114 replies to this topic

[MrHappy]

http://www.theregist...tion_long_life/

...
The results, published in the journal Current Biology, show that eunuchs lived to an average age of 70, up to 19 years longer than their intact counterparts. Three of the eunuchs made it into triple figures, reaching 100, 101, and 109 years old - although it probably felt much longer. That's 130 times the rate of centenarians you'd expect to finds in a sample of humans today, and the team concludes that male sex hormones do have an effect on male longevity.

Searching for one's own physical gratification, companionship, or love, has its own varied intrinsic associated risks & stress ...

Seems my previously posted research is in conflict with this one <chuckle>. Can anyone find the original journal article?

[Guest]

Actually the differences in lifespan between men and women are almost entirely due to environmental factors, which is largely the consensus among gerontologists.


There is an interesting empirical test study for this done in the german speaking countries called the "cloister study" where they look at the demographics of monks and nuns, as they life in fairly comparable environments and largely neglected unhealty habits - e.g. the monks did not had a lot of physical or career related stress, smoked not much etc. etc.

http://de.wikipedia....i/Klosterstudie

http://www.cloisterstudy.eu/


As it turns out, monks almost life as long as nuns and considerably longer than the average male - the difference to nuns being explained with a some confounding remaining unhealty habits. And no, monks are not eunuchs.


To summarise the topic: its not your Y-chromosome itself, but what you do with it. Don't smoke, don't drink too much, avoid stress, get your sleep etc. and your gender doen't matter.

[Nootropic Cat]

Crossing my fingers about both of the above two posts.

[dear mrclock]

nobody commented on my suicide rate between gender. males are so high on death by suicide compared to females that its just scary.

[Luminosity]

There's way too many misogynist jerks on this forum. Maybe the reason some men don't live that long is that they are ill-wished by women who are sick of their bad behavior? If so, some might want to look sharp.

[dear mrclock]

luminosity, what kind of a crap to say is this. are you saying all the men who die (100 to 1 woman) deserve to die because they supposely hated women and THATS JUSTIFIED FOR THEIR DEATHS ? not sure at all what you mean by "some might want to look sharp". thats the dumbest thing i have read yet. has ZERO explaination for anything and its put there just to have a quick conclusion for what you just said (which is awfuly insulting to a human being, not just based on sex)

[niner]

There's a genetic component... as usual.

[Florian Xavier]

Nop, it does the same thing with all mamals. It's because nature slow your aging because in the hope you find mate later.

All humans centunaries has few children.

http://www.courrieri...-plus-longtemps

Edited by Florian Xavier, 26 September 2012 - 05:31 PM.

[Florian Xavier]

Why not a study on male rats ?

Glycyrrhizin decrease testosterone


http://medherb.com/M...estosterone.htm

[dear mrclock]

floran i dont understand shit on that url you pasted.

im to ask this, so naturally you can extend longevity by holding on to your precious semen and only distribute it wisely among few potential mates ?

[okok]

Actually the differences in lifespan between men and women are almost entirely due to environmental factors, which is largely the consensus among gerontologists.
There is an interesting empirical test study for this done in the german speaking countries called the "cloister study" where they look at the demographics of monks and nuns, as they life in fairly comparable environments and largely neglected unhealty habits - e.g. the monks did not had a lot of physical or career related stress, smoked not much etc. etc.
http://de.wikipedia....i/Klosterstudie
http://www.cloisterstudy.eu/
As it turns out, monks almost life as long as nuns and considerably longer than the average male - the difference to nuns being explained with a some confounding remaining unhealty habits. And no, monks are not eunuchs.
To summarise the topic: its not your Y-chromosome itself, but what you do with it. Don't smoke, don't drink too much, avoid stress, get your sleep etc. and your gender doen't matter.

It said smoking had a relatively minor effect on the monks. The major player is probably stress. And again, the pregnancy effect showed up.
Stem cells to the rescue!

