1569 replies to this topic

[Tim Ventura]

Mikey - can you elaborate a bit on your effects / experience with Dihexa from Nootropics Source? I'd be up to give this substance another try if I could get the effects that you're describing.

 

I took Dihexa from Nyles about 12 months ago - took it for just about 1 month. I took it sublingually, and if I went over a threshold of like 20mg a day, it gave me serious brain fog.

 

I took the dose down to around 15mg, and the brain fog went away, but I'm not sure if I ever saw any of the positive effects? It definitely did *something*, I'd love to give it another try. Been a while, but I came away with the feeling that there was enough that I should give it another shot at some point...

[mikey]

I wonder how effective as a sublingual, as it is not soluble in water.

 

DMSO is a potent solvent that dissolves Dihexa.

 

If you tried it using DMSO as a transdermal carrier I think that your experience would be more like mine.

 

I made a solution with DMSO, as was described by Debonaire Death, "500mg of Dihexa dissolves with relative ease into 30mL of DMSO, giving me a 16.667mg/mL solution; perfect, since the active dose regularly cited is around 15mg."

 

I am quite familiar with DMSO. I use it topically for aches and pains frequently. It's quite safe, even though the itching/burning sensation occurs.

 

DMSO was documented as being 1/7th as toxic as aspirin, orally. The best overall reference for DMSO is "DMSO: Nature's Healer," by Dr. Morton Walker. 

 

The first night I took the dropper with 1/2 ml of DMSO (~8 mg of Dihexa) and put drops on the inside of my elbow, where there's lots of blood supply so that the transdermal effect of DMSO can be optimal. The Dihexa did cause an improvement in focus, some uplift and an improved ability to communicate. I only put enough on the inside of my elbow that can be captured there, then I rub it in. So, it takes a few times to administer the full 1/2 ml or a full ml for ~16 mg.

 

I did administer 16 mg two times on the final day.

 

After not having it yesterday I find myself wanting to indulge because of the improvements in cognition that it presents.

 

I've had extremely challenging business that benefited from my trial of Dihexa.

 

I hope this helps.

 

 

Edited by mikey, 25 April 2017 - 06:49 PM.

[Tim Ventura]

Hey Mikey - and you're confirming that this was Nootropics Source Dihexa? I'll buy it right now. I have DMSO downstairs, I just don't use it much because there's really no "great" time of the day to slather it all over myself.

[mikey]

Hey Mikey - and you're confirming that this was Nootropics Source Dihexa? I'll buy it right now. I have DMSO downstairs, I just don't use it much because there's really no "great" time of the day to slather it all over myself.

 

Yes.

[Tim Ventura]

Sorry, another quick one: how long to dissolve the Dihexa in DMSO? Any tricks involved with that?

[mikey]

Sorry, another quick one: how long to dissolve the Dihexa in DMSO? Any tricks involved with that?

 

No. It's easy.

[Tim Ventura]

OK, just bought it. So we're looking at 1 ounce of DMSO to 500mg of Dihexa. Then a 1 ml dose on skin should equate to 15 mg dose, minus whatever skin absorption losses happen.

 

I checked my records, and the only thing I've purchased from Nootropics Source in the past was NA Acetyl Semax, however, it was quality & seemed to work well.

[ADHD]

Could we perhaps do a group buy on say 500 mg each with ten people from https://nootropicsou.../dihexa-powder/ ?

 

It would be nice if we were able to experiment a bit cheaper

 

I've never done a groupbuy before so how would it work? Paypal maybe?

Cheers.

[Tim Ventura]

My Dihexa arrived today - that's 2-day delivery, and I don't think I paid extra for shipping. I mixed 1-ounce of pure "Nature's Gift" DMSO with the 500mg of powder (and took the remaining 10mg or so that was stuck in the bottom crease of the ziplock bag sublingually). It was well packaged: sealed inside 3x packages, so getting it out was like unpacking a Matryoshka doll.

 

Long story short: the sublingual Dihexa seems to have started working quite rapidly, and I felt much more clear & focused than I did with Nyles batch, and that's only with 10mg. In fact, it came into my head a few minutes into this project, "this seems to be working pretty well sublingually - why am I mixing it with DMSO again?"

