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Intelligent Design and Science – In or Out?

id debate intelligent design is id science god and sience creationism neutral id position

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#571 serp777

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Posted 05 June 2014 - 12:20 AM

Science is a process, not a position.  It does not rule anything out in advance.  So I do not care whether you believe in any of hundreds of evolutionary views, they all stand or fall on the evidence.  ID will do the same.  It is being prejudged based, not on the evidence but on naturalism.  Let the debate continue and science as well.  We will find out.  So ID is in as a scientific topic of study.  Look at this group.

http://www.longecity...-19#entry666779
 

 

Yes, and science also does not technically rule out leprechauns, Santa Claus, and the celestial teapot, so I do not care whether you believe in magical fairies or pink unicorns or any other unprovable proposition. At least you admit evolutionary views are based on evidence, like the neanderthal one I just gave you, which you conveniently ignored. Intelligent design isn't based on any evidence--it's only based on your personal bias and credulity

 

By your same logic, fairies are now a subject of scientific consideration since science does not rule them out in advance. Why do you keep making this same ridiculous argument that was destroyed centuries ago?

 

So this thread should also be called:

 

Science and Celestial teapot - In or out?

 

Science and Dragons - In or out?

 

Science and evil alien overlords from alpha centuari- In or out?


Edited by serp777, 05 June 2014 - 12:23 AM.


#572 shadowhawk

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Posted 05 June 2014 - 01:26 AM

 

Science is a process, not a position.  It does not rule anything out in advance.  So I do not care whether you believe in any of hundreds of evolutionary views, they all stand or fall on the evidence.  ID will do the same.  It is being prejudged based, not on the evidence but on naturalism.  Let the debate continue and science as well.  We will find out.  So ID is in as a scientific topic of study.  Look at this group.

http://www.longecity...-19#entry666779
 

 

Yes, and science also does not technically rule out leprechauns, Santa Claus, and the celestial teapot, so I do not care whether you believe in magical fairies or pink unicorns or any other unprovable proposition. At least you admit evolutionary views are based on evidence, like the neanderthal one I just gave you, which you conveniently ignored. Intelligent design isn't based on any evidence--it's only based on your personal bias and credulity

 

By your same logic, fairies are now a subject of scientific consideration since science does not rule them out in advance. Why do you keep making this same ridiculous argument that was destroyed centuries ago?

 

So this thread should also be called:

 

Science and Celestial teapot - In or out?

 

Science and Dragons - In or out?

 

Science and evil alien overlords from alpha centuari- In or out?

 

Nonsense.


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#573 serp777

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Posted 05 June 2014 - 01:44 AM

Yes because you're God and you're the ultimate judge of sense. Argument from personal incredulity. You use so many fallacies its comical. If you're not intelligent enough to understand the argument, that's okay, not everyone is cut out for intellectual discourse, but it doesn't mean it's nonsense.


Edited by serp777, 05 June 2014 - 02:34 AM.

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#574 Duchykins

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Posted 05 June 2014 - 03:00 AM

Read the posts again.  You dont have a clue what you are talking about.

The topic is not about defining unrelated terms and if you dont understand something or want to go off topic, Google it.
http://en.wikipedia....Null_hypothesis
 


Lol look at how far your ego defense mechanisms run, they're out of control. This is absolutely hysterical!

How does ID explain the diversity of life? Needs to be scientific. Stop being a coward and talk about ID, the actual topic of this thread.
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#575 serp777

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Posted 05 June 2014 - 04:26 AM

 

Read the posts again.  You dont have a clue what you are talking about.

The topic is not about defining unrelated terms and if you dont understand something or want to go off topic, Google it.
http://en.wikipedia....Null_hypothesis
 


Lol look at how far your ego defense mechanisms run, they're out of control. This is absolutely hysterical!

How does ID explain the diversity of life? Needs to be scientific. Stop being a coward and talk about ID, the actual topic of this thread.

 

 

NO DUDE DON'T WORRY. He can just tell us what is right or wrong. We don't need logic or good arguments. Just try not to think about it so much and accept Jesus into your life. Obviously ID explains the diversity of life cuz the trinity or whatever created all of creation 2014 years ago (approximation based on bible evidence) and made up all of this evidence for evolution to trick us faithless idiots. You point out a flaw in ID? God works in mysterious ways.


