6219 replies to this topic

[Plasticperson]

so whats the general consensus on nsi efficacy? I havent seen anything that makes me think its better than say a multivitamin.

[tdmonster99]

From personal experience it is definitely better than a multivitamin.

[Diego55]

Has anyone found NSI-189 be helpful for social anxiety disorder ?

 

 

[Hungry Hippo]

so whats the general consensus on nsi efficacy? I havent seen anything that makes me think its better than say a multivitamin.

 

The efficancy is great, but depends totally on where you want to take it for. It doesn't do anything for smelly feet and running noses. But for MDD and anxiety it can do guite a good job.

 

In my case: It restores cognitive regression: memory enhanches, focus and concentration are getting normal again. I can read a book again, do some study or watch a movie. It does a lot to motivation and the amount of energy. It's the difference between a normal life and one down in the dumps. It does not affect my emotions. It's not a happy pill to me. But it's ok to have them, they're manageable. And then there's this experience like I'm a teenager again. Not only music sounds better, but just driving a car or scooter, feeling the wind in my hair makes me go totally wack. It feels like if it's my first experience. And that's really great.

 

Is it all NSI-189? I don't know, but it certainly gives me a push in the right direction and my friends see a difference. Now they want it too

Edited by Hungry Hippo, 07 May 2014 - 08:55 AM.

[verticalVagabond]

so whats the general consensus on nsi efficacy? I havent seen anything that makes me think its better than say a multivitamin.

 

Multivitamins don't cause a strong revision of your perception of the world. If you are a responder then NSI-189 it does. I don't understand what intelligence is and I'm not sure I feel more intelligent, but what I am experiencing is absolutely an altered (and for me better) state of consciousness.

[CortisolJunkie]

Can i hear from NSI non responders? it sounds like it was mostly people taking it not for depression, right? what's the longest amount of time it took for people's side effects to subside and for any positive effects to kick in? did you have to ramp up those dose or stay at a lower dose than 40mg?

[swolo]

so whats the general consensus on nsi efficacy? I havent seen anything that makes me think its better than say a multivitamin.

Wow... what multivitamins are you taking? I've never heard of any that spur neurogenesis in rats.

 

Has anyone found NSI-189 be helpful for social anxiety disorder ?

Yes, a little. I notice slight anxiolytic effects that let me stay detached from my nerves in social situations. Normally I get swept away by my anxiety, now I'm a bit calmer and let interactions unfold. I also made it a New Year's resolution to conquer my shyness, maybe I've just finally made some baby steps.

 

All standard placebo caveats apply. In my previous post on the effects I mentioned sleeping better. I'm pretty sure that was just placebo, and I now sleep as I did before.

[FeelsNumbMan]

How about people who are using this for depression?

 

And how is this looking for public buys and stuff? Sorry, just kinda skimmed through the posts.

[5ht2a]

I'm astonished by the lack of recent experience reports from the nsi-users. I can report of a female friend who struggled with deep depression all her life. NSI has accomplished what two therapies and a whole bunch of available antidepressants (she tried at least 6 different medications over the years) couldn't: There are days on which she's almost free from depression. It's not a constant state of mind (yet), but it's about 80% of the time. Overall, on a scale from 1-10, she rated her depression an 8,5 before NSI, and now it's a 3 on average, on good days it's even 1 or 2.

It seems like her global outlook on life has dramatically changed in only 5 or 6 weeks. Her motivation to do things is back, memory seems to get better slowly and she's able to feel pleasure again in her every day life. I really hope these are permanent changes and the direct action from nsi isn't contributing too much. Her dosage is 60mg per day. Besides light occasional headaches, she has no side effects.

 

I have to say that she doesn't just take the nsi, but also started jogging (1 hour a day), doing yoga and she meditates every day. In addition to that, she's now more able to integrate what she has learned in her therapies into her daily life. So I think these are very important factors to consider. I don't think NSI can do the trick alone is such dramatic manners, but it from what I can say, it's by far the best therapy option for depression out there now.

 

A cheer to neuralstem for developing this and a cheer to VLK for doing this group buy.