 

In any case, most of the Dihexa dissolved immediately, with a few flakes remaining in solution floating around. I put it in my 1-ounce solution into a hot-water bath, and the remainder dissolved in an hour or so. I put 1 ounce on my skin later in the day, didn't notice any new effects from it that hadn't started happening earlier from the sublingual dose.

 

 

[wanderlust]

 instead of a group buy ,It might be quicker and easier if someone spends around  £1000 pounds  on having Dihexa synthesized then supplies at a reasonable price (say half the retail price) only to active posting members of longecity.

 

They could also supply it in dmso solution at stated dosages with urea creams to reduce the rashes caused by the dmso

 

 

 

 

Edited by wanderlust, 29 April 2017 - 07:53 PM.

[Ark]

When I took Dihexa, I found putting it under my tongue and leaving it for a while then washing it down with grapefruit juice and piperine worked well for me as a alternative to DMSO.

[Ark]

Personally, I don't think DMSO is 100% safe long term.

[Ark]

https://www.ncbi.nlm.../pubmed/9397984

[Ark]

Exposure of primary rat hepatocytes in long-term DMSO culture to selected transition metals induces hepatocyte proliferation and formation of duct-like structures.

Cable EE1, Isom HC.
Author information
Abstract
We previously showed that primary rat hepatocytes plated on a rat-tail collagen coated dish and fed a chemically-defined medium supplemented with 2% dimethylsulfoxide (DMSO) can be maintained in a well-differentiated, non-replicating state for periods of several months. In this study, we show that the addition of copper, iron, and zinc to the DMSO-containing chemically defined medium induced DNA synthesis and cell replication during the first two months in culture without loss of hepatic differentiation. DNA synthesis occurred throughout the hepatocyte population without regard to cellular size. No changes were observed in properties indicative of well-differentiated hepatocytes, including cellular morphology, ultrastructure, albumin, or cytokeratin-8 expression. During the third month in culture, after the hepatocytes had become confluent, pseudoduct structures became apparent. Examination of cells lining the ducts by immunohistochemistry showed that these cells lost the ability to express albumin and stained more intensely for cytokeratin 19 and laminin. The ultrastructure of the cells lining the ducts was altered and became more characteristic of bile duct cells. Immunoelectron microscopy revealed that connexin 43, a marker of bile-duct proliferation, was expressed in the duct-like cells. We conclude that under these specific nutritive conditions, primary rat hepatocytes proliferate and, with time, begin to form duct-like structures with altered gene expression and ultrastructural properties.
PMID: 9397984 DOI: 10.1002/hep.510260611
[Indexed for MEDLINE]

"We conclude that under these specific nutritive conditions, primary rat hepatocytes proliferate and, with time, begin to form duct-like structures with altered gene expression and ultrastructural properties."

Something to consider, epically for those aiming for immortality.

[Tim Ventura]

Grapefruit juice is acidic, so I get that - although maybe redundant? The Nootropics Source batch seemed to have an effect in a small dose just sublingually, and I washed it down with water after that.

 

The DMSO delivery seems to work, although I'm having trouble gauging it. Today I felt a Dihexa effect about 20 minutes to 1/2 hour after putting the DMSO on my skin - seems longer than I would have guessed for it to soak through.

[lourdaud]

What's the point of using DMSO? Does it increase uptake? If so how much are we talking about?

[Ark]

Have you tried the DMSO without the Dihexa?

[mikey]

Personally, I don't think DMSO is 100% safe long term.

 

What data do you base your caution on?

 

Reading DMSO: Nature's Healer, by Walker, DMSO is 1/7th as "toxic" as aspirin. The book has hundreds of citations. It's quite a good resource.

 

There were over 300 studies and over 10,000 patient records showing how safe and effective DMSO is.

 

I've been using it topically or occasionally orally for years. It's likely safer than milk, except for the hot itchy skin rash.

 

FDA banned further research on it because no drug company can patent it and if Americans knew about it, there would likely be maybe a hundred billion dollars less in surgical costs, drugs costs, etc...

 

FDA/big pharma wants it to remain a secret so they've worked hard at disinformation about it.

 

There were three "60-Minutes" shows devoted to DMSO. That's how effective --- and safe - it was known to be.