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#576 JohnBonham

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Posted 05 June 2014 - 11:20 AM

"For a start, how is the existence of the other universes to be tested? To be sure, all cosmologists accept that there are some regions of the universe that lie beyond the reach of our telescopes, but somewhere on the slippery slope between that and the idea that there are an infinite number of universes, credibility reaches a limit. As one slips down that slope, more and more must be accepted on faith, and less and less is open to scientific verification. Extreme multiverse explanations are therefore reminiscent of theological discussions. Indeed, invoking an infinity of unseen universes to explain the unusual features of the one we do see is just as ad hoc as invoking an unseen Creator. The multiverse theory may be dressed up in scientific language, but in essence it requires the same leap of faith."

 Paul Davies, A Brief History of the Multiverse

 
 
This quote isn't intended to be an argument for a God. Calm down trolls. 
 
 

Edited by JohnBonham, 05 June 2014 - 11:21 AM.

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#577 shadowhawk

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Posted 05 June 2014 - 05:39 PM

It is not an argument for God but it isn't an argument against one either.  My difference with Him is in what he calls faith.  It does have huge problems for explaining many aspects of the existing world but this topic isn't about that.


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#578 serp777

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Posted 05 June 2014 - 09:21 PM

 

"For a start, how is the existence of the other universes to be tested? To be sure, all cosmologists accept that there are some regions of the universe that lie beyond the reach of our telescopes, but somewhere on the slippery slope between that and the idea that there are an infinite number of universes, credibility reaches a limit. As one slips down that slope, more and more must be accepted on faith, and less and less is open to scientific verification. Extreme multiverse explanations are therefore reminiscent of theological discussions. Indeed, invoking an infinity of unseen universes to explain the unusual features of the one we do see is just as ad hoc as invoking an unseen Creator. The multiverse theory may be dressed up in scientific language, but in essence it requires the same leap of faith."

 Paul Davies, A Brief History of the Multiverse

 
 
This quote isn't intended to be an argument for a God. Calm down trolls. 
 
 

 

 

No one said it was an argument for God lol. Are you talking to the supernatural?

 

But the quote is just factually wrong, and this Davies guy is just some crackpot. He's welcome to say there is no scientific basis, Except that the evidence of reality points to a multiverse theory. No one said it's certainly right, I said it was probably right. If all religious people started saying that religion is probably right, but there is still a significant margin of error, then that would make religious belief equivalent to a likely postulation of the multiverse theory. So in no way does it resemble theological discussions.

You might ask what the scientific basis is anyways though? Firstly, the multiverse theory provides a physical explanation of. That in itself does not support the multiverse theory at all, but it's better than just saying "SUPERNATURAL" or rather "NO EXPLANATION AT ALL." At least the multiverse theory has a chance of being verified through science.

 

Here's why-

"Level I: Beyond our cosmological horizon

A generic prediction of chaotic inflation is an infinite ergodic universe, which, being infinite, must contain Hubble volumes realizing all initial conditions.

Accordingly, an infinite universe will contain an infinite number of Hubble volumes, all having the same physical laws and physical constants. In regard to configurations such as the distribution of matter, almost all will differ from our Hubble volume. However, because there are infinitely many, far beyond the cosmological horizon, there will eventually be Hubble volumes with similar, and even identical, configurations. Tegmark estimates that an identical volume to ours should be about 1010115 meters away from us.[9] Given infinite space, there would, in fact, be an infinite number of Hubble volumes identical to ours in the universe.[10] This follows directly from the cosmological principle, wherein it is assumed our Hubble volume is not special or unique."

 

There is significant evidence for chaotic inflation as well, which would support these deductions.

 

And here is the quantum mechanical interpretation-

 

"In brief, one aspect of quantum mechanics is that certain observations cannot be predicted absolutely. Instead, there is a range of possible observations, each with a different probability. According to the MWI, each of these possible observations corresponds to a different universe. Suppose a die is thrown that contains six sides and that the numeric result of the throw corresponds to a quantum mechanics observable. All six possible ways the die can fall correspond to six different universes."

 

http://en.wikipedia....antum_mechanics

 

This explains why probabilities are quantized to certain values in quantum mechanics. Black hole analyses and singularities also suggest that certain regions of space are causually separated.

 

Of course none of this is guaranteed. But when several different scientific theories converge on the same conclusion, that conclusion is probably right. The higgs boson, for example is good evidence of the general predictive power of science. It was predicted 30 years ago from mathematical analyses while this Davies guy would probably argue the kind of analysis is just theology. It is simply not just theology. Theology makes no reasonable predictions at all, but science does.


Edited by serp777, 05 June 2014 - 09:21 PM.


