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Please Help with Post-Ibogaine Treatment Recovery

ibogaine recovery

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#1 tritium

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Posted 11 January 2013 - 10:06 PM


About a month ago, I decided to try a dose of 800mg ibogaine HCL after reading some of it's beneficial effectis on raising GDNF and restoring certain nerotransmitter functions to help my condition. However, now even after a month, I still feel terrible like I am always daydreaming when I am awake and have much difficulty focusing on my studies. I found the following quotes from articles online to be interesting:

First, the high concentration of ibogaine in fat tissue suggests that fat can serve as a storage depot for
the drug. Under these circumstances, it seems feasible that small amounts of ibogaine could be released from fat tissue into the circulation for extended periods after a single dose.
...
In agreement with this notion, Obach et al. (45) reported that ibogaine is O-demethylated by cytochrome P450 enzymes in human liver microsomes in vitro. In particular, cytochrome P450 2D6 appears to be the main isoform responsible for ibogaine O-demethylase activity in humans.
...
Slow elimination of noribogaine could result from O-demethylation of central nervous system (CNS)-stored ibogaine, which could contribute to some of the reported aftereffects of single dose of ibogaine (104).


Any ideas to speed up the O-demethylation and elimination of the metabolites from my body? I have read in places that it can linger in the body for up to 4 months before being completely emininated. Please help, as it's very difficult focusing on even reading articles online! Any advice to hasten this recovery would be much appreciated!

#2 tritium

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Posted 11 January 2013 - 10:14 PM

I have Adderal, Modafinil, and Emsam patchas readily available. I figured these may just help cover up the symptoms, but not help speed up the elimination, so I decided to lay off these for a while. I took ibogaine to help restore dopamine receptors so that I would be less dependant on the Adderall. I would prefer to not have to take any of these.

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#3 BLimitless

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Posted 11 January 2013 - 10:40 PM

These other substances will not be very good. Ibogaine is one of those drugs that really doesn't like non-tonic substances (tonic as in balancing neurotransmitters). It doesn't react well with anything that forces neurotransmitter release or prevents reuptake or enzyme inhibition. Many people have died due to mixing ibogaine with drugs that force the brain to do things such as heroin, amphetamine and so on. Noribogaine is an SSRI so be mindful of that however so you deal with this.

Your best bet is to do lots of intense cardiovascular exercise every day and burn off as much fat as possible. Keep your blood flowing and pumping as well as much as possible and keep sweating; lots of steamy hot baths right after a good cardio session. I have taken iboga quite a few times and I don't really understand why you're experiencing such effects. It sounds like you are experiencing depersonalisation from the SSRI effects of ibogaine.

You might want to try inhibiting serotonin a little bit or you can perhaps go the other way and supplement with L-tryptophan or 5-HTP and see if that helps.

Edited by BLimitless, 11 January 2013 - 10:42 PM.


#4 tritium

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Posted 11 January 2013 - 10:47 PM

Yes, maybe depersonalisation would be a better way to describe the feeling. It always feels like i'm daydreraming and have trouble focusing on my tasks. Would sam-e speed up the O-demethylation process?

#5 Heh

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Posted 12 January 2013 - 04:05 PM

Maybe 1g Niacin and 1g Vitamin C will help flush out the metabolites.
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#6 abelard lindsay

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Posted 12 January 2013 - 05:10 PM

The difficulty concentrating may be due to nmda antagonism. I'm not really sure what to do about that except to further investigate substances like sarcosine, glycine and d-serine that modulate nmda activity.

#7 daouda

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Posted 12 January 2013 - 06:07 PM

Supposedly a good way to promote excretion of fat-stored xenobiotics is sauna, particularly infrared sauna.
A good overview of this http://www.balancedc..._FIRT_DETOX.pdf
This comes from a FIR sauna seller so take it with a pinch of salt, but it seems well researched and have a lot of references which you can asess wether they are of quality or not


Also look at this
Elimination of persistent toxicants from the human body This pdf cost me 32usd so please take advantage
Excellent review of science-based "detox", from Human & Experimental Toxicology journal (NOT some quack naturopath journal... "Human & Experimental Toxicology is a fully peer reviewed international journal that publishes preclinical and clinical pharmacology and toxicology original research and review articles on experimental and clinical studies of functional, biochemical and structural disorders. This journal is a member of the Committee on Publication Ethics (COPE)" )

An excellent read, especially for the "detox-skeptic" scientists and MDs out here (unfortunately the majority, and even the most brilliant minds) whom have been brainwashed by the powerful lobbying of the pharmaceutical and other "chemicals" industries that the fear of "toxins" is irrational and stem from paranoid conspiracists tin foil hat bearers minds.
Basically the experts in toxicology absolutely recognize that chronic toxicity (persistence of toxic xenobiotics in the body) is a real, widespread problem that we should aim to adress, and that effective tools already exist for this goal although further research is still needed to validate more therapies, expand the toolkit, and scientifically determine effective protocols.... But mainstream medecine still ignores the problem and will only try to adress acute toxicity/poisoning. I really cannot explain why that is so without starting to go all tinfoil-hat conspiracist that "big pharma" would rather have us sick and toxic and taking drugs to mitatigate this rather than adressing the root issue that would render their drugs useless (and prove them more harmful than beneficial). My father is a doctor so I always was educated to trust medecine AND the pharmaceutical industry. Always pretty much looked down on ppl scared of antibiotics and medications in general, nd laughed at paranoid (so i thought) ppl scared of vaccines. I think very, very differently now.,
Actually Im now starting to beleive that many "auto-immune diseases" stem from chronic toxicity. (ive been poisoned by fluoroquinolone antibiotics which are still in my body 1 and a half year later and causing symptoms - doctors have all wanted to negate the role of the FQ in my issues saying they had been long eliminated, and have been looking at autoimmune markers without success - until HPLC of my blood looking for the drugs found them in high quantities... Of course I had to order this test myself, could never have a prescription for it)



I have taken iboga quite a few times and I don't really understand why you're experiencing such effects.