 

Note that every race horse stable in the world has a big jug of DMSO that they put on million dollar race horses that start to limp. A couple weeks of DMSO application and they are healthy. 

 

And horses don't well respond to placebos...

Edited by mikey, 12 May 2017 - 06:02 PM.

[Mind_Paralysis]

What's the point of using DMSO? Does it increase uptake? If so how much are we talking about?

 

You know, now that you mention it... I honestly don't know?

DMSO does not seem to be a prerequisite in the studies and documentation which I find... Dihexa actually seems to be orally active and BBB-penetrating on its own.

 

The Brain Hepatocyte Growth Factor/c-Met Receptor System: A New Target for the Treatment of Alzheimer's Disease

. Dihexa is a first-in-class compound that is orally active, penetrates the blood-brain barrier

 

 

 

These experiments on Zebra-fish, for using Dihexa as an agent preventing hearing-loss from chemotherapy, also does not seem to imply that DMSO is necessary for attenuation of the effects - in fact, DMSO is instead used as a control, to see if Dihexa is better at preventing hearing-loss.

 

Hepatocyte growth factor mimetic protects lateral line hair cells from aminoglycoside exposure

https://www.ncbi.nlm...les/PMC4309183/

 

 

So yeah, why is everyone using Dihexa with DMSO?? Is it because of potential gastrointestinal side-effects? Absorption through the skin could certainly help with that.

 

BTW... is anyone brave and tough enough to apply DMSO CLOSER TO THE BRAIN? I.e, either applying Dihexa+DMSO to your shaved scalp/neck or to your throat? This should give the effects much, much quicker and STRONGER dosage - reaching the brain through these close blood-vessels in RECORD-TIME!! :D

As I understand it, DMSO stings quite a bit though, so I suppose that's why no one has done it yet... but it would definitively be more effective and above all, more ECONOMIC! : D Less Dihexa needs to be used then, if you reach the brain quicker.

 

 

EDIT:

 

Also just found this info:

 

Prospective Alzheimer's drug builds new brain cell connections, improves cognitive function of rats

https://www.scienced...21011090653.htm

 

can cross the blood-brain barrier. An added bonus is it can move from the gut into the blood, so it can be taken in pill form.

 

 

 

So, yeah... seems like the drugs inventors are even claiming it has absorption through the gut into the bloodstream, and then into the brain.

Edited by Stinkorninjor, 12 May 2017 - 06:01 PM.

[mikey]

What's the point of using DMSO? Does it increase uptake? If so how much are we talking about?

 

 

DMSO is a potent transdermal carrier and a solvent. It carries many things through the skin.

 

If you put some heroin on your inner elbow and rubbed a little DMSO on it you'd be high in a few minutes.

 

Please see: http://michiganmedic...44920-got-dmso/

 

The way to mix DMSO with Dihexa is in my earlier post.

 

I should say, so far, Dihexa seems like it may be the strongest agent that I've tried for focus.

 

I wish it were known to be safer. I don't want to use it regularly or too often, whatever that is.

[mikey]

 

What's the point of using DMSO? Does it increase uptake? If so how much are we talking about?

 

You know, now that you mention it... I honestly don't know?

DMSO does not seem to be a prerequisite in the studies and documentation which I find... Dihexa actually seems to be orally active and BBB-penetrating on its own.

 

The Brain Hepatocyte Growth Factor/c-Met Receptor System: A New Target for the Treatment of Alzheimer's Disease

. Dihexa is a first-in-class compound that is orally active, penetrates the blood-brain barrier

 

 

 

These experiments on Zebra-fish, for using Dihexa as an agent preventing hearing-loss from chemotherapy, also does not seem to imply that DMSO is necessary for attenuation of the effects - in fact, DMSO is instead used as a control, to see if Dihexa is better at preventing hearing-loss.

 

Hepatocyte growth factor mimetic protects lateral line hair cells from aminoglycoside exposure

https://www.ncbi.nlm...les/PMC4309183/

 

 

So yeah, why is everyone using Dihexa with DMSO?? Is it because of potential gastrointestinal side-effects? Absorption through the skin could certainly help with that.

