I'll try to record my patterns before I start the trial and on it.

sunshinefrost What's your dosage?

#1185 TestBalance

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Posted 22 August 2013 - 04:19 PM

I'm posting from another account.

My DNB score has dropped in the two successive days of DNB training I've received. Today's score was lower than yesterday's score, which was lower than baseline.

This is day 3 of treatment for me, and I'm awaiting more results but I believe the following factors may be confounding the results.

1) An adjustment period to the medication which is temporarily interfering with working memory.

2) My change in diet towards a more protein rich formula.

I am in my mid-20s however, and there is a chance that I'm experiencing negative effects due to sub-optimal over-stimulation of my hippocampus. That is to say, I may be near optimal, and this medication may simply be impairing that performance.

I will continue this regimen for approximately 1-2 weeks and if the results don't start to rebound, I will probably stop.

Edited by TestBalance, 22 August 2013 - 04:20 PM.


#1186 Metagene

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Posted 22 August 2013 - 04:21 PM

Dates to look out for

Neuralstem, Inc at 15th Annual Rodman & Renshaw Healthcare Conference 2013 (9/10/13, 11:40 am ET)

http://investor.neuralstem.com/phoenix.zhtml?c=203908&p=irol-calendar

5th annual Stem Cells & Regenerative Medicine Congress (9/30/13, 9:00 a.m. ET)

http://www.terrapinn.com/2013/stem-cells-usa-regenerative-medicine/speaker-ted-HARADA.stm

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#1187 sunshinefrost

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Posted 22 August 2013 - 06:33 PM

Could this be what's causing headache ? Anybody has an EEG ?

I have a very simple one electrode EEG, I'll try to record my patterns before I start the trial and on it.

sunshinefrost What's your dosage?


That would be awsome. I am using 45 mg capsules.

#1188 MisterHero

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Posted 22 August 2013 - 06:54 PM

I'm posting from another account.

My DNB score has dropped in the two successive days of DNB training I've received. Today's score was lower than yesterday's score, which was lower than baseline.

This is day 3 of treatment for me, and I'm awaiting more results but I believe the following factors may be confounding the results.

1) An adjustment period to the medication which is temporarily interfering with working memory.

2) My change in diet towards a more protein rich formula.

I am in my mid-20s however, and there is a chance that I'm experiencing negative effects due to sub-optimal over-stimulation of my hippocampus. That is to say, I may be near optimal, and this medication may simply be impairing that performance.

I will continue this regimen for approximately 1-2 weeks and if the results don't start to rebound, I will probably stop.


Thank you for posting your first results.
It's nice to see someone actually reporting objective results.



I'm very sceptical torwards the reports about "euphoric" states etc. reported by so many people before you.
The reports are just not objective enough and could lead to biased results because obviously every participant will closely follow this thread and will expect consciously or subconsciously, to have the same experience as the early reporters. This will lead to massive confirmation bias.
i mean, even though many have experienced light headache or pressure in their head, this could very realistically be just a placebo effect, because we expect the hypocampus to grow and displace other parts of the brain and cause some pain.
The other effects reported, could just as well be seen in any other thread where people post their results with nootropics.

It's very hard or maybe even impossible for people like me, who follow the reported results, to find out which effects are caused by placebo and confirmation bias. Thats why your results are a lot more valuable than every previous report,
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#1189 sparkk51

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Posted 22 August 2013 - 07:14 PM

Okay okay science guy is killing me lets the start the 2nd buy already befor e everyone runs out.


Quit pressuring him like this. He doesn't owe us anything.
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#1190 MizTen

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Posted 22 August 2013 - 09:19 PM

Here's my version of an effect log for NSI-189. I've used something similar for a long time, usually once in the AM and once in the PM when I'm trying to determine if a healing or optimization strategy is helping or hurting. I am female, in my mid-fifties, moderate to high fitness level, physically healthy with back problems, and want to improve my brain health. I suspect some brain damage from toxins, lengthy course of IV antibiotics, heavy metals, pathogens, chronic stress, as well as a year-long course of chemotherapy. I have PTSD and SAD (definitely), ADD (probably), and GAD (maybe).