[dear mrclock]

stem cells are only going to benefit the super rich. the difference between poor and rich as it grows will be even more noticable when the few super rich conintue to dominante the mostly mortal dying poor.

[Raptor87]

http://www.cbsnews.c...62-4418804.html

Why do men die first?

This is a question that has gone unanswered for centuries, but, now we know. It requires a bit of explanation, first:
If you put a woman on a pedestal and try to protect her from the rat race ... you're a male chauvinist. If you stay home and do the housework ... you're a pansy. If you work too hard ... there's never any time for her. If you don't work enough ... you're a good-for-nothing bum. If she has a boring repetitive job with low pay ... this is exploitation. If you have a boring repetitive job with low pay ... you should get off your lazy behind and find something better. If you get a promotion ahead of her ... that is favoritism. If she gets a job ahead of you ... it's equal opportunity.
If you mention how nice she looks ... its sexual harassment. If you keep quiet ... its male indifference. If you cry ... you're a wimp. If you don't ... you're an insensitive bastard. If you make a decision without consulting her ... you're a chauvinist. If she makes a decision without consulting you, she's a liberated woman.
If you ask her to do something she doesn't enjoy ... that's domination. If SHE asks you ... it's a favor. If you appreciate the female form and frilly underwear ... you're a pervert. If you don't ... you're gay. If you like a woman to shave her legs and keep in shape ... you're sexist. If you don't ... you're unromantic. If you try to keep yourself in shape ... you're vain. If you don't ... you're a slob.
If you buy her flowers ... you're after something. If you don't ... you're not thoughtful. If you're proud of your achievements ... you're full of yourself. If you don't ... you're not ambitious. If she has a headache ... she's tired. If you have a headache ... you don't love her anymore. If you want it too often ... you're oversexed. If you don't ... there must be someone else.

Why do men die first? Because they want to.

Edited by Brainfogged, 27 September 2012 - 05:48 AM.

[JLL]

If menstruation keeps women living longer, shouldn't birth control pills reduce lifespan in women?

[Florian Xavier]

http://kenyonlab.ucsf.edu/kri-1.pdf

"Homicide and suicide are among the top three causes for death among males between the ages of 15 and 34."

It's called intrasexual competition.

Edited by Florian Xavier, 27 September 2012 - 10:38 AM.

[Florian Xavier]

It doesn'st explain why men die sooner, it just say that reproduction has an obvious cost : acceleration of aging, since nature do not need you anymore.

Being eunuchs is like removing your germinals cells, you live longer because the body send signals that you are not ready for reproduction; wich translate to gene expression of longevity.

This is interesting :

http://www.unl.edu/r...gs/campbell.pdf

"Female’s tendency to place a high value on protecting their own lives enhanced their reproductive success in the environment
of evolutionary adaptation because infant survival depended more upon maternal than on paternal care and defence"

Edited by Florian Xavier, 27 September 2012 - 01:22 PM.

[dear mrclock]

http://www.cbsnews.c...62-4418804.html

Why do men die first?

This is a question that has gone unanswered for centuries, but, now we know. It requires a bit of explanation, first:
If you put a woman on a pedestal and try to protect her from the rat race ... you're a male chauvinist. If you stay home and do the housework ... you're a pansy. If you work too hard ... there's never any time for her. If you don't work enough ... you're a good-for-nothing bum. If she has a boring repetitive job with low pay ... this is exploitation. If you have a boring repetitive job with low pay ... you should get off your lazy behind and find something better. If you get a promotion ahead of her ... that is favoritism. If she gets a job ahead of you ... it's equal opportunity.
If you mention how nice she looks ... its sexual harassment. If you keep quiet ... its male indifference. If you cry ... you're a wimp. If you don't ... you're an insensitive bastard. If you make a decision without consulting her ... you're a chauvinist. If she makes a decision without consulting you, she's a liberated woman.
If you ask her to do something she doesn't enjoy ... that's domination. If SHE asks you ... it's a favor. If you appreciate the female form and frilly underwear ... you're a pervert. If you don't ... you're gay. If you like a woman to shave her legs and keep in shape ... you're sexist. If you don't ... you're unromantic. If you try to keep yourself in shape ... you're vain. If you don't ... you're a slob.
If you buy her flowers ... you're after something. If you don't ... you're not thoughtful. If you're proud of your achievements ... you're full of yourself. If you don't ... you're not ambitious. If she has a headache ... she's tired. If you have a headache ... you don't love her anymore. If you want it too often ... you're oversexed. If you don't ... there must be someone else.

