592 replies to this topic

[geostriata]

I find it interesting that people are pretty consistently reporting that 10mg 3x/day is too much. It leads me to suspect that perhaps there's a purity difference between ScienceGuy's coluracetam and what was available from NSN or ND.

I've tried both the NSN / NS versions of the coluracetam and had similar experiences with both... I wonder if they come from the same source.

Edited by geostriata, 16 October 2013 - 05:44 AM.

[leftside]

Incidentally, I have also found that COLURACETAM stacks extremely well with low dose HYDERGINE

How low? 50mg?

[renodino]

Follow up to prior colu experiences. I've been stacking colu + nefi + centro the past 3 days (25-30 mg colu + 100mg nefi + 800-900 mg centro). I only dose once a day at breakfast. I'm pretty happy with the results. Normally, nefi turns me into a bit of a zombie (very focused, but emotionally blank). The colu seems to temper the "zombie" effect of the nefi, with a nice emotional lift. Plus it definitely improves my sleep at night, which nefi usually disrupts.

I'm washing out for a few days before trying some phenyl, and don't use nefi except for crunch projects at work (which describes the past 3 days), but future such crunches I'll consider this stack if I've got colu handy.

I've not experienced any of the adverse effects described by others, but I've only dosed 1-2x a day. I'd also be curious of variations in lifestyle (age, diet, tobacco use, exersize, etc) relative to those who seem to be having unpleasant effects.

[ThePhoeron]

I've not experienced any of the adverse effects described by others, but I've only dosed 1-2x a day. I'd also be curious of variations in lifestyle (age, diet, tobacco use, exersize, etc) relative to those who seem to be having unpleasant effects.

I suppose a week of fatigue and stiff neck count as adverse effects. Worth noting: I finally feel completely better today. Had to up my doses of piracetam to 5x 1.6g daily the past couple days, but I think I finally burned through all the excess acetylcholine.

I'm 31, 6' tall, approx 140lbs. My diet is high in protein and lipids. I don't shy away from carbs, but I do avoid refined sugar and alcohol. I don't work out, but I do make a point of briskly walking everywhere, since as a programmer I spend too much time sitting down in front of the computer. I was off cigarettes for a while, using an e-cig, but I killed the batteries on it---so I'm back on tobacco while I wait for my Provari. Due to the suspected risks associated with consuming tobacco + sunifiram, I have been avoiding sunifiram until I'm off tobacco again. I also tend to drink a lot of coffee and tea, and have been taking C60-EVOO every day since the spring.

For me, 3x 10mg coluracetam daily for three days was substantially too much, and the after-effects persisted a full 7 days.

[Leadingdaway]

I'm starting my third week of coluracetam. Dose range from 5-10 mg sublingual BID. During the first week, coluracetam had a pronounced calm, mood lift, if not anxiolytic effect. It seemed as if I had an impenetrable anti-stress shield of some sort, and managed to brush off things I normally blew a fuse over. My mind was unusually serene and quiet; it was a great feeling! I was glad to notice the effects persist through a three day hiatus. The effects are not as pronounced now, but my current stress threshold still remain significantly above baseline. Unfortunately, I don't "feel" acute effects any longer. By acute effects I don't mean euphoria, I mean that taking it doesn't add or improve current state of mind. I no longer notice a difference between on or off days. Could it be a tolerance issue or placebo maybe? BTW, I haven't observed any nootropic effects thus far.

EDIT: To my pleasant surprise, RLS symptoms have been AWOL for the last two weeks.

STACKS:

Coluracetam 5mg Aniracetam 300mg
Found this to be a good mix. Processed things with ease along with mood stability. Felt a bit spacey, and quite strange, as if my head was detached from my body. This feeling didn't have negative effects on motor balance or any other areas, as far as I'm concerned.


Coluracetam 5mg Sunifiram 5mg, CQ10 200mg
Clear thinking more of what I expeted from coluracetam, but developed a severe headache on the left frontal paranasal sinus region an hour after ingestion. Needless to say, I will not be trying this combo again.

Coluracetam 5mg aniracetam 200mg Phenylpiracetam 175mg ALCAR 500mg
Took this an hour before my presentation/lecture.This was an incredibly powerful combo! I felt calm but stimulated, word flowed out of my mouth effortlessly. This combo seems to synergize both potency and duration. The effects were noticeable for what appeared to be eight hours or so. In many respects, this combo is similar to low dose aTM without the psychedelic effects. I will reserve this combo for days when I have to be at my best.

