49 replies to this topic

[bernard]

So I decided to start on my quest for mental glory. I kept reading how Piracetam is so safe that people should probably change the word "safe" itself to "piracetam". Lol imagine this:
" - Hey man do you think that belt is piracetam ?"

Anyway...
I've been taking it for three days now.
Day One: 1200 mg and three whole eggs
Day Two 1200 mg and three whole eggs
Day Three 2x2400mg and 2x 250/250mg Choline/Inositol

At the end of Day Three I almost got a panic attack. I'm not sure why - mostly due to stomach uneasiness and weird mouth feeling. The roof (palate) was numb and somewhat rugged. I managed to calm myself down, no panic attack. And got to sleep. Pupils were constricted I think.

Now most people will tell you how piracetam makes your sleep a wonder. You get up all refreshed and everything, willing to conquer new heights etc. etc.

Well guess what. I slept for over 12 hours and when I got up I felt even more tired than the night before, the palate still tingling, and somewhat nauseated. Mildly depressed and rather irritable. I hated it. Actually as I'm writing this I still feel nauseated a little bit.

What do you think is that all about ? This is just the start of my nootropic quest, I was looking forward to much much tougher stacks and now I crumbled at the very basic one. Don't know what to do.

[Kwerl]

For some reason, Piracetam doesn't work for me (I was just going to start a thread about this). You can try other nootropics, some work great for some people.

[bernard]

Well it did work fine before this crap. I was able to break through my plateau at lumosity with ease. However today I feel like I want to shoot myself. Very similar to post-mdma crash.

[dz93]

It's because you slept for over 12 hours dummy. Try to get anywhere from 6 - 8 hours. I read somewhere 7 hours is the best. Any less or any longer and you wont be performing your best during the day. Just look it up for yourself so you can see. I don't know all the details.

[bernard]

I know that longer sleeping is not good but that is definitely not the reason for having a major crash and nausea. Longer sleeping can only cause groggyness at best.

[Pirate]

Too much choline can cause depression. Maybe try it again with one less egg.

[Absent]

Replace the choline/eggs with a Fish Oil.

People believe Choline is required for piracetam but I believe that is the worse suggestion. People take choline because it stops the headaches that piracetam can seemingly cause.

But choline also nukes all of the uplifting effects of piracetam and practically everything significantly good about it. As far as my research has shown me, almost every user who reports negative experiences with Piracetam use a choline source with it.

Cut the choline. Use Fish Oil. Fish Oil synergizes with piracetam far better, it also gets rid of the headaches so there is no need for choline. Fish Oil with piracetam will also massively increase your focus and concentration, while too much choline can have the opposite effect. Since choline is pro-depressive, it can cancel out almost everything good about piracetam, leaving room only for small long term improvements, instead of the massive short term & long term improvements that can come with using fish oil instead of choline.

Fish Oil also can enhance serenity and calmness, defeating your anxiety.

[bernard]

Can I use this instead of Fish Oil because I'm a vegetarian ?

http://www.solgar.co...an-Softgels.htm

However consider the fact that I was taking only 250mg Choline twice a day which is even below the recommended dose on the supplement bottle. It's really hard for me to believe that B-vitamin was causing my terrible experience.

[Absent]

Tatsumaru,

Fish oil contains a combination of ingredients. I am unsure which ones in particular have the synergizing effect with piracetam.

As far as being a Vegetarian... that's no reason not to take Fish Oil. Fish Oil sold in stores does not come from fish, and is synthetically made in a laboratory.

On top of that, nothing about fish oil has anything to do with meat or anything that would come into conflict with any sort of Vegetarian Ideas, whether you are a vegetarian for moral, health, or spiritual reasons.

"Fish Oil" is just a label to define a set of ingredients that commonly occur in fish but are merely chemical compounds. Taking that supplement that you linked would be akin to taking half of Fish Oil, which is pointless. You'd still be taking part of fish oil. Don't let the name 'Fish Oil' bother you, it's just a label that has little to do with Fish

[Pirate]

Almonds are another source of fatty omega-3s, but I'm unsure about dosage.

[bernard]

"Fish Oil" is just a label to define a set of ingredients that commonly occur in fish but are merely chemical compounds. Taking that supplement that you linked would be akin to taking half of Fish Oil, which is pointless. You'd still be taking part of fish oil. Don't let the name 'Fish Oil' bother you, it's just a label that has little to do with Fish

Are you sure ? Do you have proof ?

Unless you do I'm pretty sure you are not correct on this one. And I am saying this since synthetical EPAs have just recently emerged on the marked and are considered pharmaceutical-grade drugs to aid in high triglycerids. They are marketed by GlaxoSmithKlein and some other companie Amarine and cost about 10 times more than supplemental fish oil.

[Absent]

"Fish Oil" is just a label to define a set of ingredients that commonly occur in fish but are merely chemical compounds. Taking that supplement that you linked would be akin to taking half of Fish Oil, which is pointless. You'd still be taking part of fish oil. Don't let the name 'Fish Oil' bother you, it's just a label that has little to do with Fish

Are you sure ? Do you have proof ?