Why do men die first? Because they want to.

lol jeez man thanks a lot for reminding me this. we all know it but somehow avoid discussing this crap associated with women. quite depressing. do you have a gf and do you get at least some if not all of those problems ? ive always had them even if not all of them with the same one, at least always half or so with different ones :(

Edited by dear mrclock, 28 September 2012 - 02:46 AM.

[dear mrclock]

btw to the few mentions that delaying reproduction (abstence from sex or masturbation) naturally preserving you for longer life as male, i was going to ask how is it same with females ? what if they dont have sex or experience orgasms for a long period of times actually extend their lives ?

[Raptor87]

lol jeez man thanks a lot for reminding me this. we all know it but somehow avoid discussing this crap associated with women. quite depressing. do you have a gf and do you get at least some if not all of those problems ? ive always had them even if not all of them with the same one, at least always half or so with different ones :(

We all get it man! I don't think it's depressing though!

[dear mrclock]

damn he is good. almost as good as richard pryor

[Namkcalb]

Cultural reasons might be a factor, men might be shamed from seeking medical treatment,

Height may be another factor, tall men die earlier than short men and men are on average taller than women.

[dear mrclock]

how is the being tall related to mortality ? this is weird

[Guest]

Just to reinstate what I mentioned previously: the genetic component in the discrepancy between life expectancies between genders is likely very small, considering that nuns and monks almost have the same life expectancy and the remainder can be explained to some extend by monks smoking more often than nuns. Also nuns on average do not life longer than women of the normal population.


In the general population men in the past had more unhealthy life styles, especially much higher rates of smoking, heavy drinking and physically and mentally stressfull occupations.


This is the main cause of the difference in life expectancies - not different body sizes between genders, Y-chromosome related genetics etc. If you avoid smoking, heavy drinking, stressfull occupations and maintain a sound BMI a man is likely to live considerably longer than the average women.

[clairvoyant]

Women has better cell membranes. That is the explanation. I read a study that claimed that men cell membranes contain about 10% less saturated fatty acids than women's. I do not know whether the reason for that is the testosterone.

[warner]

Women's premenopausal estradiol (E2), and men's falling testosterone with age, accounts for much of the difference in lifespan. After menopause, if E2 is not supplemented, then women see rising LDL, falling HDL, rising endothelin, faster rising CAC scores (a measue of arterial plaque), etc. They still have, however, about a 10 year advantage over men due mainly to their premenopausal estradiol levels. I you want to live longer, it helps a lot to maintain adequate, but not excessive, levels of estradiol (which in men is from conversion of testosterone to estradiol).

[YOLF]

Both Testosterone and Estrogen (new info to me, though I did suspect women needed it from somewhere) are telomerase activators. The older men get, the longer the telo's in their sperm are. Sex/ejaculation boosts critical hormones and keeps us healthy and give us longer lives. I've read of bodybuilding strategies that involve frequent sex.

I had read that oestrogen has a positive effect on telomere length and women have a higher amount,
perhaps that is enough so that over their lifespan it makes a few years difference,

-testosterone can depress the immune system
-leftover stem cells from a pregnancy can be used by used by the mother
-I have an unproven hunch that frequent enough male ejaculation over time takes some essence out of a man. Is it spermidine, zinc, or something else?