I am taking 40 mg of NSI-189 twice daily, usually after eating with 200 mg of Centrophenoxine and 100 mg of idebenone. Sometimes I take it on an empty stomach inside a small ball of coconut oil. It seems to absorb about the same either way. I do take other supplements but I don't think they're that important as they are pretty standard for health and I was already taking them before NSI-189.


10:10 am
8/22/13


Sleep hours — 7
Sleep quality — disturbed
Dreaming — no memory



Scaled from 0-6:
Health — 5
Fitness — 4
Mood — 4
Energy — 5
Focus — 5
Memory — 5
Libido — 4
Internal Stress (perceived, also known as anxiety) — 3
External Stressors (real life events that require significant responses and changes) — 4
Productivity — 4

Notes:
Huge abnormal increase in hunger, though I have not changed the diet (modified Paleo, intermittent fasting, and fitness protocols that I've followed for the last 18 months. I am seriously hungry a lot. I ate a massive fish and vegetable salad for breakfast, amounting to three lunch size portions for healthy active people. Maybe neurogenesis (in brain) is occurring and requiring a lot more nutrients?

Salivation: Once I tried taking NSI-189 sublingually. After a couple of minutes salivation was so copious that it became impossible not to swallow a lot, so that dose ended up being mostly oral due to swallowing the excess saliva. Effects did come on a little faster and stronger, but that's NOT what I wanted.

Digestive bile: I suspect that has increased because I can no longer tolerate digestive enzymes that I take regularly with good results (in the past).

Some mild nausea on a few occasions, almost unheard of for me.

A few times I felt the exact same kind of sudden body fatigue that I felt on low dose Deprenyl. Hard to drag my legs up the hill type fatigue, unique to Deprenyl when I am not doing hard exercise and one of two reasons I stopped taking Deprenyl. The other was increased anxiety.

I am sleeping pretty well which is very unusual, under the circumstances. Current situation would normally cause pretty bad insomnia.

Considering that the new major stressors that happened to occur at the beginning of my NSI-189 trial are still present, though a bit less intense, my current response to the stress is remarkable. Under these conditions I would normally be ready to pack my bags and drive off into the sunset or find a little cave to crawl into and stay there indefinitely. One certain response is that I would become much less productive and very emotionally numb, which provides some protection from PTSD symptoms, dysfunctional though that may be. But that hasn't happened this time at all.

I hesitated to include libido as a field to rate (mostly wanting to avoid perv-troll responses), but it is often a valuable marker of overall health. Plus, it is an item of great concern to many people here, so I've added it to this public log. Hopefully we can communicate and also keep our dignity on this topic. There has been a definite increase over what I thought was a normal sex drive. Also normally when stress escalates, my libido disappears. But not since starting NSI-189. This was one of the most noticeable first effects.

The headaches or head pressure feelings have been mild and infrequent. I know that these mild sensations are sometimes a sign of neurological repair and regeneration. Perhaps that is the cause...

I want to ramp up my optimization practices if possible before the NSI-189 is gone. Language learning, fitness challenges, memorization of boring but important stuff, new creative output, and meditation hacks are what I usually do to optimize my brain. Also enjoying some new adventure qualifies as an optimization activity for me. But right now maybe just avoiding a major episode of PTSD is a valuable goal under the current circumstances.

I had some mild come-downs from this initially, manifesting as very mild depression and anxiety. I think the half-life is probably around 6-8 hours. But dosing twice a day seems plenty. It also does seem to build up somewhat, I am reducing the dosage to 30 mg twice a day.

But I still think this this is a major and very unique drug. I have used various prescription drugs, many supplements and noots, and a number of mind hacks, such as meditation and self-hypnosis. I have radically changed my diet and fitness protocols. Some had very positive lasting effects (diet, exercise, supplements, mind hacks), and some were initially rather dramatic (Paleo diet, Adderall and Sunifiram). But none eliminated the brain changes that come with PTSD. The difference with NSI-189 is that it is so broad in scope and integrates pretty seamlessly into whatever else you're doing to help yourself. It seems to induce mindfulness and change the pre-cursor thought patterns that bring on PTSD when there is a real life triggering event. It isn't making me stupid or slow in responding to danger or extreme unpleasantness. It's making me a lot smarter in those conditions.