Edited by Leadingdaway, 18 October 2013 - 04:08 PM.

[renodino]

Thanks for the data, ThePhoeren.

For comparison, I'm 50, about 6'1" and 250lbs (and working hard to lower that number). No coffee, but do drink weak iced tea during the day; I do knock back a 5 hour energy shot before my daily workouts. I'm dieting, so its fresh fruit for breakfast, simple light lunch, and mostly chicken soup for dinner. I smoke 5-6 cigars a week. I've been spinning 75-90 minutes every day.for a couple months. I take a couple flaxseed oil caps every day, along with low dose aspirin.

The biggest variations seem to be age and weight, tho I wonder about the exersize levels, and maybe omega-3 intake ?

As an aside, I've been off colu for 3 days now, and must say the emotional lift seems to linger, I've been in a pretty positive mood the entire time, despite having some challenging issues at work.

[typ3z3r0]

Has anyone else had trouble with sublingual absorption? I bought mine from ND (NootropicsDepot) and have been weighing 10mg and dropping it under my tongue. Even if I leave it under there for 15-30 mins, and then look back under my tongue, there's just a pool of saliva with the coluracetam floating on top or stuck underneath my tongue.

Are there any perceivable differences with oral absorption for anyone besides potential stomach upset, and is there data on the bioavailability when used orally?

Thanks!

Edited by typ3z3r0, 24 October 2013 - 08:05 AM.

[typ3z3r0]

is there data on the bioavailability when used orally?

Sorry, hadn't read over the whole thread in a while and just saw that ScienceGuy answered this previously (there isn't).

Anyway, today was my second day dosing coluracetam 10mg TID (letting each dose sit under my tongue for 15-30 mins before washing it down with water). The first dose I took seemed to enhance my vision slightly. The third dose that I took today, I co-administered with aniracetam and noticed greater vision enhancement than from any of the previous doses, and I definitely felt more talkative/social than usual. I've also noticed quite a sense of calm like other people. It's definitely anxyliotic, and I have noticed that negative thoughts have not made me feel as down as they normally would, and I feel more positive than usual about myself.

[Ben]

NOTE: Neither Nootropicsdepot or Newstarnootropics have COA (certificates of analysis) for their coluractam.

This means that you are trusting that the chinese powder both companies sell you contains nothing toxic--acutely or chronically (like something cancer causing.)

It's up to you whether you want to blindly trust Chinese chemical plants.


Demand a COA before purchase.

Edited by Ben, 24 October 2013 - 11:04 AM.

[typ3z3r0]

ND do have a COA provided on their site (http://i.imgur.com/i4eVJwZ.jpg), and NSN have an H-NMR provided on their site (http://www.newstarno...MR-20130923.pdf)...

[Isochroma]

New Star Nootropics' Coluracetam is sourced from Season Zhu <sales07@trustwe.com> T&W GROUP.
They are in the Coluracetam section of the Racetam Prices list which is how New Star Nootropics found them.

Email I received from Season on 2013/10/11:

"Hello,

Good news- Coluracetam is ready! Please check the spectrums as attached. We have successfully made it and the quality is good.

In case of interest, please contact me for more information.

Have a nice weekend.

Thanks,
Season"

Attached are the PDFs of their Coluracetam's HNMR, LCMS and HPLC spectra. NSN only posted the NMR PDF. The NMR exactly matches Season's.
After finding the match I emailed Season about it. Below is her reply:

"Hi Jason,

Thanks for your reply.

You know the whole market so sell. Thanks so much for posting me as the supplier and many people contacted me because of this. So if you need anything from us, I’ll offer a special discount for you.

New Star Nootropics isn’t my client, so I’m not sure about their information. They seem to buy 1kg every month.

If any question, please feel free to ask me.

Best regards,

Season"

Another salesperson at her company sells New Star Nootropics their Coluracetam shipments but she was able to lookup NSN's file and find out that they have been buying 1kg per month.

Attached Files

•  Coluracetam HPLC.PDF   56.51KB   23 downloads
•  Coluracetam LCMS.PDF   62.21KB   10 downloads
•  Coluracetam NMR.pdf   54.72KB   13 downloads

Edited by Isochroma-Reborn, 24 October 2013 - 03:12 PM.

[Ben]

ND do have a COA provided on their site (http://i.imgur.com/i4eVJwZ.jpg), and NSN have an H-NMR provided on their site (http://www.newstarno...MR-20130923.pdf)...