Unless you do I'm pretty sure you are not correct on this one. And I am saying this since synthetical EPAs have just recently emerged on the marked and are considered pharmaceutical-grade drugs to aid in high triglycerids. They are marketed by GlaxoSmithKlein and some other companie Amarine and cost about 10 times more than supplemental fish oil.

You may be right. I do know there are synthetic Fish Oils on the market.

Either way, in the natural fish oils..... the filtration processes removes all impurity and fish matter, there's nothing carnivorous about taking them. The synthetic fish oils may be more expensive like you say, but there is literally going to be absolutely no difference in the products.

Well, technically the only difference would be that the natural fish oils were synthesized in a recently living fish and the synthetic fish oils were made in a lab, likely from chemicals that existed in some fishes body millions of years ago. Knowing this, does it really matter?

The primary reason people use natural vs synthetic is due to the fear of mercury coming from natural fish oils, though, if you stick with any good, reliable, and affordable brand, they do extensive mercury testing and filtering so there is none in the product, again, end product, is no different.

[bernard]

Still I find it hard to believe that such a low dose of an essential vitamin could cause any of that. I mean 3 whole eggs contain about the same amount of Choline (~250mg) and I've been eating eggs for the last 20 years. Never felt anything like it... Not even a resemblance.

I have to think that Piracetam is whatever's causing the discomofort. I can definitely feel Piracetam on a physiological level - hotter head, stronger (not faster) heart beat, slight feverish feeling kicks in at about the 8th post-ingestion. Probably a little placebo as well caused by anxiety. I don't know. I really want to continue taking Piracetam, but I don't know what to do.

[Absent]

Still I find it hard to believe that such a low dose of an essential vitamin could cause any of that. I mean 3 whole eggs contain about the same amount of Choline (~250mg) and I've been eating eggs for the last 20 years. Never felt anything like it... Not even a resemblance.

I have to think that Piracetam is whatever's causing the discomofort. I can definitely feel Piracetam on a physiological level - hotter head, stronger (not faster) heart beat, slight feverish feeling kicks in at about the 8th post-ingestion. Probably a little placebo as well caused by anxiety. I don't know. I really want to continue taking Piracetam, but I don't know what to do.

Piracetam can definitely cause anxiety if you take too much. But I promise you if you take enough fish oil, all bad side effects of piracetam will go away, and even more mental benefits will appear. There's no downside(as far as I can tell)

Also, I am confused on what you mean "such a low dose of an essential vitamin could cause any of that", any of what?

I take about 1g of Choline Bitartrate(about 500g of choline) every 3 days. I definitely do not take it every day because it has an obvious pro-depressive effect and majorly blunts my effects of Piracetam, at least for 4-6 hours after the choline is taken.

[bernard]

What is it that FIsh Oil contains except for DHA and EPA ?

[Absent]

What is it that FIsh Oil contains except for DHA and EPA ?

Good question.

It's mostly different vitamins and minerals, very small amounts. I read an article about it but I can't seem to find it... but I did find this one.

http://www.webmd.com...ntName=FISH OIL

Fish oil supplements often contain small amounts of vitamin E to prevent spoilage. They might also be combined with calcium, iron, or vitamins A, B1, B2, B3, C, or D.

[jonnyD]

So I decided to start on my quest for mental glory. I kept reading how Piracetam is so safe that people should probably change the word "safe" itself to "piracetam". Lol imagine this:
" - Hey man do you think that belt is piracetam ?"

Anyway...
I've been taking it for three days now.
Day One: 1200 mg and three whole eggs
Day Two 1200 mg and three whole eggs
Day Three 2x2400mg and 2x 250/250mg Choline/Inositol

At the end of Day Three I almost got a panic attack. I'm not sure why - mostly due to stomach uneasiness and weird mouth feeling. The roof (palate) was numb and somewhat rugged. I managed to calm myself down, no panic attack. And got to sleep. Pupils were constricted I think.

Now most people will tell you how piracetam makes your sleep a wonder. You get up all refreshed and everything, willing to conquer new heights etc. etc.

Well guess what. I slept for over 12 hours and when I got up I felt even more tired than the night before, the palate still tingling, and somewhat nauseated. Mildly depressed and rather irritable. I hated it. Actually as I'm writing this I still feel nauseated a little bit.

What do you think is that all about ? This is just the start of my nootropic quest, I was looking forward to much much tougher stacks and now I crumbled at the very basic one. Don't know what to do.

I would suggest that you drop your choline and try 2x600mg Piracteam (morning, midday).
Some people react very sensitive to piracetam. Do this for one week. You can try to increase the dosage to 2x1200mg if you get no effects.
Stop piracetam if you get negative effects on 600mg for more than 2 days... it is probably just not the right stuff for you in this case.

I would suggest to switch to Aniracetam or perhaps Noopept if you cannot get any positive effects from Piracetam.

[Spinlock]

I didn't notice much with Piracetam either. Pramaracetam on the other hand, at least I'm sure I took something.