 

Edited by 5ht2a, 08 May 2014 - 08:17 PM.

[CortisolJunkie]

I am using it for depression and I have been a non responder for 2 weeks now..still dealing with the *negative* side effects, don't know how some of you find it anxiolytic, lol, I'm so edgy! pretty devastated since it seemed like the consensus is that it really helped those with untreatable depression :(

[Hungry Hippo]

I am using it for depression and I have been a non responder for 2 weeks now..still dealing with the *negative* side effects, don't know how some of you find it anxiolytic, lol, I'm so edgy! pretty devastated since it seemed like the consensus is that it really helped those with untreatable depression :(

 

What dose do you use? Keep in mind that the first two weeks are not the best. After two weeks my memory went down and my thinking foggy. With 40 mg I got some anxiety as a bonus, but taking 20 mg it didn't bother me. If you come from a long way, it takes some time to get back on the track. I hope the next weeks will be more hopefull.

[5ht2a]

 

I am using it for depression and I have been a non responder for 2 weeks now..still dealing with the *negative* side effects, don't know how some of you find it anxiolytic, lol, I'm so edgy! pretty devastated since it seemed like the consensus is that it really helped those with untreatable depression :(

 

What dose do you use? Keep in mind that the first two weeks are not the best. After two weeks my memory went down and my thinking foggy. With 40 mg I got some anxiety as a bonus, but taking 20 mg it didn't bother me. If you come from a long way, it takes some time to get back on the track. I hope the next weeks will be more hopefull.

 

 

I can second that. 2 weeks is not much in  terms of neurogenesis. I'd wait at least 5 or 6 weeks to say if you're a non responder.

[ElixirOfLife]

I'm astonished by the lack of recent experience reports from the nsi-users. I can report of a female friend who struggled with deep depression all her life. NSI has accomplished what two therapies and a whole bunch of available antidepressants (she tried at least 6 different medications over the years) couldn't: There are days on which she's almost free from depression. It's not a constant state of mind (yet), but it's about 80% of the time. Overall, on a scale from 1-10, she rated her depression an 8,5 before NSI, and now it's a 3 on average, on good days it's even 1 or 2.

It seems like her global outlook on life has dramatically changed in only 5 or 6 weeks. Her motivation to do things is back, memory seems to get better slowly and she's able to feel pleasure again in her every day life. I really hope these are permanent changes and the direct action from nsi isn't contributing too much. Her dosage is 60mg per day. Besides light occasional headaches, she has no side effects.

 

I have to say that she doesn't just take the nsi, but also started jogging (1 hour a day), doing yoga and she meditates every day. In addition to that, she's now more able to integrate what she has learned in her therapies into her daily life. So I think these are very important factors to consider. I don't think NSI can do the trick alone is such dramatic manners, but it from what I can say, it's by far the best therapy option for depression out there now.

 

A cheer to neuralstem for developing this and a cheer to VLK for doing this group buy.


 

 

My jaw just hit the floor.

 

Are you smoking crack? She's doing several time tested and well studied methods of lifting depression without pharms (which are very powerful when combined, IME) - and you're buying the idea that an untested chem is helping her (it's as yet unproven that this chem is even NSI-189). I don't even know what to say.

 

So many people here are under the influence of a runaway mind-train. This should be your wake-up call. Yoga, meditation, and exercise can help you retake your own body's throne. Stop smoking the mind's weed.

[5ht2a]

 

I'm astonished by the lack of recent experience reports from the nsi-users. I can report of a female friend who struggled with deep depression all her life. NSI has accomplished what two therapies and a whole bunch of available antidepressants (she tried at least 6 different medications over the years) couldn't: There are days on which she's almost free from depression. It's not a constant state of mind (yet), but it's about 80% of the time. Overall, on a scale from 1-10, she rated her depression an 8,5 before NSI, and now it's a 3 on average, on good days it's even 1 or 2.