 

BTW... is anyone brave and tough enough to apply DMSO CLOSER TO THE BRAIN? I.e, either applying Dihexa+DMSO to your shaved scalp/neck or to your throat? This should give the effects much, much quicker and STRONGER dosage - reaching the brain through these close blood-vessels in RECORD-TIME!! :D

As I understand it, DMSO stings quite a bit though, so I suppose that's why no one has done it yet... but it would definitively be more effective and above all, more ECONOMIC! : D Less Dihexa needs to be used then, if you reach the brain quicker.

 

 

EDIT:

 

Also just found this info:

 

Prospective Alzheimer's drug builds new brain cell connections, improves cognitive function of rats

https://www.scienced...21011090653.htm

 

can cross the blood-brain barrier. An added bonus is it can move from the gut into the blood, so it can be taken in pill form.

 

 

 

So, yeah... seems like the drugs inventors are even claiming it has absorption through the gut into the bloodstream, and then into the brain.

 

http://jpet.aspetjou.../1/141.full.pdf

They say, "“These results, which suggest that dihexa is very hydrophobic...”  So, rather than sublingual Dihexa, it can just be swallowed.

 

I did 8 mg total in DMSO an hour ago, by using the dropper and dropping some on my inner elbow and rubbing it in. Repeat with the other elbow and back and forth until the solution is used up. 

 

I can feel it in minutes. 

 

 

[Ark]

Personally, I don't think DMSO is 100% safe long term.

What data do you base your caution on?

Reading DMSO: Nature's Healer, by Walker, DMSO is 1/7th as "toxic" as aspirin. The book has hundreds of citations. It's quite a good resource.

There were over 300 studies and over 10,000 patient records showing how safe and effective DMSO is.

I've been using it topically or occasionally orally for years. It's likely safer than milk, except for the hot itchy skin rash.

FDA banned further research on it because no drug company can patent it and if Americans knew about it, there would likely be maybe a hundred billion dollars less in surgical costs, drugs costs, etc...

FDA/big pharma wants it to remain a secret so they've worked hard at disinformation about it.

There were three "60-Minutes" shows devoted to DMSO. That's how effective --- and safe - it was known to be.

Note that every race horse stable in the world has a big jug of DMSO that they put on million dollar race horses that start to limp. A couple weeks of DMSO application and they are healthy.

And horses don't well respond to placebos...

Curious have you researched DMSO and it's negative effects on gene expression?

https://www.google.c...mobile&ie=UTF-8

[Ark]

https://www.rockefel...rlier-expected/

(The importance of gene expression early on explained.)

[mikey]

 

 

Personally, I don't think DMSO is 100% safe long term.

What data do you base your caution on?

Reading DMSO: Nature's Healer, by Walker, DMSO is 1/7th as "toxic" as aspirin. The book has hundreds of citations. It's quite a good resource.

There were over 300 studies and over 10,000 patient records showing how safe and effective DMSO is.

I've been using it topically or occasionally orally for years. It's likely safer than milk, except for the hot itchy skin rash.

FDA banned further research on it because no drug company can patent it and if Americans knew about it, there would likely be maybe a hundred billion dollars less in surgical costs, drugs costs, etc...

FDA/big pharma wants it to remain a secret so they've worked hard at disinformation about it.

There were three "60-Minutes" shows devoted to DMSO. That's how effective --- and safe - it was known to be.

Note that every race horse stable in the world has a big jug of DMSO that they put on million dollar race horses that start to limp. A couple weeks of DMSO application and they are healthy.

And horses don't well respond to placebos...

Curious have you researched DMSO and it's negative effects on gene expression?

https://www.google.c...mobile&ie=UTF-8

 

 

The potential for negative effects of DMSO (or any potential beneficial molecule) is a matter of dosage or concentration. 

 

The in vitro study that you referenced said no problems until DMSO is used at "high concentrations."

 

Like almost any active beneficial molecule there is an optimal dosage range, where no cytotoxicity occurs, and the effects are positive or optimal and then there's what is basically an overdose. For DMSO the overdose amount is quite high.

 

I studies DMSO in depth about 10 years ago. It does not present significant toxicity, in general, unless the concentration is hundreds or thousands of times more than is necessary for the effect we are considering it.

