64 replies to this topic

[Galaxyshock]

I had a preworkout stimulant (White Flood) containing Vinpocetine and Huperzine A and I've had some previous experience with them. While those can have noticeable nootropic effects they had tendency to make me depressed and worsened anhedonia (in my subjective experience) which is why I had to discontinue. I have to say that combination of Phenibut <1g and Jack3d (caffeine, DMAA, huperzine) was one of the strongest nootropic upper-downers I've experienced (like caffeine-theanine to a whole new level). Enormous focus and confidence to take tasks while remaining calm and content. I had sense of dominance when playing several short-handed cash game tables and results were good.

Piracetam I haven't actually tried, it's controlled here unlike other racetams (logic?) which has made me hesitant for ordering. Ginkgo gave me barely any effects except some restlessness from the noradrenaline-increase. My newest stimulant contains DMAE along with dendrobium, caffeine, rhodiola etc. I find this good alertness, energy and focus boost. I wonder how much the DMAE affects there.. Anyway, interesting thread there, deh707. Focus XT might be something I could give a try at some point.

Because of my condition of anhedonia and blunted response to things my anecdotes can be a bit altered from that of average person. This is why I want to keep my mood well while optimizing cognition. Shutting myself indoors in hypomania and playing extreme sessions, maybe in near future lol. For now I wanna enjoy the summer while making some cash.

Interesting regimen and thread, Galaxyshock. What brands are all of those herbs that you are taking? It seems that even among standardized herbs there can be a lot of variation between brands.

This thread kind of makes me hope there will an an investment/ stock trading stack discussion thread started some day.

Bacopa, I use Thorne research extract and it works well. Ginseng and Rhodiola I've recently used local health supplement store products, seem to do the job. With Rhodiola I have previously used Life extension and Nature's Way products successfully. Schisandra I'm using Nature's Way full herb, it's smooth but I recently ordered extracted form to see if it has stronger effects. In my experience these popular brands tend to be decent enough quality.

Edited by Galaxyshock, 29 May 2013 - 02:00 PM.

[LetMusicRule]

actually just saw that Victor Blom won the SCOOP main event in a pretty nice fashion. Saw the replay of the final table on pokertube. You bought in for 10K or qualified through a satellite? Will give Bacopa and Ginseng a try for sure. Currently im buying everything from iherb so ill see whats available there.

Edited by LetMusicRule, 30 May 2013 - 05:25 AM.

[Galaxyshock]

I played the medium-stake main event so $1050 buy-in.

[helluva nootro]

Good to see you have already been trying quite a few stacks and nootropics to up your game, too many people don't look to cover all possible advantages and then just want to dive in head first when they need results. I have quite a bit of experience with nootropics and stacking for different effects but find its each to their own most of the time. Looking at what you have stacked so far I would recommend giving piracetam a trial its not that hard to get hold of if you look around and its quite low cost. The high dosages can be a bit of a pain in the ass and I would recommend not testing with it close to any event...... it seems to cause headaches in a few cases but personally I think its due to OD and poor diet, you seem to have quite a sound base. Have you tried Noopept also? I quite like that myself although I find Piracetam gives has a much longer life span and gives your motivation more of a kick.

[bootdoc]

Galaxyshock- What about the mind body connection of working out and health? Are you doing any cardio or weight lifting? I always look towards Gus Hansen for inspiration of what a true poker player should be.
When you start the racetams (if you do), watch out for actually feeling foggier for a few days. I have found after the initial break in period, I respond better without and negatives.
Also, any standard multi-vite? Any consistent sleep wake cycle?
Glad the cards were dealt to you. It does suck losing all-in as a favorite and being able to be zen in that experience is important (as well as for life).
Cheers

[Galaxyshock]

I lift weights usually 4-5 times a week and recently started outdoor cardio (running) again. Can definitely feel the difference in output. My sleep-wake cycle is pretty good and stable, only problem is I tend to drink alcohol on weekends.. and the best tournaments are sunday, but I've usually managed to not let it affect too much. Not taking a multi at the moment, I've usually found it pretty useless and rather add superfoods to my diet which provide a wider range of nutrition.

I may indeed order some Piracetam to give it a try soon. Noopept I had good experiences at first, then it started to make me strangely foggy and even spaced out. Past few days I've been trying it again but can't conclude what effects it would've had - nothing major I guess.

[LetMusicRule]

yeah if you want to see fit poker players id go for patrick antonius or jason koon. Koon especially. They both have very fit lifestyles.

and phil ivey is a pretty healthy eater. You always see him eating an apple at the final table while dealing a million dollar hand lol. Also had a prop bet to go vegetarian at some point (not that i endorse that standpoint, i love meat).