#579 shadowhawk

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Posted 05 June 2014 - 11:39 PM

Paul Davis is a top writer on scientific subjects.  I have most of his books and he is no crackpot even though I disagree with him sometimes.  However, you do like to call people names.

http://en.wikipedia....iki/Paul_Davies

 

 


Edited by shadowhawk, 05 June 2014 - 11:46 PM.

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#580 serp777

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Posted 06 June 2014 - 01:54 AM

Paul Davis is a top writer on scientific subjects.  I have most of his books and he is no crackpot even though I disagree with him sometimes.  However, you do like to call people names.

http://en.wikipedia....iki/Paul_Davies

 

 

 

You frequently use argumentative fallacies, so I am welcome to use a few ad hominems. If he says wrong things in spite of scientific evidence, then he is a crack pot. I don't care if you consider him a top writer. I don't care about arguments from authority. His status has nothing to do with reality or truth.
 


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#581 shadowhawk

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Posted 07 June 2014 - 09:25 PM

 

Paul Davis is a top writer on scientific subjects.  I have most of his books and he is no crackpot even though I disagree with him sometimes.  However, you do like to call people names.

http://en.wikipedia....iki/Paul_Davies

 

 

 

You frequently use argumentative fallacies, so I am welcome to use a few ad hominems. If he says wrong things in spite of scientific evidence, then he is a crack pot. I don't care if you consider him a top writer. I don't care about arguments from authority. His status has nothing to do with reality or truth.
 

 

1. You haven’t identified any fallacy
2.  You justify your own many fallacies by claiming someone else did it.  This is another logical fallacy.  Does everyone get to do this?

You have produced no reason ID should not be scientifically studied which is the topic.

So you don’t like Paul Davis and call him names. :) Have a good day



#582 serp777

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Posted 07 June 2014 - 10:46 PM

 

 

Paul Davis is a top writer on scientific subjects.  I have most of his books and he is no crackpot even though I disagree with him sometimes.  However, you do like to call people names.

http://en.wikipedia....iki/Paul_Davies

 

 

 

You frequently use argumentative fallacies, so I am welcome to use a few ad hominems. If he says wrong things in spite of scientific evidence, then he is a crack pot. I don't care if you consider him a top writer. I don't care about arguments from authority. His status has nothing to do with reality or truth.
 

 

1. You haven’t identified any fallacy
2.  You justify your own many fallacies by claiming someone else did it.  This is another logical fallacy.  Does everyone get to do this?

You have produced no reason ID should not be scientifically studied which is the topic.

So you don’t like Paul Davis and call him names. :) Have a good day

 

 

1. I have identified numerous fallacies that you never responded to.

2. I have only used one fallacy. And you clearly get to use numerous fallacies. Just because ad hominem was used to express how terrible your arguments were doesn't mean my arguments are incorrect. I only use ad hominem because you ignore most of my arguments, or deny them and claim "nonsense." This is when ad hominem starts to become fact. it's not an argument anyways, when all you can do is deny and ignore.

 

You have produced no reason ID should be scientifically studied. I've explained that ID is in the same category as leprechauns and Santa Claus, since these things also cannot be disproven. You have the burden of proof for why it should be distinguished from leprechauns and Santa Claus.

 

So you like Paul Davies. I didn't call him names, I used a descriptive adjective that describes him and you similarly. A crackpot is someone who denies something in spite of evidence.
 


Edited by serp777, 07 June 2014 - 11:15 PM.


#583 shadowhawk

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Posted 08 June 2014 - 01:33 AM

More name calling. :)  Not interested.



#584 serp777

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Posted 08 June 2014 - 02:47 AM

More name calling. :)  Not interested.

 

More denial. More red herring. Your arguments are so bad you cannot even respond except to deny.  Go link some more youtube videos since you cannot seem to make your own arguments. Perhaps a few scripture quotes would be good as well. :laugh:


Edited by serp777, 08 June 2014 - 02:51 AM.

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#585 shadowhawk

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Posted 09 June 2014 - 10:04 PM

 

More name calling. :)  Not interested.

 

More denial. More red herring. Your arguments are so bad you cannot even respond except to deny.  Go link some more youtube videos since you cannot seem to make your own arguments. Perhaps a few scripture quotes would be good as well. :laugh:

 

No evidence, nothing but hot air.


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#586 Duchykins

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Posted 09 June 2014 - 11:20 PM

Hey I know, let's get back to ID!

What's the biological mechanism of ID?
Hey I know, let's get back to ID!

