6219 replies to this topic

[jaiho]

Robin Williams was definitely on the wrong drugs. I see it far too often. My sister became severely suicidal when she kept getting prescribed Effexor by doctors. I told her, fuck them. Here's tianeptine, and instantly she lifted, then got her on fluoxetine. Because of the annoyance of weighing powder, i haven't provided nsi as an option yet. I'm thinking of a sublingual solution but wish we had more information on how nsi lasts in solution or nasal spray. I left my phosphate packet exposed to air for a couple weeks, and noticed i lost all effects from it. Switched to freebase and I'm good again. I think nsi may be sensitive to air exposure, but unknown in solution.

[pheanix997]

I’m basically thinking the same thing. If I can get 500 grams and sell 400 grams at the break-even point, then that will give me 100 free grams, which will be enough to last me a long time and also enable me to give it to people who really need it. I sometimes wonder if Robin Williams would still be with us if somebody had given him some NSI-189 and tianeptine. But at the same time, I don’t want to step on anybody’s toes. The economy where I live is really good right now, but the economy where he lives isn’t. I also don’t need anybody stomping my ass into the ground screaming “NOBODY moves NSI-189 in the South Valley but ME, bitch!”

Has it helped your depression that much? In what way? Is it calming like SSRI's, activating and brain-fog clearing like stimulants, or what is the general subjective response for you? 

I've tried SSRI's, stimulants, and wellbutrin - and all of them give unacceptable side effects. On wellebutrin, for example, it makes whatever mild speech impediment I have worse, i.e it hits me with expressive aphasia and then an embarrassing misuse of words, mild stuttering, etc. The SSRI's were good when i had bad anxiety in my early University days, and I've been on them here and there when needed, but at this point in my life (I'm 25) the severe lethargy is quite handicapping. So I'm hoping NSI will give some relief. 

[Fenix_]

Add me to the group buy list!

[Dominicus]

im in on the group buy

[jaiho]

Pheanix, if you go through the thread, you'll find lots of reports of effects. For me, it abolishes my depression and Anhedonia. All without side effects, besides start up mild head pressure and sometimes itching.
Nsi 189 doesn't mess with receptors, except for downstream effects of potent neurogenesis. It stimulates stem cells, growing the hippocampus. It was created on the hypothesis of depression originating from the hippocampus. And i think they got this right.
Ssris provide a lower level of neurogenesis in the hippocampus via its inhibition of reuptake. Why do that when we now have a substance to do it directly?

[Heisenburger]

I’m not sure if I’ve ever suffered from clinical depression. I’ve suspected it, but never had it diagnosed or really been sure. If I do have it, it’s not super-bad. What NSI-189 does for me is completely abolish my lack of self-confidence; a problem that has plagued me since I was in elementary school. Tianeptine seems to multiply its effects. Although bear in mind that if you take over about 50 milligrams of tianeptine it will give you a very pleasant buzz, so you have be aware that you may not be alleviating depression—you might just be getting high. I have a pet theory that high-dose (the pun is intentional and meant to be qualitative rather than humorous) tianeptine for three or four weeks would be extremely effective for people who are depressed because of broken relationships.

[cheezburger]

I have a pet theory that high-dose (the pun is intentional and meant to be qualitative rather than humorous) tianeptine for three or four weeks would be extremely effective for people who are depressed because of broken relationships.

 

- When you end a relationship you're not "depressed". You're sad. The word "depression" is a clinical term and must be used only for behaviour of sadness for no precise reason.

- I don't think it's good to advise people to take a drug to escape a common condition of life. Even if it's sad. You somehow have to face it. NSI-189 is not Xanax.

Edited by cheezburger, 08 July 2015 - 08:10 PM.

[pheanix997]

 

I have a pet theory that high-dose (the pun is intentional and meant to be qualitative rather than humorous) tianeptine for three or four weeks would be extremely effective for people who are depressed because of broken relationships.

 

- When you end a relationship you're not "depressed". You're sad. The word "depression" is a clinical term and must be used only for behaviour of sadness for no precise reason.

- I don't think it's good to advise people to take a drug to escape a common condition of life. Even if it's sad. You somehow have to face it. NSI-189 is not Xanax.

 

I agree, that's where the whole "SSRI's are overprescribed" argument comes in. Situational sadness after loss is normal; it's called grief. Grief is not the same thing as having a shitty childhood and growing up rather sad and grossly lacking in self-confidence because of it - that's characterlogical depression. With that said serotonin supposedly works best for sadness caused by separation stress, so using a serotonergic also makes sense in that situation. 