Edited by LetMusicRule, 31 May 2013 - 01:23 AM.

[helluva nootro]

I lift weights usually 4-5 times a week and recently started outdoor cardio (running) again. Can definitely feel the difference in output. My sleep-wake cycle is pretty good and stable, only problem is I tend to drink alcohol on weekends.. and the best tournaments are sunday, but I've usually managed to not let it affect too much. Not taking a multi at the moment, I've usually found it pretty useless and rather add superfoods to my diet which provide a wider range of nutrition.

I may indeed order some Piracetam to give it a try soon. Noopept I had good experiences at first, then it started to make me strangely foggy and even spaced out. Past few days I've been trying it again but can't conclude what effects it would've had - nothing major I guess.

Sounds good, For me personally I find piracetam has a more stimulant kick like effect with more singular concentration, noopept is more subtle and has less of a motivational effect but increases multi tasking concentration and fluidity of some thoughts a little I guess. I would definitely try piracetam and look into a few of the racetam family, but I just suggest you do it when its definitely not going to impact your training or competitions. Don't mean to put you off by that but simply some people find it amazing straight out the gate whereas a few have adverse reactions, nothing major if you are just taking them on a trial and test basis or in your free time, but wouldnt want them to risk interfering with anything on a professional level. I have noted they all seem to differ in effect also, no saying you may not have a bad reaction from one racetam just because you can take the other A ok. .... on another note and slightly off topic, how did you start getting into poker bro, do you recommend any reading materials or guides with a few good tips, I have a game or two now and then myself but always interested in pointers. pm me if you like to keep this thread on topic

[LetMusicRule]

Just went to buy some theanine. Like the calming effects it gives. Also getting some ginseng like you recommended and bought some bacopa online. However for the ginseng there are so many varieties (siberian, american panax, ) which one have you found to be most helpfull and how much do you take?

Thanks

[Galaxyshock]

Panax ginseng is the gold standard. American should have the same benefits (ginsenosides being the actives) altough slightly different "nature". I'm actually gonna order some American ginseng soon to see how it differs. Siberian ginseng (Eleuthero) is not a true ginseng, but has some similar uses, and qualities of it's own. Could be something to cycle Panax if one likes to. I've used it time to time.

I could post some poker tips and guidelines etc. soon.

[LetMusicRule]

thanks. i also bought american ginseng and ashwaganda. I also take PQQ, CoQ10, Fish Oil, magnesium and theanine (which I love!!!). Looking forward to trying the piracetams as I think they can be really useful. Id really like to get advice on the poker thing because while I play and am profitable at cash games, ive never really had any big scores in large tourneys. I play mostly 6 max cash games and some PLO. It just seems that for tourneys that have big prize pool the fields are huge and u need so much patience to tough it out for hours and hours. We'll see. But by far the thing that has helped me the most in my game has been Jared Tendlers the Mental Game of Poker. Message me man.

[xks201]

Please be careful with St. John's Wort. In my experience it does not mix well with other drugs and I had nasty side effects due to the liver enzymes it occupies and it being a potent mao inhibitor?

[chris106]

Please be careful with St. John's Wort. In my experience it does not mix well with other drugs and I had nasty side effects due to the liver enzymes it occupies and it being a potent mao inhibitor?

Couldn't one take something that is liver protective, like Schizandra, to counter-balance this? My knowledge of this tiópic is still sub-par, are you referring to p450 enzymes?

[Galaxyshock]

Sad to hear many people responding negatively to St. John's. I have used it from january, even at megadoses at times, and haven't had any issues. I don't use any drugs that would interact though. The MAOI activity isn't something to worry about either, it's quite weak and reversible.

[LetMusicRule]

Hey guys,

Right now am using Ashwagandha, Bacopa and Ginseng (along with Fish Oil, PQQ, CoQ10, Magnesium,etc..) and am going to start ordering a racetam for the same purpose.

Which one would you consider best for sustained concentration for long tourneys? Oxiracetam? Pramiracetam? Aniracetam?

Thanks.

[LetMusicRule]

Hello anybody here lol? Well ok doesn't seem like this forum is active too much except for one or two hot topics. There's just so many threads out there would like to know who has experience with these regarding this specific application.

[platypus]

Which one would you consider best for sustained concentration for long tourneys? Oxiracetam? Pramiracetam? Aniracetam?

Modafinil?

[LetMusicRule]

Both adrafinil and modafinil made me sick to my stomach. Bad reaction to both. Not ritalin or aderrall though (which i have no plans of retaking anyways). Look for the healthy way to boost cognition, focus and attention and overall health.