What's the biological mechanism of ID?
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#587 serp777

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Posted 09 June 2014 - 11:25 PM

Hey I know, let's get back to ID!

What's the biological mechanism of ID?
Hey I know, let's get back to ID!

What's the biological mechanism of ID?

 

According to shadowhawk none of that matters. It's our job to prove that intelligent design is false and scientifically unreasonable, along with leprechauns, santa clause, and the celestial teapot. Lol don't give him logical advice, he won't listen.


Edited by serp777, 09 June 2014 - 11:25 PM.


#588 Duchykins

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Posted 09 June 2014 - 11:35 PM

But he gets mad if you ask him, I've been asking him for weeks and he's got nothing and he knows it. It's hilarious.
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#589 serp777

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Posted 09 June 2014 - 11:42 PM

But he gets mad if you ask him, I've been asking him for weeks and he's got nothing and he knows it. It's hilarious.

 

Perhaps if you ask him enough, he will quote some scripture or give you a youtube video of William lane Craig  :laugh: . Don't question the evidence though.


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#590 shadowhawk

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Posted 10 June 2014 - 12:00 AM

 

Hey I know, let's get back to ID!

What's the biological mechanism of ID?
Hey I know, let's get back to ID!

What's the biological mechanism of ID?

 

According to shadowhawk none of that matters. It's our job to prove that intelligent design is false and scientifically unreasonable, along with leprechauns, santa clause, and the celestial teapot. Lol don't give him logical advice, he won't listen.

 

That there is a real Santa Clause (who was intelligent by the way) and teapots do orbit the earth (also designed by Intelligence) is beyond you I know.  I wont try to explain it to you, because it is obviously beyond you.  I never knew St. Nick but I do believe He was intelligent and I never knew the maker or designer of the teapot but only an Idiot would think an IDer was not involved.
And though I don’t know the designer of most designed things, it is not illogical to suspect they are real.  So save your advice such as it is. :)
 



#591 serp777

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Posted 10 June 2014 - 12:16 AM

 

 

Hey I know, let's get back to ID!

What's the biological mechanism of ID?
Hey I know, let's get back to ID!

What's the biological mechanism of ID?

 

According to shadowhawk none of that matters. It's our job to prove that intelligent design is false and scientifically unreasonable, along with leprechauns, santa clause, and the celestial teapot. Lol don't give him logical advice, he won't listen.

 

That there is a real Santa Clause (who was intelligent by the way) and teapots do orbit the earth (also designed by Intelligence) is beyond you I know.  I wont try to explain it to you, because it is obviously beyond you.  I never knew St. Nick but I do believe He was intelligent and I never knew the maker or designer of the teapot but only an Idiot would think an IDer was not involved.
And though I don’t know the designer of most designed things, it is not illogical to suspect they are real.  So save your advice such as it is. :)
 

 

 

So the guy who always cries about ad hominem now uses it himself. LOL! All those tears were for nothing in the face of such hypocrisy.

 

"I wont try to explain it to you, because it is obviously beyond you."

Or you just don't have an explanation because your arguments are terrible.

 

Obviously you do not understand the point of my argument by trying to argue that Santa Clause and the celestial teapot are real, nor did you address leprechauns. By santa clause, I am referring to the traditional fat man, who rides around on a hypervelocity sleigh, propelled by the magic of reindeer who sustain their flight by galloping.

'

The real point is this

"Russell's teapot, sometimes called the celestial teapot or cosmic teapot, is an analogy first coined by the philosopher Bertrand Russell (1872–1970) to illustrate that the philosophic burden of proof lies upon a person making scientifically unfalsifiable claims rather than shifting the burden of proof to others,"

 

http://en.wikipedia....elestial_teapot
 

"Russell wrote that if he claims that a teapot orbits the Sun somewhere in space between the Earth and Mars, it is nonsensical for him to expect others to believe him on the grounds that they cannot prove him wrong."

 

*insert pointless, spammy emoticons that convey fake emotions

 

"And though I don’t know the designer of most designed things, it is not illogical to suspect they are real."

 

Some things are designed, therefore intelligent design is legit. LOL, OK. That must mean everything is designed since somethings are designed. No basis or proof of that whatsoever.

 

http://memegenerator...stance/36862657



#592 shadowhawk

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Posted 10 June 2014 - 01:32 AM

Do you think I called you a name?  I did not call you a name but I bet you thought it was about you from your response.  :)  All that writing because teapots are in space and Russell at the time didn't know a designer could put them there.  ID is part of nature and reality even though we may not, at this point, know who the designer is.  You are asking for proof before science has even been applied.  You won't believe in an artist even though we have a painting.  I don't care if you don't believe in an artist, just don't try to stop science from seeing if they can find one.



