56 replies to this topic

[formergenius]

Thank you Rior for your swift reply.
AptekaDoma was way ahead of me, and this morning I received an e-mail offering payment by WesternUnion. For now, I am awaiting payment details. I'm happy to find that WesternUnion also has an online service, making it quite easy to pay. Did you use the online service as well?

So it helps with derealization and depersonalization? That's great! Judging from your "cerebral history", mine is somewhat similar, so perhaps there's a good chance I'd benefit from it as well.
For me, the cognitive benefits of been calm would be ineffable, so perhaps it might helps on that level as well. Maybe not so much with the visual aspect of my problems, but with a sharper mind it would be less bothersome. Also, if it helps me, there's a whole new door opened for others with HPPD, as treatment is limited in research. Anyways, getting ahead of myself now. I will report back once the order is confirmed. Seeing as I am closer to Russia, I might receive my order faster.

Be well, and do keep us posted

Edited by formergenius, 28 April 2013 - 01:55 PM.

[daouda]

formergenius (i could have almost the same screen name if I wasnt such a humble guy lol - same avatar for sure), could you succintly describe the "visual aspect of your problem"? Could you please read my post right before yours, and tell me if it is similar to mine?

[formergenius]

formergenius (i could have almost the same screen name if I wasnt such a humble guy lol - same avatar for sure), could you succintly describe the "visual aspect of your problem"? Could you please read my post right before yours, and tell me if it is similar to mine?

No problem.
HPPD stands for Hallucinogen Persisting Perception Disorder. It was induced by a hallucinogen. My visual perceptions however are quite different from yours I believe. I experience visual snow, ghosting (I look at a tree, and see it's silhoutte cascading above it), palinopsia, micropsia and macropsia, morphing, floating, pulsating, and disappearing of objects, light flashes/flickering (the ceiling sometimes looks like a rave party), aura's, double vision, blurry vision, diminished depth perception, colors constantly change their hue (this text can fluctuate between black-blue-purple), and peripheral blurred shadows. Probably more things, but my symptoms seem to fluctuate, as I don't experience them all at once, but always a few of the aforementioned simultanuously.
Sometimes I experience the shaking as well, but it is the least of my problems.

Sorry that I can't help you there. However on the cognitive level I do have similar problems. Hehe, guess that wasn't too succinct after all. Do you think Tenoten might help you with your issues?

[daouda]

I also have blurry vision and ghosting but they were induced by the corneal toxicity of quinolones adding up over my not so successful LASIK surgery done 10 years ago (which left me with some level of higher order aberrations resulting in diminished contrast sensitivity, halos, starbursts, and ghosting, but the quinolones amplified these 3 or 5 fold).
My symptoms also fluctuate often with no apparent reason (like the shaking thing sometimes almostgs resolves then i wake up the next day and feels like Im on some weird fucking shrooms)
I have no solid reason to think that tenoten will help me but it seems I dont have anything to lose besides 120 dollars...
(One thing that definitely helps me a great deal is cerebrolysin btw)

Edited by daouda, 28 April 2013 - 04:10 PM.

[formergenius]

Hmm I would give it a shot Daouda! This study shows it's effectiveness for treatment of cognitive impairment, causes unspecified. Perhaps the cause isn't all that significant.
Cerobrolysin... The whole intra-muscular idea does not appeal to me to be honest. I don't trust myself in this state to confidently do such a procedure without damaging any tissue.

Back to Tenoten: Western Union's online service kindly refused my creditcard. Luckily, and unbeknownst to me, there is a Western Union service right around the corner.
Currently awaiting a confirmation from AptekaDoma. I will update once I have received the Tenoten.

[formergenius]

I'd just like to thank you guys for pointing me to tDCS. I have begun researching it, and it seems very, very promising. qEEG's of people suffering from HPPD show overexcitability in the visual cortex/occipital lobe. This lead me to the crude hypothesis that perhaps placing the cathode on the occipital lobe, and the anodal lobe on the prefrontal cortex (or wherever, perhaps just on the shoulder), would decrease neuronal excitability. If you're interested, here's the topic I opened at HPPDonline (external link). Any comments Ladner? Now, all this is totally unrelated to the topic, but I just wanted to thank you guys for pointing me in the right direction.