The principles of traditional Chinese medicine are centered upon the kidneys.

The kidneys are referred to as "the door to life".

Qi, or Chi, the Life Force, is stored in the kidneys. Each time you ejaculate,
you drain away your Chi.

Do that several times a day for a week, and you would feel the consequences.


http://harmonyhealin...rong-kidney-qi/

[YOLF]

btw to the few mentions that delaying reproduction (abstence from sex or masturbation) naturally preserving you for longer life as male, i was going to ask how is it same with females ? what if they dont have sex or experience orgasms for a long period of times actually extend their lives ?

This is based on Drosophilia bugs and has nothing to do with a given individual's own lifespan.

What the Drosophilia studies did was prevent the bugs that died early from breeding and removed them from the gene pool. If we were to actually attempt to practice this a form of LE we'd be Eugenicists (evil nazi types who irradiate people and put them in death camps to "prevent the spread of disease" rather than actually curing it), not Life Extensionists. I fear the day when Drosophilia lifespan studies are used to cure disease by removing populations. This is when science stops dead in its' tracks. Fear these scientists, they are the next "supremacist mass-murderers." I'm sure they'll at least smile when they're destroying lives to "prevent" disease.

Just to make sure I'm clear about what happens in Drosophilia studies:
Males and females are separated and allowed to breed late in life
lifespan increases a tiny bit in the next generation
cycle repeats with several lifespans per year (IIRC unaltered populations life 26 days that's at least 14 generations a year)
A slight gain is repeated over and creates a compound interest effect.

This type of life extension would allow us all to be long dead and possible removed from the gene pool by the time lifespan was significantly extended. It's only for a select few, huge waste of money...

Edited by cryonicsculture, 22 December 2012 - 06:40 AM.

[dear mrclock]

http://www.theregist...tion_long_life/

...
The results, published in the journal Current Biology, show that eunuchs lived to an average age of 70, up to 19 years longer than their intact counterparts. Three of the eunuchs made it into triple figures, reaching 100, 101, and 109 years old - although it probably felt much longer. That's 130 times the rate of centenarians you'd expect to finds in a sample of humans today, and the team concludes that male sex hormones do have an effect on male longevity.

Searching for one's own physical gratification, companionship, or love, has its own varied intrinsic associated risks & stress ...

Seems my previously posted research is in conflict with this one <chuckle>. Can anyone find the original journal article?

ah. you just have shown one more reason men arent happpy, do not have longer lives. women always control this behavior. no woman will ever be happy, allow you to, stare at her tits continueslyt at least.

[YOLF]

Perhaps we should look to create a homogeneity in human relationships that yield equal satisfaction for both sexes. I hardly think it's acceptable to have men dropping off like flies. It seems to me that both sexes living longer would continue to add a net positive to the lifespan of people.

I can't edit my earlier posts, but some good seems to have come from the drosophilia studies after all.

They took the changes in genetic expression that occurred in the flies and looked for human analogues. If they get them right, it might be good. I'd like to see rat trials though.

[Maecenas]

So we have the iron thing, but otherwise it seems rather obvious to me that the statistics are largely skewed by a) dying in wars and b) generally 'macho'-driven risky behaviour. Obvious to me, but apparently not obvious to anyone else in these threads, so I feel like I must be way off for reasons I don't understand :/

Edit: missed seivtcho's post - what he said

Double edit: PWAIN - 'it is not just in humans so that theory does not hold water' - actually, 'generally 'macho'-driven risky behaviour' probably does apply in other species

I too think that it is pretty obvious that high testosterone levels in male population explain shorter lifespan. Increased aggression, risky behavior, higher stress are explained by hormones differences.Biologically testosterone is rather good than bad for man's health: though it heightens risk for some diseases, but in the same time, it lowers chances for others. So I think testosterone makes indirect impact on male health through competitive behavior.

Edited by Maecenas, 22 December 2012 - 03:36 PM.