That COA is invalid. No lab's name is mentioned. An H-NMR is not a COA.

Edited by Ben, 29 October 2013 - 05:14 PM.

[Isochroma]

Ben: You have quite a talent at ignoring my posts. Apparently you did not download the two COAs to find they match and apparently you have ignored the fact that I received and have posted above direct confirmation from the named Chinese manufacturer that indeed they have been selling 1kg of Coluracetam per month to New Star Nootropics.

I advise you to buy yourself a good nootropic stack to improve your brain function. Oxiracetam plus Sunifiram taken every three hours works miracles.

[NG_F]

Hey Guys, I've noticed that NSN has been out of stock for a while with Ani and coluracetam. Does anyone have an idea when they're supposed to be getting more in? The ani I'm not concerned about as I still have lots and its easily attainable.
I contacted LM and they told me that their colu is through NewMind. Has anyone had experience with NM colu and would you say or think its on Par with the colu from NSN?

Any recommendations would greatly be appreciated.

Currently running: 3cc's of Cere, 5mgs Ritalin, 4gms of Piracetam, 1gram of Aniracetam, 300mgs Phenylracetam, and 25mgs of sertraline.
Ritalin and Pir with Phenyl is in the morning,with Cere,Ani and sert in the Evening.

Brain Damage Hx : 2 concussions,moderate with no loss of consciousness (1991 and 1999)
Small Caudate Nucleus hemorrhage from Rapid BP spike during a botched Benzo detox.

Thanks in Advance guys

[p3x888]

Not that I am doubting, just one question. I thought New Star only released Coluracetam once. It seems strange that they are buying one kilo per month unless they are hoarding it. Again, not doubting, just posing a question.

Edited by p3x888, 02 November 2013 - 07:03 AM.

[Isochroma]

NG_F: Use the Racetam Prices list [Mirror 1 | Mirror 2]. Bookmark it.
It's updated very often - sometimes daily.

Since days ago the world's only other Coluracetam bulk powder supplier has been listed and they are in stock as of today. With lower prices than NSN to boot. Reboot.

Edited by Isochroma-Reborn, 02 November 2013 - 09:39 PM.

[typ3z3r0]

Has anyone else had fasciculations/muscle twitches which may be attributable to coluracetam? So far I've been on coluracetam for about two weeks, and have been consuming 4 to 8 eggs daily, and today for at least three hours, I had fasciculations in one of my triceps, and over the past couple of days I have had some short-lived fasciculations in one of my thighs. I'm guessing too much acetylcholine is the cause and that I should either stop using coluracetam or consume less eggs.

[▲420MD]

Has anyone done independent testing on the "debated" NM Coluracetam? Like GS/HPLC?

[FW900]

Has anyone else had fasciculations/muscle twitches which may be attributable to coluracetam? So far I've been on coluracetam for about two weeks, and have been consuming 4 to 8 eggs daily, and today for at least three hours, I had fasciculations in one of my triceps, and over the past couple of days I have had some short-lived fasciculations in one of my thighs. I'm guessing too much acetylcholine is the cause and that I should either stop using coluracetam or consume less eggs.

I have experienced fasiculations as well. However, I have had occasional fasiculations in the past before my use of Coluracetam. Like you, I also am curious as to whether or not people are experiencing fasiculations as a side-effect of using Coluracetam.

I would not say that Coluracetam (directly) caused the fasiculations, it merely exacerbated their frequency. However, it seems the fasiculation effect from it has since dissipated and I do not notice any increase in fasiculations whenever I take Coluracetam. I only think individuals predisposed to fasiculations are susceptible; as I've given multiple dosages to one friend and one relative of mine and neither of them have experienced fasiculations.

[typ3z3r0]

I have experienced fasiculations as well. However, I have had occasional fasiculations in the past before my use of Coluracetam. Like you, I also am curious as to whether or not people are experiencing fasiculations as a side-effect of using Coluracetam.

I don't actually remember ever experiencing fasciculations before my use of coluracetam, so they were actually a little bit worrying for me. Haha. Glad to see that I'm not the only one.

[NG_F]

NG_F: Use the Racetam Prices list [Mirror 1 | Mirror 2]. Bookmark it.
It's updated very often - sometimes daily.

Since days ago the world's only other Coluracetam bulk powder supplier has been listed and they are in stock as of today. With lower prices than NSN to boot. Reboot.