Regarding Tenoten, I am still waiting to receive a tracking number. WesternUnion shows payment has not yet been collected. I am really eager to try Tenoten, and hope they will send it out soon. MateriaMedica also seems to have several other medications based on S100 anti-bodies, including a smoking cessation agent. See also this study. Add that to Proproten, and they've basically nichéd the sh*t out of S100 anti-bodies. More info on ultra low dose S100 anti-bodies can be found here.

[formergenius]

I did a search in Russian, and I found some user experiences of Tenoten. Here's the link,
You gotta love Google Translate. It's installed in my browser, so the entire page translates to.. well readable English I suppose.
Thought it was worth mentioning, as the only experience I've read so far are from you guys!

I sent an e-mail to AptekaDoma, inquiring order status. Still waiting for a response.

[Reformed-Redan]

Anyone here used Afobazole or Ladasten for anxiety?

I'd love to give a try and see if they are any good. I could send some extra selegiline I have for research purposes in exchange.

[formergenius]

No, check ebay for Afobazole. I saw some listings there. Idk about Ladasten. Afobazole has repeatedly been reported to have a detrimental effects on cognition. IMO it (and it's safety profile) preferable over benzo's, but not over other alternative anxiolytics, like Tenoten.
I've got a buttload of Selegiline lying around, so no thanks :D

Anyways regarding Tenoten:
Order has been shipped, according to AptekaDoma. Strangely enough, they sent me a tracking number of some parcel that was sent in 2008. I hope this was my mistake, as I didn't know which service to use for track&trace, so I opted for using RussianPost. Perhaps they used that number in 2008 for a package, I really don't know. Currently I'm awaiting an answer to this mystery.

Rior, in the meantime I would be very grateful if you could tell me which service you used to track your package.

My impatience led me to search eBay. I contacted some people who where selling Selank and other noots, and they all replied that they could sell me Tenoten. In correspondence with one now, however shipping seems to be equally, ranging from anywhere between 10 to 22 days. Note that this is specific for Holland, as shipping to the US has a maximum of 14 days delivery time. I don't know what I was thinking earlier, when I said "seeing as I'm closer to Russia". This proves just how badly I need the stuff. Duhh... the earth is round, and Russia is huge.
Anyway I requested if they could possibly send it faster than that, and if Express delivery proves to have a maximum of 2 weeks, I'll order it.

Rior, Ladner, any news?
Cheers

Edited by formergenius, 05 May 2013 - 07:41 PM.

[formergenius]

I have been conducting extensive research in the past week on HPPD, specifically it's pathogenesis and how stop it from occuring.
So far I have made incredible progress, I never expected to come this far. Eventually this could very well lead to a universal cure for HPPD.
Just now I found out that proteïn S100B could possibly play a significant part in HPPD, so I am extra curious to try out Tenoten.
I have to reread the material I found, but I suspect my speculations are correct.
My hypothesis, which started as a wild guess, is rapidly evolving into a lengthly article. I have weeks of research and studying ahead of me. I am in dire need of enhanced cognition, and could definitely use that boost from Tenoten! Irony also seems to play a significant role here

Either way as my findings grow, I get more excited, and I definitely need to remain calm to asses the facts properly. Damn I even invested in a whiteboard for mindmapping etc.
Tomorrow I see a neurologist, with whom I will discuss my findings. Remember, this is all just citizen science.
Anyway, you can see why I am excited to try Tenoten for myself to asses the effects. If it proves to affect any aspect of my HPPD, I will start investing in Neurological literature, and definitely build my own tDCS. Anyways, I'm getting way ahead of myself again, but the preliminary results prove very promising.

Edited by formergenius, 06 May 2013 - 01:17 AM.

[formergenius]

Please refer to my avatar for sound effects: AptekaDoma is based in Ukraine, not in Russia. Further illustrating the great potential benefit Tenoten might have, sigh.
Anyways, turns out Ukraine is having (easter... translation issues?) holidays, and tracking service is not updated.
I'll probably know more of its whereabouts in a few days. In the meantime I might opt for buying from eBay as well.

[daouda]

Could you please share the ebay source?