Edited by pheanix997, 08 July 2015 - 08:35 PM.

[Heisenburger]

I’m not entirely sure this is true. When the DSM-5 was published a couple of years ago, substantial revisions were made to the diagnostic criteria for depression. In previous editions, bereavement was not considered a form of depression. Now it is. I’ve taken clinical psych twice—once about 30 years ago, and again two years ago, right when the DSM was being revised. Even when I took it the first time in 1984, clinical depression was described as being either endogenous or reactive. There was a major overview paper published in Science during that semester illustrating a final common pathway for both types of depression; I’m looking for the citation right now.

[Shai Hulud]

I recently started NSI again.

 

I took it before for about 3 months. In the end I was not so sure it worked anymore and in hindsight I can't be sure if it was placebo altogether.

Now, I started that trial with TLR's product and switched to ceretropic's in the end.

After I stopped I switched to Tianeptine (3x12,5 mg)

 

Now I use NSI as an adjunct to Tianeptine, but I don't feel much of the latter.

What has changed? 

1) I now use ceretropic's product

2) I now have an accurate scale, using 40 mg sublingually. My old scale was pretty inaccurate, as I realized in the end, so I mostly took larger, sometimes way larger amounts.

I use it sublingually and it's always been the phosphate. Both used products looked and tasted the same.

 

Suggestions? Use more? I'm thinking about buying some freebase to get better sublingual bioavailability.

 

 

Edited by life backwards, 08 July 2015 - 09:14 PM.

[cheezburger]

I recently started NSI again.

 

I took it before for about 3 months. In the end I was not so sure it worked anymore and in hindsight I can't be sure if it was placebo altogether.

Now, I started that trial with TLR's product and switched to ceretropic's in the end.

After I stopped I switched to Tianeptine (3x12,5 mg)

 

Now I use NSI as an adjunct to Tianeptine, but I don't feel much of the latter.

What has changed? 

1) I now use ceretropic's product

2) I now have an accurate scale, using 40 mg sublingually. My old scale was pretty inaccurate, as I realized in the end, so I mostly took larger, sometimes way larger amounts.

I use it sublingually and it's always been the phosphate. Both used products looked and tasted the same.

 

Suggestions? Use more? I'm thinking about buying some freebase to get better sublingual bioavailability.

 

It seems to be unusual. Either people feel good on NSI, either they feel bad. But NOTHING? that's pretty impressive.

 

I see one flaw : SUBLINGUALLY. 40mg sub. That's really huge I think. Use more? Well I would say "USE LESS". NSI-189 seems to have a "reverse U-shape" response. So, maybe your too far from the effective dose. Try 40mg orally B.I.D, and if nothing 40mg QD. Try as much as possible to follow Neuralstem protocol. Sublingual was non-existant in neuralstem papers.

Do you feel something as you're on tianeptine?

[Shai Hulud]

When I was first on NSI, I first felt a little bit speedy when I took the dose. Also diminished appetite. After some time, maybe an hour, this would go away.

It made me more positive, alleviated depression and anxiety and made me less vulnerable emotionally.

As I wrote above, I took even higher dosages without knowing.

In the first days it gave me headaches, after that I was fine.

I only dosed once a day in the morning, as it messed with my sleep if I took a dose in the evening.

 

I also tried oral dosing, but didn't feel anything immediately. Maybe it would work if I tried oral dosing for several days, need to try this.

Yes, I feel the tianeptine. It helps a little bit: It's quite possible I have even more suicidal thoughts, but it also makes me feel more (which is a good thing, I can feel more joy but also can be genuinely sad and cry, which almost never happened before I took it). Beyond that, it helps me with cognitive problems (bad memory, etc.).

 

 

 

[pheanix997]

I’m not entirely sure this is true. When the DSM-5 was published a couple of years ago, substantial revisions were made to the diagnostic criteria for depression. In previous editions, bereavement was not considered a form of depression. Now it is. I’ve taken clinical psych twice—once about 30 years ago, and again two years ago, right when the DSM was being revised. Even when I took it the first time in 1984, clinical depression was described as being either endogenous or reactive. There was a major overview paper published in Science during that semester illustrating a final common pathway for both types of depression; I’m looking for the citation right now.