Thanks Isochroma. Was it in stock earlier today as I was away in the U.S and got back 10:00 p.m Eastern time and it shows out of stock for the liquid solution.?

Why is there such a large disparity between different wholesalers for the same amount of said product ? Are they all supplied by one main manufacturer in the far East?

Is Cere an independent manufacturer.How could one know the quality and authenticity of said product, Is it all about trials and Word of Mouth, as we all know that COA's have lately become very spurious!

Thanks Much for the Price list. I did indeed bookmark it.I need help more then ever now :( AND.. I need some COLUR in my life!

[3AlarmLampscooter]

To confound things, I've had fasciculations in the past, but not on Coluracetam.

[Isochroma]

Price disparities exist due to market inefficiencies.

The Racetam Prices list exists to destroy market inefficiencies by increasing market transparency within the classes of products it lists. The method it uses to accomplish this effect is the widespread distribution of worldwide supplier, payment, shipment and price data to buyers everywhere at zero cost. By lowering the time and financial cost of price discovery to near-zero, over time it will also force the average intersupplier price delta to near-zero, resulting in supplier consolidation and - for better or worse - reduced competition.

Since I created it back around 2009 - not the oldest date listed in the list itself due to supplier changes - it has resulted in continuous market consolidation and price range compression. It means that suppliers with higher-than-average prices lower them and suppliers with lower-than-average prices raise them. Price range compression occurs when a formerly inefficient market is forced to become an efficient market via increased market transparency.

When suppliers' prices approach very closely to each other a new dynamic takes hold - supplier consolidation. Typically smaller suppliers are forced out of the market or bought up by larger suppliers. This can eventually result in oligopoly or monopoly. The list is a brutal destroyer.

Now that a major secondary Coluracetam supplier is listed I expect that market segment to consolidate and price-compress within coming months. It is already known that New Star's operator(s) have used the list to find their Coluracetam manufacturer and likely regularly consult the list for other purposes, therefore it can be expected that at minimum unimodal compression will occur.

Edited by Isochroma-Reborn, 03 November 2013 - 04:57 AM.

[NG_F]

Price disparities exist due to market inefficiencies.

The Racetam Prices list exists to destroy market inefficiencies by increasing market transparency within the classes of products it lists. The method it uses to accomplish this effect is the widespread distribution of worldwide supplier, payment, shipment and price data to buyers everywhere at zero cost. By lowering the time and financial cost of price discovery to near-zero, over time it will also force the average intersupplier price delta to near-zero, resulting in supplier consolidation and - for better or worse - reduced competition.

Since I created it back around 2009 - not the oldest date listed in the list itself due to supplier changes - it has resulted in continuous market consolidation and price range compression. Price range compression occurs when a formerly inefficient market is forced to become an efficient market via increased market transparency.

Now that a major secondary Coluracetam supplier is listed I expect that market segment to consolidate and price-compress within coming months. It is already known that New Star's operator(s) have used the list to find their Coluracetam manufacturer and likely regularly consult the list for other purposes, therefore it can be expected that at minimum unimodal compression will occur.

Thanks for the Enrichment Isochroma. I wasn't aware of such politics with the racetams, but like any other lucrative business It's bound to exist in an attempt to create a monopoly.

So was this low cost the reason the Secondary supplier went out of stock so quickly? Also can you please tell me if I'd be in good hands with NM as one of the primary distributors. I really want to use this compound to help with my condition.

How are the major primary and secondary suppliers designated(1&2), is there a code, letter or color? Thanks Much........

[Isochroma]

NewMind is a well-established nootropic seller so I expect you won't be ripped off.
That said, I have never purchased from them but will likely in the future.

Finally, NewMind does not accept PayPal payment so a buyer has no way to get his money back should the product not arrive or be otherwise unacceptable. New Star Nootropics does take PayPal payment so is much safer in that regard.

However, NewMind does take Credit Card payments. Certain card policies do allow chargebacks in case of retail fraud or non-receipt of product. Buyers should check with their card issuer(s) before purchasing so they understand the risks and potential remedies should the product not arrive or be otherwise defective.

[NG_F]

NewMind is a well-established nootropic seller so I expect you won't be ripped off.
That said, I have never purchased from them but will likely in the future.

Finally, NewMind does not accept PayPal payment so a buyer has no way to get his money back should the product not arrive or be otherwise unacceptable. New Star Nootropics does take PayPal payment so is much safer in that regard.