#593 serp777

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Posted 10 June 2014 - 02:35 AM

Do you think I called you a name?  I did not call you a name but I bet you thought it was about you from your response.  :)  All that writing because teapots are in space and Russell at the time didn't know a designer could put them there.  ID is part of nature and reality even though we may not, at this point, know who the designer is.  You are asking for proof before science has even been applied.  You won't believe in an artist even though we have a painting.  I don't care if you don't believe in an artist, just don't try to stop science from seeing if they can find one.

 

"ID is part of nature and reality even though we may not, at this point, know who the designer is."

 

Ok, do you have proof or evidence that intelligent design is behind the creation of life on earth? All the scientific evidence currently points, though doesn't 100% confirm, to the fact that life can emerge without intelligent design and on its own, through means of chemistry and physics.

 

The moon, sun, and wind were once considered by many to be Gods because they didn't know enough about the universe, and presumed the answer before they asked the question. of course those things were found to have physical explanations. The progress and discoveries made by science suggest that all things can probably be explained through physical, natural, and not intelligent causes; including the big ones such as consciousness, how the universe came to be, and how life began/evolved.

 

It hinders science to assume that there is no physical cause for all the complexity and initial development of life on earth. You don't assume fringe case probabilities as worth considering until new evidence arises. Another counterpoint is to say that "we could just be living in the matrix", but is that worth wasting time and resources on trying to determine if it is true or not?

 

you can make a huge number of different claims that have no evidence about the universe, and science neither rejects or accepts them. Intelligent design is no different until evidence arises.

 

"You are asking for proof before science has even been applied."

The difference is that science is moving in a direction that does not suggest intelligent design, and therefore it's not worth pursuing unless some counter evidence emerges. It is more logical and efficient to pursue ideas that are probably true, instead of pursuing all the ideas that are likely untrue. It's just allocation of resources.


Edited by serp777, 10 June 2014 - 02:39 AM.


#594 addx

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Posted 10 June 2014 - 09:45 AM

You are asking for proof before science has even been applied.


Exactly, people require something tangible to apply themselves as scientists. "It looks designed" doesn't cut it.

Think of it as an investment.

A person comes to you with an idea that creatures from different times are similar in some ways and presents these similarities and explains them in a way that makes sense. He shows you many such examples he figured out. You then decide to invest effort and commence deep research and produce a scientific paper for peer review. This effort was invested into the idea that was presented.


The idea that is presented with ID merely says "Some things look designed, here's a few, don't you agree? This couldn't possibly evolve out of random mutations, could it? That means there's something out there". Such a presentation doesn't produce a single clue for the direction of research. There's no information on where do we find this designer, where to start looking. There's no tangible clue leading to anything regarding this idea of design except the idea itself. There's nothing to start scientific research from except the mind of the idea presenter in the form of psychotherapy. The presenter in fact has the same idea, he would in fact like the scientist also to start from his mind, he would like the scientist to ask him more and he would provide more, he would provide the idea of God, he would provide his opinions about what lies beyond the universe. He would like his completely imagined ideas to be scientifically verified in this way by having a scientist succumb to his clear genius in disproving evolution with a mere thought (it looks designed) and then providing a whole theory that finally can explain all the issues in his own mind! This must be the truth of all people, but they don't know it yet.

Edited by addx, 10 June 2014 - 09:48 AM.


#595 shadowhawk

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Posted 10 June 2014 - 08:52 PM

Science

You start off with a hunch that something is true or not based on some observation.  Then you form a hypothesis as to its truth or falsity.  You then design ways to test your hypothesis and finally you come to a conclusion and perhaps a new hypothesis.  ."a method or procedure that has characterized natural science since the 17th century, consisting in systematic observation, measurement, and experiment, and the formulation, testing, and modification of hypotheses."

However don’t get to hung up on this because anyone who has studied the philosophy of science knows there is much dispute and many things are discovered by pure accident.  There are limitations to science. The point here is you don’t start with the conclusion.  You don’t rule out ID just because you cant first identify the designer.  Science is a process not a position.



#596 addx

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Posted 10 June 2014 - 09:06 PM

Science
You start off with a hunch that something is true or not based on some observation. 


Exactly.


And what have you observed in regards to ID, except a thought in your own mind: that while evolution looks plasubile there must have been something more!