It seems like her global outlook on life has dramatically changed in only 5 or 6 weeks. Her motivation to do things is back, memory seems to get better slowly and she's able to feel pleasure again in her every day life. I really hope these are permanent changes and the direct action from nsi isn't contributing too much. Her dosage is 60mg per day. Besides light occasional headaches, she has no side effects.

 

I have to say that she doesn't just take the nsi, but also started jogging (1 hour a day), doing yoga and she meditates every day. In addition to that, she's now more able to integrate what she has learned in her therapies into her daily life. So I think these are very important factors to consider. I don't think NSI can do the trick alone is such dramatic manners, but it from what I can say, it's by far the best therapy option for depression out there now.

 

A cheer to neuralstem for developing this and a cheer to VLK for doing this group buy.


 

 

My jaw just hit the floor.

 

Are you smoking crack? She's doing several time tested and well studied methods of lifting depression without pharms (which are very powerful when combined, IME) - and you're buying the idea that an untested chem is helping her (it's as yet unproven that this chem is even NSI-189). I don't even know what to say.

 

So many people here are under the influence of a runaway mind-train. This should be your wake-up call. Yoga, meditation, and exercise can help you retake your own body's throne. Stop smoking the mind's weed.

 

 

 

About 2 years ago she did EXACTLY all that besides the yoga (1 hour of jogging a day and 45 mins of meditation) and in addition to that, she even saw a therapist every week. At that time, she was on some ssri. That helped to stop her from having suicidal thoughts all day and going back to university, but she was very far away from living a life worth living (her own words) like she does at the moment. When the therapy ended, she wasn't able to keep on with that daily routine and started again one week after her first dose of NSI.

 

You can trust me, she was very uncomfortable with taking an untested research chemical from some guy on the internet.

But if you already tried such a "Gold standard" therapy combination (CBT + Medication + exercise + meditation) for 6 month and it did nothing more than making you able to function on a very low mood every day, you can imagine that this was an act of desperation.

 

From what I can see, the only main factor that is different from 2 years ago is the NSI. I don't want to raise false hopes and I don't claim that NSI is a panacea for depression, there are always people who respond extremely well to one particular medication. I'm sorry if my post did sound a bit too optimistic, but seeing a person you love happy again after so many failed attempts and medication trials did make me want to share her experience. Maybe I should have been more precise about what she had already tried.

 

That said, I'm still sure her state of mind would be not nearly as good as it is now without doing the things she does in addition to taking the NSI. So maybe upregulation of growth factors in your brain just provides a WAY better basis for synergy and personal development with "time tested and well studied methods of lifting depression" than an SSRI ever could.

 

I think some other NSI-experience reports back up this claim - it seems like all the glowing experience reports are from people doing more (especially mindfulness meditation) than just waiting for their depression to lift from taking medication alone.

Edited by 5ht2a, 09 May 2014 - 03:08 PM.

[blood]

I'm astonished by the lack of recent experience reports from the nsi-users. I can report of a female friend who struggled with deep depression all her life. NSI has accomplished what two therapies and a whole bunch of available antidepressants (she tried at least 6 different medications over the years) couldn't: There are days on which she's almost free from depression. It's not a constant state of mind (yet), but it's about 80% of the time. Overall, on a scale from 1-10, she rated her depression an 8,5 before NSI, and now it's a 3 on average, on good days it's even 1 or 2.
It seems like her global outlook on life has dramatically changed in only 5 or 6 weeks. Her motivation to do things is back, memory seems to get better slowly and she's able to feel pleasure again in her every day life. I really hope these are permanent changes and the direct action from nsi isn't contributing too much. Her dosage is 60mg per day. Besides light occasional headaches, she has no side effects.
 
I have to say that she doesn't just take the nsi, but also started jogging (1 hour a day), doing yoga and she meditates every day. In addition to that, she's now more able to integrate what she has learned in her therapies into her daily life. So I think these are very important factors to consider. I don't think NSI can do the trick alone is such dramatic manners, but it from what I can say, it's by far the best therapy option for depression out there now.
 
A cheer to neuralstem for developing this and a cheer to VLK for doing this group buy.


 

 
My jaw just hit the floor.
 