Also I think separation stress for example for a healthy person wouldn't be devastating, but for a dependent personality it would most likely cause some form of depression. And then further down the line of pathology to borderline personality, that could cause a disastrous depressive situation. So I think grief can certainly lead to depression, especially for vulnerable types; it isn't always a "normal" response. 

[Shai Hulud]

 

I’m not entirely sure this is true. When the DSM-5 was published a couple of years ago, substantial revisions were made to the diagnostic criteria for depression. In previous editions, bereavement was not considered a form of depression. Now it is. I’ve taken clinical psych twice—once about 30 years ago, and again two years ago, right when the DSM was being revised. Even when I took it the first time in 1984, clinical depression was described as being either endogenous or reactive. There was a major overview paper published in Science during that semester illustrating a final common pathway for both types of depression; I’m looking for the citation right now.

Also I think separation stress for example for a healthy person wouldn't be devastating, but for a dependent personality it would most likely cause some form of depression. And then further down the line of pathology to borderline personality, that could cause a disastrous depressive situation. So I think grief can certainly lead to depression, especially for vulnerable types; it isn't always a "normal" response. 

 

I think this is true. If a doctor already knows this about his patient, then maybe it's good idea to use pharmaceuticals after separation. Though I'm not sure if there are studies about this.

 

It is true that it's normal to be sad after separation, but the extent to which this happens differs greatly. Some need weeks and others are suffering for years. I'm also not sure if the sadness is needed in any way, just because it's "normal". I wonder if with the right drug one could mostly skip the sadness but still loose the bond to someone. Or keep the bond and be friends and just loose the special part between lovers.

[tintinet]

Just started NSI @ approximately 10 mg SL. Not sure I feel anything either. My mood has been ok, so it may be having some effect.

[jefferson]

I don't understand doing NSI sublingually when it seems to be absorbed fine when taken orally. More is not necessarily better. Not even the most rudimentary data is available on SL absorption. It's asking for trouble.

[jaiho]

I recently started NSI again.

 

I took it before for about 3 months. In the end I was not so sure it worked anymore and in hindsight I can't be sure if it was placebo altogether.

Now, I started that trial with TLR's product and switched to ceretropic's in the end.

After I stopped I switched to Tianeptine (3x12,5 mg)

 

Now I use NSI as an adjunct to Tianeptine, but I don't feel much of the latter.

What has changed? 

1) I now use ceretropic's product

2) I now have an accurate scale, using 40 mg sublingually. My old scale was pretty inaccurate, as I realized in the end, so I mostly took larger, sometimes way larger amounts.

I use it sublingually and it's always been the phosphate. Both used products looked and tasted the same.

 

Suggestions? Use more? I'm thinking about buying some freebase to get better sublingual bioavailability.

 

take less.

NSI becomes less effective at higher dose. 40mg sublingual is equivalent to a higher oral dose, though we dont know this for certain.

In my experience, NSI stops working when i increase my dose too high.

 

It was most effective when i took it sublingual at 20mg, twice a day.

 

with this substance, i believe less is more.

[Shai Hulud]

 

I recently started NSI again.

 

I took it before for about 3 months. In the end I was not so sure it worked anymore and in hindsight I can't be sure if it was placebo altogether.

Now, I started that trial with TLR's product and switched to ceretropic's in the end.

After I stopped I switched to Tianeptine (3x12,5 mg)

 

Now I use NSI as an adjunct to Tianeptine, but I don't feel much of the latter.

What has changed? 

1) I now use ceretropic's product

2) I now have an accurate scale, using 40 mg sublingually. My old scale was pretty inaccurate, as I realized in the end, so I mostly took larger, sometimes way larger amounts.

I use it sublingually and it's always been the phosphate. Both used products looked and tasted the same.

 

Suggestions? Use more? I'm thinking about buying some freebase to get better sublingual bioavailability.

 

take less.

NSI becomes less effective at higher dose. 40mg sublingual is equivalent to a higher oral dose, though we dont know this for certain.

In my experience, NSI stops working when i increase my dose too high.

 

It was most effective when i took it sublingual at 20mg, twice a day.

 

with this substance, i believe less is more.

 

Thanks. I will try 20mg, twice a day sublingually or 40 mg orally, twice a day and report back.

 

Is it best taken on an empty stomach?

Edited by life backwards, 09 July 2015 - 12:55 AM.

[jaiho]

Not known if food / no food helps absorption. Sublingual is a safe bet with a lower dose.

[Strangelove]

I find 20mg sublingual to be a very high dose for me.

 

I have used 10mg sublingually with excellent results the previous couple weeks.