 

For anyone that is interested in DMSO I do suggest reading DMSO: Nature's Healer, to get a solid background.

 

It's an amazing healing agent, as well as being an effective transdermal agent.

[Ark]

No worries there are pros and cons with everything, I try to nelagate the risk and discuss it, whenever I can, and that people should be careful since there aren't any studies mixing DMSO and Dehixea. So besides my concerns over DMSO long term saftey with gene expression, your taking a research chemical and mixing it with something unstudied. You may end up getting more of the drug than the therapeutic dosage or maybe it won't work at all...

All things considered good luck, and report back what you find please.


Cheers, Ark

Edited by Ark, 13 May 2017 - 08:18 PM.

[mike888]

Dear participants,

 

are there any news regarding self-tests with Dihexa?

[jabowery]

Dear participants,

 

are there any news regarding self-tests with Dihexa?

 

I can, without much confidence, report that the effects, such as they are, will disappoint those who are seeking the kind of motor recovery demonstrated in the rodent studies.  Those studies demonstrated that in the absence of neurodegeneration, Dihexa does not yield much improvement -- but in the presence of degeneration it has a profound effect on motor function and possibly even cognitive function (some theories of neocortical development posit a common phylogenetic origin between coordination of muscles and coordination of thought).  My wife has Huntington's Disease and, if you look back at my reports of our experiment with Dihexa (I subjected myself to the same protocol), the benefits were not obvious in her case and seemed absent in my case -- to the limited extent I was able to measure both.

Now, having said that, there were no control groups to which we could compare -- the measurements were crude at best and subjective at worse, the protocol followed may very well have been inadequate given the calculations of the pharmacokinetics were amateur, etc. -- and Huntington's Disease's neurodegeneraiton is particularly devastating.

The strongest evidence I have that there was a positive effect is that upon termination of the protocol, she became obviously worse within a few months.  I therefore restarted it, without joining her in it so as to preserve the diminishing supply, and have exponentially decreased the dosage to preserve it in hopes that if there is any benefit, it will still be present at sub-mg doses once a week.

PS:  I will add to this that the cause of HD is known to be a specific allele and there is a treatment for HD that silences its expression (ASO gene silencing) that not only terminates neurodegeneration but causes its remission as the natural repair mechanisms kick in.  Dihexa may be particularly valuable in that repair.  I've looked into it in enough detail to know that if it were not being denied my wife, she would _very_ likely still be able to talk and think, if not run 5-Ks as she did when the ASO treatment was first under investigation, and she was desperately trying to forestall her otherwise inevitable neurodegeneration.  The government has probably now succeeded in killing her with gradually-increasing torture over the years.

PPS:  I'm not sure why this post did not appear after I thought I had submitted it, but autosave permitted me to restore it.  If it was deliberately deleted by a moderator, my apologies but it would help to at least acknowledge deletions so people don't think they screwed up and failed to post properly, as I may have in this case.

Edited by jabowery, 03 December 2017 - 09:46 PM.

[mikey]

"Harding, Wright, and their colleagues found Dihexa to be seven orders of magnitude more powerful than BDNF, which has yet to be effectively developed for therapeutic use. In other words, it would take 10 million times as much BDNF to get as much new synapse formation as Dihexa."

http://www.scienceda...21011090653.htm

Seems to be a derivative of an angiotensin.

Seems interesting. Who knows what the side-effects are, but for that level of synapse formation I think there may be some people willing to be guinea-pigs. Does anyone know anything about this?

"Harding, Wright, and their colleagues found Dihexa to be seven orders of magnitude more powerful than BDNF, which has yet to be effectively developed for therapeutic use. In other words, it would take 10 million times as much BDNF to get as much new synapse formation as Dihexa."

http://www.scienceda...21011090653.htm

Seems to be a derivative of an angiotensin.

Seems interesting. Who knows what the side-effects are, but for that level of synapse formation I think there may be some people willing to be guinea-pigs. Does anyone know anything about this?

[mikey]

I found Dihexa to produce irritating stimulation, indicative of adversely affecting my CNS

[BioHacker=Life]

Have any of you compared the effects to 7,8 DHF? It seems like a safer choice and also a potent BDNF agonist.