Are you smoking crack? She's doing several time tested and well studied methods of lifting depression without pharms (which are very powerful when combined, IME) - and you're buying the idea that an untested chem is helping her (it's as yet unproven that this chem is even NSI-189). I don't even know what to say.
 
So many people here are under the influence of a runaway mind-train. This should be your wake-up call. Yoga, meditation, and exercise can help you retake your own body's throne. Stop smoking the mind's weed.

Good post. I accidentally down voted you (meant to give you an up vote).

[ElixirOfLife]

5ht, I appreciate your clarification.

 

Meditation and yoga don't automatically add up to happiness. There's proper instruction and personal intention needed for these to be effective. Considering that - and the high likelihood of placebo affect - I think these are better long term strategies for your friend. It sounds like she's well on her way to her own realization.

 

Blood, /nod

Edited by ElixirOfLife, 09 May 2014 - 03:11 PM.

[Perek]

I think it all stinks, BIG time since the very beginning.

VLK is really sending an unknown undividual in Poland 20.000 euros to hopefully get a substance( He didn't even plan to test with an independant lab for a fraction of the cost).

 

And suddenly some "collegues" got some NSI....

.

 

I think VLK made a very bad job indeed. I like NSI (did both  Scienguy and Nyles) but I don't want such an naive idiot to cater for my needs.

 

Could be good intentions, but I couldn't care less.

 

You got to deliver. You did not.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[swolo]

I have some of vlk's product. I might be willing to have it independently analyzed if the cost isn't prohibitive. How might I go about finding a lab that does this? I'm in the Los Angeles area, if anyone knows any local places.

[Flex]

I have some of vlk's product. I might be willing to have it independently analyzed if the cost isn't prohibitive. How might I go about finding a lab that does this? I'm in the Los Angeles area, if anyone knows any local places.

 

Joeyo said in the participians thread, that he is able to run a test (C-NMR and H-NMR) in his University for free.

He just asked if some chemist wanted to team up with him.

 

The test should been made last week.

So we could get the results in the next time.

 

MS-GC testing will be made later

Edited by Flex, 09 May 2014 - 05:26 PM.

[fairy]

An interesting old article: May 24, 2013 - New neuron formation could increase capacity for new learning, at the expense of old memories goo.gl/slNDGw. As far as people continue reporting positive experiences with substances that increase neurogenesis I wouldn't be too concerned about that.

[ILIkeBeer]

Wow I have to say this is a mega thread I really enjoyed reading it!  Especially all the positive effects from this drug... I like others was hoping for more reports.... I saw some people who did not report their experience.  On another thread trying to buy more so they must have liked it.  Also Isaac nice Youtube video review... "stay frosty"

 

[stponky]

Can i hear from NSI non responders? it sounds like it was mostly people taking it not for depression, right? what's the longest amount of time it took for people's side effects to subside and for any positive effects to kick in? did you have to ramp up those dose or stay at a lower dose than 40mg?

 

I have continued taking it. I don't have depression or anything. I was hoping to get smarter. I think I started Feb 20th. 40 mg twice a day. Increasing later on to 60-70 mg twice a day. I would say that I do tend to get a little tired after taking NSI as others have reported. However, I don't notice any accelerated learning or other magic even after all this time. I feel pretty much ok even though I have been going through some stressful times. I plan on continuing to take it until I finish 5 grams. The one thing I wish I had done more was more exercise. I would really be interested in any testing since the conspiracy theorist in me can relate to Perek, but it's hard to argue with first person accounts.

[idontknow]

I reduced my dosage to 20 mg vlk-NSI once a week, because I am very sensitive to any medication in general. One effect that is really obvious to me is, that I can remember at least one dream each morning like 80% of the time. Sometimes I can remember almost every detail of the dream-world. Before taking NSI I would have some vague memories of a dream like twice a month.

 

It's difficult for me to judge it's effects on depression and anxiety. What I do believe is, that it makes you more likely to engage in various activity. This effect seems to be subconscious and long-lasting. I may have not even have noticed it, if others didn't report it. It may be placebo, though a rather strong one then.