[formergenius]

Could you please share the ebay source?

PM sent.

[trigger1978]

Could you please share the ebay source?

PM sent.

Could you please PM me with the ebay source. Thanks!

[Dinvestor]

Formergenius:

Can you PM the ebay source as well?

Thx

[formergenius]

Haha you gotta be kidding me, 3 people! Ok people from now on: Just send me a PM and I'll send you the details. Please don't post in this topic for such things.
Dinvestor, I'll send you a PM in a few.

There, that should contain the off-topic-ness.

Now then, regarding Tenoten.. Let me check the track and trace.
Hmm seems it's been stuck in Kiev for a few days now. Sigh.
But perhaps that's just the last place it was registered, and it's in a plane now.. who knows.
Seems it's being sent through Poland.. Romenia would've been faster, but must be a financial thing.
I'll update once received.

[formergenius]

Huzzah! I just received my Tenoten. Awesomeness.
Will be giving it a fair trial tomorrow, as I was screwing around with tDCS today.

Just wondering: how long would it take to feel effects? Rior, you seem to report after a week and a haf you noticed clarity? What about after first dose?

Edited by formergenius, 16 May 2013 - 12:24 PM.

[Ladner]

I am interested to know if tDCS has any posotive benefits for you formergenius. I am unsure how hppd works in the brain, but if it is from wires getting crossed in the brain I am willing to bet tDCS can help. From what I have read I think that the senors that are causing snow etc could be related to the optic nerve. If that is the case placing the unit around the base/back of the skull will have varied results imo. If it is related to your actual retina though I can not see the device helping in that regard. Keep me posted I will offer any advice I can.

[Ladner]

Formergenius how have you been? It has been awhile since anyone posted on the thread, and wanted to check on you.

[unregistered_user]

All of that build-up and once he finally got the product and began his trial, he went radio silent! What a tease....

@formergenius: How about an update?

[formergenius]

Ohh yeah sorry guys. I took Tenoten for a few days and didn't give it a fair trial. This was because I needed to do a washout period before commencing with Levetiracetam. Not even allowed to take vitamins! So I can't say really. Thought I noticed some anxiolysis, but nothing that couldn't have been attributed to placebo.

In retrospect I presume it was a waste of money though. It is, after all, homeopathic in the sense that it's diluted to such an extent it's basically a sugar pill. But I could be wrong there, perhaps the Russians have a different meaning for homeopathic. Before looking it up, I thought homeopathic was synonymous with natural, which is why I gave it a shot. Had I known then what the distinction was, I wouldn't have given it any attention.

Sorry to leave you hanging guys. Hope it works for you though. Anyway the vendor I bought it from was a good one, so at least I can add that.

Ladner: my experiences with tDCS have been nothing short of profound to be honest. Despite the transience, I had a few minutes of my depersonalization lifting completely, which was nice. I attribute this to the factor "homemade" and probably the fact that the placement wasn't all too precise. I'm thinking of buying the Foc.Us in the future, as I suspect it'll be a lot more reliable than my gadget. For now though, I can't do any tDCS for evaluation purposes. HPPD is not a retinal problem, but a cortical one. So yes, theoretically cathodal stimulation of Oz, O1 and O2 could be beneficial (hope I remembered those positions correctly, haha!). Conversely though, I recall some articles in which it stated that the visual cortex/occipital lobe was harder to reach due to either thicker skull there or deeper location.. something like that. But exciting the (ventromedial or dorsolateral) PFC would be beneficial in this regard, with the PFC having afferent inhibitory connections and all. Visually there wasn't much difference, but man did I feel a hell of a lot better!

Problem with Levetiracetam is that it inhibits overall neuronal firing, not just the visual cortex. This is why I think adding either focal excitatory pharmaceutical approaches, or focal tDCS to the regions that would suffer from this inhibition, would help even things out. Currently I'm considering Guanfacine, as it seems to exhibit a very favorable profile for my case. But tDCS might prove to be sufficient, and with the Foc.Us, administration should be as easy as taking a pill. Lately I found that the visual cortex is largely governed by cholinergic mechanisms, so I'm also considering Coluracetam. Just have to be mindful of interactions there. So yeah, for my personal situation I'm slowly getting what I need, and where I need to be I suppose, through trial and error.