We all have widely different metabolisms...
Let me share my story :
Ive been given 2 pills of levofloxacin 500mg then 14 pills of cirpofloxacin 1000mg. I had an immediate reaction to levo (intense joint pains) so got switched to cipro which I tolerated much better. Then other quinolones to avoid bacterial resistance. Joint pains and neuropathies appeared slowly while on the drugs (6 weeks total duration), but it was only 2 weeks after cessation that the bomb exploded in my body (including incredibly heavy brain fog, confusion, and derealization)
Now, I think its interesting to observe that i reacted much more intensely to levofloxacin than to cipro, and to relate it with the fact that I have much more levo than cipro in my body now 1.5 year out (0.30mg/l levo vs 0.01mg/l cipro ), although I took much, much more cipro than levo!! (14g cipro vs 1g levo!!)

My theory is that I am most probably a poor levofloxacin excreter, and thats where lie the different susceptibilities (or not) of different ppl to different quinolones. Thats why one of the hottest fields in medical research now is pharmacogenomics, actually its extremely irresponsible to administer potentially toxic drugs at the same standard dosage to different ppl with widely different metabolisms/enzymes etc. (I plan to take this coursera course from Upenn https://www.coursera...course/pharm101 which tackles pharmacogenomics, check out the video)

See, I was getting treated with a bunch of guys simultaneously at the same doc, and check this out :
  • I reacted intensely to levaquin but was fine with cipro, relatively fine (at the time), with regular dose pruli and moxi (avelox) too. (I only realize now how the doc got medieval on me)
  • A friend of mine reacted intensely to cipro, switched to prulifloxacin and he was fine with it. (he didnt get no levo)
  • Another firend (yeah we all friends now) reacted intensely to prulifloxacin, so switched to cipro and was fine with it! (no levo for him either)
Look at the pharmacokinetics of these quins (pubmed or wikipedia is good enough), and see how they are all very differently metabolized and excreted, with different enzyme systems interviening or not.
Levaquin seems to be one that ppl react the most to (by looking at the amount of complaint on the web compared to the fact that its much less prescribed than cipro). And it also seems that its one that has the less metabolic pathways, being largely (80% or so) excreted intact by the kidney with negligible liver metabolism. Cipro can undergo extensive liver metabolism.

Edited by daouda, 12 January 2013 - 06:27 PM.

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#8 dsohei

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Posted 12 January 2013 - 07:42 PM

So basically you took an entheogen and are now resisting and complaining about it. The real answer is that you are denying the effects, and you don't have much meditation practice. Go into the "daydreams" and learn as much as possible from them. Ibogaine is used by ppl to bring forth their subconcious mind to guide them better in everyday life, like having your own version of jiminy cricket.
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#9 kevinseven11

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Posted 12 January 2013 - 07:50 PM

This effect is caused by continuneous opioid activation. You can block the effects, but this is how ibogaine is improving your mood. Just wait a month and your treatment would be complete
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#10 lourdaud

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Posted 12 January 2013 - 09:50 PM

This effect is caused by continuneous opioid activation. You can block the effects, but this is how ibogaine is improving your mood. Just wait a month and your treatment would be complete

What makes you think it's caused by that and not NMDA antagonizm? Methoxetamine (a ketamine analogue) made me stupid and unable to focus for about five days upon ingestion.. (no, won't repeat that one)

#11 tritium

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Posted 12 January 2013 - 09:50 PM

This effect is caused by continuneous opioid activation. You can block the effects, but this is how ibogaine is improving your mood. Just wait a month and your treatment would be complete


I don't really think ibogaine is improving my mood. Actually, I believe I felt much better than before I took it and would probably never take it again in my life. During the experience, I seriously felt like I was on the threashold of death and was very frightening. After a month now, I have lost a lost much of my personality, feel terrible most of the time, and have trouble concentrating. Also, I don't really have time to daydream and meditate when I have many tasks to complete.

So the following theories have been presented which are causing the after effects:
1. Serotonin reuptake inhibition
2. Nmda antagonism
3. Opioid activation
Any ideas on how to block the opioid activation? Appreciate the comments so far.

#12 tritium

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Posted 13 January 2013 - 05:57 PM

Another thing I nitoced is that I still hear the buzzing / thumping noises in my ears every once in a while, mostly in quiet places (those of you who have taken it should know what I'm talking about). I wonder what could be causing this?

#13 BLimitless

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Posted 13 January 2013 - 06:01 PM

That buzzing is probably caused by high serotonin levels as it is also induced in users of harmala alkaloids.

#14 kevinseven11

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Posted 13 January 2013 - 08:44 PM

Antagonists for your ibogaine experience would be Kudzu root, yohombine, or Shi Shang Bai. I dont recommend taking Shi shang bai, but if you think its important to take it, your choice. Shi Shang will lower your energy levels, but it is the only natural opioid antagonist.
This will reverse the effects of the residual drug being released.

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#15 Luddist

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Posted 16 August 2013 - 08:39 AM

How are you doing tritium? Did you recover? If so, how?




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