 

Still, I'm excited for the results of the clinical test.

[Aka Poe]

An interesting old article: May 24, 2013 - New neuron formation could increase capacity for new learning, at the expense of old memories. As far as people continue reporting positive experiences with substances that increase neurogenesis I wouldn't be too concerned about that.

 

I see this subject here and also similarly at another recent post by Debaser in Brainhealth, "Neurogenesis."

"Study on mice, guinea pigs and degus shows that neurogenesis facilitates new learning, but causes old memories to be forgotten, similar to that seen in young children."

 

When examining the relationship between the production of new neurons in the hippocampus and memory, studies have generally first manipulated hippocampal neurogenesis and afterward investigated memory formation and found that new neurons help to encode new memories. However, when investigating how similar manipulations of neurogenesis impact established hippocampus-dependent memories, Akers et al. uncovered a role for neurogenesis in memory clearance. Thus, the continuous addition of new neurons both degrades existing information stored in hippocampal circuits and simultaneously provides substrates for new learning.

 

I post here because  I wonder, which memories would be extinguished? An "old" memory is not necessarily a bad thing to have stored. Could such neurogenesis induce the loss of "good" memories too?  For example, happy times as a child or  mathematics learned in elementary school for example? 

 

I recall that a study showed some drugs and also some cognitive "exposure  therapies" (for example CBT cognitive behavioral training, EMDR - Eye Movement Desensitization Reprocessing) each help reduce the psychological impact of negative memories, targeting the  so called "aversive" and traumatic memories. EMDR in particular, is proving quite effective, more so than any other  treatment in the past,. A  large percentage of American veterans returning with PTSD from wars in Afghanistan  and Iraq are finding considerable improvement. Former soldiers treated with drugs alone are not fairing nearly as well. One theory is that in persons with PTSD, the mind locks into the fearfilled "fight or flight" response and won't let go long after the  traumatic experience is over with, as  the brain's limbic system won't let go, won't recognize the person is now safely out of danger.

 

People  who  experienced long term traumatic events, such as over many months during  a war or while in prison, require longer term EMDR treatment, so people who have been traumatized in single events such as death of a loved one in a car accident or for victims of rape,  may often find significant improvement quite quickly, in fact typical treatments last  less than two months.  A large portion of patients do say that re-exposing oneself to the traumatic event during therapy is very difficult and a percent give up before completion as they can't stand it. I think the patients trust and rapport with the therapist is critical in such treatments.

 

Now regarding drugs to reduce aversive memories, it would seem pertinent for it to have benefit it would have to carefully pick and choose and not just have a blanket memory extinguishing effect on both good  with bad memories. I wonder how Dihexa, NSI-189 and other drugs purported to induce neurogenesis might fair in this regard?  It would seem  prudent to stick with EMDR and cognitive behavioral training until any drugs are proven effective and safe.

 

Also, where do we draw the line between a good or bad memory having a lasting value?  Additionally, what is good or bad is of course subjective, getting punished  after bullying another innocent as a kid might be traumatic, but it also may make a person learn to be a better behaved adult. 

 

I wonder, is it known how negative memories are formed compared to positive memories?  Are they stored in separate areas?  If so, where are the so called "negative" memories  stored in the brain?  Does the brain  store happy and good memories in one area and aversive memories in another?  I doubt it is that simple.  I guess I hope that any memories that a drug extinguishes or reduces the impact of would select only stored knowledge that won't help further one's life goals. 

 

I recall both cannabis and also certain antihistamines have some effect on reducing the negative impact of aversive memories.  I am not sure to what degree these medicines and behavioral training treatments are permanent, but surmise that some people might be self medicating with cannabis for this reason. I believe researchers are working to  isolate   specific chemicals from the cannabis plant with this specific  benefit and in the future isolating them as medicines may work wonders. Below are two quick Duck Duck Go searches:

 

1. Nature | 1 August 2002 |

The endogenous cannabinoid system controls extinction of aversive memories Calming brain circuit could treat anxieties.