[chris106]

I would strongly advice to start with Piracetam. It's very tempting to start with one of the newer, fancier racetams - but It can be a long lasting trial-and-error period to see which one works for you.
For me personally, none of them really worked that well. Tried Noopept, Aniracetam, Oxiracetam, Nefiracetam and Pramiracetam. But all of those didn't work or give me brainfog, with or without CDP Choline.

I feel like Piracetam is more of a safe bet, as it works for most people in comparison to the more exotic ones. It's the only one that works for me.
Just start with 800-1600 mg doses of piracetam 1-3 times daily. If it doens't work as desired,add 250mg of CDP Choline to each dose.
If it still doesn't work, first megadose the Pira (many people here take up to 4g a dose, which is conscidered safe and not even megadosing.), and then redose the-CDP Choline accordingly as you see fit.

While Modafinil itself might have irritated you, adding small doses of 25-50 mg of it to Piracetam might be worth a try.

Also you might want to add Vit D and Zinc to your supplement regime. I find those in combination with Magnesium give a nice energy + testosterone boost

[platypus]

Both adrafinil and modafinil made me sick to my stomach. Bad reaction to both. Not ritalin or aderrall though (which i have no plans of retaking anyways). Look for the healthy way to boost cognition, focus and attention and overall health.

What was your dosage? Even 50mg sublingually gives me a more noticeable boost than any dose of piracetam.

[chris106]

What was your dosage? Even 50mg sublingually gives me a more noticeable boost than any dose of piracetam.

Modafinil can be taken sublingually? God, that must taste horrible! I will try it right away!

[LetMusicRule]

I would strongly advice to start with Piracetam. It's very tempting to start with one of the newer, fancier racetams - but It can be a long lasting trial-and-error period to see which one works for you.
For me personally, none of them really worked that well. Tried Noopept, Aniracetam, Oxiracetam, Nefiracetam and Pramiracetam. But all of those didn't work or give me brainfog, with or without CDP Choline.

I feel like Piracetam is more of a safe bet, as it works for most people in comparison to the more exotic ones. It's the only one that works for me.
Just start with 800-1600 mg doses of piracetam 1-3 times daily. If it doens't work as desired,add 250mg of CDP Choline to each dose.
If it still doesn't work, first megadose the Pira (many people here take up to 4g a dose, which is conscidered safe and not even megadosing.), and then redose the-CDP Choline accordingly as you see fit.

While Modafinil itself might have irritated you, adding small doses of 25-50 mg of it to Piracetam might be worth a try.

Also you might want to add Vit D and Zinc to your supplement regime. I find those in combination with Magnesium give a nice energy + testosterone boost

As i was researching this I was thinking along the same wavelength as you and going for straight piracetam. The dosages you mentioned are quite high though and could get expensive at the place I am looking at. Do you know of any cheap RELIABLE source of piracetam? Or do you really get what you pay for with the branded one.

[deh707]

I would strongly advice to start with Piracetam. It's very tempting to start with one of the newer, fancier racetams - but It can be a long lasting trial-and-error period to see which one works for you.
For me personally, none of them really worked that well. Tried Noopept, Aniracetam, Oxiracetam, Nefiracetam and Pramiracetam. But all of those didn't work or give me brainfog, with or without CDP Choline.

I feel like Piracetam is more of a safe bet, as it works for most people in comparison to the more exotic ones. It's the only one that works for me.
Just start with 800-1600 mg doses of piracetam 1-3 times daily. If it doens't work as desired,add 250mg of CDP Choline to each dose.
If it still doesn't work, first megadose the Pira (many people here take up to 4g a dose, which is conscidered safe and not even megadosing.), and then redose the-CDP Choline accordingly as you see fit.

While Modafinil itself might have irritated you, adding small doses of 25-50 mg of it to Piracetam might be worth a try.

Also you might want to add Vit D and Zinc to your supplement regime. I find those in combination with Magnesium give a nice energy + testosterone boost

As i was researching this I was thinking along the same wavelength as you and going for straight piracetam. The dosages you mentioned are quite high though and could get expensive at the place I am looking at. Do you know of any cheap RELIABLE source of piracetam? Or do you really get what you pay for with the branded one.

800mg-1600mg are the standard doses for Piracetam.

There are studies that conclude 4.8g to be the most effective single dose.

However, some; including myself, find lower doses to be better suited. 400mg-600mg is my personal sweet range.

[chris106]

What was your dosage? Even 50mg sublingually gives me a more noticeable boost than any dose of piracetam.

Modafinil can be taken sublingually? God, that must taste horrible! I will try it right away!