[SuperjackDid_]

Do not waste money on other racetam if root one (Piracetam ) bad to you ,other will react similar experience , trust me .

[bernard]

I'm not looking to switch racetams mindlessly. I'm looking how to resolve this issue that I have with Piracetam and then I'll move on to stronger ones.
A lot of people here keep saying "Piracetam didn't work for me as well".
Let me be clear. Piracetam DID work for me. I definitely felt cognitive improvements. It was its anxiogenic properties that bothered me.

Edited by Tatsumaru, 19 October 2012 - 03:56 AM.

[SuperjackDid_]

Piracetam involve in glutamate receptor and stimulate it ,so anxiogenic should be normal ,i think should look some thing that can compete this effect such as some gaba substance..

[Templanoid]

Piracetam involve in glutamate receptor and stimulate it ,so anxiogenic should be normal ,i think should look some thing that can compete this effect such as some gaba substance..

Sawasdee khap! Just noticed your location saying from Thailand, I was wondering where you could get Piracetam in Thailand?? I'm from there too. Sorry for hijacking the thread, but I'm really curious. Thanks.

Edited by Templanoid, 22 October 2012 - 03:02 PM.

[SuperjackDid_]

local pharmacy have it ,but i have tried many different brand and supplier ,found nothing different in quality anyhow,but powder form is less effective than tablet .

Piracetam lower my concentration ,i just using it for anxiety and anger release ,with no fear . LOL

Piracetam effect non consistency for me ,very annoying stuff .

[bernard]

Ok so Piracetam is linked to a decrease in platelet count (thrombocytopenia) and reduced levels of the hormone Aldosterone. Why is nobody discussing that and just popping Piracetam like candy ? I mean I know it's rather safe but is it THAT safe ?

[SuperjackDid_]

Ok so Piracetam is linked to a decrease in platelet count (thrombocytopenia) and reduced levels of the hormone Aldosterone. Why is nobody discussing that and just popping Piracetam like candy ? I mean I know it's rather safe but is it THAT safe ?

Could you tell me where to get research "reduced levels of the hormone Aldosterone" ?

[bernard]

http://www.ncbi.nlm..../pubmed/2765169
http://www.ncbi.nlm..../pubmed/2137359
http://www.ncbi.nlm..../pubmed/2149831
http://www.ncbi.nlm..../pubmed/1410129

[bernard]

Ok...
So I've been taking 2 x 1200mg Piracetam for the last week and I want to share the following side effects:

- Mouth and throat soreness. Tongue is covered with aphtae and the palate of the mouth is sore as well. Very weird. Now I just got the flu, which is worth mentioning in terms of throat soreness but it's not THAT much worth mentioning since I got the same side effect a couple of weeks ago when I attempted 2 x 2,400mg and I wasn't any sick at all back then.

- Anxiety is very mild, tolerable. I'm stacking Piracetam with Himalaya Mentat and Himalaya Geriforte which is a great relief. I tend to think they actually compliment each other.

- I have more regular bowel movements but the feces is darker and stickier (Ugh, I know but maybe is worth mentioning). I know some people have problems with Choline Bitartrate in that department but I'm really only taking 250mg every other day.

- No headaches but grogginess yes.

Any ideas on these sides ?

Edited by Tatsumaru, 30 October 2012 - 07:56 AM.

[deh707]

Ok...
So I've been taking 2 x 1200mg Piracetam for the last week and I wont to share to following side effects:

- Mouth and throat soreness. Tongue is covered with aphtae and the palate of the mouth is sore as well. Very weird. Now I just got the flu, which is worth mentioning in terms of throat soreness but it's not THAT much worth mentioning since I got the same side effect a couple of weeks ago when I attempted 2 x 2,400mg and I wasn't any sick at all back then.

- Anxiety is very mild, tolerable. I'm stacking Piracetam with Himalaya Mentat and Himalaya Geriforte which is a great relief..

- I have more regular bowel movements but the feces is darker and stickier (Ugh, I know but maybe is worth mentioning)

- No headaches but grogginess yes.

Any ideas on these sides ?

Try separating the timing of your choline and piracetam. It could range anywhere from 30 minutes to 7 hours.

For example. I take 1g of choline citrate right before sleeping, then take 1.6g piracetam upon awakening.

[bernard]

Try separating the timing of your choline and piracetam. It could range anywhere from 30 minutes to 7 hours.

For example. I take 1g of choline citrate right before sleeping, then take 1.6g piracetam upon awakening.

That would be beneficial how and why ?

[deh707]

Try separating the timing of your choline and piracetam. It could range anywhere from 30 minutes to 7 hours.

For example. I take 1g of choline citrate right before sleeping, then take 1.6g piracetam upon awakening.

That would be beneficial how and why ?

Some people get massive brainfog when choline and piracetam are taken together. This only happens to me if I take both together without taking choline at least 30 minutes prior.

There was a few threads on here about this, I believe.

Edited by deh707, 30 October 2012 - 08:01 AM.