I would suggest for anyone with anxiety to also look into the Autonomic Nervous System, subsequently to consider sympatholytics (for example Guanfacine) as well.

Edited by formergenius, 04 July 2013 - 10:35 AM.

[Ladner]

Good to know you found some relief genius. For me tDCS got me to where I did not need it as much ,and it has lasting relief for what it does. I do not know about how to make a homemade version, but you should look into HDtDCS for deeper more focused beam maybe? That Foc.us does seem to be really neat I looked at it a couple weeks back. Adjustable current from phone, but you can not really adjust the electrode positioning like you would want imo. It does look futuristic and cool though... you would get asked what it is that is for sure. I have a college lecture that is very informative on HDtDCS if you have not found this before: https://clinicalrese...e&pbMode=normal . Guanfacine seems pretty potent. I would think once you start taking it you would continue for life being it is blood pressure medicine, or am I wrong with that assumption?

[formergenius]

Ladner:
HD-tDCS is such an interesting field! Much better than regular tDCS.. Sadly, it's not as available to the gen pop. Definitely on my radar though.
Positioning seems rather static for the Foc.Us, but there's an upgrade pack for either 1 extra anodal, 1 extra cathodal, or both. So that makes it shiftable (I just learned that's not a word.. hell who cares). Thanks for the link, I'll look in to it.
Regarding the Guan.. well yeah I've already some hypotension, but the BP effects are rather negligible compared to, say, Clonidine. Figuring my hypotension is a result of sedentary lifestyle, I'd say it would be pretty safe risk-benefit wise. Continuing for life though.. Nah. I regard all exterior aids just as a means to an end. Homeostasis is what's the goal here, and therapies are just an aid to achieve that (semi)permanently. When you can't run, you crawl. When you can't crawl, you find something or someone to carry you. In this case, pharmaceuticals! But yeah, I just regard such things as a way to improve the chance of returning to baseline; not necessarily as something to be eternally dependent on. Might be the Chardonnay speaking though.

Cheers!

[unregistered_user]

@formergenius: Thanks for the update!

[AlwaysLearning]

I ordered a box from Awakebrain.com with priority mail shipping and it arrived in about 5 days (spanning a weekend). I ordered a box from drugsfort on the 11th - the website said the payment didn't go through but they told me by email that the shipment was approved - and according to tracking, its status is still "Origin Post is Preparing Shipment".

[keeno]

I ordered a box from Awakebrain.com with priority mail shipping and it arrived in about 5 days (spanning a weekend). I ordered a box from drugsfort on the 11th - the website said the payment didn't go through but they told me by email that the shipment was approved - and according to tracking, its status is still "Origin Post is Preparing Shipment".

keep us updated

[MenDis]

I can vouch for aptekadoma being trustworthy, at least in regards to my experience: they gave me a 10% discount for using Western Union, sent my package with a tracking number--initially did not make it through/got lost in transit, after which they RESENT it with a tracking number again--and included additional drugs for free for the trouble. So in that regard, I would say they're good! They didn't have their payment system set up when I initially used them, so I didn't have to go through any of those systems...if you're worried, I'm sure you could just ask them if they're willing to use Western Union. I communicated with the website manager using google translate to russian, and it worked fairly well as we got everything sorted out (modern technology's awesome).

As for the effect that it compares to...well, I wouldn't compare it to any drug. If anything, when I take it, it feels like I've BEEN ON A DRUG for a long time--a drug that's fucked up my head, and then I finally feel like I'm coming down after I take Tenoten. I just, simply, feel normal. It's like "oh, shit, this is what I'm supposed to feel like" everything is just...normal, instead of the heightened sense of anxiety I generally have. It's pretty fantastic. I don't feel any particularly major cognitive benefit like an increased memory or reasoning ability, beyond what I've gained through not being anxious. I figure it's also obviously worth noting that I'm only really a week/week and a half in, when the normal therapeutic duration is between 1+month to 6 months. I'm sure the benefits will simply compound.

 

Rior, have you continued using tenoten? I'm interested to hear about your long term results. I'm considering ordering some. Thanks!