However, NewMind does take Credit Card payments. Certain card policies do allow chargebacks in case of retail fraud or non-receipt of product. Buyers should check with their card issuer(s) before purchasing so they understand the risks and potential remedies should the product not arrive or be otherwise defective.

Thanks for your reassurance Isochroma I just picked up some Oxiracetam from NSN and I know its one of your fave's for quite a few good reasons.

What are your thoughts and viewpoints on Sunifiram? I now you recommended the Oxiracetam/Sunifiram stack to Ben T.I.D. Have you yourself tried that stack before?

[Isochroma]

Sure! About 4 hours ago.

The combination works to defeat the toughest daytime brain fatigue, fog and dropouts/microsleeps. Sunifiram is the most stimulating of the racerams and Oxiracetam is the cleanest, most stimulating of the racetams - aside from the tolerance-inducing and grossly expensive Phenylpiracetam.

Only Oxiracetam and Phenylpiracetam have the unique additional effect of decreasing physical fatigue. They do so because they can re-power all the body's mitochondria - not just brain mitochondria. About three weeks ago I finally discovered why. The two share a unique molecular feature not found in any other racetam. Hydroxylation at the 4-position on the pyrrolidine ring.

Oxiracetam: 4-hydroxy-2-oxo-1-pyrrolidine acetamide
Phenylpiracetam's main metabolite: 4-hydroxycarphedon. It's secondary metabolite is 3-hydroxycarphedon.

Oxiracetam is also the strongest re-enabler of mitochondria in general, beating the peak effect of Piracetam and Aniracetam. Both science and careful self-testing of many racetams against the toughest of degenerative brain disease have shown the same results.

[Isochroma]

Regarding supplier legitimacy: there is an online tool known as SafeOrScam to check them.

You type the supplier's website URL into SOS's validator and click the Go button for details.

New Star Nootropics currently has a rating of 10.0 which is perfect.
NewMind has no rating as of yet but two posters commenting.

[NG_F]

Sure! About 4 hours ago.

The combination works to defeat the toughest daytime brain fatigue, fog and dropouts/microsleeps. Sunifiram is the most stimulating of the racerams and Oxiracetam is the cleanest, most stimulating of the racetams - aside from the tolerance-inducing and grossly expensive Phenylpiracetam.

Only Oxiracetam and Phenylpiracetam have the unique additional effect of decreasing physical fatigue. They do so because they can re-power all the body's mitochondria - not just brain mitochondria. About three weeks ago I finally discovered why. The two share a unique molecular feature not found in any other racetam. Hydroxylation at the 4-position on the pyrrolidine ring.

Oxiracetam: 4-hydroxy-2-oxo-1-pyrrolidine acetamide
Phenylpiracetam's main metabolite: 4-hydroxycarphedon. It's secondary metabolite is 3-hydroxycarphedon.

Oxiracetam is also the strongest re-enabler of mitochondria in general, beating the peak effect of Piracetam and Aniracetam. Both science and careful self-testing of many racetams against the toughest of degenerative brain disease have shown the same results.

Yes I read that post about making an engine run faster without adding any fuel.You found Methylphenidate to be repleting and toxic in the long run and you were very fond of Oxiracetam's ability to replenish mitochondria.

I could definitely use this, as the caudate lesion disrupts my dopamine reward circuit, keeps me unmotivated and abulic as well as never feeling fully rested.I have sleep apnea, I use cpap and my studies are going good with improved Spo2 levels with minimum desaturations.

I feel that certain combos may be able to really keep me motivated for extended hours at a time. I build custom computers for gamers and video editing and am doing well, but sometimes I procrastinate or cant get in the right mind frame to start that push and get the project rolling and finished within a reasonable time.

You seem very knowledgeable in organic Chemistry.Is that your background? I took it and did well in High school and College but that was before my accidents.

Thanks very much for sharing your ideas, Insights and experiences,as well as the mechanism of action as to how these nootropics work to create a positive healing enviornment. I really do appreciate it

Regarding supplier legitimacy: there is an online tool known as SafeOrScam to check them.

You type the supplier's website URL into SOS's validator and click the Go button for details.

New Star Nootropics currently has a rating of 10.0 which is perfect.
NewMind has no rating as of yet but two posters commenting.

Thanks for this

[Isochroma]

NG_F: There are no marjor or secondary supplier designations in the Racetam Prices list.

I just meant that in the case of Coluracetam a second supplier has recently been added - namely NewMind. Their pricing is lower than New Star's so for many they may be their 'primary' or 'preferred' supplier. It's all up to you.