A true observation of a phenomena would have scientists attemping to observe it again by figuring out how to provoke it or what causes it. Once the observation can be made repeatable true validated theories can arise.

Where can science go by observing a thought in your head?


Then you form a hypothesis as to its truth or falsity.  You then design ways to test your hypothesis and finally you come to a conclusion and perhaps a new hypothesis.  ."a method or procedure that has characterized natural science since the 17th century, consisting in systematic observation, measurement, and experiment, and the formulation, testing, and modification of hypotheses."

However dont get to hung up on this because anyone who has studied the philosophy of science knows there is much dispute and many things are discovered by pure accident.  There are limitations to science. The point here is you dont start with the conclusion.  You dont rule out ID just because you cant first identify the designer.  Science is a process not a position.

I rule out ID because it does not offer a true observation to start with. ID is quackery, not science.

#597 shadowhawk

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Posted 10 June 2014 - 09:57 PM

ID starts off with observation of what appears designed.  You haven't shown it is not and that hunch is being explored.



#598 serp777

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Posted 10 June 2014 - 10:57 PM

Science

You start off with a hunch that something is true or not based on some observation.  Then you form a hypothesis as to its truth or falsity.  You then design ways to test your hypothesis and finally you come to a conclusion and perhaps a new hypothesis.  ."a method or procedure that has characterized natural science since the 17th century, consisting in systematic observation, measurement, and experiment, and the formulation, testing, and modification of hypotheses."

However don’t get to hung up on this because anyone who has studied the philosophy of science knows there is much dispute and many things are discovered by pure accident.  There are limitations to science. The point here is you don’t start with the conclusion.  You don’t rule out ID just because you cant first identify the designer.  Science is a process not a position.

 

The hypothesis that is likely is that life can emerge on it's own through natural explanations and physical phenomenon, given the huge number of combinations of different planets in the universe, and the incomprehensibly large number of places that have similar conditions to those of early earth, or even other planetary conditions (such as those on Titan) which could give rise to an entirely new kind of life.

 

Even your favorite guy, william lane craig, argues that life has a non zero probability of emerging by itself.

 

  One of the main goals of science currently is to find the mechanisms and first self replicating molecules formed from basic amino acids, and it has made great progress towards that goal. Why does science think this? Because everything thus, like evolution and the standard model, has indicated that most things can be explained by physical phenomenon. most of the things in this universe are not designed. It does not help to say "Well maybe some God did it, and there is no physical explanation." The only things that are known to have been designed have been designed by primates on this planet.

 

"There are limitations to science."

Asusmption. You do not know what you cannot know. You do not know the maximum potential of science, or even if there is a limit.

 

"You don’t rule out ID just because you cant first identify the designer."

Science doesn't rule it out. it's just so unlikely that there are many other better theories worth pursuing before ID . It's like saying "Well you don't rule out leprechauns because you cant know they do not exist." It wouldn't be worth spending time and effort looking for leprechauns obviously. Did you not understand the allocation of resources argument that several people have given you?


Edited by serp777, 10 June 2014 - 11:01 PM.


#599 shadowhawk

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Posted 10 June 2014 - 11:48 PM

Again, you can engage in the old leprechauns nonsense all you want but this is a question of science.  You don't have to spend a moment on it and others will.  We will see.


Edited by shadowhawk, 10 June 2014 - 11:49 PM.

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#600 serp777

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Posted 11 June 2014 - 12:02 AM

Again, you can engage in the old leprechauns nonsense all you want but this is a question of science.  You don't have to spend a moment on it and others will.  We will see.

"You don't have to spend a moment on it and others will."

 

Ok most scientists in the world will continue making progress, while you and other "crackpots" contribute nothing.

 

 

Again, this is the same old tired denial and lack of understanding. This is why you are the worst arguer on this forum; all you can do is deny, claim nonsense, quote scripture, and cry about ad hominem. You have no arguments so you just spout your counter claim without any justification. Are you so blind that you can't see the point of the leprechauns example? I literally addressed how it is relevant and you refuse to respond to those points. Are you incapable of reading my words?

 

This is not even a debate anymore, just another one of your denials. You're not the ultimate judge of sense; it's nonsense in your opinion, but clearly your opinion is useless since you don't support your claims with reasoning at all. You are an idiot.

 

HAVE A GOOD DAY FOOL :)

 

Please respond by crying about ad hominem now.


Edited by serp777, 11 June 2014 - 12:07 AM.






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