 

Brain chemicals similar to those in cannabis wipe out bad memories - and could point to new drugs for severe anxiety.

 

2. Benadryl Wipes Away Bad Memories: Is The Antihistamine A Fresh Solution For PTSD?

Medical Daily / Oct 21, 2013 04:05 PM EDT

A Swiss study finds that a common antihistamine, Benadryl, alleviates negative memories.

Allergy medication may do more than clear up a stuffy nose, according to a  new report that shows that diphenhydramine — the antihistamine in Benadryl — stymies the recall of aversive negative memories in humans.

[Godof Smallthings]

 

Can i hear from NSI non responders? it sounds like it was mostly people taking it not for depression, right? what's the longest amount of time it took for people's side effects to subside and for any positive effects to kick in? did you have to ramp up those dose or stay at a lower dose than 40mg?

 

I have continued taking it. I don't have depression or anything. I was hoping to get smarter. I think I started Feb 20th. 40 mg twice a day. Increasing later on to 60-70 mg twice a day. I would say that I do tend to get a little tired after taking NSI as others have reported. However, I don't notice any accelerated learning or other magic even after all this time. I feel pretty much ok even though I have been going through some stressful times. I plan on continuing to take it until I finish 5 grams. The one thing I wish I had done more was more exercise. I would really be interested in any testing since the conspiracy theorist in me can relate to Perek, but it's hard to argue with first person accounts.

 

 

What type of learning have you been engaged in? Did you try to actively measure and compare it to before taking NSI-189?

[cyberger]

I think it all stinks, BIG time since the very beginning.

VLK is really sending an unknown undividual in Poland 20.000 euros to hopefully get a substance( He didn't even plan to test with an independant lab for a fraction of the cost).

 

And suddenly some "collegues" got some NSI....

.

 

I think VLK made a very bad job indeed. I like NSI (did both  Scienguy and Nyles) but I don't want such an naive idiot to cater for my needs.

 

Could be good intentions, but I couldn't care less.

 

You got to deliver. You did not.

 

 

Personally, I'm grateful that VLK VOLUNTEERED massive amounts of time and effort to provide NSI-189 in spite of the setbacks and maybe losing his life savings.  AFAIK Nyles batch was produced from Chinese labs, not independently tested, and in a form different than used in Neuralstems studies.  I'm glad you got good results from it, but lets not hold VLK to an artificially high standard that many other nootropics companies (and Nyles) was not held too.  Incidentally, it sounds like a few people are looking into testing this batch anyway, so we may have test results soon.  Also, several users who were on SG first batch have said that it tasted very similar to the first batch (such as MizTen and Paul and others) while a minority felt it had a different taste.  

 

If there is anyone to get mad at, it is Szymon Kaminzki who scammed VLK out of his savings.  Mr. Kaminski was not some unknown individual in Poland but was rather part of the trusted nootropics lab who had produced the NSI-189 for the first group buy as well as SG $16,000 order of coluracetam.  It was a case of a good supplier going bad.  

 

One thing I honestly cannot understand is how people could claim that VLK would be a scammer at this point.  VLK has lost his own money - around $32,000 - to Mr. Kaminzki.  He paid for the NSI-189 out of his own pocket, and was expecting to recover that money as individuals paid for the NSI-189.

 

Instead of criticizing VLK for the dishonest actions of the original supplier of NSI-189, what if the group brainstormed ways to help VLK recover his money?  

 

_____________________________________________________________________________________

 

Addendum: Obviously, if one were to dispute that he paid the $32,000 to the supplier, one could think he is a scammer.  But there are statements from other board members confirming he made this payment such as:

 

PWAIN said:

"I am in a joint conversation with the lab and vlk so I could verify that the payment has been received if that would help anyone. I've been on these forums for quite a while now so not exactly a stranger"

http://www.longecity...e-5#entry613830

 

 ScienceGuy confimed that Vlk was sending money to the same supplier that ScienceGuy has used successfully in the past:

 http://www.longecity...e-7#entry618467

 

Also, ScienceGuy has posted that this european supplier used to have a track record of 100% reliablility but now that same person is 100% unreliable:

"Up until now said INDIVIDUAL has had a proven track record of 100% RELIABILITY and REPUTABILITY... but IMO not any longer in either department... and for this reason my vote will be to BLACK-LIST said INDIVIDUAL and his COMPANY "

http://www.longecity...-54#entry637735

[Perek]

I did not suggest attempted fraud. I just found the handling absurd and extremly naive.