How to make the best use of this is the real question for me. But I also don't understand how it can change my brain so quickly without any apparent ill-effects. The only "bad" effects have been very mild and infrequent.

What if you could keep on taking it?
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#1191 Hebbeh

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Posted 22 August 2013 - 09:52 PM

Some of my experiences have been similar including the hunger which I mentioned earlier. Today was the first time I haven't had a headache and cognitive improvements are becoming apparent as I've had somewhat of a stressful day but felt unusually quick on my feet....but also feel a little "speedier" today and as such, effects seem to be building.

Even though I don't have a headache today, the head pressure is very apparent and my tinnitus noticeably worse.

I'm 56 and have very likely suffered brain atrophy over the years due to a variety of experiences. I have no reason to expect the changes to be permanent and would expect my brain to began to atrophy again on ceasing nsi as the brains do when aging....and as such I would at least consider cycling this drug long term. I'm liking it better and better.
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#1192 Hebbeh

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Posted 22 August 2013 - 10:08 PM

Meant to add I'm dosing 20-25mg twice (6am-6pm). Guess it hasn't improved my multitasking!

#1193 Hebbeh

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Posted 22 August 2013 - 10:40 PM

Can't edit from my phone but should also add I am doing my doses sublingual. I spoon 20-25mg on the scale and then flip it under my tongue. I haven't been experiencing any excess salivation or noticeable negative effects from sublingual and prefer feeling the quick onset of effects. I also take 100 mg UMP sublingual at the same time as have been using uridine this way for several years.

#1194 psychopath

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Posted 22 August 2013 - 11:13 PM

Anyone tried taking nsi before bed ? No problems with going to sleep ?
I am thinking if it will not be better take it before sleep instead taking it at day because brain repair afaik happens mostly at sleep.

#1195 Hebbeh

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Posted 22 August 2013 - 11:25 PM

I find my sleep has been more fragmented with nsi. I don't sleep as sound throughout the night and wake earlier. Which corresponds to the slight "stimulant" or "speedy" effect. It does have a slight negative effect on sleep for me and the positive effects are best utilized during the day. The half life is also long....maybe 12 hours for me.

#1196 rikelme

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Posted 22 August 2013 - 11:31 PM

Anyone tried taking nsi before bed ? No problems with going to sleep ?
I am thinking if it will not be better take it before sleep instead taking it at day because brain repair afaik happens mostly at sleep.


I'm taking it in the morning somewhere between the breakfast and lunch break during which I do my cardio exercise (swimming or running). It has been shown in mice [1] that the most neural growth in brain happens when mice are the most active (which is during the night). Since humans are most active during the day and I'm around noon, I take the substance accordingly.

[1] http://cellularscale...s-at-night.html

#1197 Hebbeh

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Posted 23 August 2013 - 12:34 AM

In addition to dosing NSI-189 sublingually with UMP, my long term stack also includes C60/EVOO and 500mg sublingual resveratrol. I've come to the conclusion that the resveratrol intensifies the "speedy" effect of NSI....they seem to intensify the effects of each other in that regard.

#1198 Posthuman

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Posted 23 August 2013 - 01:41 AM

I am more hungry than I usually am since the trial. I still sleep a lot, but since 2 months I sleep in a very hot room, and I wake up at every little soundsé Chould change when I move in 2 weeks though

#1199 Xenix

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Posted 23 August 2013 - 06:48 AM

I am more hungry than I usually am since the trial. I still sleep a lot, but since 2 months I sleep in a very hot room, and I wake up at every little soundsé Chould change when I move in 2 weeks though


Try sleeping with your window open.

Definitely experiencing an antidepressant effect that is not placebo - which is interesting because it seems to have started working much faster than other SSRIs I have used in the past.

Still not experiencing much cognitive enhancement, which is what I'm after, but maybe in time...

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#1200 ranza

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Posted 23 August 2013 - 01:02 PM

Anyone trying to quantify if there are any improvement in memorization and recall due to NSI?





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