 

Did you feel its effects from the first dose? I got a strong stimulant boost the first time I used it.

 

I gave a friend today a 40mg oral dose and she did not feel anything!

 

From my experience I cannot understand how this is possible...

 

 

 

 

[jaiho]

I don't feel a thing from nsi until day 22. It needs time to grow the hippocampus i guess.

[foreseason]

I find 20mg sublingual to be a very high dose for me.

 

I have used 10mg sublingually with excellent results the previous couple weeks.

 

Did you feel its effects from the first dose? I got a strong stimulant boost the first time I used it.

 

I gave a friend today a 40mg oral dose and she did not feel anything!

 

From my experience I cannot understand how this is possible..

 

My first dose of NSI (40mg phosphate) definitely made hypomanic for a few hours.  So while I technically "felt it", I think it was more of an unintended side effect.  

[Shai Hulud]

I find 20mg sublingual to be a very high dose for me.

 

I have used 10mg sublingually with excellent results the previous couple weeks.

 

Did you feel its effects from the first dose? I got a strong stimulant boost the first time I used it.

 

I gave a friend today a 40mg oral dose and she did not feel anything!

 

From my experience I cannot understand how this is possible...

 

Are these amounts for freebase or phosphate? I'm using phosphate.

 

I will try for some more days, see where it gets me. And yes, from my very first dose (not in this cycle) I got a stimulant boost (not all pleasant).

 

Anyway, I will go see a physician tomorrow and get mirtazapine. I recently realized I hadn't tried enough of the different ADs available. 

Guess I will go with the mirtazapine and tianeptine and see how it will work out. If it's not enough, I need to see what to do next.

 

My appointment with a real psychiatrist is only in 5 month. 

[ILIkeBeer]

 

I find 20mg sublingual to be a very high dose for me.

 

I have used 10mg sublingually with excellent results the previous couple weeks.

 

Did you feel its effects from the first dose? I got a strong stimulant boost the first time I used it.

 

I gave a friend today a 40mg oral dose and she did not feel anything!

 

From my experience I cannot understand how this is possible...

 

Are these amounts for freebase or phosphate? I'm using phosphate.

 

I will try for some more days, see where it gets me. And yes, from my very first dose (not in this cycle) I got a stimulant boost (not all pleasant).

 

Anyway, I will go see a physician tomorrow and get mirtazapine. I recently realized I hadn't tried enough of the different ADs available. 

Guess I will go with the mirtazapine and tianeptine and see how it will work out. If it's not enough, I need to see what to do next.

 

My appointment with a real psychiatrist is only in 5 month. 

 

 

 

WTH 5 months?? What on gods green earth takes so long???

[ILIkeBeer]

I’m not sure if I’ve ever suffered from clinical depression. I’ve suspected it, but never had it diagnosed or really been sure. If I do have it, it’s not super-bad. What NSI-189 does for me is completely abolish my lack of self-confidence; a problem that has plagued me since I was in elementary school. Tianeptine seems to multiply its effects. Although bear in mind that if you take over about 50 milligrams of tianeptine it will give you a very pleasant buzz, so you have be aware that you may not be alleviating depression—you might just be getting high. I have a pet theory that high-dose (the pun is intentional and meant to be qualitative rather than humorous) tianeptine for three or four weeks would be extremely effective for people who are depressed because of broken relationships.

 

If you are depressed as you said unless it is mild... you do not need someone to diagnose you... it is obvious.

[ritterbutzke]

Hey, i finally got my first batch of NSI 189. Do you think i can just add the powder to my Noopept sublingual solution (propylene glycol)? Big two questions are if it stays stable in PG and whether there is any interaction with Noopept.

Thanks

[Fenix_]

ritterbutzke, your NSI-189 might break down if you put it in solution. So far nobody has really found a stable solvent yet (as far as I know).

[ritterbutzke]

ritterbutzke, your NSI-189 might break down if you put it in solution. So far nobody has really found a stable solvent yet (as far as I know).

 

A couple people on this board have mentioned using it sublingualy

[Shai Hulud]

 

ritterbutzke, your NSI-189 might break down if you put it in solution. So far nobody has really found a stable solvent yet (as far as I know).

 

A couple people on this board have mentioned using it sublingualy

 

Yes. We mostly just put the powder under our tongues and wait.

[Shai Hulud]

@ilikebeer: I don't know. The mental health system in Germany is chronically overloaded. Maybe I'll just look for another one.