Ok, I tried that yesterday with 50 mg and this morning even with 100mg of Modalert - and absolutely nothing!

This is kinda suprising, but may have various reasons:

I may after a few days of use have developed a rapid tolerance coicidentaly at the same time I tried this -Unlikely but judging from my past experiences not impossible.

It may be due to the fact that sublingual administartion is a lot more potent. So I may have overdosed to the point where the copound becomes useless. I've read about Modafinil having an n-shaped response-curve for some people - as in less is more and too much does nothing.

Maybe it's due to the generic form (Modalert) that I'm taking. I had the feelig that it didn't really dissolve under my tongue right. Maybe it doesn't work sublingually because it doesn't dissolve - but maybe "real" brand Modafinil does?

So platypus - when you took it sublingually - was it original Modafinl or a generic form of it?

[platypus]

So platypus - when you took it sublingually - was it original Modafinl or a generic form of it?

Generic, I can clearly feel it 6 hours after I've taken it as concentration and mental stamina are improved. People react differently to medication so YMMV.

[LetMusicRule]

800mg-1600mg are the standard doses for Piracetam.

There are studies that conclude 4.8g to be the most effective single dose.

However, some; including myself, find lower doses to be better suited. 400mg-600mg is my personal sweet range.

so you would recommend 400-600 two times a day? Thats VERY affordable and reasonable an amount. Will definitely try it out and see.Would you also take CDP or a choline supp at this dose or is it unnecessary

Edited by LetMusicRule, 01 July 2013 - 03:39 PM.

[machete234]

I feel like Piracetam is more of a safe bet, as it works for most people in comparison to the more exotic ones. It's the only one that works for me.
Just start with 800-1600 mg doses of piracetam 1-3 times daily. If it doens't work as desired,add 250mg of CDP Choline to each dose.
If it still doesn't work, first megadose the Pira (many people here take up to 4g a dose, which is conscidered safe and not even megadosing.), and then redose the-CDP Choline accordingly as you see fit.

Above 3g of piracetam is less irritating for me, I dont know why that is and I dont know if you still have cognitive benefits when you actually feel a bit sedated but 3g is more pleasant than 400,800,1600mg

At 3g its a bit hard to sustain that habit with pharmazeuticals though

[Galaxyshock]

Sorry guys I've been struggling with some issues. Looks like I haven't mentioned it in this thread but I withdrew from Phenibut usage (6 months almost continously) over a year ago and have been in a recovery since then. I haven't been fully responsible with the recovery and have used GABAergics and alcohol time to time, and a few short-term reinstatements with Phenibut. Overall I'm pretty well functional but still have some fluctuating symptoms and feel fragile to certain things. I don't think I can still handle big swings from poker yet or high-volume playing, so things are not progressing as well as I hoped. If there's anything that could help with glutamate - GABA-B function recovery I would be very interested. I know Theanine upregulates GABA-B and is a glutamate analog, so I should probably give it a go again. I played another live tournament recently, didn't go well, but I do enjoy these live games so maybe I should focus on them for this summer and not take too much stress about things.

[Galaxyshock]

Alright, time to start building a new stack and get back in the game!

Now started with:
Triacetyluridine 25mg
Fish oil
Adaptogen mix
Shilajit extract
Creatine 5g
Theanine 600mg in the evening

What I have in stock:
Picamilon 5 grams
Theanine 50 grams
Guarana powder 250 grams
Noopept 1 gram
Aniracetam
Triacetyluridine
Fish oil
Adaptogens: Rhodiola, Eleuthero, Suma, Reishi, Astragalus, Ashwagandha
Shilajit extract 25 grams
Mucuna extract 100 grams
5-HTP
Melatonin
CILTEP supps: Forskolin and Artichoke extract
Creatine
Gotu Kola 125 grams


Still yet to try piracetam.. damn, don't know where to order from so I can get it here without issues.
Quit caffeine for a while, renewed gym membership. Been doing outdoor cardio almost daily for couple of weeks.

Probably still going to aim for selectivity in the games instead of massive volume, I don't think that has ever suited for me. Shall see..

Edited by Galaxyshock, 16 August 2013 - 02:07 PM.

[airplanepeanuts]

I think it makes kind of sense that someone like you with anhedonic tendencies could make a good poker player. Being anhedonic- devoid of feeling you tend to get super rational. You are kind of outside of the games people play. Also you create a meta game for yourself, like a confusion tactic to navigate through life. If you now reaquire your hedonic feelings, say by using Phenibut, those "skills" are still there and now that you are actually engaged you can put them to use. And poker is a playground for mind games and tricks.