 

Your addendum doesnt add shit to anyones credibility.

 

PWAIN. How could he confirm receipt of payment to the lab on the 25th of September? I am quite sure he meant COULD i.e. in the future.

VLK made several post after the 25th of Sept saying he WILL pay. (Recall a post he said lab got funds on the 16th of Oct.)

 

ScienceGuy post doesn't make sense to me and is in NO WAY any confirmation of any payments done.

 

If I was VLK I would scan and post a verification. 

Best way for VLK to compensate for any loss is to make a profit. If NSI holds any of it's promises it would be no problem at all.

But he would have to deliver, the right quality at  the right price at the right time.

[sparkk51]

What Perek is saying isn't necessarily wrong, but he's making some pretty aggressive remarks. We definitely need to get this stuff tested by a third party lab.

 

Personally, I was a part of Scienceguy's group buy and this stuff tastes exactly the same. Something tells me it is genuine, but I have no evidence.

[cyberger]

I did not suggest attempted fraud. I just found the handling absurd and extremly naive.

 

Your addendum doesnt add shit to anyones credibility.

 

PWAIN. How could he confirm receipt of payment to the lab on the 25th of September? I am quite sure he meant COULD i.e. in the future.

VLK made several post after the 25th of Sept saying he WILL pay. (Recall a post he said lab got funds on the 16th of Oct.)

 

ScienceGuy post doesn't make sense to me and is in NO WAY any confirmation of any payments done.

 

If I was VLK I would scan and post a verification. 

Best way for VLK to compensate for any loss is to make a profit. If NSI holds any of it's promises it would be no problem at all.

But he would have to deliver, the right quality at  the right price at the right time.

 

I went digging through the payments and logistics thread noticed that your right, PWAIN confirmed the lab had received payment, and later VLK writes that he needs the lab to confirm that payment was received (good catch Perek).  Perhaps PWAIN could explain?

 

_______________

PWAIN

Posted 25 September 2013 - 04:25 AM

I am in a joint conversation with the lab and vlk so I could verify that the payment has been received if that would help anyone. I've been on these forums for quite a while now so not exactly a stranger.

http://www.longecity...ndpost&p=613830

 

VLK

Posted 14 October 2013 - 02:07 AM

I'm just waiting for the lab to confirm that they have received the money, and I also want to double check all my postage and packing calculations.

http://www.longecity...ndpost&p=617736

_______________

 

If scanning and posting a payment verification would help VLK recive support for his financial loss, I'm for that too. But how could one authenticate that these documents weren't forgeries, and what type of redaction would be necessary to protect VLK?

 

Seems like the VLK's actions prove his legitimacy best.  We know from ScienceGuy that Googletarian became a scammer so that part of VLK's story seems reasonable to me. After the scam ocurred, I argued VLK should adjust the price higher to cover his new costs, but VLK rejected that idea since he didn't want to make a profit selling a patented compound (why would a scammer turn down making more money?).  People are receiving bottles of NSI-189 from VLK which most report taste like the batch from ScienceGuys.  Sounds like there are a few people who are looking into getting the NSI-189 tested so we may have even more proof of the VLK NSI-189's authenticity soon enough.

 

In any case, it would be good to have a guide so that future group buys safe for participants and organizers.  I bet this was VLK's first time organizing something like this.

[paul]

I met with VLK in person. He is a genuine honest guy and did loose a lot of money on the group buy. His batch is identical to Science guys in taste, density, colour, solubility and effects. I would not have bought 30 grams from him if I did not trust him 100%. Once my life is back on track and I'm earning a good salary I will donate money as I have a lot to thank him for.